AFAIK it's >250mm^2 die.I have seen this slide before, but I have never found any value how big 'Large Die' is. Anyone knows?
AFAIK it's >250mm^2 die.I have seen this slide before, but I have never found any value how big 'Large Die' is. Anyone knows?
I think we're looking at two variations of the 7nm process here. Mobile, where density and low power is supreme and HPC, (aka N7 Large Die), where clocks have more value. Probably trying to be as dense as possible introduces more defects than slacker density rules. EUV with the fantastic line resolution it brings will change things for a while.You are right but they strangely put out this slide where the big dies have even better yield (or less defects) than the small ones or i'm reading it incorrectly.
I agree it looks like a pipe dream right now, we already discussed this leak before. But that's solely Intel's problem to solve. AMD problem is to be prepared for wherever its competition might be at a given time, pipe dream or not.This is a pipe dream, IMO. I mean, it looks pretty- very orthogonal. Looks like something drawn up by marketing, not engineering (you’d think they’d learn from tick-tock). As feature size decreases, neat little patterns break down.
According to the pic's source, it's 250mm squared or higher.I have seen this slide before, but I have never found any value how big 'Large Die' is. Anyone knows?
If intel wins just because of the higher clock, then stop talking about IPC. If intel had significantly better IPC, then they wouldn’t need higher clocks to win. Conversely, if you have something that scales very well with clock speed, then that means it isn’t dependent on memory latency. It has to be very cacheable for that to work. Regardless of the reasons, intel winning at super low quality isn’t actually important. I have seen quite a few benchmarks where they are already flat, even at 1080p.Compared to Matisse, it's more the all core frequency that's the difference.
Don’t know what the second one is, but the first one is defect density reduction over time, not absolute defect density. That sounds like a good way to make it look good when it isn’t. I would expect them to have good and fast reduction in defect density since it probably started out absolutely terrible. Also, if that is 20 nm planar? Did we ever get a big gpu on 20 nm? I thought they skipped that node.According to the pic's source, it's 250mm squared or higher.
There's also this article where the graph is very similar (colors changed and doesn't have the "large die" bit) but, most importantly, gives us N7's defect density.
View attachment 17167 View attachment 17166
Don’t know what the second one is, but the first one is defect density reduction over time, not absolute defect density. That sounds like a good way to make it look good when it isn’t. I would expect them to have good and fast reduction in defect density since it probably started out absolutely terrible. Also, if that is 20 nm planar? Did we ever get a big gpu on 20 nm? I thought they skipped that node.
We haven’t really gotten much in the way of large GPUs on 7 nm. Nvidia seems to have released a set of higher clocked rebrands at 12 nm rather than 7 nm parts. The mi60 is 331 square mm, but that is a low volume and very expensive part. Nvidia Ampere should be coming eventually, which will give us some info. I don’t think the yields are that good, so smaller chips will still be preferred going forward.
Edit: actually how available are AMD 7 nm GPUs?
What is X3D? It is a hybrid of 2.5D packaging, aka interposers/MCMs, and 3D chip stacking, aka HBM/vias. When will it happen? SemiAccurate’s best info says that it will be in Milan, just like we told you last April. Be honest, I’ll bet you thought we were joking back then, right? In any case it sounds like the X3D version will only be in some variants of Milan but will be much more prominent in Genoa.
If true AMD will have a track record of revamping their packaging every single Zen gen (discounting the consumer only Zen+ filler).According to Charlie, some form of X3D will make it to Milan/Zen 3. If there is someone out there that I would trust when it come to these things it would be Charlie.
AMD talks direction and tech at Financial Analysts Day
AMD had their Financial Analyst Day yesterday and SemiAccurate found a lot of goodies.www.semiaccurate.com
So it seems we could expect some form of stacking in Zen3.
According to Charlie, some form of X3D will make it to Milan/Zen 3. If there is someone out there that I would trust when it come to these things it would be Charlie.
AMD talks direction and tech at Financial Analysts Day
AMD had their Financial Analyst Day yesterday and SemiAccurate found a lot of goodies.www.semiaccurate.com
So it seems we could expect some form of stacking in Zen3.
What would that have to do with reporting on AMD?Ehh, I wouldn't trust Charlie too much. He really seems to dislike Intel.
I am confused on release. Last July they were saying Zen3 would be out June 2020. Now there are post stating March 2021.
Is there any news about when that know?
I was going to get one in June but has it shifted a year?
I'm not sure where are you getting that info from? We have just had Analyst Day, they stated Zen3 will be coming in late 2020 (desktop presumably).
...Zen 3 processors are on track to launch this financial year, giving us a window of anywhere between now and March 2021.
AMD has promised that its Zen 3 architecture be introduced later this year, while consumer CPUs powered by the Zen 3 architecture will arrive in March 2021.
Either way, the fact that we know AMD Zen 3 processors will be hitting the streets by March next year is helpful, even if AMD didn't help narrow the window any further.
AMD Zen 3 processors will arrive by March 2021 at the latest
And 5nm AMD Zen 4 will follow by 2022www.techradar.comAMD says it will have Zen 3 processors by March 2021, Zen 4 in 2022
AMD's next-gen Zen 3 CPUs will be here in March 2021 on 7nm, Zen 4 arrives on 5nm in 2022.www.tweaktown.comAMD’s latest roadmap update details timeline for Zen 3, Zen 4, RDNA 2 and RDNA 3 - KitGuru
Yesterday during AMD's Financial Analyst Day, the company gave insight into future releases, includiwww.kitguru.net
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Seems people are confused about it.
In this graph, we see that the Zen 3 product here is on the far right, but so is the date – 2021. Does this mean Zen 3 for consumers is coming 2021? We asked AMD to clarify, and were told that we should interpret this as that the range of Zen 3 consumer products, such as desktop CPUs, HEDT CPUs, mobile APUs, and consumer APUs, should all be available by the end of 2021. The company clarified that Zen 3 will hit the consumer market ‘later this year’, meaning late 2020.
When did AMD say June 2020?I am confused on release. Last July they were saying Zen3 would be out June 2020. Now there are post stating March 2021.
Is there any news about when that know?
I was going to get one in June but has it shifted a year?
Financial year goes until March 2021. But AMD stated Milan (the Ecpyc server chips) is "late this year" whereas Vermeer (the Ryzen desktop chips) is "later this year" which I'd assume is earlier than "late this year". *shrugs*
Good call. Nowhere, just assumed (made an *** out of u and me, etc.) when the others mentioned march 2021 as part of the year, and I know many Japanese companies do follow such fiscal years. But yeah, AMD uses the calendar year as fiscal year. Thanks for correcting me.Where did you get that AMD's fiscal year ends in march?
I think it's nVidia that uses a "strange" fiscal yearGood call. Nowhere, just assumed (made an *** out of u and me, etc.) when the others mentioned march 2021 as part of the year, and I know many Japanese companies do follow such fiscal years. But yeah, AMD uses the calendar year as fiscal year. Thanks for correcting me.
That would be reasonable, there may be a case for making Threadripper a pre-Christmas release though it's definitely less holiday-sensitive than desktop.Maybe:
- Desktop September 2020 (first models)- Server November 2020- Threadripper January 2021- APUs March 2021 (last models)?
Right. Also, laptop/mobile is the only area that AMD does not currently dominate (except the 1% high end of gamers that want a 9900k for the most fps).That would be reasonable, there may be a case for making Threadripper a pre-Christmas release though it's definitely less holiday-sensitive than desktop.
The most important thing for AMD (IMO) is to get Zen2 Ryzen 4000 mobile CPUs in as many lineups as possible before school starts up again.
I would switch TR and APU, they're pushing on the laptop market AND there's really no need of a new TR, they can definitely focus on the other productsMaybe:
- Desktop September 2020 (first models)- Server November 2020- Threadripper January 2021- APUs March 2021 (last models)?