Stop saying Islam is a religion of peace: Taslima Nasreen

[SmilingBhudda]

Totally ok for christians & atheists to kill more people than anyone else because they're the good guys and the christians aren't really christian at the time of the killing. LOL

Well, sorry for being a bit slow but in my defence: saying that Christian people are responsible for most of the killings in this world, while being influenced by Christianity either directly or indirectly, even if they say they are not Christian, is such a completely ridiculous position to hold that it took a while for this thought to form in my mind.

You see, Christianity wasn't created by white men, who after they converted to it went on the largest killing spree in the history of mankind (if it's even true because we will never know the true numbers). It was created by a brown man, from the semitic genome type, speaking a semitic language, based on an earlier religion created by his semitic ancestors. A religion with supposedly the same family father as that other semitic religion that is in the news so much lately. If you want to blame the Abrahamic influence on white men for all their crimes, you should blame those other people too who consider him their patriarch, even giving many of their children his name. In fact, they are just as guilty according to your view.

What you are really saying is that it was the brown mans religion that corrupted the white man and made him commit the atrocities he did. Oh, if only white people hadn't accepted the message of love and forgiving, but stuck to their primitive pagan beliefs. The world would have been such a better place. Or you could just keep your disgusting theories to yourself and get the fuck out of this thread. A thread in which we discuss a muslim person saying that there is a problem with their religion, but if a non-muslim person says the same you accuse them of racism. While in reality it is you who are the racist nazi.

 

[agent00f]

I took you for a smart guy but at this point you seem to get caught up in knee jerk reactions, grasping at straws and logical fallacies, probably caused by your political correctness or unwillingness to face reality (which, admittedly, is not very pretty). Or maybe you're actually a muslim, they have a tendency of inconsistent reasoning as well.

I'm sure you believe this, but then against it's well established you believe a lot of completely wrong things.

Anyway, it's a good thing we have this internet thingy nowadays: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_and_anthropogenic_disasters_by_death_toll

As you can see it's not Christians that are leading the pack. In fact, it's the Native Americans you so adamantly defend (and who actually themselves wiped out the real Native Native Americans). Guess you should direct your anger at those evil Shamans.

For example, blaming native americans for smoking. Consider researching what grasping at straws and logical fallacies means first before throwing big words around.

But WWII, that most Christian war, does take second place. Except we have to subtract the casualties from the Eastern theatre, in which case WWII drops to 3rd place, behind the Three Kingdoms War, which was fought without firearms. So maybe you should be a bit more afraid of that yellow scourge as you called it.
Another interesting thing I learned from that list: the Dungan Revolt, in which "A recorded 20.77 million people died in Shaanxi and Gansu, most of them Han Chinese civilians massacred by the Hui Muslims." That's as many as civilian casualties in WWII in Europe, except using far less advanced weaponry. No wonder Hitler admired Islam so much.

To be more honest though we should look at the impact of killings on the world population. In that case it's the Mongols that take the top spot: "In terms of proportion of the population the Mongol Conquest might be the worst as they killed over 10% of the world's population, however those took place over the course of over a century, while WWII killed only 3% of the world's population but it also took place over a much shorter period of time of only a bit over 6 years." It took them a little more time, but they're 3 times as bad as christians in this regard.

While you're at it, notice that the argument was the muslims aren't terribly accomplished all things considered in this competition. Your argument is that the chinese or whatever are. The next logical step is to determine whether systematic prejudice re: the yellow peril by the right wing types is rationally based on this, or whether it's the same kind of deal as the blacks/mexicans/muslims. I'll charitably assume you're at least smart enough to figure how that's going to work out.

Now I know that's not what you are actually saying: that all Christians -even if they act directly against the core tenets of their belief, and even if they denounce Christianity- througout history have killed more people than any other religions adherents (correct me if I'm wrong). TBH, it seems like an idiotic position to take but w/e. First, we do not have accurate numbers so we will never know for sure. Second, to be honest you would have to adjust for population numbers, because following your reasoning, a religion with 10 followers that kills a 100 people over the course of a year is better than a religion with 1000 followers that kills 101 people over the course of a 100 years. I know which one I prefer to hang around.

The crux of this argument is which presents the greatest threat to arbitrary global citizens these days through some mass atrocity, and it's certainly not the muslims/islam. Seems pretty obvious going by the recent historical trend it's going to be some Bush type proud of praying to God, right before dropping a bomb on some dirt farmer.

You should have a look at this video though:

.
If this guy is right, which he might well be, I think we have a new number one for the wikipedia list.

It makes a great deal of sense why the right wing loves revisionist history. This guy's other hits probably include how the civil war wasn't about slavery, and other reasons why the white man is the real victim.

Oh, one more thing: Christians developed modern science, which allowed them to create weapons of true mass destruction, and they used them for sure. But who will say how many more were saved by modern science? Despite all the war and killing most people during the course of history died from diseases. The same diseases that Christians were so succesfull in fighting against, either with medicine and vaccins or things like hygiene and water purification. Maybe they actually saved more people than they killed. Who's to say? It's certainly not impossible. But I guess your red herring was succesful this time.

The major reason why some of the larger historical death tolls above were around china is because they advanced in agriculture & such early and were thus able to support a large population. Islam also had its golden era some while back, and I'm sure they had their share of wars. So with some historical perspective it's easy to capture the nature of the human condition. That's really the point here, but dummies are pretty good at never getting the point.

 

[agent00f]

Well, sorry for being a bit slow but in my defence: saying that Christian people are responsible for most of the killings in this world, while being influenced by Christianity either directly or indirectly, even if they say they are not Christian, is such a completely ridiculous position to hold that it took a while for this thought to form in my mind.

You see, Christianity wasn't created by white men, who after they converted to it went on the largest killing spree in the history of mankind (if it's even true because we will never know the true numbers). It was created by a brown man, from the semitic genome type, speaking a semitic language, based on an earlier religion created by his semitic ancestors. A religion with supposedly the same family father as that other semitic religion that is in the news so much lately. If you want to blame the Abrahamic influence on white men for all their crimes, you should blame those other people too who consider him their patriarch, even giving many of their children his name. In fact, they are just as guilty according to your view.

What you are really saying is that it was the brown mans religion that corrupted the white man and made him commit the atrocities he did. Oh, if only white people hadn't accepted the message of love and forgiving, but stuck to their primitive pagan beliefs. The world would have been such a better place. Or you could just keep your disgusting theories to yourself and get the fuck out of this thread. A thread in which we discuss a muslim person saying that there is a problem with their religion, but if a non-muslim person says the same you accuse them of racism. While in reality it is you who are the racist nazi.

I'm not really the type to blame a book for anything, that's more your job. Instead I've only been mocking that job, and you clearly wrote this because you think it's the only work out there.

 

[bshole]

The crux of this argument is which presents the greatest threat to arbitrary global citizens these days through some mass atrocity, and it's certainly not the muslims/islam. Seems pretty obvious going by the recent historical trend it's going to be some Bush type proud of praying to God, right before dropping a bomb on some dirt farmer.

So no fears of Islamists getting their hands on a nuclear device (it is Obamas biggest fear)? If Islamists gain control of Pakistan (which they are actively attempting to do), it would be pretty much game over. Pakistan is actively growing their nuclear arsenal faster than any other nation on earth. The question is how likely is Pakistan to fall Islamists?

 

[agent00f]

So no fears of Islamists getting their hands on a nuclear device (it is Obamas biggest fear)? If Islamists gain control of Pakistan (which they are actively attempting to do), it would be pretty much game over. Pakistan is actively growing their nuclear arsenal faster than any other nation on earth. The question is how likely is Pakistan to fall Islamists?

Sure, doomsday devices are particularly dangerous in the hands of people who have little to lose. That's why it's not a good idea to create more people with little to lose in a world where a lot of dangerous weapons exist.

 

[Roflmouth]

Damn it, how many more honor killings and suicide bombings to Muslims need to commit before they're finally declared peaceful?

 

[SmilingBhudda]

I'm sure you believe this, but then against it's well established you believe a lot of completely wrong things.



For example, blaming native americans for smoking. Consider researching what grasping at straws and logical fallacies means first before throwing big words around.



While you're at it, notice that the argument was the muslims aren't terribly accomplished all things considered in this competition. Your argument is that the chinese or whatever are. The next logical step is to determine whether systematic prejudice re: the yellow peril by the right wing types is rationally based on this, or whether it's the same kind of deal as the blacks/mexicans/muslims. I'll charitably assume you're at least smart enough to figure how that's going to work out.



The crux of this argument is which presents the greatest threat to arbitrary global citizens these days through some mass atrocity, and it's certainly not the muslims/islam. Seems pretty obvious going by the recent historical trend it's going to be some Bush type proud of praying to God, right before dropping a bomb on some dirt farmer.



It makes a great deal of sense why the right wing loves revisionist history. This guy's other hits probably include how the civil war wasn't about slavery, and other reasons why the white man is the real victim.



The major reason why some of the larger historical death tolls above were around china is because they advanced in agriculture & such early and were thus able to support a large population. Islam also had its golden era some while back, and I'm sure they had their share of wars. So with some historical perspective it's easy to capture the nature of the human condition. That's really the point here, but dummies are pretty good at never getting the point.

It was you who came up with the idiotic concept of accusing white people of being histories biggest mass murderers due to their Christian heritage, even when they go against all the things that heritage stands for. So I can just as easily blame Shamans for actually being histories biggest mass murderers by making the smoking of tobacco a core tenent of their spiritual beliefs. Not because I actually believe that, but to show you how idiotic your position really is. That's not a logical fallacy, that's an equivalence to make you understand how wrong you are.

And then you blame the Chinese for being good at farming and fucking, while agriculture was actually invented in Mesopotamia. Fucking was invented long before that, but if those brown folks just would have kept being hunter/gatherers we wouldn't have been in this situation I suppose. But at least we can agree on something: humans loved them some killing throughout history. Which is what the Western World currently would like to see come to an end.

You can blame Bush (and Cheney, and Rumsfeld, and a lot of other people in the government) for wrongfully removing Saddam from power. But if you do, you also imply at the same time that 'some dirt farmer' can only live in a (semi-)functional society if he's being oppressed by a ruthless dictator. The US didn't mess up rebuilding Iraq, it was Al-Zarqawi who messed up the US efforts by provoking the Shia and Sunni into a civil war by using mass suicide bombings. And it was left-wing liberal progressives (and hypocrit muslims) that sealed Iraq's fate by demanding Obama to pull the troops, just when they were about to round shit up.

But since you don't believe me, I'll let an ex-muslim do the talking: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=UU19J83LCkBL2KFPEtifwfJQ. Watch all those videos and then come back to me.

 

[SmilingBhudda]

For the people in the US who don't speak Dutch, here's a little video showing the opinion of muslim youth in the Netherlands, probably 4th or even 5th generation by now:

I have translated the interview for you guys:

announcer: We know Gouda as the city of of Gouda cheese, the Gouda waffle and the Gouda scales building (my note: a place where goods for trade where weighed back in the day when people didn't have their own scales). But soon also as the city with the largest mosque in the Netherlands. And there is a reason it is being build in Gouda.

little boy: The kuffars are in our way

reporter: who are they exactly?

little boy: they are the non-believers

reporter: what are those people doing wrong?

little boy: not allowed

tall boy: what they are actually doing wrong is, they don't worship allah

reporter: what do you think of the Dutch women who wear normal average clothes?

earbud boy: it's not allowed according to our religion, i think it's very wrong

reporter: no?

all boys: no

reporter: don't you secretly enjoy it a little when you see them?

all boys: no, we're not allowed

reporter: what do you...

little boy: you have to abuse them, you know

tall boy: what it comes down to, there must be a deadly (arabic word?), an islamic state, where a muslim can just live like he's supposed to, according to the islamic rules

little boy: convert to islam, all of you...all of you girls, behave and wear normal clothes...you must all become muslims...yeah, just do it...everybody yeah

reporter: everybody muslims?

little boy: everybody must become muslims...come to the mosque...everybody pray...islam is forever

earbud boy: long live the islamic state

all boys: allah akbar, allah akbar

I do pity our teachers.

 

[Orignal Earl]

For the people in the US who don't speak Dutch, here's a little video showing the opinion of muslim youth in the Netherlands, probably 4th or even 5th generation by now:

I have translated the interview for you guys:

Oh sweet Jesus...your from Holland?
I can understand those kids spooking you
Over here though, like 80% of Americans are Christians, 90% believe in God
We see shit like that everyday from some Christian groups it's normal to us, all you have to do is turn the TV onto the religious channels. Or go down a block n check it out in real life
You guys are mostly atheists eh, and 20% religious?

Check out the doc Jesus Camp, see our little armies of God being trained up

 

[Blue_Max]

Oh sweet Jesus...your from Holland?
I can understand those kids spooking you
Over here though, like 80% of Americans are Christians, 90% believe in God
We see shit like that everyday from some Christian groups it's normal to us, all you have to do is turn the TV onto the religious channels. Or go down a block n check it out in real life
You guys are mostly atheists eh, and 20% religious?

Check out the doc Jesus Camp, see our little armies of God being trained up

...except they're not going to forcibly convert, rape, or behead anyone over Jesus. Not exactly an equal argument to make, don'cha think?

 

[Orignal Earl]

...except they're not going to forcibly convert, rape, or behead anyone over Jesus. Not exactly an equal argument to make, don'cha think?

Seen my doc the other day
He's still going at it, saving peoples lives everyday while you sit terrified he's going convert, rape and behead you

 

[agent00f]

It was you who came up with the idiotic concept of accusing white people of being histories biggest mass murderers due to their Christian heritage, even when they go against all the things that heritage stands for. So I can just as easily blame Shamans for actually being histories biggest mass murderers by making the smoking of tobacco a core tenent of their spiritual beliefs. Not because I actually believe that, but to show you how idiotic your position really is. That's not a logical fallacy, that's an equivalence to make you understand how wrong you are.

It's certainly your prerogative to believe Christians who pray to god regularly killing people is the same thing as smokers using a product which was in some fashion discovered by some natives. Same as it's your perogative to believe 2+2=22; it doesn't affect me and just makes you a deluded idiot.

And then you blame the Chinese for being good at farming and fucking, while agriculture was actually invented in Mesopotamia. Fucking was invented long before that, but if those brown folks just would have kept being hunter/gatherers we wouldn't have been in this situation I suppose. But at least we can agree on something: humans loved them some killing throughout history. Which is what the Western World currently would like to see come to an end.

It's simply historical fact the chinese had relatively advanced agriculture fairly early, which is what allowed a pretty large civilization and all that portends. It took the west a while longer to get to the same point then surpass it. The west's wars never really ended, they just can't fight themselves anymore due to nukes and had to be content with killing hapless brown people or such when politically expedient. Rather serendipitous since you're not a hapless brownie.

You can blame Bush (and Cheney, and Rumsfeld, and a lot of other people in the government) for wrongfully removing Saddam from power. But if you do, you also imply at the same time that 'some dirt farmer' can only live in a (semi-)functional society if he's being oppressed by a ruthless dictator. The US didn't mess up rebuilding Iraq, it was Al-Zarqawi who messed up the US efforts by provoking the Shia and Sunni into a civil war by using mass suicide bombings. And it was left-wing liberal progressives (and hypocrit muslims) that sealed Iraq's fate by demanding Obama to pull the troops, just when they were about to round shit up.

But since you don't believe me, I'll let an ex-muslim do the talking: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=UU19J83LCkBL2KFPEtifwfJQ. Watch all those videos and then come back to me.

Placing a contentious & volatile sunni/shia/etc mixture into the same country was a british colonial strategy to divide & conquer. Their eventual successor in strongman Saddam also had the skillset to keep that mixture under control. Unfortunately the proj for new merican century folks had about your level of competency & intellect, which was only ever going to produce what we see today.

 

[agent00f]

I was pondering these sorts of thread and had an idea. In the interest of better organization, this forum should have a thread for every foreign ethnicity, where records of their uppidiness can be recorded for posterity & reference. For logistical purposes, we should assign a member who ostensibly hates each race/creed the most to their respective responsibility. A foreseeable issue though is that these bigotries tend to overlap, for example, some might hate all asians, but others only the chinese, similarly arabs/muslims or hispanics/mexicans. So the bigots will have to work out some kind of system for deduplication & such.

 

[SmilingBhudda]

It's certainly your prerogative to believe Christians who pray to god regularly killing people is the same thing as smokers using a product which was in some fashion discovered by some natives. Same as it's your perogative to believe 2+2=22; it doesn't affect me and just makes you a deluded idiot.


It's simply historical fact the chinese had relatively advanced agriculture fairly early, which is what allowed a pretty large civilization and all that portends. It took the west a while longer to get to the same point then surpass it. The west's wars never really ended, they just can't fight themselves anymore due to nukes and had to be content with killing hapless brown people or such when politically expedient. Rather serendipitous since you're not a hapless brownie.



Placing a contentious & volatile sunni/shia/etc mixture into the same country was a british colonial strategy to divide & conquer. Their eventual successor in strongman Saddam also had the skillset to keep that mixture under control. Unfortunately the proj for new merican century folks had about your level of competency & intellect, which was only ever going to produce what we see today.

You must have been binge watching those videos I linked. I am not going to waste more time by replying to false comparisons between islam and Christianity.

This is the thread in which (ex-)muslims speak about the dangers of islam, here are two more of them:

 

[agent00f]

You must have been binge watching those videos I linked. I am not going to waste more time by replying to false comparisons between islam and Christianity.

This is the thread in which (ex-)muslims speak about the dangers of islam, here are two more of them:

So I take it you accept the nomination as keeper of this thread if the OP declines?

 

[SSSnail]

SmillingBudda, those Muslims in those videos are obviously white right-wing Christian racists.

 

[agent00f]

Only watched like a min of the second video, and the guy was talking about muslim dummies much the same way I've done for their counterparts here. I've mentioned this sort of intellectual class division numerous times but unfortunately dummies are rarely self-cognizant of their station.

 

[SSSnail]

So, same old same old, talking about things you know nothing about, or don't fully understand. Got it.

 

[agent00f]

To humans, words have meaning, so just parroting what I say about you like a zoo exhibit isn't going to result in what you're hoping for.

 

[SSSnail]

So you do understand that you're full of shit. Good to know.

 

[agent00f]

When that guy's talking about western enlightenment, he's not talking about you & friends. You know, the sort that use his point as an argument for bigotry. Your sort are muslim equivalents he's criticizing.

 

[AnonymouseUser]

https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/4y4zwt/turkey_removes_age_limit_for_sex_with_children/

Don't it make you wonder when all these sites try to lie to you?

It does appear that there was some misinformation regarding the repeal of said law.

It's easier to marry a child in the US and the age of consent in Germany is 14

"No minimum age with approval of a superior court judge and parental consent."
"Consent can be just judicial, but is normally both parental and judicial. In the absence of any statutory minimum age, one opinion is that the traditional minimum common law marriageable age of 12 for girls and 14 for boys may still be in effect"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_marriage_in_the_United_States
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_the_United_States

So... Americans sure love their children eh?

According to the charity organization Girls Not Brides (which fights to end child marriages worldwide), the US has such a low prevalence of child marriages that they can't even give an estimate (for one year it was roughly 3000 under 18). For Turkey, it's listed as 1% of all girls are married before age 15, and that the actual number may be much higher because they can't gauge the true extent due religious marriages:

Turkey has one of the highest rates of child marriage in Europe with an estimated 15% of girls married before the age of 18.

However, statistical data available may not be representative of the scale of the issue since most child marriages are unregistered and take place as unofficial religious marriages.

A UNHCR survey conducted in 2014 revealed that the average age of marriage for Syrian refugee girls in Turkey was between 13 and 20 years with many respondents saying if they had the money, they would not have resorted to marrying off their daughters at such a young age.

How about degenerates?

How about no. I thought I made myself clear that I don't want any more moslem refugees coming to the US...

 

[Orignal Earl]

How about no. I thought I made myself clear that I don't want any more moslem refugees coming to the US...

Gotch ya
You think you have a chance at banning Muslims?

 

[AnonymouseUser]

You think you have a chance at banning Muslims?

Alone? Not a snowballs chance in a nonexistent place. Collectively, I would hope so. The fact that islam - or any religion for that matter - is still growing in this information age is deeply disturbing. The fact that some of the world's leaders feel that (mostly) free, progressive countries should have islam forced on them is even more disturbing.

 

[Orignal Earl]

Alone? Not a snowballs chance in a nonexistent place. Collectively, I would hope so. The fact that islam - or any religion for that matter - is still growing in this information age is deeply disturbing. The fact that some of the world's leaders feel that (mostly) free, progressive countries should have islam forced on them is even more disturbing.

I think the vast majority of Americans still believe freedom of religion is important