Slavery still affects black people in america

[AbsoluteParadigm]

While I agree with Bill Cosby, one cannot completely disregard that there are certain constraints on how far minorities can go in American society. People that are born into poverty tend to stay in poverty. So, for blacks, starting with few resources, tend to stay on the lower level of society. People don't staying below the poverty line because they want to, they stay there because they have to. As for those of you who site the fact of Asian Americans or European immigrants, there are reasons why those people are doing fairly well today than blacks. For Asian Americans, it's the fact that they were completely isolated from American Society due to their forced living location (Asian ghettos aka Chinatowns). The isolation forced Asian Americans to push for their own education, their own leadership. The commerce resulting from the tourist business allowed Asian Americans to better take advantage of the Civil Rights movment in the 1960s.

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: Arkitech
However just like the Holocaust, slavery has had far reaching effects. Is that such a wrong statement to make?

It depends on your mindset. Care to explain how you think the Holocaust affects Jews negatively today? In my mind - other than has a historical event to remember not to repeat - it sure as hell doesn't.

 

[Howard]

Originally posted by: Arkitech
sigh


why does everyone choose to misunderstand what I'm saying?

1. Its possible that almost every black person in america has an opportunity to better themselves if they choose to

2. Slavery and racism is NOT an excuse for irresponsible behavior or lack of effort


However just like the Holocaust, slavery has had far reaching effects. Is that such a wrong statement to make?

What far-reaching effects did the Holocaust have? Turned Germans into objects of fear?

 

[sygyzy]

Watch Chris Rock's latest, Never Scared. He has a very good explanation of how slavery still affects black people today. Pretty insightful.

 

[BannedTroll]

Originally posted by: Whisper

Originally posted by: Howard

Originally posted by: Ranger X

Originally posted by: Arkitech
If your grandparents were poor, uneducated and a potential target for racism anywhere in the US I can assure you that it would have an impact on your life in some form or another.

Slavery is NOT the reason why they're poor and uneducated. African Americans drop out on their own, whether it's the lack of motivation or a preference to enter the workforce early.

Are you aware of how much financial support African Americans get for college? Way more than Caucasians and way more than Asians. Don't you ever wonder why many blacks in America get such a bad reputation? It's because they blame the world for all their problems. Howard> Or maybe because they've seen the statistics on imprisonment with respect to race. They feel like the world owes them something when in reality, the world owes them NOTHING. Racism is there and will always be there, whether you're Persian, Caucasian, Asian, German, French, etc. If you think Americans are racist, try going overseas. You haven't seen half of what the world has to offer when it comes to racism.

Generalizing statements such as these against an entire race of people is counterproductive. Statistics on imprisonment don't say much, and that's one argument I can't stand.

Actually it says a lot about the state of the black community. Figuring out why the numbers exist is more complicated but I don't attribute it to slavery.

 

[Pacfanweb]

#1. Irrelevant. The Civil war has been over for well over 100 years, has nothing to do with blacks today.

#2. Irrelevant. Everyone has the same opportunity at education today, at least in public schools. You forget that back then, most whites weren't eductated, either.

#3. Again, irrelevant. It's been many generations, and most families in the country, no matter what race, can't trace roots back 140 years ago in the same place.

#4. Racism exists regardless of slavery, not because of it. If you are an "African-American", and you go to Africa, the "pure" blacks there will look down on you because you aren't "full-blooded". You will be called "colored", not black. And your ancestors were never their slaves. There's racism and hatred from blacks here toward Mexicans and Asians. What's the difference? Did your ancestors own their ancestors?

#5. I can partially see this, but I'd again say that there are very few families that have passed fortunes and businesses down from that far back.

 

[oboeguy]

Ugh, too long a thread to read at this hour. Anyway... the connections drawn by the OP are tenuous at best. There's a huge leap of logic in each one.

However, anyone who thinks segregation was abolished, say in schools, by Brown vs. Bd. of Ed. has absolutely no freaking clue. Try visiting a school in the South Bronx.

Anyway, racism is still a huge problem, no matter what people say, but slavery? Come on, you need to give a more connected argument for you to convince anyone.

 

[Viper GTS]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: Arkitech
However just like the Holocaust, slavery has had far reaching effects. Is that such a wrong statement to make?

It depends on your mindset. Care to explain how you think the Holocaust affects Jews negatively today? In my mind - other than has a historical event to remember not to repeat - it sure as hell doesn't.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that.

There are still people alive today who survived concentration camps.

People who lost their entire family + everything they owned would likely argue they are still affected.

Viper GTS

 

[djplayx714]

ok people stop using asians as an antithesis. we're well aware of the asian slavery that went on and of the internment camps. there are people still very pissed and very vocal about this. we are not the model minority. i hate it when asians are used as scapegoats for racial issues.

 

[Goosemaster]

Originally posted by: Arkitech
sigh


why does everyone choose to misunderstand what I'm saying?

1. Its possible that almost every black person in america has an opportunity to better themselves if they choose to

2. Slavery and racism is NOT an excuse for irresponsible behavior or lack of effort


However just like the Holocaust, slavery has had far reaching effects. Is that such a wrong statement to make?

I thought I actualyl addressed that?

 

[MommysLittleMonster]

Here we go.

 

[Arkitech]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
While I will concede that it is possible that some of these events/social conditions may have effects spanning multiple generations, the effect on any CURRENT generation should be virtually negligible.

Combine that with AA & everything it entails, & IMO you have no reason to bitch.

I would really expect better out of you Arkitech, what's gotten into you tonight?

Viper GTS

You know man, I never realized til tonight just how alienated a person can feel. My parents always taught me to do my best at everything, they also stressed the importance of education in my life. Those lessons have served me well in life, I've achieved quite a bit in 32 years of living. However it really hurts me when I see other people of my own race who don't even put forth a minimal effort. It hurts me when I see certain high profile black people (rappers, athletes, actors, etc..) use broken english and generally make asses of themselves in public. However it really hurts when other people genuinely can't understand how past events can shape a group of people. Its not something I use as a copout but I aknowledge those events and it serves as a motivator for me to work hard.

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: Arkitech
However just like the Holocaust, slavery has had far reaching effects. Is that such a wrong statement to make?

It depends on your mindset. Care to explain how you think the Holocaust affects Jews negatively today? In my mind - other than has a historical event to remember not to repeat - it sure as hell doesn't.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that.

There are still people alive today who survived concentration camps.

People who lost their entire family + everything they owned would likely argue they are still affected.

Viper GTS

I didn't want to say this to begin with because it's a little extreme, but I thought of that and balanced it out in my mind against the uniting power of the event. Israel is now a reality, and though I think that was going to happen anyways whether the Holocaust happened or not (I forget at this hour the specifics), its creation certainly gained new urgency from it. Now, never again will a Jew have no place to turn. I admire that strike for independence greatly.

 

[BannedTroll]

Originally posted by: oboeguy
Ugh, too long a thread to read at this hour. Anyway... the connections drawn by the OP are tenuous at best. There's a huge leap of logic in each one.

However, anyone who thinks segregation was abolished, say in schools, by Brown vs. Bd. of Ed. has absolutely no freaking clue. Try visiting a school in the South Bronx.

Anyway, racism is still a huge problem, no matter what people say, but slavery? Come on, you need to give a more connected argument for you to convince anyone.

Please explain the "South Bronx" thing to me. I don't want to go on what I assume you mean.

 

[Kanalua]

go talk to a Jew...

longer slave period, harsher condition (arguable)

they seem to be doing pretty good...

 

[hysperion]

I never realized til tonight just how alienated a person can feel

You don't have to be black to feel alienated. I'm sure fat people, abused kids and wives, ugly people, people with small peepees feel the same.

 

[Tates]

I'm still trying to shake off the Spanish onslaught of the Aztecs & Incas....

 

[erikistired]

sebastian bach is still a slave to the grind, but you don't hear him complaining about the civil war do you?

 

[BannedTroll]

Originally posted by: Arkitech

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

You know man, I never realized til tonight just how alienated a person can feel. My parents always taught me to do my best at everything, they also stressed the importance of education in my life. Those lessons have served me well in life, I've achieved quite a bit in 32 years of living. However it really hurts me when I see other people of my own race who don't even put forth a minimal effort. It hurts me when I see certain high profile black people (rappers, athletes, actors, etc..) use broken english and generally make asses of themselves in public. However it really hurts when other people genuinely can't understand how past events can shape a group of people. Its not something I use as a copout but I aknowledge those events and it serves as a motivator for me to work hard.

You are succesful because your parents didn't intill the slavery mindset in you or at least that is what I gathered from your statement. The affect of slavery is not from slavery itself but how people perceive it and let it affect them. This is not necessarily a personal decision because parents/ grandparents shape your views.

 

[Howard]

Originally posted by: djplayx714
ok people stop using asians as an antithesis. we're well aware of the asian slavery that went on and of the internment camps. there are people still very pissed and very vocal about this. we are not the model minority. i hate it when asians are used as scapegoats for racial issues.

I don't know any Orientals that still seem pissed about it.

 

[Wuffsunie]

I understand perfectly well the history of slavery in the states. And I understand perfectly well that some people cannot get over sh!t in the past, no matter how far back it happened and no matter the direct bearing (or lack thereof) of the orignal events on them. The constant harping on that whole period has grown fvcking tiresome, from those in the south who bear a continental chip on their shoulder because their side "lost," to, of course, your side. It's the fact that some people just won't let the fvck go that pisses me off about the whole issue.

Really, the more I hear about it, the less I care.

-- Jack

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first.
-- Mark Twain

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: hysperion

I never realized til tonight just how alienated a person can feel

You don't have to be black to feel alienated. I'm sure fat people, abused kids and wives, ugly people, people with small peepees feel the same.

Man. I wonder how fat abused ugly kids with small peepees get through the day. I mean, I fit the opposite description so well that my mind is completely incapable of contemplating that situation.

 

[erikistired]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: hysperion

I never realized til tonight just how alienated a person can feel

You don't have to be black to feel alienated. I'm sure fat people, abused kids and wives, ugly people, people with small peepees feel the same.

Man. I wonder how fat abused ugly kids with small peepees get through the day. I mean, I fit the opposite description so well that my mind is completely incapable of contemplating that situation.

they sue mcdonalds.

 

[Arkitech]

Originally posted by: oboeguy
Ugh, too long a thread to read at this hour. Anyway... the connections drawn by the OP are tenuous at best. There's a huge leap of logic in each one.

However, anyone who thinks segregation was abolished, say in schools, by Brown vs. Bd. of Ed. has absolutely no freaking clue. Try visiting a school in the South Bronx.

Anyway, racism is still a huge problem, no matter what people say, but slavery? Come on, you need to give a more connected argument for you to convince anyone.

Maybe I should have fleshed out my original post better. Sometimes its hard for me to put everything down in words.

Slaves were in many cases viewed as less than humans, this view did'nt automatically disappear just because slavery was abolished. There is much evidence of this in the decades after slavery, unfortunately there are many who still hold some of those views.

I've done extensive reading through historical documents, biographical accounts and speaking with older relatives about the state of black people in america. And perhaps because I'm so intimately involved in this issue I have a view and understanding that other people not of my background may not understand. Again its hard for me to put all of my thoughts, experiences and knowledge into words but I feel strongly that slavery has had a direct impact on the current state of black people in this country. This does'nt mean that I believe in excuses or copouts, in fact I'm probably harder on other black people than persons from another race would be.

I think some of the responses in this post are kind of knee jerk statements. There has been many black people in the past who have used slavery as "get out of jail free card" or as a way to further their own financial or personal goals. So I guess some of the backlash here should be expected to a certain extent.

 

[BannedTroll]

Originally posted by: Wuffsunie
I understand perfectly well the history of slavery in the states. And I understand perfectly well that some people cannot get over sh!t in the past, no matter how far back it happened and no matter the direct bearing (or lack thereof) of the orignal events on them. The constant harping on that whole period has grown fvcking tiresome, from those in the south who bear a continental chip on their shoulder because their side "lost," to, of course, your side. It's the fact that some people just won't let the fvck go that pisses me off about the whole issue.

Really, the more I hear about it, the less I care.

-- Jack

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first.
-- Mark Twain

uuuuummmmm.......seriously I didn't realize there was a chip on the shoulder of the south.