Some College/Major Advice Please

[ath50]

Ok, I've been accepted to both schools so now I need to decide, Cornell or Carnegie Mellon. Both are top schools for the field I'm considering right now (Computer Science or Information Sciences).

So the quick questions for those who don't really want to read, naturally responses from current students, alumni, employers/coworkers of graduates, anyone who has a decent perspective, etc would be most appreciated.

1. Do you think Carnegie Mellon or Cornell would be a better match for someone with the intent of studying CS/IS right now?

2. Between the two majors, Computer Science and Information Systems, what do you think the main differences are, and which one would you recommend going into now?
(it seems that most people have been in favor of Computer Science so far)

________________________________________________________________________

Now for some more details, I can update as necesssary. Keep in mind these are my current impressions, feel free to dispute.

The Colleges

Between the two colleges, I think Carnegie Mellon has the slight academic advantage with its CS and IS departments, though Cornell's CS department is still top notch. I like Cornell's campus a lot more, Carnegie Mellon has a pretty dull campus. Carnegie Mellon obviously has Pittsburgh right there, while Cornell has nothing. The social scene is likely to be a lot more "normal" I guess at Cornell, as opposed to Carnegie Mellon which has at least an image of a having a lot more "dorky" people, but hey I'm kinda dorky myself so that isn't a problem Then again I'm worried that I won't get as good of a social experience at CMU.

On the side, I also got accepted into University of Pittsburgh and the new integrated Computer Science and Business program at Lehigh University, and I got a very significant amount of merit scholarship from each, but my parents will be able to handle the costs of CMU and Cornell. Not to say that its "nothing" but it seems like Cornell and CMU are a level above Pitt and Lehigh.

The Majors

As for the majors, I'm not entirely sure on which one is better. I'm taking AP Computer Science now and I'm doing fine with it, but I'm sure the actual major in college is a lot different. What we're doing right now is more of an introduction to java and writing programs, as opposed to a comp sci major which would involve a lot more theory and math. Information Systems seems like it might be Comp sci - lite. It has more focus on applying computer systems to real world situations, probably more business oriented. At CMU they said that IS just overtook CS as the majors that got the highest starting salary out of college, I'm interested in learning more about what different jobs CS majors are getting as opposed to IS majors. Which one would be better in the long term?

Thank you

UPDATE: Well it seems like if I choose to go to CMU, Computer Science is the way to start out, and its possible to move down to IS if necessary.

Adding some links for people who just feel bored and want to browse

CMU Department of Computer Science
CMU Information Systems Department

Cornell Computer Science
Cornell Information Science

Lehigh Computer Science and Business

UPDATE2: 3/31 I got accepted into Cornell

 

[OverVolt]

I'm just hoping failing english 2nd sem wont effect my chances of going to UMBC. I was absent for 1week during term paper, teacher didn't care, had no idea wtf was going on while i was sick/could not go out with strep/did not have resources at home needed to write this paper. So, had to do an 8page paper in one day, with a migrane(symptom of my migranes is that i have a hard time reading, especially from computer screens) after taking 6make-up tests and making up a weeks worth of assignments. One day, not possible. I'm really pissed as this can really fvck my future over, i do not want to go to CC because i am much smarter than that, just unfortunate circumstances.

My teacher is an a-hole btw.

edit: my major for now is chemisty, UMBC has very good sciences majors, and even if i do switch it will be science related.

I have thought about taking a CS major but i feel that for the amount of work and cost put into getting the degree it is a huge/unwarranted risk when it comes to being able to find a job in that field. If you have any other interest you really ought to consider them. Don't go for an IS.

 

[gopunk]

if you are absolutely sure you will stick with CS (most people change majors several times), then go with carnegie mellon. cornell is in the top 10 or something for CS, but CMU is at the very top.

if you're choosing between CS and IS, i would go with CS, assuming you like the curriculum. you can go to IS from CS, but not the other way around.



edit: whoops! fixed the part in bold from IS to CS

 

[pclstyle]

Originally posted by: gopunk
if you are absolutely sure you will stick with CS (most people change majors several times), then go with carnegie mellon. cornell is in the top 10 or something for CS, but CMU is at the very top.

if you're choosing between CS and IS, i would go with IS, assuming you like the curriculum. you can go to IS from CS, but not the other way around.

 

[mzkhadir]

have you talked with any one at the colleges to see what they say or how they sell themselves.

 

[Ameesh]

Originally posted by: gopunk
if you are absolutely sure you will stick with CS (most people change majors several times), then go with carnegie mellon. cornell is in the top 10 or something for CS, but CMU is at the very top.

if you're choosing between CS and IS, i would go with IS, assuming you like the curriculum. you can go to IS from CS, but not the other way around.

i disagree with the second part, absolutley don't get an Information Science degree, Computer Science is usually the core program and IS is just a watered down version for flunky comp sci people.

most big software companies will not hire people with IS degrees for development jobs. many of them will just toss your resume for any technical position.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: Ameesh

Originally posted by: gopunk
if you are absolutely sure you will stick with CS (most people change majors several times), then go with carnegie mellon. cornell is in the top 10 or something for CS, but CMU is at the very top.

if you're choosing between CS and IS, i would go with IS, assuming you like the curriculum. you can go to IS from CS, but not the other way around.

i disagree with the second part, absolutley don't get an Information Science degree, Computer Science is usually the core program and IS is just a watered down version for flunky comp sci people.

most big software companies will not hire people with IS degrees for development jobs. many of them will just toss your resume for any technical position.

sorry ameesh, it was a typo. meant to say CS you know i agree with you

 

[frankie38]

Congratulations on your acceptance! Cornell and Carnegie Mellon are both great schools!

Before I give an opinion on which CS program is "better", I would like to know your plans after graduating with a BS in CS.

Do you intend on getting a MS in CS? Do you intend on working in the IT field?

If yes, what Industry? Business IT, Defense Dept, Academic, etc.?

My last comment is that the IT business is changing. Outsourcing is a major factor and high paying jobs such programmers and engineers are being outsourced outside the US.

The future for IT business is not that bright. I do think that there is a real need for CS PHD's for research and development.

 

[Ameesh]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Ameesh

Originally posted by: gopunk
if you are absolutely sure you will stick with CS (most people change majors several times), then go with carnegie mellon. cornell is in the top 10 or something for CS, but CMU is at the very top.

if you're choosing between CS and IS, i would go with IS, assuming you like the curriculum. you can go to IS from CS, but not the other way around.

i disagree with the second part, absolutley don't get an Information Science degree, Computer Science is usually the core program and IS is just a watered down version for flunky comp sci people.

most big software companies will not hire people with IS degrees for development jobs. many of them will just toss your resume for any technical position.

sorry ameesh, it was a typo. meant to say CS you know i agree with you

i figured it was a typo.

CMU is a good school, i was also accepted into it for comp sci but the reason i declined and went to UCSD was two fold, one is the environment good there, am i going to be happy working there for years, two what companies are local, what kind of relationship do they have with the school, is it easy to find co-op positions that you can do during the year? three are you going to be happy there?

the whole area around CMU sucks in my opinion, UCSD is in beautiful san diego, UCSD gets more research money, the campus has a very varied populace and in general has better facilities.

compare cornell and cmu together and see what makes sense to you and try not to be myopic when you make your choice.

 

[bpatters69]

Congratulations. You are considering two top notch schools. I am impressed that you are so focused and still have not set foot on a college campus yet. It took me a year to figure out what I wanted to do.

I will give you my take which is probably a lot less scientific than others. I am going by what common sense tells me vs. strict empirical data.

Computer Science is great and I am sure you can make a solid income but IS will make you more well rounded from a management standpoint. With IS you will get exposure to a lot of technologies and also take several management classes (unless something has changed since I was in school). Getting into management will one day allow you to make strategic (decisions that have a dramatic effect) for your company.

I really don't like the direction that programming\computer science is taking. Many of those jobs are the first jobs to be shipped off to India and China. At least with IS, you will (at least for now) need to be here in the US. Choosing a career is partly based on your interests and also what is going to be marketable. I vote more well rounded and thus IS. Maybe I don't completely understand what CS is and if that is the case, oh well. Just one impression.

If I could do college again, I would take IS in a heartbeat. I chose marketing. What a complete waste of time.

HTH

Nice Stealth College gloat. I am jealous. ;-)

 

[frankie38]

UCSD is beauiful. I miss Lajolla, Pacific Beach, Mission Beach, Olde Towne........

 

[Insomnium]

#2 -> Of the two, get a C.S. degree. Don't even think about I.S. as that will not look nearly as attractive to employers and doesn't lend itself to further post-graduate study should you choose that route.

#1 -> I would honestly urge you to go to Cornell over Carnegie Mellon for a plethora of reasons. If you ever decide that you do not want to pursue a CS degree after a few classes or semesters (as many people do, including myself), you will have a much larger selection of majors to choose from at Cornell than at CM, and the departments will be much stronger than at CM. As far as social life goes, it's much, much better at Cornell than at CM, from what I gather from my friends. Granted, Cornell is kinda in the middle of nowhere, but you'll always find stuff to do and will always find people to hang with. The only drawback to Cornell is that it is a large school, which you may or may not like, and the weather is kinda wet/snowy and sh1tty much of the year (but the same goes for Pittsburgh really). I'd go to Cornell for its range of options and choices, both academic and social.

 

[HardcoreRobot]

at my current company, non-engineers/scientists dont get any love. we do a lot of software engineering an IT work, and they just dont hire MIS or other type businessy pseudo science majors. strictly computer science, EE for the tech jobs. that being said, if you can handle the work and you enjoy it, go CS. academically-only speaking, CMU is the better choice IMO. lots of respect for that CS dept. though, there are a LOT of other factors. Cornell very good and if you decide on that for other reasons, its not like you are taking a huge step backwards.

dont worry about the dorky image. dorks and geeks can definitely party and have a good time. if you are like that a bit as well, you may fit right in. of course there will always be socially inept dorks, but you will find that even at the biggest state schools. even at the DORKIEST schools, college is still a VERY social experience, so i wouldnt worry about that.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: bpatters69
Congratulations. You are considering two top notch schools. I am impressed that you are so focused and still have not set foot on a college campus yet. It took me a year to figure out what I wanted to do.

I will give you my take which is probably a lot less scientific than others. I am going by what common sense tells me vs. strict empirical data.

Computer Science is great and I am sure you can make a solid income but IS will make you more well rounded from a management standpoint. With IS you will get exposure to a lot of technologies and also take several management classes (unless something has changed since I was in school). Getting into management will one day allow you to make strategic (decisions that have a dramatic effect) for your company.

I really don't like the direction that programming\computer science is taking. Many of those jobs are the first jobs to be shipped off to India and China. At least with IS, you will (at least for now) need to be here in the US. Choosing a career is partly based on your interests and also what is going to be marketable. I vote more well rounded and thus IS. Maybe I don't completely understand what CS is and if that is the case, oh well. Just one impression.

If I could do college again, I would take IS in a heartbeat. I chose marketing. What a complete waste of time.

HTH

Nice Stealth College gloat. I am jealous. ;-)

i agree with you, except that if he is planning on going into management, i think he's better served with a CS degree and getting an MBA. there are 4 choices if he plans on going into management:

IS
CS
IS + MBA
CS + MBA

the latter is the best, imo.

 

[cchen]

So you've already been accepted at CMU for CS? OR are you just speculating?

 

[ath50]

Yes I have been accepted to CMU's Computer Science and Information Sciences programs, still waiting to hear from Cornell.

Thanks for the comments, keep them coming

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: ath50
The Majors

As for the majors, I'm not entirely sure on which one is better. I'm taking AP Computer Science now and I'm doing fine with it, but I'm sure the actual major in college is a lot different. What we're doing right now is more of an introduction to java and writing programs, as opposed to a comp sci major which would involve a lot more theory and math. Information Systems seems like it might be Comp sci - lite. It has more focus on applying computer systems to real world situations, probably more business oriented. At CMU they said that IS just overtook CS as the majors that got the highest starting salary out of college, I'm interested in learning more about what different jobs CS majors are getting as opposed to IS majors. Which one would be better in the long term?

Thank you

From CMU's website it indeed seems that IS is a watered-down version of CS with some emphasis redirected to management, ethics and informational organization. While I generally feel that the real $$$ to be made in the world comes from directing all of your energies into becoming an expert in a narrow area of knowledge, this is not the right way to go about it. Better to get a degree in CS and take courses later on to refine your management skills.

 

[cchen]

CMU has the most prestigious CS program for undergrads, and one of the top graduate programs as well. CMU CS >>>> Cornell CS. CMU CS grads are aggressively recruited for the top jobs. If I were you, I would choose CMU for CS, and definitely not IS.

 

[Ameesh]

Originally posted by: cchen
CMU has the most prestigious CS program for undergrads, and one of the top graduate programs as well. CMU CS >>>> Cornell CS. CMU CS grads are aggressively recruited for the top jobs. If I were you, I would choose CMU for CS, and definitely not IS.

you can get prestigious jobs from any school, internships matter more then anything else.

 

[frankie38]

Originally posted by: cchen
CMU has the most prestigious CS program for undergrads, and one of the top graduate programs as well..

CMU is in the top 10 CS programs in the US. Their Grad program is top notch.

I believe that CMU also recieves a substantial amount of $ for research.

With that said, Cornell does have an excellent reputation as an IVY LEAGUE SCHOOL.

I do not think that their CS program is on the same level as CMU.

 

[cchen]

Originally posted by: Ameesh

Originally posted by: cchen
CMU has the most prestigious CS program for undergrads, and one of the top graduate programs as well. CMU CS >>>> Cornell CS. CMU CS grads are aggressively recruited for the top jobs. If I were you, I would choose CMU for CS, and definitely not IS.

you can get prestigious jobs from any school, internships matter more then anything else.

true, but CMU CS is by far the most difficult undergrad CS program to gain acceptance into. That being said, your peers will be some of the most talented CS students, which adds another aspect if you're REALLY into CS

 

[frankie38]

Full Disclosure: BS Computer Science SUNY at Stony Brook.

When I graduated, Stony Brook's undergrad program was focused on getting you into a MS/PH program. All students were told that BS CS does not prepare you to be a programmer. If you wanted to be a programmer then you should go somewhere else (ie Devry or Chubb).

After many years I now understand that statement and agree completely.

After I graduated with my BS. I turned sown lucrative offers to work in Defense industry. I knew I wanted to work in the business/Corporate world.

I think that internships/coop opportunities really help if you are interested in working in the Corporate world. Less so if you are going to get your PHD.

I still give CMU a slight edge in the snobby CS world. However, Cornell U still looks great on a resume.

 

[OverVolt]

Hhahaha plethora, that word makes me laugh.

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: frankie38
Full Disclosure: BS Computer Science SUNY at Stony Brook.

When I graduated, Stony Brook's undergrad program was focused on getting you into a MS/PH program. All students were told that BS CS does not prepare you to be a programmer. If you wanted to be a programmer then you should go somewhere else (ie Devry or Chubb).

After many years I now understand that statement and agree completely.

After I graduated with my BS. I turned sown lucrative offers to work in Defense industry. I knew I wanted to work in the business/Corporate world.

I think that internships/coop opportunities really help if you are interested in working in the Corporate world. Less so if you are going to get your PHD.

I still give CMU a slight edge in the snobby CS world. However, Cornell U still looks great on a resume.

CMU's Ph.D program is the #1 program in the country, if I recall correctly...the undergraduate program is also one of the most competitive on the East Coast.

CMU > Cornell, at least in this aspect of things.

 

[markgm]

I was all set on going to CMU for Engineering back in '98. I visited and liked what I saw, but after the tour I walked around and saw that what they showed me and what classes were really like weren't the same thing (always sit in on a few classes!)

The day I was driving up to visit CMU I got a postcard for Drexel University, which I had never heard of. I liked what I saw (I know...from a POSTCARD!!) and visited it the next week. I applied, was accepted on the spot, and started off as a Mechanical Engineering student. After my first year of five (they have a coop program where you have 3 6 month co-ops) I decided that engineering wasn't what I wanted to do, so I switched to IST. They have one of the highest rated IST programs, so that worked out well.

CS is more programming, IST is more useless, I mean, theory. I wound up getting a job at IBM with it, and would do it again!