Strikeforce's Heavyweight Grand Prix starts TODAY! ( 2/12/11 )

[Woosta]

The point of the list was to say I think most of them would beat Fedor and it would mostly be 1 sided. I'm also saying that "prime" Fedor cant beat 75 percent of that list.

You named 15 "could" bes and not 25 destroyers.

I'm still waiting for you to refute my statement.

 

[ctark]

You said 25 would destroy him yet you post 15. I will say that the best who have a chance are Cain, JDS, Rua, Bones, Carwin and Roy Nelson.

They certainly wouldn't "destroy" him, though.

I said in my post I only posted the UFC fighters that would beat him soundly. I can name 25, but whats the point? You will just argue with me. The only fighters on that list i'd give Fedor a 50/50 shot is Rampage and Carwin, mainly due to styles.

 

[ctark]

You named 15 "could" bes and not 25 destroyers.

I'm still waiting for you to refute my statement.

Fine. I refute your statement.

 

[ArchAngel777]

The point of the list was to say I think most of them would beat Fedor and it would mostly be 1 sided. I'm also saying that "prime" Fedor cant beat 75 percent of that list.

Were down to opinion anyway. I do believe that the Prime Fedor could beat 75% of that list. Not fedor as he is today, and not everyone in the list even in his prime.

You see Cain beat Brock Lesnar. That is how the prime Fedor would have beaten him as well. It is pretty easy to see that Brock doesn't like getting hit in the face. If Lesnar can learn to take a punch without cowering, he will become the great MMA fighter of all time. But until we starts getting hit in the face on a regular basis and adapts, the guy is always going to baby up when the fists keep going.

 

[JMoore17]

i'm not a pro on this site at all but i do know how to count, woosta named 13 heavyweights in the top 10, 14 if you count fedor... top 10 or top 14?

 

[QueBert]

The point of the list was to say I think most of them would beat Fedor and it would mostly be 1 sided. I'm also saying that "prime" Fedor cant beat 75 percent of that list.

Your list is a bit flawed, I love Berry and he has amazing kick boxing, but his TDD and ground game are total shit at this point. If Fedor got him down it would be over. Mitrioni doesn't have the ground game to survive either, his TDD is pretty good though. Mir stands no chance, at this point he's still obsessed with a 3rd and final fight with Lesnar (which he would lose) Fedor is better at everything than Frank. Couture & Griffin, Randy I say 50/50, Forrest hummm he shouldn't be able to beat Fedor, but you can never count that bastard out.

Evans 70/30 not in his favor, Carwin 50/50 just from his power but he doesn't do anything on an elite level. Nelson? Shit I don't know dude is tough as nails and has pretty decent power but I don't see how he could pull it off. The rest of your list I agree with, well 'Page I dunno because fight to fight lately you don't know what the fuck to expect from him.

Sherdog's still overloaded, it sucks that Fedor fans will try to deny this as a loss because they think it was a bad stoppage "he didn't lose, the ref was an idiot" But then again Sherdoggers are the ones who claim the best BJJ HW in MMA submitting Fedor was a fluke, so lol.

 

[Woosta]

Fine. I refute your statement.

Since you can't bring up a good argument, why don't you just agree?

 

[WaTaGuMp]

I don't know why, but when I saw the lineup for this tourny, I had a feeling the Fedor and Allistar fight would never happen.

 

[ctark]

P4P is too subjective to even argue about it.

The man was undefeated for 10 years. He was the #1 HW for at least 4-5 years, LOL @ 2-3 years.

*waits for your refute*

You like to throw around the word refute a lot. You also like to throw around meaningless numbers a lot. Face it, Fedor would get stomped by the likes of Mitrione and some of the lesser known heavyweights in the UFC. You can compare records all day

Matt Mitrione has been undefeated for 32 years, that beats Fedor's 10.


See what I did there?

 

[ArchAngel777]

i'm not a pro on this site at all but i do know how to count, woosta named 13 heavyweights in the top 10, 14 if you count fedor... top 10 or top 14?

There is no contradiction. Being top 10 isn't static. Arlovski was ranked #4? I believe when Fedor had fought him. Is he Top 10 now? No, of course not. It is at the time of the fights what they are ranked, that matters.

But rank is deceiving anyway. As I noted earlier, because MMA is evolvings, it isn't as simple as saying who fought who and who was a top 10, etc... If they never fought, then it is only a guess no matter how educated it was.

Take Dana White. He predict that Fedor would beat Antonio Silva no problem. So did everyone... It didn't work that way, did it? All this speculation doesn't mean jack. Fedor's record is proven at this point. He did great for his time. Lets leave him be.

 

[Woosta]

You like to throw around the word refute a lot. You also like to throw around meaningless numbers a lot. Face it, Fedor would get stomped by the likes of Mitrione and some of the lesser known heavyweights in the UFC. You can compare records all day

Matt Mitrione has been undefeated for 32 years, that beats Fedor's 10.


See what I did there?

The fact is Fedor has fought more top 10 HWs than any other HW in the last 4 years. You can't back that up so you clutch at straws.

What you did there is completely retarded, even the Zuffa Zombies would agree.

 

[Woosta]

Broken orbital looks like.

 

[ArchAngel777]

I don't know why, but when I saw the lineup for this tourny, I had a feeling the Fedor and Allistar fight would never happen.

I didn't exect Fedor to make it there. But, I did expect him to beat Silva. However, I even said to my buddy at work "I worry about Silva, because he has such a good chin. Look like the punches he took from Mike Kyle, the guy is an ape." It looks like my reservations were founded on solid thoughts. Silva did take a few hits, didn't seem to phase him though. Congrats to Silva, he did a great job.

 

[QueBert]

I don't know why, but when I saw the lineup for this tourny, I had a feeling the Fedor and Allistar fight would never happen.

This loss is bad for SF, Fedor was suppose to smash Bigfoot and than either rematch the guy who just beat him or fight Overreem. Now he's out and I know SF wanted him or Alistair or Werdum to win it. Well 1 of the 2 remaining will also be out come the next round. What the fuck will they do is Barnett wins? he can't even reliably pass a piss test, shit he's the reason Affliction had to fold. If Overreem or Werdum don't win this, SF will be fucked because their 3 supposed top fighters all lost. The finals could end up being Silva Vs Rodgers, while I'd like to see that, the average SF fan won't. I think I'll pull for Rogers now just because I know SF pulled a Silva on him, putting him in a fight they're sure he'd lose.

 

[ctark]

The fact is Fedor has fought more top 10 HWs than any other HW in the last 4 years. You can't back that up so you clutch at straws.

What you did there is completely retarded, even the Zuffa Zombies would agree.

You can maniuplate numbers and use them to get your point across. Do you honestly believe that list you compiled of "top 10 HW's" really is accurate?

What I'm saying is, if you take that list of heavy weights that fedor fought, and put them in with the rest of the relevant heavyweights in the last 4 years. Do you really think those guys would be top 10? If P4P is subjective then so are your so called rankings. When he fought those opponents their ships had already sailed, and you know it.

 

[Woosta]

You can maniuplate numbers and use them to get your point across. Do you honestly believe that list you compiled of "top 10 HW's" really is accurate?

What I'm saying is, if you take that list of heavy weights that fedor fought, and put them in with the rest of the relevant heavyweights in the last 4 years. Do you really think those guys would be top 10? If P4P is subjective then so are your so called rankings. When he fought those opponents their ships had already sailed, and you know it.

It is accurate. Go lookup Sherdog rankings for the time range during each of the fights.

put them in with the rest of the relevant heavyweights in the last 4 years

This would be akin to rewriting history. You can't pick and rearrange rankings years afterwards.

When he fought those opponents their ships had already sailed, and you know it.

You could say that about any opponents the UFC HWs have fought and won over. You can't change rankings, though.

I don't get why people don't understand context... it matters very much what the opponent(s) were ranked at that time.. I don't see how you can understand it any other way.

 

[ctark]

It is accurate. Go lookup Sherdog rankings for the time range during each of the fights.



This would be akin to rewriting history. You can't pick and rearrange rankings years afterwards.



You could say that about any opponents the UFC HWs have fought and won over.

You put a guy on the list who lost tonight, and has lost quite a few fights in a row. Rankings are not the be all end all. Those fighters you listed are nothing compared to the ones in the UFC now. If you have a division full of cans, one of them has to be successful. But once you bring real talent in, it paints a whole different picture and gives you new perspective on how things really are.

Face it, the UFC has just recently built a decent heavyweight division. So what he beat a former UFC champ, really means nothing. By the way.. I'll add 2 more to the list that can beat Fedor soundly

Shawn Michaels via Sweet Chin Music
Undertaker via Tomb Stone

 

[Woosta]

You put a guy on the list who lost tonight, and has lost quite a few fights in a row. Rankings are not the be all end all. Those fighters you listed are nothing compared to the ones in the UFC now. If you have a division full of cans, one of them has to be successful. But once you bring real talent in, it paints a whole different picture and gives you new perspective on how things really are.

Face it, the UFC has just recently built a decent heavyweight division. So what he beat a former UFC champ, really means nothing. By the way.. I'll add 2 more to the list that can beat Fedor soundly

Shawn Michaels via Sweet Chin Music
Undertaker via Tomb Stone

The UFC's HW division is actually realistically weaker than Strikeforce's.

By bringing WWE into this you practically destroyed your own argument for me. Quoted so you can't edit.

Hopefully a few years down the road the realization will kick in; would be a shame if you went so long being an ignorant MMA fan.

 

[gevorg]

At his peak, Fedor achieve more than any current HW plus some. Now, it looks like Fedor is on his way down.

 

[ctark]

At his peak, Fedor achieve more than any current HW plus some. Now, it looks like Fedor is on his way down.

Fedor was in the right place at the right time. MMA only really started gaining traction in the last decade. IF the sport thrives for 100 years Fedor wont even be a blip on the radar.

 

[gevorg]

By the way.. I'll add 2 more to the list that can beat Fedor soundly

Shawn Michaels via Sweet Chin Music
Undertaker via Tomb Stone

Fedor was in the right place at the right time. MMA only really started gaining traction in the last decade. IF the sport thrives for 100 years Fedor wont even be a blip on the radar.

 

[ctark]

The UFC's HW division is actually realistically weaker than Strikeforce's.

By bringing WWE into this you practically destroyed your own argument for me. Quoted so you can't edit.

Hopefully a few years down the road the realization will kick in; would be a shame if you went so long being an ignorant MMA fan.

I just know how you hardcore MMA fans hate the WWE. The very thought of the WWE being in the same sentence as MMA irks you, and I know it does.

 

[ctark]

I know, I'm clowning this fool. Glad you appreciate it!

 

[Woosta]

Can't believe ctark forgot

and Stone Cold by Stunner
Sting by Scorpion Death Lock
Bret Hart by Sharpshooter
Hogan with the Leg Drop
Goldberg by Jackhammer

 

[Woosta]

I just know how you hardcore MMA fans hate the WWE. The very thought of the WWE being in the same sentence as MMA irks you, and I know it does.

Wrong again

I actually watched WWF/WCW during my childhood; I loved the Attitude Era, the NWO Era before Russo, ECW.

I still watch some TNA every once in awhile just to see the old generation. I think AJ Styles is probably the best mainstream company wrestler even though he's of the relatively newer generation.

I watch the Botchmanias; I watch shoots with older wrestlers; I watch a lot of wrestling on the 'tube nowadays so I'm no hater.

I do hate the current WWE though; John Cena and Orton.. ugh.. 1/50th the talent of a Rock/Stone Cold.

My favorite wrestler of all time would have to be The Rock since he retired.. it was Sting before he did. No one could work the crowd like Maivia, including Flair.