So why does Israel keep occuping the West Bank and Gaza?

[b0mbrman]

Besides, if there were no suicide bombings, no threats of militant attacks, then the IDF would likely do little in the way of occupation.

If the IDF started pulling out, would the suicide bombings stop? The past few months have shown that it is *not likely...

 

[TheOmegaCode]

<< well how is this any different from the Nazi era?
Nazis went into Poland and would basically just say "this is my brand new house", Israelis go into Palestine and destroy the homes and say "this is my new property"
difference?

yes i know that there are suicide bombers, i would blow myself up too if i know there was nothing to live for besides a bunch of guys in tanks coming to tear down my house. >>


If you think Poland was the first and/or the only country for the Nazi's to invade, you obviously don't have enough of a historical background to make this assumption...

 

[gopunk]

<< Their only real claim to that land is that God gave it to them in their Bible. >>



the only party that was there before them were the canaaites. you can give it back to them if you can find them. oh that's right, they were assimilated into the hebrew tribes. it's not like the "palestineans" have any more of a claim.

 

[shurato]

<< The Israelis have become the Nazis of the new Millenium (well actualy the last 40 years or so) so rationality and reason do not apply to their actions or motives. >>



WTF? Have we as human beings become desensitized to what the NAZI's were and what they did? Your comment makes me want to puke...I'm not even Jewish, i'm asian and I'm severely offended by this statement. I think a different analogy might actually get people to listen to your opinion...oh wait you didn't even state any facts to back your opinion... just a stupid irresponsible comment. Please refrain from pro-creating.

 

[ThePresence]

<< Please refrain from pro-creating. >>

 

[Chooco]

shurato let's look at some facts for a moment. similarities and differences between the Nazis ans the Israelis
SIMILARITIES:
-both claim land which is not theirs
-both choose to kick the poeple off the land instead of live with them
-both are committing war crimes (Nazis and their experiments, Israelies and their bombing of refugee camps)
-both denied red cross from treating the people they were attacking/had prisoner
-both are controlling the media (Nazis disallowed media to say what was going down in death camps and portray a good image for why they are having the war, Israeli disallows the media from taping what is going down on the front lines and disallowed any filming of interigations)
-both are invading because of retribution (after WW1 Germany had to pay equivalent of 100 billion dollars reparations and WW2 was sort of a pay back on the world for putting them into a depression as well as Hitler and his own personal agenda, Israel is attacking because they are tired of getting attacked by surrounding Arab countries which have somewhat stone-age weapons)

DIFFERENCES:
-no messed up/cruel experiments
-no killing people just for the hell of it (Israelis kill them if they don't leave but if they are leaving they won't get shot in the back like the Nazis would have done)
-Israel's retribution is for war, Nazi's was for imposing a depression on the country


there's more but i can't think of them off the top of my head.
editted for grammer

 

[tontod]

Umm, there's absolutely no comparison. Do you see the Israelis sending millions of Palestinians to gas chambers? I think not. Israelis are doing this in response to the suicide bombings. The Nazis were much more inhumane on a completely different level.

 

[ThePresence]

<< Umm, there's absolutely no comparison. Do you see the Israelis sending millions of Palestinians to gas chambers? I think not. Israelis are doing this in response to the suicide bombings. The Nazis were much more inhumane on a completely different level. >>



tontod did you really find it necessary to reply to such pure idiocy?

 

[b0mbrman]

Mmm...this should be interesting

 

[tontod]

ThePresence : I guess it is futile to argue with someone like this. Shouldn't have wasted the bandwidth. Couldn't help but try to prove a point, but thats useless in this case.

 

[Texmaster]

<< there's 2 ways to go down in Palestine:
1. Israel tears your house down and shoots you dead
2. Israel tears your house down and you blow up military guys at a border check stop

eye for an eye tought in the Jewish bible fits more along the lines of answer number 2 >>



Wow. I heard you were dumb but not on a Biblical scale.

 

[shurato]

/me Pukes.... i'm not even going to bother. On another note...the fact that Arafat and other PA officials could call the Israelis, NAZI's (I've seen this quoted in many news articles) makes me want to puke some more...If I was Jewish, I don't think I could control my rage if someone refferred to me as a Nazi.

 

[b0mbrman]

<< yes i know that there are suicide bombers, i would blow myself up too if i know there was nothing to live for besides a bunch of guys in tanks coming to tear down my house. >>


Are you sure you truly believe that?

If it does, then I'd do some serious soul-searching. Somewhere along the line, someone convinced you that trying to kill civilians while killing yourself at the same time was justifiable

BTW, when people are trying to argue that Palestinians are really good people, they usually just ignore the suicide bombings...if someone asks you a question about suicide bombing, just say "Well, Israel does bad stuff too"

 

[Texmaster]

<< /me Pukes.... i'm not even going to bother. On another note...the fact that Arafat and other PA officials could call the Israelis, NAZI's (I've seen this quoted in many news articles) makes me want to puke some more...If I was Jewish, I don't think I could control my rage if someone refferred to me as a Nazi. >>



News Articles? I've seen people say it here!

 

[shurato]

<<

<< /me Pukes.... i'm not even going to bother. On another note...the fact that Arafat and other PA officials could call the Israelis, NAZI's (I've seen this quoted in many news articles) makes me want to puke some more...If I was Jewish, I don't think I could control my rage if someone refferred to me as a Nazi. >>



News Articles? I've seen people say it here! >>



Well...joeblow from ATOT saying it is a bit different from Arafat spoutin that sh!t....Well the PA has no credibility anymore anyways but it's still irresponsible as a human being to even say such a thing. Geez, don't they teach people about the holocaust in high school anymore?
This isn't directed at you of course.

 

[Chooco]

if you think that this is in no way similar to what the Nazis did then this is bound to happen AGAIN because it shows that none of you can recognize when there is a problem that needs to be fixed.
as for eye-for-an-eye, it's in the later part of Exodus when Moses brings down the commandments and lays down the rules. in Moses' part of describing how justice is, it says that people who do wrongs WILL be punished by death. there is even a part of Ezekiel where Moses condems a man to death just because he was caught gathering sticks on the Sabath, and you say that the bible does NOT teach eye-for-an-eye?

 

[ThePresence]

Hey Chooco, as a former soldier in the IDF, I guess that makes me one of your fantasy "Nazis". Interesting. My relatives happened to be brutally murdered by the Nazis. I'd advise you to get a friggin clue or just STFU. Im surprised I even bothered replying, but it does piss me off in no small way to hear idiots like you babble.

 

[Format C:]

God loves children, idiots, and fools. Smile Chooco, God loves you! A lot.

 

[Chooco]

Presense are you infering that when Germany steals land and kills those who resist it is evil but when Israelis do it, it suddenly becomes acceptable? i think i'll go setup a tent on your lawn then call you a terrorist when you yell at me to go away.

 

[ThePresence]

<< Presense are you infering that when Germany steals land and kills those who resist it is evil but when Israelis do it, it suddenly becomes acceptable? i think i'll go setup a tent on your lawn then call you a terrorist when you yell at me to go away. >>



Wow. You really ARE a moron. Germany wasn't "evil" because it attacked another country and occupied it's land. Thousands of countries have done that in the past. Thats not why the Nazis were evil. They were evil because they created killing camps for the express purpose of killing innocents. They were evil because everything they represented was evil, not because of the German army. BTW, setting up a tent on my "lawn" will prolly get you mugged very quickly. Things like that happen in NYC.

 

[Turkey]

AAAAAAAAAAAAHHH!

ok. much better.

 

[alrocky]

You set a precedent for giving in to terrorism and it will be used more & more against you.
quote by MartyTheManiak << but you missed my point. Terrorism will CONTINUE to be used no matter what Israel does.>>

Your point has no point if as you say "T<U>errorism will CONTINUE</U>". And your statement "T<U>errorism will CONTINUE</U>" also suggest that the Palestinians and or the Arab nations at large will not stop until they destoy Isreal. Or did you not notice that?

Thus if it matters not what Isreal does, there is no compelling reason for her to relinquish the land. (Your 3 points in your first posts don't sound correct nor compelling.)

b0mberman, perhaps no cares about those 900 Muslim deaths in Gujarart because they can't blame Isreal for it.

I thought maybe it was just me, but Chooco's posts seems to make less and less sense.

 

[WarCon]

Chooco, maybe you should study your bible a little more carefully and fully in context. Not every law or commandment had to be prefaced by all of the other commandments that obviously take precedence. But you have to know all the laws to be able to preface any of them. Lawyers take laws literally (out of context or intent) for selfish interest, not people seeking justice.

Eye for an eye has always been explained to me as something like this (with mercy governing your decisions) if you blind a man you be his eyes. If you kill (not murder) a man, you take over his duties to support his family. The foundations of justice are found in Jewish law. You know two or more witnesses, etc. At least the justice of western ideology.

 

[b0mbrman]

<< b0mberman, perhaps no cares about those 900 Muslim deaths in Gujarart because they can't blame Isreal for it. >>




You hit it right on the 'ead. Although you can extend it and say "because they can't blame Israel or the US for it."

 

[Mats]

"Because the real answer is rooted in something very deep. It has to do with the contrast between Islam's self-perception as the most ideal and complete expression of the three great monotheistic religions ? Judaism, Christianity and Islam ? and the conditions of poverty, repression and underdevelopment in which most Muslims live today."

Extracted from:
"The Core of Muslim Rage"
Commentary by Thomas L. Friedman
for The New York Times

It was posted a few months ago, this debate is so tired already.