Originally posted by: glen
110dB at 20 Hz sounds quieter than 110dB at 200 Hz to the human ear.
Yes, but that is not what I am talking about.
I am talking about how you want your response curve to look on an RTA when you are playing pink noise.
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
Originally posted by: myjaja
LOL @ THIS THREAD!!!
Most amps don't even say the truth about their watts. Like off branded amps. Those amps say it has 1200 watts. That piece of sh!t dosn't have a 1200 watts. It's like 35 watts per channel. Have you ever checked the rms on it? Oh yeah, each sub is different. You can't say all subs need 10 or 20 watts. Even speakers need more than that. Look up more information before posting a stupid thread like this one.
Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
Originally posted by: myjaja
LOL @ THIS THREAD!!!
Most amps don't even say the truth about their watts. Like off branded amps. Those amps say it has 1200 watts. That piece of sh!t dosn't have a 1200 watts. It's like 35 watts per channel. Have you ever checked the rms on it? Oh yeah, each sub is different. You can't say all subs need 10 or 20 watts. Even speakers need more than that. Look up more information before posting a stupid thread like this one.
and again, myjaja with useless information, prolly doesnt know what he is talking about, just re stating what he has read in other threads.
i completely agree with Glen on this when buying an amp, the only things that you will really be able to tell is if the Amp has a bad ground loop in it, then you can tell. other than that a $50 100watt amp is equal to a $300 100 watt amp.
However, the only difference between these, will be the stated THD (i think its anything below .5% is unnoticeable, i dont remember, and most amps are like .1 and less. The only other difference will be, does the $50 amp actually put out all 100 watts without clipping (squarewave) or will it not?
other than that, the most important things in a system are:
Source, if your source sucks, your output sucks
wiring location, if you run your RCA's with your PWR, most likely you will get SOME interference, but its not guarenteed
Speakers, if your speakers dont have a good response, then nothing will save you.
JLw7's are liked by many because of their rolly type sound, its not a sudden boom supposedly, but rather a roll.
and Glen emailed adire audio, i like his source
of course, some subs 20 watts wont even get it to move because they are so ineffecient in design that it requires lots of power to move.
someone will correct me if im wrong, but all of the freq. charts are given at 5watts if i am not mistaken.
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Also consider room size, if I have a 14 inch subwoofer....in a movie theater lets say....and the audience is sitting 30 feet back from it...your gonna need to supply quite a bit more power for the sound pressure waves to reach them at an appreciable level.
That said, a lot of car speakers and amps are all about advertising so that some dude can go brag to his friend that he has a 1500 watt amp "feeding" a 15 inch sub...and yes, it would never use that much. But car speakers do have to overcome the noise of the road/engine, which is louder than most of you probably think.
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
take a look at this graph.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/abc.gif
in the audio world, the line that is red is called A weighting, it is how your ear actually operates. if something is measured at 80db at 20hz, then it is actually 30dbA under the A weighting scale. and I contest that you would have a VERY hard time picking up a 20hz sound at 80db.
also, check these graphs, the curves on this graph are how your ear acutally responds to audio reception.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/fletcher.gif
Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Also consider room size, if I have a 14 inch subwoofer....in a movie theater lets say....and the audience is sitting 30 feet back from it...your gonna need to supply quite a bit more power for the sound pressure waves to reach them at an appreciable level.
That said, a lot of car speakers and amps are all about advertising so that some dude can go brag to his friend that he has a 1500 watt amp "feeding" a 15 inch sub...and yes, it would never use that much. But car speakers do have to overcome the noise of the road/engine, which is louder than most of you probably think.
most of that however is cancelled out because the Cabin Gain of a car is extremely high.
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
take a look at this graph.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/abc.gif
in the audio world, the line that is red is called A weighting, it is how your ear actually operates. if something is measured at 80db at 20hz, then it is actually 30dbA under the A weighting scale. and I contest that you would have a VERY hard time picking up a 20hz sound at 80db.
also, check these graphs, the curves on this graph are how your ear acutally responds to audio reception.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/fletcher.gif
Your missing the point, the goal of speakers is to play things as you would hear them in real life for music...and as the mix engineer wants you to hear them in movies.
Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
take a look at this graph.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/abc.gif
in the audio world, the line that is red is called A weighting, it is how your ear actually operates. if something is measured at 80db at 20hz, then it is actually 30dbA under the A weighting scale. and I contest that you would have a VERY hard time picking up a 20hz sound at 80db.
also, check these graphs, the curves on this graph are how your ear acutally responds to audio reception.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/fletcher.gif
Your missing the point, the goal of speakers is to play things as you would hear them in real life for music...and as the mix engineer wants you to hear them in movies.
dont get me started on that. i think this stupid dorm room has a room gain of like 50billion on movie bass, i mean my 6.5" speakers are nice, but damn, i didnt think they could put out the amount of bass they do in movies, its like movies are JUST for the low end...
Thanks for the insult.Originally posted by: glen
I am the only person who seems to have posted information, or seems to knwo what teh theil Small parameters even mean.Originally posted by: myjaja
LOL @ THIS THREAD!!!
Most amps don't even say the truth about their watts. Like off branded amps. Those amps say it has 1200 watts. That piece of sh!t dosn't have a 1200 watts. It's like 35 watts per channel. Have you ever checked the rms on it? Oh yeah, each sub is different. You can't say all subs need 10 or 20 watts going throught them. Speakers need more than that. Look up more information before posting a stupid thread like this one.
Are you saying that goes for all systems with a flat on-axis frequency response?Originally posted by: glen
Originally posted by: Howard
Nah, glen's saying that you only need low power for a system that "sounds good", apparently. He justifies this by saying that a flat response sounds "harsh", though I didn't see any data he used to back up this claim.
Anyway, the maximum amp power correlates (logarithmically) to the maximum loudness. A 1000W amplifier can net you a 10dB higher maximum SPL than a 100W amplifier can, ignoring power compression.
You got it sort of right.
A flat response is harsh as hell.
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
take a look at this graph.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/abc.gif
in the audio world, the line that is red is called A weighting, it is how your ear actually operates. if something is measured at 80db at 20hz, then it is actually 30dbA under the A weighting scale. and I contest that you would have a VERY hard time picking up a 20hz sound at 80db.
also, check these graphs, the curves on this graph are how your ear acutally responds to audio reception.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/fletcher.gif
Your missing the point, the goal of speakers is to play things as you would hear them in real life for music...and as the mix engineer wants you to hear them in movies.
dont get me started on that. i think this stupid dorm room has a room gain of like 50billion on movie bass, i mean my 6.5" speakers are nice, but damn, i didnt think they could put out the amount of bass they do in movies, its like movies are JUST for the low end...
:oints to HK AVR 435 with Room Equalization::
Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: MIKEMIKE
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
take a look at this graph.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/abc.gif
in the audio world, the line that is red is called A weighting, it is how your ear actually operates. if something is measured at 80db at 20hz, then it is actually 30dbA under the A weighting scale. and I contest that you would have a VERY hard time picking up a 20hz sound at 80db.
also, check these graphs, the curves on this graph are how your ear acutally responds to audio reception.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/fletcher.gif
Your missing the point, the goal of speakers is to play things as you would hear them in real life for music...and as the mix engineer wants you to hear them in movies.
dont get me started on that. i think this stupid dorm room has a room gain of like 50billion on movie bass, i mean my 6.5" speakers are nice, but damn, i didnt think they could put out the amount of bass they do in movies, its like movies are JUST for the low end...
:oints to HK AVR 435 with Room Equalization::
Points to my Marantz 1120 with an underrated 60x2 at 6 hz, and my Vifa PJ6.5" mids, and my Northcreek D-25 speakers.
in movies i have to have my bass boost on the amp at -8 in order to settle the bass down enough.
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
take a look at this graph.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/abc.gif
in the audio world, the line that is red is called A weighting, it is how your ear actually operates. if something is measured at 80db at 20hz, then it is actually 30dbA under the A weighting scale. and I contest that you would have a VERY hard time picking up a 20hz sound at 80db.
also, check these graphs, the curves on this graph are how your ear acutally responds to audio reception.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/fletcher.gif
Your missing the point, the goal of speakers is to play things as you would hear them in real life for music...and as the mix engineer wants you to hear them in movies.
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
take a look at this graph.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/abc.gif
in the audio world, the line that is red is called A weighting, it is how your ear actually operates. if something is measured at 80db at 20hz, then it is actually 30dbA under the A weighting scale. and I contest that you would have a VERY hard time picking up a 20hz sound at 80db.
also, check these graphs, the curves on this graph are how your ear acutally responds to audio reception.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/fletcher.gif
Your missing the point, the goal of speakers is to play things as you would hear them in real life for music...and as the mix engineer wants you to hear them in movies.
I'm actually trying to make a point, not catch one . My point is this: it requires a lot of power to recreate low end frequencies, a lot, especially when you are at sub 40hz (the thick, rich bass) due to the response of the human ear. there is no 50 watt amp that is going to give you the power level you need in an 12"+ driver that will sound good those low frequencies.
All system far feild lsitening.Originally posted by: Howard
Are you saying that goes for all systems with a flat on-axis frequency response?
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: Cattlegod
Originally posted by: glen
You can't hear 80db?Originally posted by: Cattlegod
he is full of crap. a 20hz signal at 80db would be hardly even loud enough to hear. you need a LOT of power to put out the low frequencies at a high enough SPL to hear.
my system was putting out 140db at 33 hz with the windows up, and 147db at 33 hz with the windows down. It ended up taking 3rd place in the SPL drag race I entered it in.
You don't know what you are talking about.
That would be audible in any normal enviroment, and percieved as loud in a sound proof room. Loud car stereo systems are 110db. FOr lsitening, I can't see the need to produce mroe than 110 db.
take a look at this graph.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/abc.gif
in the audio world, the line that is red is called A weighting, it is how your ear actually operates. if something is measured at 80db at 20hz, then it is actually 30dbA under the A weighting scale. and I contest that you would have a VERY hard time picking up a 20hz sound at 80db.
also, check these graphs, the curves on this graph are how your ear acutally responds to audio reception.
http://www.eie.fceia.unr.edu.ar/~acustica/comite/fletcher.gif
Your missing the point, the goal of speakers is to play things as you would hear them in real life for music...and as the mix engineer wants you to hear them in movies.
I'm actually trying to make a point, not catch one . My point is this: it requires a lot of power to recreate low end frequencies, a lot, especially when you are at sub 40hz (the thick, rich bass) due to the response of the human ear. there is no 50 watt amp that is going to give you the power level you need in an 12"+ driver that will sound good those low frequencies.
Originally posted by: glen
All system far feild lsitening.Originally posted by: Howard
Are you saying that goes for all systems with a flat on-axis frequency response?
Far field is anything more than a foot, I think.
Car listenign is considered faar feild.
So many speakers (measured in an anechoic chamber) of high repute, then?Originally posted by: glen
All system far feild lsitening.Originally posted by: Howard
Are you saying that goes for all systems with a flat on-axis frequency response?
Far field is anything more than a foot, I think.
Car listenign is considered faar feild.
What are you asking?Originally posted by: Howard
So many speakers (measured in an anechoic chamber) of high repute, then?Originally posted by: glen
All system far feild lsitening.Originally posted by: Howard
Are you saying that goes for all systems with a flat on-axis frequency response?
Far field is anything more than a foot, I think.
Car listenign is considered faar feild.
Originally posted by: glen
What are you asking?Originally posted by: Howard
So many speakers (measured in an anechoic chamber) of high repute, then?Originally posted by: glen
All system far feild lsitening.Originally posted by: Howard
Are you saying that goes for all systems with a flat on-axis frequency response?
Far field is anything more than a foot, I think.
Car listenign is considered faar feild.