St. Louis minimum wage will drop from $10 to $7.70

[brycejones]

Sure. It was min wage and I'm fine with that. What I'm not fine with is calling a min wage a livable wage. It was never intended to be that as evidenced by its beginnings of 25 cents/hr.

Yep we could never figure out how to improve on an idea that is more than 100 years old. Makes complete sense.

 

[Sea Ray]

Yep we could never figure out how to improve on an idea that is more than 100 years old. Makes complete sense.

If you have an idea on how to improve on it, post it here. For the time being a min wage is just that and no more.

 

[brycejones]

If you have an idea on how to improve on it, post it here. For the time being a min wage is just that and no more.

Its called the living wage, but you've already shit canned the concept in your own mind which is why you ask questions like the one you just did.

Generally you're a pretty polite guy but you've got massive blindspots and its like things just sail right by you without registering. Its like the healthcare thread where you just kept refusing to accept how the GOP was sabotaging the ACA.

 

[Sea Ray]

Its called the living wage, but you've already shit canned the concept in your own mind which is why you ask questions like the one you just did.

Generally you're a pretty polite guy but you've got massive blindspots and its like things just sail right by you without registering. Its like the healthcare thread where you just kept refusing to accept how the GOP was sabotaging the ACA.

This thread is about the minimum wage. If you want to talk about a living wage then it has nothing to do with St Louis or this thread.

So let's put the min wage aside. What do you envision gov't doing about a living wage? I'm not sure there's a role for gov't here but I have an open mind and I'll definitely hear you out.

 

[JSt0rm]

This thread is about the minimum wage. If you want to talk about a living wage then it has nothing to do with St Louis or this thread.

So let's put the min wage aside. What do you envision gov't doing about a living wage? I'm not sure there's a role for gov't here but I have an open mind and I'll definitely hear you out.

How can people afford your medical insurance on minimum wage?

 

[Engineer]

How can people afford your medical insurance on minimum wage?

Get bigger bootstraps.

 

[brycejones]

This thread is about the minimum wage. If you want to talk about a living wage then it has nothing to do with St Louis or this thread.

So let's put the min wage aside. What do you envision gov't doing about a living wage? I'm not sure there's a role for gov't here but I have an open mind and I'll definitely hear you out.

Given your history of not really honestly engaging why don't you do some research on the living wage?

Sorry but your willful ignorance in the healthcare thread left a bad taste maybe someone else here will try.

 

[agent00f]

You're too slow to get my point? I guess I have to hit you right between the eyes with it:

FDR signed a bill that legalized paying a wage that was by all accounts not "livable" and defended it afterwards showing that he was fully supportive of it.

If you want to pivot to years after his death that's fine but it has nothing to do with FDR

The counterargument you were playing too dumb to ever understand was that it was a livable wage then.

 

[Jhhnn]

Sure. It was min wage and I'm fine with that. What I'm not fine with is calling a min wage a livable wage. It was never intended to be that as evidenced by its beginnings of 25 cents/hr.

False-

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=15405

 

[Sea Ray]

How can people afford your medical insurance on minimum wage?

People can't afford my insurance on a 6 figure income.

 

[Sea Ray]

False-

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=15405

True unless you're arguing that 25 cents/hr was a living wage back then.

 

[Sea Ray]

Given your history of not really honestly engaging why don't you do some research on the living wage?

Sorry but your willful ignorance in the healthcare thread left a bad taste maybe someone else here will try.

Once again you can't carry on a conversation. If there's something that can make your point then bring it to my attention. It's not my job to research your points. If you care to make one, do so

 

[Sea Ray]

The counterargument you were playing too dumb to ever understand was that it was a livable wage then.

Ok. It was $4.20hr by today's dollars. If you think that was above the poverty line, I think you're mistaken

While FLSA mandated a minimum wage to prevent such dangerous child labor conditions, the initial design of the policy suggests it was never intended to be completely livable or support an entire family on its own.

https://www.americanactionforum.org...mum-wage-and-combating-poverty/#ixzz4n9cRL2Tb

 

[agent00f]

Ok. It was $4.20hr by today's dollars. If you think that was above the poverty line, I think you're mistaken


https://www.americanactionforum.org...mum-wage-and-combating-poverty/#ixzz4n9cRL2Tb

Unlike Jhhnn types I don't play along when your sort ignore what's said and pretend to be forever dumb.

 

[ch33zw1z]

People can't afford my insurance on a 6 figure income.

Erm, yes they do.

Your definition of afford needs adjustment.

In fact, percentage wise, yours would be 15% of a 100k salary.

Mine was 20% until about a year ago, and it's only much less due to a union.

 

[J.Wilkins]

Our minimum wage is $8.50 which is a liveable wage. Of course, given that we have national health care and universal paid leave for 5.6 weeks and other benefits that are not available to minimum wage workers in the US, is quite a bit more.

The US idea seems to be to supplement the wages with food stamps for those in need which isn't actually social benefits for the receiver of the food stamps but for the employer that prefers to add to profits rather than pay their workers a decent wage.

The idea that "these jobs are just for college kids" isn't different from the argument that was made when child labour was abolished.

 

[Sea Ray]

Erm, yes they do.

Your definition of afford needs adjustment.

In fact, percentage wise, yours would be 15% of a 100k salary.

Mine was 20% until about a year ago, and it's only much less due to a union.

Not really. Mine is $1500/mo. That's 18% and that doesn't include the huge deductibles. But that's neither here nor there in a min wage thread

 

[ch33zw1z]

Not really. Mine is $1500/mo. That's 18% and that doesn't include the huge deductibles. But that's neither here nor there in a min wage thread

you stated 100k

and, 18% is pretty standard now. enjoy.

 

[Sea Ray]

you stated 100k

and, 18% is pretty standard now. enjoy.

Yes I stated $100K. Do the math. That's 18%

 

[Puffnstuff]

Yes I stated $100K. Do the math. That's 18%

18 percent on the money.

 

[Sea Ray]

18 percent on the money.

Yeah, it's not tough math. I'm wondering what the problem is

 

[ch33zw1z]

Just me being dumb, lol. Doing too many things at once and not doing the math in my head right.

Either way, 18% is pretty standard now.

I don't think it's a good thing though. It sucks for a middle class family.

While being raised...I was taught to expect certain things, like a mortgage, to be a certain percent. Healthcare wasn't really considered, and definitely not at that percentage.

 

[Sea Ray]

Just me being dumb, lol. Doing too many things at once and not doing the math in my head right.

Either way, 18% is pretty standard now.

I don't think it's a good thing though. It sucks for a middle class family.

While being raised...I was taught to expect certain things, like a mortgage, to be a certain percent. Healthcare wasn't really considered, and definitely not at that percentage.

It sure isn't and this is one of many reasons why ACA has been a failure. It's not affordable.

I will write more about this in the healthcare forum.

 

[runzwithsizorz]

You're too slow to get my point? I guess I have to hit you right between the eyes with it:

FDR signed a bill that legalized paying a wage that was by all accounts not "livable" and defended it afterwards showing that he was fully supportive of it.

If you want to pivot to years after his death that's fine but it has nothing to do with FDR

“ We have tried spending money. We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work. And I have just one interest, and if I am wrong … somebody else can have my job. I want to see this country prosperous. I want to see people get a job. I want to see people get enough to eat. We have never made good on our promises … I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started … And an enormous debt to boot ! ”

These words were spoken 75 years ago before the House Ways and Means Committee May 9, 1939 by Henry Morgenthau, Jr.

 

[runzwithsizorz]

A headline, and a couple of sentences in an article in todays paper caught my eye, and gave me a chuckle.
" Shortage Of Foreign Labor Forces Maine Businesses To Hire Local Workers. Businesses in Bar Harbor, Maine are turning to locals to make up for a shortage of foreign guest workers that normally fill summer jobs in the bustling seaside resort town.The shortage is so acute that companies have gone so far as to offer higher wages to entice locals."
GEE WHAT A CONCEPT!

And a related article;

Employers are demanding the Trump administration raise the cap on the H-2B visa guest worker program because they supposedly can’t find enough Americans to fill job vacancies.
“In economics, the price of anything, even workers rises if demand outstrips supply and, of course, the price of workers is primarily wages. However, wage data shows in both the long and short term there have been little to no wage increases in many of the most common H-2B occupations, and in many cases wages show an outright decline. the Center for Immigration Studies compared U.S. government wage data for eight job categories from 2007 to average wages in the same fields from 2013 to 2015, the last year for which data is available. They found that inflation-adjusted wages increased in just two of the categories and either stagnated or fell for the other six. Collectively, real wages across the H-2B categories were 1.3 percent lower in 2015 than they were in 2007. The rationale for approving more H-2B visas is “highly questionable” in light of the government’s own data, which shows that wages have largely fallen in the low-skill occupations seasonal workers often fill. Allowing wages to increase can be seen as a positive development because it reduces social inequality and encourages work,” But even assuming that rising wages are a negative development that must be addressed by increased immigration, there is still no evidence in the wage data that workers are in short supply. So the stated reason for the increase in the H-2B program is unsupported.