how can 72 photon torpedoes not destroy any contemporary ship when detonated INSIDE. we even saw them blowing holes in the hull of the vengeance. no way it still had any sort of power or anything that would let khan say "aim for starfleet HQ" after that.
pretty much demonstrated that one torpedo is really all it would take to completely obliterate an enemy ship when it's shields were completely down. If one torpedo could do that, than certainly numerous torpedoes detonated from inside a ship could destroy even the most advanced of vessels. They weren't even run of the mill ones either, but cutting edge top of the line prototypes possessing payloads likely beyond anything anyone had in ToS.
how can 72 photon torpedoes not destroy any contemporary ship when detonated INSIDE. we even saw them blowing holes in the hull of the vengeance. no way it still had any sort of power or anything that would let khan say "aim for starfleet HQ" after that.
My assumption was that the torpedoes were neutered in the process of replacing the high yield payload with a cryotube. All that got set off in the ship was the part of the torpedo that was meant to set the rest of the explosive in the torpedo off, but since the rest of the explosive was removed to make room for the cryotube, each individual torpedo didn't really pack much punch. Viewed from that angle it makes sense that even 72 torpedoes would barely do enough damage to disable the ship.
My assumption was that the torpedoes were neutered in the process of replacing the high yield payload with a cryotube. All that got set off in the ship was the part of the torpedo that was meant to set the rest of the explosive in the torpedo off, but since the rest of the explosive was removed to make room for the cryotube, each individual torpedo didn't really pack much punch. Viewed from that angle it makes sense that even 72 torpedoes would barely do enough damage to disable the ship.
It was the "fuel cell" which was removed. I would assume that was for propulsion and not the explosive. I think the best explanation is just that the ship was simply massive and the explosions were in the same place (redundant blast radius). Also, the ship was designed for minimal crew, so there likely wasn't much atmosphere inside the unoccupied areas to carry the shock wave.
It was the "fuel cell" which was removed. I would assume that was for propulsion and not the explosive. I think the best explanation is just that the ship was simply massive and the explosions were in the same place (redundant blast radius). Also, the ship was designed for minimal crew, so there likely wasn't much atmosphere inside the unoccupied areas to carry the shock wave.
Hm... apparently, Lindelof apologized for the Alice Eve underwear scene. While I've certainly never complained about looking at Alice Eve with as few clothes as possible, part of me thinks that if they were going to
rip off the Khan storyline
, then they should have at least
shown the two of them getting a bit cozy given they have a kid in Star Trek 2.
It's not like Kirk doesn't try to bag anything that looks remotely female (tails? no problem!) and moves.
Hm... apparently, Lindelof apologized for the Alice Eve underwear scene. While I've certainly never complained about looking at Alice Eve with as few clothes as possible, part of me thinks that if they were going to
rip off the Khan storyline
, then they should have at least
shown the two of them getting a bit cozy given they have a kid in Star Trek 2.
It's not like Kirk doesn't try to bag anything that looks remotely female (tails? no problem!) and moves.
I watched the movie twice. Khan said he could only assume that they had been discovered and "every single one" had been killed, so he sought vengeance when he attacked the Federation and senior officers. "What would you do for your family?"
I'm a super bad-ass that has access to ships weapons and my buddies. Admiral is a meanie so I'm going to stick my buddies in explosive devices that he plans to fire at the Klingons. Because you know, they'll be safe when the torpedoes blow up. But OH NOES! He may have discovered my plot to blow up my friends and killed them all himself, so now I must get revenge for the chance that he killed them.
There is simply no explaining this pile of shit writing. Wave your hand and say "I DID IT FOR MY FAMILY!" doesn't make it go away.
Was it? I don't recall, even if it was mentioned somewhere in a brief comment it's a very important part of the story and character of Khan. All the time wasted could have been spent explaining or offering more details on very important information like this...so Khan actually had some relevance or felt like a part of this story.
It was character exposition so they could have a scene showing that Spock was willing to sacrifice himself for the needs of the many. The volcano was going to destroy this pre-warp civilization and the Enterprise crew went outside their mission parameters to try and prevent it. They didn't mean to violate the Prime Directive until Kirk felt he had no choice.
Stupid and useless, and a massive waste of time. We already know Spock is willing to make sacrifices. All this kind of shit could have been done off screen, do a short scene where Spock and Kirk explain themselves (they already did this scene) and the situation. You can still have Kirk kicked out ect. In fact it would have made it seem less stupid if more time had passed between these events and getting fully reinstated as captain.
Clearly they don't give a shit. He breaks the rules, lies about it, and gets a very minor demotion? Putting these events off screen and giving him a real punishment for some length of time would have shown this effect better. But in the grand scheme of this movie it's 100% completely irrelevant anyway...why do we need a 30 minute display of "SRS FEDRATIN IS SRS ABT RULES!". They failed to show any seriousness at all, and the whole damn thing is broken anyway because of Mr bad admiral and his bent against Klingons.
I could rant on an how about how stupid this is, but it doesn't matter, there isn't a single valid argument or reason for wasting so much time on this shit. Almost no valid argument or reason for even having it done or said in the show at all. How did any of this positively affect anything in the movie? A movie remake about Khan.
All it did was make for a clunky disconnected plot that stole precious time away from the real story.
Yes because he can just walk onto a brand new prototype ship and just know how to completely disable it. Doesn't explain the sudden ED the ship had. Like I said it pops into warp, instantly blasts the shit out of them, then stops for a second so the admiral can twist his beard and tell everyone hes a bad guy, then suddenly the ship can't fire anymore, it has to wait a few minutes so Scotty has time to disable it. The whole scene was stupid and clunky. Its like watching the bad guy stand around while the power rangers change their clothes and blow up grass.
Not sure what your getting at here? What I'm saying is they are breaking their own mechanics here. "YOU MUST HAVE A WARP CORE TO USE ANY MAJOR SYSTEM!" But they show you that you don't need a warp core to teleport across the galaxy and you don't need a warp core to keep your shields. Though everything else on the ship is now broken somehow including the transporters, because the warp core is broken. They can power shields but not thrusters? But wait, then the shields are down when they fall into gravity, but then they come back again when Kirk kicks the warp core?
This doesn't seem the least bit insane to you? I'm all for mumbo jumbo techno babble, but when you cant even keep your shit straight in a single scene it just looks terrible.
Except he knew the admiral wanted to blow up "Kronos" and knew that going there would give him even more excuse to do so. He knew he failed to kill the admiral, and knew the bad-ass ship was still around and since he apparently assumed the admiral found his buddies that would mean there were at least 72 fully functional torpedoes again he knew would be used for this attack.
So how can it be that he knows we cant go when he in fact knows that we can and will go immediately?
And with the realization that you can use a portable teleporter and the turbine generator of a small ship to teleport you anywhere in the galaxy, why the fuck did he put his buddies in torpedoes again?
Everything about this story is just so fucked up and broken.
Except that's crap because they told you what was going to happen already (sick kid, magic cure everything blood potion, who DIDN'T know that was going to be used?), and the fact that this show is supposed to be for people who don't know star trek and don't know Spock dies. So there would be no surprise role reversal for those who don't know, and for those who do know would immediately realize that nobody will die because of said magic potion. Its was blatantly obvious and stupidly predictable.
Yes. The story was bad and lots of stuff didn't make sense. Why do they even have starships anymore if a "portable trans-warp beaming device" can take you anywhere instantly? I agree that people in torpedoes does not make sense. If the cryotube replaced the fuel cell, how were the torpedoes supposed to reach their target when fired from the neutral zone?
It had plenty of action and satisfying references to previous Trek material. I was entertained. I really liked the previous movie. This new one is worth watching at least once...despite being very poorly-written. I really wish J.J. Would cut ties with Damon Lindelof...but they're obviously close buds. It's the same fuckhead that ruined Prometheus.
For me there was to much face palm and WTF are they serious? to enjoy it. I knew everything that was going to happen long before it did because I'm not an idiot.
And now that I'm discussing it I've realized there are even more massive universe breaking holes everywhere you look.
Go watch Hercules in New York. One of the most retarded stupid "B grade" movies with a big name actor. They friggen dubbed over Arnold and didn't even have sound in parts of the movie...but I would still rate it higher than this this movie because it has a clear and defined story that doesn't play stupid and contradict itself every other scene. In fact the consistent low budget over the top fake feel gives it a comedic and entertaining value.
This movie just makes you feel stupid for watching it...there are so many massively wrong things with it trying to club you in the face you cant ignore them and enjoy yourself. I thought the first trek redo was dumb, but this absolutely takes the cake. Its just about on par with those star wars prequels. At least they didn't have Jar Jar to throws balls at people and let a 12yr old kid command the enterprise all by himself and defeat Khan...and a giant fish to eat a giant fish to eat the admiral.
I might know some of the story from the original trek show, but this is supposed to be for people who don't know trek. Nothing was explained in the movie. Nobody knows who Khan is and the don't have any reason to care. To them hes just some stupid frozen guy that got but hurt and fired at a building and then crashed a ship. A totally stupid weak lame ass that's a pushover and easily defeated/captured. "OH-HOHOHO! But he had some dude blow up a building!" That just reinforces his pansy ass weakness...cant even bomb a building on his own. Any half baked terrorist can at least do that.
Khan in this story meant nothing, and basically did nothing. They wasted far to much time to properly develop Khan into "the biggest threat the enterprise ever faced". The admiral was by far the biggest threat the enterprise ever faced, whopped their ass good.
For the record, I think spoiler tags in a discussion thread are stupid, because if you haven't seen the movie, you shouldn't be reading this thread. But to avoid the haters, I have them.
Wow, that was great. REALLY great! Enjoyed it a ton. Lots of fun! Saw it in 2D, glad I did. Sherlock did an awesome job, I think he stole the show. Graphics were probably the best I've ever seen - the stuff at the beginning was mind-blowingly good. Amazing pre-opening-credits job! Also RIP Mickey the Tin Dog
Only two real complaints. First was the "big guns" thing on the evil Enterprise, that were then powered down. It felt overly simplistic, even though it fit. Second was that I didn't feel as involved in this one, even though it was a terrific movie - I think almost all sequels suffer that though. Like when they're shooting into the other ship and the helmet starts cracking etc., I felt like I was watching the story rather than "being there" because I knew, for sure, they'd make it in. So I dunno, not as much involvement as I'd hoped for.
I'd say this is the best movie I've seen since the first Ironman. Really enjoyed it. Yay for the Spock cameo. Scotty was amazing as always, one of my favorite characters, he had so many great lines in this movie. I still can't get over how good the graphics were either!
Also great job on the lens flares. I actually liked it in the first one, the first time around, because it was a really different, cool look. Yes, it got kind of annoying on the re-watch. In this new one, however, they balance it really well - just enough to look cool, not enough to be annoying.
Great movie, if you're a geek you owe it to yourself to see it in theaters!
For the record, I think spoiler tags in a discussion thread are stupid, because if you haven't seen the movie, you shouldn't be reading this thread. But to avoid the haters, I have them.
Wow, that was great. REALLY great! Enjoyed it a ton. Lots of fun! Saw it in 2D, glad I did. Sherlock did an awesome job, I think he stole the show. Graphics were probably the best I've ever seen - the stuff at the beginning was mind-blowingly good. Amazing pre-opening-credits job! Also RIP Mickey the Tin Dog
Only two real complaints. First was the "big guns" thing on the evil Enterprise, that were then powered down. It felt overly simplistic, even though it fit. Second was that I didn't feel as involved in this one, even though it was a terrific movie - I think almost all sequels suffer that though. Like when they're shooting into the other ship and the helmet starts cracking etc., I felt like I was watching the story rather than "being there" because I knew, for sure, they'd make it in. So I dunno, not as much involvement as I'd hoped for.
I'd say this is the best movie I've seen since the first Ironman. Really enjoyed it. Yay for the Spock cameo. Scotty was amazing as always, one of my favorite characters, he had so many great lines in this movie. I still can't get over how good the graphics were either!
You lose cred for saying "graphics" instead of "visuals."
In video games, the term "graphics" originally applied to 2D pixel artwork, which you could basically draw on graph paper. When we talk about car or skateboard graphics, we're still talking about artwork that goes onto a 2D surface.
Moving images have "visual effects," not "graphics."
You lose cred for saying "graphics" instead of "visuals."
In video games, the term "graphics" originally applied to 2D pixel artwork, which you could basically draw on graph paper. When we talk about car or skateboard graphics, we're still talking about artwork that goes onto a 2D surface.
Moving images have "visual effects," not "graphics."
Eh, I thought the CG was alright. I recall a scene with a shuttle in the city that just looked downright fake, and that really took me out of the movie. The rest of it didn't bother me so much. I was also annoyed by some of the lens flare, but not all of it. Although, arguably... none of it was necessary as it adds nothing of note to the film.
Eh, I thought the CG was alright. I recall a scene with a shuttle in the city that just looked downright fake, and that really took me out of the movie. The rest of it didn't bother me so much. I was also annoyed by some of the lens flare, but not all of it. Although, arguably... none of it was necessary as it adds nothing of note to the film.
Eh, I thought the CG was alright. I recall a scene with a shuttle in the city that just looked downright fake, and that really took me out of the movie. The rest of it didn't bother me so much. I was also annoyed by some of the lens flare, but not all of it. Although, arguably... none of it was necessary as it adds nothing of note to the film.
Yeah, that shaky stuff bothers me. Can't they afford camera stabilizers in the future???
My biggest issue with this movie (and a lot of other movies) is the pacing is too fast because they're trying to fit too much stuff in.
For instance...it seems like warping to another planet only takes an hour or so now. In the older movies/TV shows travel time left time for character development and side plots. Everything is such a rush now that you feel like you're whizzing by everyone in a roller coaster and don't get time to know anyone.
Yeah, that shaky stuff bothers me. Can't they afford camera stabilizers in the future???
My biggest issue with this movie (and a lot of other movies) is the pacing is too fast because they're trying to fit too much stuff in.
For instance...it seems like warping to another planet only takes an hour or so now. In the older movies/TV shows travel time left time for character development and side plots. Everything is such a rush now that you feel like you're whizzing by everyone in a roller coaster and don't get time to know anyone.
See the RedLetterMedia review of the first one. He compares Turbo-Lift travel times to diagrams of the ship and shows how the previous movies stuck to the designs and structured their dialog/story around it and the new movies just want to keep the story moving. Doesn't bother me though. If Turbo-Lift time slows things down too much, by all means: Speed it up!
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