Star Wars: The Force Awakens reviews *SPOILERS*

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Phoenix86

Lifer
May 21, 2003
14,643
9
81
Why would we set reasons aside when they are crucial to forming a point?

Reason Vader work a mask aside, he needed one, Ren is emulating Vader. Doesn't mean Ren has to have the same reason. Hence the reason Vader wore one doesn't matter.

It's not a crucial point at all. At best, it's one of several parts to his character development.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,820
29,571
146
Ignoring it doesn't make it go away. Within the context of the movies it makes ZERO sense for him to be wearing that helmet. Real-world context tells us that he is wearing it because the character is a shameless rip-off. If they had explained that he was too much of a noob to rely on his powers and needed custom trooper armor to remain safe then I wouldn't be having this conversation.

You're right about that. We've had this yahoo named Trump running around for 6 months now making all sorts of "points" and he sure hasn't gone away.

 

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
Ignoring it doesn't make it go away. Within the context of the movies it makes ZERO sense for him to be wearing that helmet. Real-world context tells us that he is wearing it because the character is a shameless rip-off. If they had explained that he was too much of a noob to rely on his powers and needed custom trooper armor to remain safe then I wouldn't be having this conversation.

You're just ignoring the arguments as to why the character might wear it, as you'd rather make evidence fit your theory than acknowledge the possibility of a different conclusion.
 

Phoenix86

Lifer
May 21, 2003
14,643
9
81
Within the context of the movies it makes ZERO sense for him to be wearing that helmet. Real-world context tells us that he is wearing it because the character is a shameless rip-off. If they had explained that he was too much of a noob to rely on his powers and needed custom trooper armor to remain safe then I wouldn't be having this conversation.

Wait... You missed that he's emulating Vader, his grandfather and idol?! Were you drunk and or high when you watched it?

That's the reason. That's it. He didn't need it.
 

paperfist

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
6,517
280
126
www.the-teh.com
Also, am I the only one that doesn't like Poe...at all? He was so 2-dimensional and completely boring in this flick. He has no personality. Not yet, anyway.

Probably the worst I've ever seen Oscar Isaac and it seems to me he just phoned it in with this underwritten stand-in of a character.

I don't get why Rylo didn't kill him seeing that he's the best pilot in the galaxy. Obviously that's a threat to the New Order.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,820
29,571
146
I don't get why Rylo didn't kill him seeing that he's the best pilot in the galaxy. Obviously that's a threat to the New Order.

because no way! a mere pilot can attack a tiny structural weakness in a giant planet-sized death machine!

I mean, one time is just a mere coincidence. Two times is just another random coincidence. But THREE TIMES? hah! That's stupid.
 

Slew Foot

Lifer
Sep 22, 2005
12,381
96
86
Doing a second watchthrough you really pick up on a lot of the foreshadowing and hints.

Like in the beginning Lor San Tekka hints that Kylo is related to Leia (to Poe "The General is like Royalty to me", to Kylo "I know where you come from", "I know your family"), or how the sun goes out right before Kylo stabs Han (as long as there is light, there is hope).
 

GlacierFreeze

Golden Member
May 23, 2005
1,125
1
0
It's called: more proof that this is a blatant rip-off of A New Hope. Is that an important enough discussion topic for you?

Rip off of A New Hope because Luke wore a helmet too? Oh wait.

And so what if he looks up to his grandpa and also wants to wear a helmet. So freakin' what. Lol

And of course this was going to mirror A New Hope to some extent. What did people expect? Luke and Han doing backflips at 75? No. 30 years after part 6, new characters are going to be introduced and take over. New force users are going to be discovered and trained to fight this new evil. Unless people wanted them to already be established Jedis? Then people would just cry about wondering why they didn't show how they became Jedi/Jedi Knights.
 
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GlacierFreeze

Golden Member
May 23, 2005
1,125
1
0
Reason Vader work a mask aside, he needed one, Ren is emulating Vader. Doesn't mean Ren has to have the same reason. Hence the reason Vader wore one doesn't matter.

It's not a crucial point at all. At best, it's one of several parts to his character development.

/thread (well this point)
 

gorcorps

aka Brandon
Jul 18, 2004
30,740
452
126
It's called: more proof that this is a blatant rip-off of A New Hope. Is that an important enough discussion topic for you?
I'm sick of hearing this like it's a bad thing. People liked A New Hope, and frankly it hasn't aged well. I liked getting a new version with more humor.
 

paperfist

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
6,517
280
126
www.the-teh.com
because no way! a mere pilot can attack a tiny structural weakness in a giant planet-sized death machine!

I mean, one time is just a mere coincidence. Two times is just another random coincidence. But THREE TIMES? hah! That's stupid.

lol

It's almost like Disney ripped off the Road Runner scripts

Or maybe Rylo didn't know any better seeing how his training isn't complete.
 

paperfist

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
6,517
280
126
www.the-teh.com
I'm sick of hearing this like it's a bad thing. People liked A New Hope, and frankly it hasn't aged well. I liked getting a new version with more humor.

But then it shouldn't be called Episode 7. I wouldn't mind if it got rebooted as a New Hope isn't as easy to watch as it once was.
 

Childs

Lifer
Jul 9, 2000
11,450
7
81
New force users are going to be discovered and trained to fight this new evil. Unless people wanted them to already be established Jedis? Then people would just cry about wondering why they didn't show how they became Jedi/Jedi Knights.

They could have started with the Knights of Ren wiping out the Jedi. That seems to be where the story is interesting, because you also have Ben Solo making his first turn and maybe an explanation of why Luke went into hiding instead of fighting. Also Han and Leia's break up, and why Han was so disappointing to Ben. Granted, they were probably limited with the age of Ford, Fisher and Hamill, but nothing a little vaseline and/or CG couldnt fix. Setting the story a little earlier would have provided more context to all the crucial plot points in TFA.
 

Charmonium

Diamond Member
May 15, 2015
9,595
2,958
136
More of a cloak/half cape and hood.

So they didn't want him to look like too much of a Vader clone.

I can't help thinking that Disney is mostly responsible for parallels to New Hope. I think they wanted to do whatever possible to replicate the popularity of the original trilogy w/o making it an exact copy. If that's the case, you have to give Abrams some credit for the new story elements. It would mean that they basically tied his hands and he still managed to produce something watchable. Maybe not great or even the high side of good, but serviceable.
 

Childs

Lifer
Jul 9, 2000
11,450
7
81
So they didn't want him to look like too much of a Vader clone.

I can't help thinking that Disney is mostly responsible for parallels to New Hope. I think they wanted to do whatever possible to replicate the popularity of the original trilogy w/o making it an exact copy. If that's the case, you have to give Abrams some credit for the new story elements. It would mean that they basically tied his hands and he still managed to produce something watchable. Maybe not great or even the high side of good, but serviceable.

Disney movies are purposely generic, including the Marvel movies and Pixar post Disney acquisition. Its a "more of the same" philosophy. Who knows how many movies it will take for Disney to push the boundaries in SW, if ever. It took a crap load of Marvel movies to get to that point.
 

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,658
5,228
136
What about the cape? Does Ren wear a cape. I can't remember.

Why don't we analyze why Vader had a cape in the first place?

Was he just an elf/ranger wannabe? Is the dark Lord of the sith chilly? Death star a bit drafty? Why didn't he just turn up the heat? It boggles the mind! Why didn't ANH explain this? Oh the plot holes!

And wtf, why did Vader have a belt? It's a custom suit, did he lose weight?! Wtf is going oooooonnnnn???!
 
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