I knew there would be outrage from the the current MMORPG crowd. I was concerned about stats being removed at first but after seeing how it would all work first hand I'm not anymore. The reason I posted what I did is I was recently contracted to work for a new MMORPG. I was told it would be something totally different from the current concepts and boy were they right. They plan to announce in June when the final team is complete. I'm not involved in the full project, I was contracted to do some mock ups for that June announcement.
I will not go into who is doing it or what it is based on, I value my income too much for that, but will say I have never seen anything like it. Their monthly fee is steep anywhere from $24.95 - $29.95 but I understand the reasoning behind that fee as they are going to do a lot that has never been done before like replacing most of the NPC with real people not scripts and it also is a one server world which can get costly. If I didn't know the companies involved I would say it was all a bit too big an undertaking but they have the talent and the resources so I think it will happen. Announcement coming June 2010
Sorry but stats/levels are right there next to involved story/dialog trees as things that define a CRPG. Maybe you don't like that definition but its the truth.
The only reason stats are used is because of the limitation on the technology and previous game designs that relied on them to convey when the player had advanced.
In a current rpg when you buy a sword you look at the stats to determine how good it is. Then you go out and use it a few times and kill the same monster several times with it. The next time you see that same monster do you pop open inventory and check the stats or do you attack the monster based on your experience with the weapon ?
Which would be better:
You could not kill a monster before but since the game has told you that you gained a level, the monster is now showing as easy to kill so you go kill it.
You could not kill a monster before but have been killing lots of slightly lower monsters and improved your sword skills some and notice that these monsters are no longer as tough as they were so you go and kill that higher level monster , not because the computer told you that you could but because you decided that your character was able to do it.
I would rather have discussions with players like " I tried to kill monster xx twice now and I couldn't do it, my sword is pretty good and I have been practicing on monster yyy" and someone reply , " You have to come from behind monster xx because it has weaker armor at the back than the front and retreat when it tries to bite"
Than discussions like " I tried to kill monster xx twice now and I was using the sword that has AGI+5, DEX+12 , STR+3, and it hit me for 300pts dmg several times" and someone reply " You need to go buy sword XXX with +20dmg and use the +50hp potions and remember to boost your stamina stats by +5"
One puts the player in the game, while the other pulls the player out, reminding them it is a game.
so basically, you want all stats out of the game?
how are you supposed to get an indication of your character's strength (or weakness) without stats to relate your character to other players or monsters?
how do you find out which areas are good or bad for you? trial and error and getting your ass handed to you multiple times?
you can still include things like weak armor in the back (backstab / attacks of opportunity in DnD games).
stats take the game from completely random (no idea how strong you are relative to another player/monster) and give you a basis on which to compare.
How do you decide if you should fight the guy who pushes you inside a bar in the real world ?
How do you decide that the area of town you are in at whatever time it is and by how others are reacting to you might not be the best place to be ?
They are used as a basis because the games had no other way to convey that to the players.
I admit there are a lot of challenges with implementing something like this and I have my doubts if the technology is there just yet, but it isn't my money and I can't wait to see if it can be pulled off.
How do you decide if you should fight the guy who pushes you inside a bar in the real world ?
How do you decide that the area of town you are in at whatever time it is and by how others are reacting to you might not be the best place to be ?
They are used as a basis because the games had no other way to convey that to the players.
I admit there are a lot of challenges with implementing something like this and I have my doubts if the technology is there just yet, but it isn't my money and I can't wait to see if it can be pulled off.
so i should size up enemies on the screen by trying to figure out how many muscle ripples they have? cmon now.....
there are also things called crime statistics that can tell you which areas to avoid in real life. fancy that, numbers to tell you what's good and bad
stats are the amin attraction of rpgs
so i should size up enemies on the screen by trying to figure out how many muscle ripples they have? cmon now.....
there are also things called crime statistics that can tell you which areas to avoid in real life. fancy that, numbers to tell you what's good and bad
stats are the amin attraction of rpgs
This makes alot of sense- the idea is just to make it more real-life- you learn by experience. Also, I am assuming that with weapons and armor etc, the real stats will be what it is made of, the sharpness of the blade, the thinness or thickness of the metal, etc. What else will be in place to determine the "stats" of weapons and armor and other items you come across and buy?
That is why they are released and then people get bored. There is no substance, just mindless button pushing.
there's already a game like this and it's the Witcher, no stats but some HP and MP, no time wasted trying to build your character at all. what u know is that if you swing the sword 4 times instead of 3 u deal more damages.
The only reason stats are used is because of the limitation on the technology and previous game designs that relied on them to convey when the player had advanced.
In a current rpg when you buy a sword you look at the stats to determine how good it is. Then you go out and use it a few times and kill the same monster several times with it. The next time you see that same monster do you pop open inventory and check the stats or do you attack the monster based on your experience with the weapon ?
Which would be better:
You could not kill a monster before but since the game has told you that you gained a level, the monster is now showing as easy to kill so you go kill it.
You could not kill a monster before but have been killing lots of slightly lower monsters and improved your sword skills some and notice that these monsters are no longer as tough as they were so you go and kill that higher level monster , not because the computer told you that you could but because you decided that your character was able to do it.
I would rather have discussions with players like " I tried to kill monster xx twice now and I couldn't do it, my sword is pretty good and I have been practicing on monster yyy" and someone reply , " You have to come from behind monster xx because it has weaker armor at the back than the front and retreat when it tries to bite"
Than discussions like " I tried to kill monster xx twice now and I was using the sword that has AGI+5, DEX+12 , STR+3, and it hit me for 300pts dmg several times" and someone reply " You need to go buy sword XXX with +20dmg and use the +50hp potions and remember to boost your stamina stats by +5"
One puts the player in the game, while the other pulls the player out, reminding them it is a game.
Your idea might work for what you know about the other guy (simple physical description), but the difference is in how much you know about yourself. Your entire lifetime is filled with data points that you unconsciously use to make decisions and when you're stepping into the role of a character the statistics and levels you dislike are necessary to convey information that would otherwise be 500 volumes of biographical text.How do you decide if you should fight the guy who pushes you inside a bar in the real world ?
The only reason stats are used is because of the limitation on the technology and previous game designs that relied on them to convey when the player had advanced.
In a current rpg when you buy a sword you look at the stats to determine how good it is. Then you go out and use it a few times and kill the same monster several times with it. The next time you see that same monster do you pop open inventory and check the stats or do you attack the monster based on your experience with the weapon ?
Which would be better:
You could not kill a monster before but since the game has told you that you gained a level, the monster is now showing as easy to kill so you go kill it.
You could not kill a monster before but have been killing lots of slightly lower monsters and improved your sword skills some and notice that these monsters are no longer as tough as they were so you go and kill that higher level monster , not because the computer told you that you could but because you decided that your character was able to do it.
I would rather have discussions with players like " I tried to kill monster xx twice now and I couldn't do it, my sword is pretty good and I have been practicing on monster yyy" and someone reply , " You have to come from behind monster xx because it has weaker armor at the back than the front and retreat when it tries to bite"
Than discussions like " I tried to kill monster xx twice now and I was using the sword that has AGI+5, DEX+12 , STR+3, and it hit me for 300pts dmg several times" and someone reply " You need to go buy sword XXX with +20dmg and use the +50hp potions and remember to boost your stamina stats by +5"
One puts the player in the game, while the other pulls the player out, reminding them it is a game.
The issue here is that you're keeping the stats and levels but just hiding from the player. Maybe this would make for a puzzle RPG where the player had to figure it all out through trial and error, but it wouldn't make for a more realistic RPG.Maybe dumb descriptions could work here too when you 'level-up', like 'Compared to yesterday, I feel much more swift when attacking and defending' or 'Over these last few days, I've learned so much and know more than I used to about medicine'. Something like that...I don't know.