Smart Home & Home Automation discussion thread

[Kaido]

intraHouse project for home automation http://intrahouse.eu
аnd demo http://intrahouse.eu/demo

Nice web interface

A couple questions:

1. Is this available in the US?

2. Does it use entirely custom controllers?

 

[Kaido]

Its hard to understand what this thing actually is.

Seems like its just a small tablet that lets you modify all your other smart locks/lights and whatnot.

Yup, I'd imagine it's a modified Android tablet with some custom monitoring software. If they're smart, they'll integrate some additional capabilities like ZigBee or Zwave down the road for integration. This would actually be a really nice system for like an apartment, where you could hang it on a living room wall & maybe tie in some lights and whatnot - a basic security system with some basic home automation controls.

 

[Kaido]

Keen has a neat idea: individually-controlled smart vents for your HVAC system:

http://www.keenhome.io/

 

[Kaido]

Round of 25 crowd-funded home automation projects: (article is about a year old, but still good)

http://www.cepro.com/article/crowdfunding_and_home_automation_a_roundup/

 

[Kneedragger]

If this works as well as I think it might, then this will be HUGE, especially since they've partnered with Home Depot. Imagine running down to the local big-box store, picking up a hub & some devices, and getting everything setup in a free afternoon. Super awesome. This could be the next Veralite device...

That's pretty much my take on this. The one thing I noticed I don't see much word about is camera support. Not a deal breaker for me but I guess it's better if this can do everything else well..

 

[Kaido]

That's pretty much my take on this. The one thing I noticed I don't see much word about is camera support. Not a deal breaker for me but I guess it's better if this can do everything else well..

The iOS app reviews are not so great:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/wink-instantly-connected/id719287124?mt=8

Granted, that's without a central hub or link hub, just with Quirky-connected devices; I'd imagine with a company as big as GE behind it, it will have some serious horsepower once it comes to market, especially since they've partnered with Home Depot - if it's garbage, they're going to get so many returns that they'll kick it out of their store. But seeing as how Home Depot is selling their smart-enabled egg containers for $80 a pop, I'd say they're well on their way to being successful, haha.

I pre-ordered the Link Hub & 2-pack Link LED combo for $49, so I'll see how that turns out. I'm in a rental right now and just finished setting up the half-finished basement with my LED projector for my micro-sized home theater & needed some lights anyway, so this will be super convenient since I can control everything through Wink (lights), Roku app (Netflix), and the Logitech Harmony Smart Control IR blaster (5.1 receiver & LED projector) via my iPhone - pretty slick. Simple touchscreen remote, no gimmicks. And for $79, I'll definitely be picking up a Wink controller - that's a lot easier to justify than one of the near-$200 Zwave-only controller hubs, especially since it has support for BT, Zigbee, Wifi, Zwave, etc.

 

[Kaido]

TNW has a first look review of the Wink Hub up:

http://thenextweb.com/gadgets/2014/07/02/wink-hub/

Takeaways:

* Home Depot & Quirky teamed up for Wink-enabled products
* Compatible with Android Wear (smart watches etc.)
* Works with tons of stuff: Chamberlain (garage door openers), Honeywell (thermostat), Rheem (water heater) and GE (lighting and kitchen appliances) to name a few
* Super easy interface: sample image
* Wink app lets you setup timers, alerts, proximity settings, and shortcuts (both iOS & Android compatible out of the gate - that's HUGE)
* Put it anywhere in your house - uses Wifi instead of Ethernet
* Decently fast response time - about a 1-second delay
* 24/7 help line with a real human for troubleshooting
* Wink Hub = $49 (not $79); if purchased with a Wink-compatible product, the Hub is only $24.99, and if purchased with two or more products, it's 99 cents. That's insane!
* Available July 7th, both in-store & online at Home Depot & Amazon

Well shoot! That's awfully enticing! I just cancelled my pre-order at Home Depot; I'll run down to my local store since I wanted to get 4 LED lights for my basement project anyway, so that should only cost $61 (4 lights @ $15 each + $1 for the Wink Hub when purchased with 2 or more Wink-compatible products), which is only $11 more than buying the 2-pack of bulbs with the Link Hub in the bundle. Most excellent!

 

[VladimirM]

A couple questions:

1. Is this available in the US?

2. Does it use entirely custom controllers?

Yes. itraHouse server (ihServer) available to order from site www.intrahouse.eu

itraHouse now works with controllers and couplers Beckhoff, Wago, Moxa
In addition, the system can work with wireless protocols (enocean, z-wave)

Once again, you can try to work with the system http://intrahouse.eu/demo
for PC, iPad http://demo.intrahouse.eu/ih.html
for smartphones http://demo.intrahouse.eu/ihm.html

It does not flash clip. It's live interactive demo!

 

[Kneedragger]

I pre-ordered the Link Hub & 2-pack Link LED combo for $49, so I'll see how that turns out. I'm in a rental right now and just finished setting up the half-finished basement with my LED projector for my micro-sized home theater & needed some lights anyway, so this will be super convenient since I can control everything through Wink (lights), Roku app (Netflix), and the Logitech Harmony Smart Control IR blaster (5.1 receiver & LED projector) via my iPhone - pretty slick. Simple touchscreen remote, no gimmicks. And for $79, I'll definitely be picking up a Wink controller - that's a lot easier to justify than one of the near-$200 Zwave-only controller hubs, especially since it has support for BT, Zigbee, Wifi, Zwave, etc.

I can't wait to hear your thoughts after getting it. :thumbsup:

 

[Kaido]

I can't wait to hear your thoughts after getting it. :thumbsup:

One thing I'm curious is how it will with existing technology. So my basement has 3 wall lamps and 1 floor lamp, for a total of 4 bulbs. Wink can control all 4 bulbs individually or as a group via the Wink app through the Wink Hub (iPhone to Wifi to Hub). But what if I want to use a wall switch? Do the bulbs auto-detect power? So if I walk out of a room & flip the wall switch off, that will cut power to the Link bulb, turning it off. If I walk into a room and flip the switch on, is it smart enough to turn on when power is applied, or does that simply enter it into a state where it can receive Wink commands, so nothing happens?

I'd imagine it has a power detection feature, and then from the "max brightness once power is received" state you can control the on/off/brightness level via Wink. I know INSTEON has some in-line micro modules that you can wire in inbetween the wall switch & power line to communicate the lamp itself:

http://www.smarthome.com/2442-222/INSTEON-Micro-Dimmer-Module/p.aspx

GE (Wink) already has a plug-in dimmer adapter, so that would be good for the floor lamp since I wouldn't have to replace an outlet or anything:

http://www.amazon.com/GE-Z-Wave-Wire.../dp/B0013V6S0Q

Although they do have outlets already available as well, which I'm assuming would be Wink-compatible because they're from the same manufacturer:

http://www.amazon.com/GE-Wireless-Li...dp/B0013V1SRY/

They also have wall switches:

http://www.amazon.com/GE-Z-Wave-Wire.../dp/B006LQFHN2

What I'd really like is a center-sprung momentary wall switch with an LED light built in. I've used transparent light switches with an LED built-in, so you can see where they are in the dark, which is SUPER handy:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...l-Toggle-Switch-Clear-R57-01223-0LC/202027025

But for a smarthome application, it'd be ideal to have a momentary switch that springs back to the middle. So if you flick it up, it sends the "on" command and then returns to center. If you flick it down, it sends the "off" command and then returns to center. And then you could program in like a 2-second hold for "all on" or "all off". They have some large rocker switch panels & touch button that do stuff like that, but I don't find them very intuitive - I like having a standard flip up/flip down switch, and if they could do a Zwave-enabled model that did that, that would be the best because it's the same old switch you're used to, just a little better. Ideally with backup functionality to function if the Hub is down as well.

 

[EightySix Four]

Keen has a neat idea: individually-controlled smart vents for your HVAC system:

http://www.keenhome.io/

An engineering project I did in college had a smart vents like this that learned where you were in the house at what time of day and controlled the temperature so you weren't wasting energy cooling/heating rooms that didn't have anyone in it.

 

[Kneedragger]

One thing I'm curious is how it will with existing technology. So my basement has 3 wall lamps and 1 floor lamp, for a total of 4 bulbs. Wink can control all 4 bulbs individually or as a group via the Wink app through the Wink Hub (iPhone to Wifi to Hub). But what if I want to use a wall switch? Do the bulbs auto-detect power? So if I walk out of a room & flip the wall switch off, that will cut power to the Link bulb, turning it off. If I walk into a room and flip the switch on, is it smart enough to turn on when power is applied, or does that simply enter it into a state where it can receive Wink commands, so nothing happens?

I'd imagine it has a power detection feature, and then from the "max brightness once power is received" state you can control the on/off/brightness level via Wink. I know INSTEON has some in-line micro modules that you can wire in inbetween the wall switch & power line to communicate the lamp itself:

http://www.smarthome.com/2442-222/INSTEON-Micro-Dimmer-Module/p.aspx

GE (Wink) already has a plug-in dimmer adapter, so that would be good for the floor lamp since I wouldn't have to replace an outlet or anything:

http://www.amazon.com/GE-Z-Wave-Wire.../dp/B0013V6S0Q

Although they do have outlets already available as well, which I'm assuming would be Wink-compatible because they're from the same manufacturer:

http://www.amazon.com/GE-Wireless-Li...dp/B0013V1SRY/

They also have wall switches:

http://www.amazon.com/GE-Z-Wave-Wire.../dp/B006LQFHN2

What I'd really like is a center-sprung momentary wall switch with an LED light built in. I've used transparent light switches with an LED built-in, so you can see where they are in the dark, which is SUPER handy:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...l-Toggle-Switch-Clear-R57-01223-0LC/202027025

But for a smarthome application, it'd be ideal to have a momentary switch that springs back to the middle. So if you flick it up, it sends the "on" command and then returns to center. If you flick it down, it sends the "off" command and then returns to center. And then you could program in like a 2-second hold for "all on" or "all off". They have some large rocker switch panels & touch button that do stuff like that, but I don't find them very intuitive - I like having a standard flip up/flip down switch, and if they could do a Zwave-enabled model that did that, that would be the best because it's the same old switch you're used to, just a little better. Ideally with backup functionality to function if the Hub is down as well.

Yeah I'm curious if it goes to last state or turns on at 100%. Good question! Now that you bring this up.. I wonder how this works for all these smart bulbs...

 

[Kaido]

An engineering project I did in college had a smart vents like this that learned where you were in the house at what time of day and controlled the temperature so you weren't wasting energy cooling/heating rooms that didn't have anyone in it.

Now that Nest has an open API for developers, I bet Keen will be all over this! My big plan is to use the mini-split ductless systems along with a ductwork system for fresh air. The new Mistsubishi models have the H2i feature, which lets them pull in warm air from -13F weather outside:

http://www.mitsubishipro.com/media/226460/h2i_brochure.pdf

Couple that with a gas fireplace for backup & additional heat and you've got yourself a pretty nice system! I would still have a concern about fresh air, especially if I get to the point where I can build an ICF house (ultra-tight), so you'd still need an ERV/HRV system:

http://www.broan.com/products/lifes...fference-bf711e80-2043-41a0-bf21-98542b29a2d0

You can tie a HEPA filter on those for whole-house clean air:

http://www.iqair.com/home-air-purifiers/wholehouseairpurifiers/perfect16

And then throw on a humidifier for moisture control:

http://www.aprilaire.com/whole-house-products/whole-house-products/humidifiers

I'd rather not have to do ductwork, but the mini-split systems are more about temperature control than fresh/hot air exchange & moisture control, so it makes sense to do an HRV/HEPA/humidifier combo for the ductwork & then keep the mini-split systems to individual rooms so everyone can set their own temperature. Plus in a fairly airtight house, you could get away with just cooling (or heating) the room that you're in so you're not wasting power (1) heating/cooling the whole house, and (2) not getting the same temps in each room since some rooms are further away from the HVAC system. Plus they have really neat ducting these days, like fabric ductwork:

http://www.ductsox.com/

So basically:

1. Whole house: Ductwork + HRV + Humidifier + Air Filter
2. Per room: Mini-split system + vents (in & out)

Stuff like the new Honeywell thermostat has geofencing features, so when you're driving home, it could ping your system to kick off the living room, kitchen, and bedroom A/C 5 minutes before you get home so it's nice & cool; that way it's not running all day and it's only running in the rooms you want. Lots of neat little things you could do like that that wouldn't require much work to setup once everything starts talking to each other!

 

[Kaido]

I have done a bunch of reading on Wink over the weekend & have compiled my notes onto a wiki page: (short url available on the page, just can't link it here)

http://catch42.pbworks.com/w/page/82660393/Wink

This is shaping up to be a VERY interesting technology. Personally, this looks exactly like what I have been waiting for:

1. Available at Home Depot
2. Branded with "Wink Compatible" logos so you know the device will work with the system
3. Works with a variety of protocols
4. Consumer-friendly (read: easy)
5. Native support for mobile devices (iOS & Android)

They also announced a cloud connector, including support for Dropcam via a cloud-to-cloud exchange, so that's pretty cool. LOTS of opportunities for this technology, as long as it proves to be more reliable than the competitors. The existing Wink app for Android & iOS has terrible reviews, but they are launching a (free) updated app with Wink Hub support tomorrow, so we'll see how that fares. My guess is that they'll put a lot of work into making it stable & reliable, since they've partnered with Home Depot, and I doubt they will get cut much slack if they get a ton of returns due to crappy functionality.

 

[Kaido]

I can't remember if I've mentioned this (it's not really smarthome-related), but I switched out to Gojo touchfree soap dispensers last year. They're super cheap (under $15 on Amazon), are touch-free (battery-operated), and long-lasting (the dispenser turns the soap into foam, which lasts for about 2,000 uses):

http://www.amazon.com/2740-01-Touch-...dp/B0040ZOMX2/

Black model is also available:

http://www.amazon.com/2730-12-Black-...dp/B005YS21E6/

You can screw it into the wall or just use the included sticky-back pad. I've had zero problems with the industrial-strength sticky-back pad they include. It uses the 1,200mL refills, which are sold in minimum cases of 2 (usually under $40). For convenience, I purchase the soap that includes hand conditioner, which is great in the wintertime for dry skin:

http://www.amazon.com/GOJO-5361-02-P...dp/B0040ZOMVY/

I have these in all of my bathrooms, as well as my kitchen. The WAF was not high initially until she got used to them & then realized we only have to change out the soap twice a year instead of twice a month, plus they're super easy to use with a toddler since they foam up the soap for you.

On a related note, I also bought a CLEANcut touchless paper towel dispenser for my kitchen. It's not cheap (around $100, several colors available), but is very convenient. It uses two IR beam detectors to dispense & cut paper towels, so if your hands are messy (like if you're handling raw chicken), you can simply stick your hand in one recess to feed the paper towels out, then in the other recess to have it sliced - the existing perforation on the paper towels doesn't matter since the unit has its own built-in knife:

http://cleancutdispenser.com/

For the record, my wife hates the CleanCUT I think she finds it annoying & feels like we're constantly refilling it anyway. To be fair, it is almost as easy to get paper towels out using our old dispenser, which is one of those upright ones with a rubber stopper so you don't yank off a mile of paper towels. Plus paper towels are now being sold with half-size perforations, so if you only need a small section, you can just rip it off without any hassles, and the upright paper towel stand can be relocated anywhere (to a table for feeding a baby or to a mess on the floor in another room for cleanup duty). I'm just throwing it out there as a neat option because I like things with added electronics

 

[Kaido]

Whoohoo, it's Wink day! Amazon has the Wink Hub for $49:

http://www.amazon.com/Quirky-PWHUB-W...dp/B002YVHYF2/

The version 2.0 app is available on the iTunes store:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/wink-instantly-connected/id719287124?mt=8

Wink is the one quick and simple app that connects you and the products you rely on every day in your home.

It uses a smart and intuitive interface for easy control of connected devices like lights, locks, thermostats, smoke alarms, cameras, sprinkler systems, and more from these leading brands: Bali, Dropcam, GE, Honeywell, Kidde, Kwikset, Lutron, Leviton, Schlage, Philips, Quirky, Rachio, and TCP.

Wink makes setup clear with step by step guides and videos. If you ever need help with anything, you can talk to a real human on our customer support team 24/7.

Wink is free to download and doesn’t charge any fees for use.

Many products work directly with the Wink app. Other products use the Wink HUB to get connected. The Wink HUB allows your diverse collection of smart products to speak the same wireless language so you can control them --and customize their interactions-- from the Wink app.

Features:

Shortcuts - Make simple buttons to quickly access your favorite settings.
Robots - Automate your home by building virtual robots to do things for you.
Activity - Schedule and monitor everything in your home.

So you can use 4 types of controls:

1. Manual control (push a button)
2. Shortcuts (for quicker access to stuff you use often)
3. Robots (simple IFTTT-style programming for creating chains of commands)
4. Activity (scheduling actions, such as turning on the bedroom lights at 6am

The Android version has been updated as well:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.quirky.android.wink.wink&hl=en

Great article on Wired:

http://www.wired.com/2014/07/wink/

Of course, these won’t be Kaufman’s only competitors. Apple’s HomeKit certainly looks like one. But Kaufman insists HomeKit is an opportunity for Wink, not a threat. “HomeKit’s a developer platform. It makes things like Wink work better,” he says, explaining that Wink could tap into Apple products like Siri and touch identification. Plus, Wink would benefit from the fact that it can work even with products that aren’t HomeKit-enabled.

Support information:

http://www.winkapp.com/support

Need Support?

Call 1-844-WINKAPP, or email us at support@winkapp.com

These guys are serious: the app is updated, the equipment dropped today at a good price, and they have free live help. Who the heck has free live help? Haha.

 

[TerryMathews]

Whoohoo, it's Wink day! Amazon has the Wink Hub for $49:

http://www.amazon.com/Quirky-PWHUB-W...dp/B002YVHYF2/

The version 2.0 app is available on the iTunes store:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/wink-instantly-connected/id719287124?mt=8



So you can use 4 types of controls:

1. Manual control (push a button)
2. Shortcuts (for quicker access to stuff you use often)
3. Robots (simple IFTTT-style programming for creating chains of commands)
4. Activity (scheduling actions, such as turning on the bedroom lights at 6am

The Android version has been updated as well:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.quirky.android.wink.wink&hl=en

Great article on Wired:

http://www.wired.com/2014/07/wink/



Support information:



These guys are serious: the app is updated, the equipment dropped today at a good price, and they have free live help. Who the heck has free live help? Haha.

Better deal: go to Home Depot and buy two Wink-compatible devices (you'll need them anyway right?) And get the hub for $0.99.

 

[Kaido]

Better deal: go to Home Depot and buy two Wink-compatible devices (you'll need them anyway right?) And get the hub for $0.99.

Yup, Amazon is also running the deal through Labor Day if you don't feel like driving:

http://www.amazon.com/b?ie=UTF8&node=9637704011

$50 for the hub
$25 for the hub if you purchase one Wink Certified device
$1 for the hub if you purchase two Wink Certified devices

 

[Kaido]

I've split off the Wink discussion to a separate thread:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2390152

I'll swing by Home Depot today & pick up my gear - planning on a pair of lights & a Hub (should be $31 + tax). I'm hoping the discount deal is available in-store as well; right now Home Depot's website is showing the GE starter kit for $50 (2 lights & a Hub in a combo pack), so if that's the case, I'll save the $20 & just purchase it through Amazon Prime.

 

[Kneedragger]

Better deal: go to Home Depot and buy two Wink-compatible devices (you'll need them anyway right?) And get the hub for $0.99.

Wow good deal. I'm gonna go to Home Depot today and check it out.

 

[Kaido]

Intel, Samsung join forces to streamline connectivity for the Internet of Things:

http://www.engadget.com/2014/07/08/intel-samsung-iot-consortium/

...considering that the IoT market is projected to reach 212 billion devices by 2020, it's pretty much guaranteed to be a huge mess if products continue to run independently of each other. One universal spec allowing interoperability across all kinds of devices would help to simplify things, and that's what Intel, Dell, Samsung and other tech giants hope to achieve with the just-announced Open Interconnect Consortium.

...

The new OIC, on the other hand, is more concerned with consumer and enterprise use cases (at least for the time being), and it will produce an industry standard to improve device-to-device connectivity. According to Intel, the participating companies will develop a certification program along with the new IoT protocol spec. The OIC will initially focus on open-source code for smart home and office scenarios, with specs tailor-made for connected cars and the healthcare industry to follow. For consumers, though, the bottom line is that connected devices could someday be sold with a OIC sticker on the package, letting you know that the smart door lock you're eyeing meets the consortium's requirements for interconnectivity.

So yeah, it's another consortium. Can't remember if someone linked this XKCD earlier or not:

http://xkcd.com/927/

I think Wink has the right idea...let the people who are good at what they make (deadbolts or motorized blinds or whatever) do what they do best, and let them choose what connectivity chip they want to put inside, and then they'll patch that into their system. If Wink takes off with "Wink Certified" equipment across the board, then Intels' OIC is going to have a hard time playing catch-up imo. At least they made out successfully with Thunderbolt! Oh, wait...

 

[shabby]

Btw the nest thermostat is $230 now http://www.amazon.com/Nest-Learning-...&keywords=nest

 

[Kneedragger]

http://gigaom.com/2014/07/15/nest-a...-a-wireless-mesh-standard-for-the-smart-home/

 

[Kaido]

Btw the nest thermostat is $230 now http://www.amazon.com/Nest-Learning-...&keywords=nest

Nice! I've been thinking about getting a smart thermostat. I'm leaning towards the Honeywell - slightly cheaper, more information on the screen, and is already compatible with Wink:

http://www.amazon.com/Honeywell-RET9...dp/B00FLZEQH2/

It's just that $200 is a lot to spend for something that I already have simple manual control over & rarely change :biggrin:

 

[Kaido]

http://gigaom.com/2014/07/15/nest-a...-a-wireless-mesh-standard-for-the-smart-home/

My first reaction was "gee great, another protocol in the HA scene", but their approach actually makes sense: there is no good, standardized, "true" low-power automation protocol & hardware on the market today. As they point out, ZigBee is fragmented, plus Zwave suffers from some reliability & control issues, as well as standardization issues for controlling it between hubs & software management systems. I think that if Apple was smart, they'd integrate HomeKit in with Thread. One sticking point is that Nest kinda-sorta does Thread already, and ZigBee stuff could, in theory, be upgraded, but we all know how growing standards & improved hardware works, haha.

So far, I like the concept behind Wink the best: a small, low-power central hub running an embedded OS that simply acts as a basic controller & command relay device. Basically a smarthome router. And in the future, you could simply buy a replacement v2 $50 hub that has support for say Lutron's RA stuff, Nest's Thread stuff, etc. so it's not an overly huge investment - more akin to upgrading your 802.11g router to an 802.11n model. They're having some initial rollout issues, but they have a fairly powerful machine (Linux + a 400mhz CPU with various radios), so I think most of that can be ironed out with software updates (I hope!).