Student loans

[OverVolt]

What Old people think when people argue if college is worth it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vz-6-MfpsJo

What young people who actually have a ton of student loans think: http://www.dwmgmt.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Student-Loans.png

 

[highland145]

At some point, parents and students should have realized that they were effing themselves. I'm hoping that the system implodes in the next 5 years ( I have a 13 yo) and tuition drops to a more reasonable level. LK posted a link showing Clemson's budget increased 36% over the last 5 years. I'm fairly sure the quality of education didn't increase 36%.

 

[Anubis]

im not sure it'll implode, what I think will happen is you are going to see a huge shift in where people go to school. Lots more going to state schools or doing a couple years at a community college and then transferring someplace else. as both of those are much more affordable options

 

[Moonbeam]

How was it that there was a time when average people could afford a college education and they can't today?

 

[Fenixgoon]

one of my facebook friends was complaining about how she has 30k in student loan left and will be paying it off for a long time (she's a teacher). well here's a brilliant idea, don't get a bazillion dollars in student loans if you can't pay them back.

i busted my ass in school, got multiple scholarships, and paid all 17k of my loans back in about 2 years. then again, i majored in engineering where we can actually get paid a decent amount to pay back all those loans.

so maybe we shouldn't be handing out loans like candy. maybe people should take a hard look at whether it's actually worth going into such massive debt for a degree that will end up paying little

 

[highland145]

im not sure it'll implode, what I think will happen is you are going to see a huge shift in where people go to school. Lots more going to state schools or doing a couple years at a community college and then transferring someplace else. as both of those are much more affordable options

That should help if the unis are being squeezed like a rotten tomato for students.

Clemson gets some state $$ but I'm not sure what the definition of a state school is.

Fortunately, we have one of the best regional colleges just down the road. The kid will be going there for his 1st year, at least. ~$9K/yr.

so maybe we shouldn't be handing out loans like candy. maybe people should take a hard look at whether it's actually worth going into such massive debt for a degree that will end up paying little

There you go with that personal responsibility crap.

 

[Exterous]

maybe people should take a hard look at whether it's actually worth going into such massive debt for a degree that will end up paying little

Largely I agree but the issue goes beyond that. Part of the problem is that student loan debt is that its starting to eclipse wages for 'important' degrees like those in education and the sciences. Normally this would simply increase demand and eventually wages\benefits but many of these fields are under intense downward wage\benefit pressure from institutions poorly positioned to respond to supply and demand changes (ie the government). The long lead times of these degrees compounds the problem. If you end up with a shortage now it will be difficult to fill that shortage in under 4-6 years.

Also, while this doesn't hold true for all degrees there are the situations like what happened to Architects in 2006, MBAs in 2008, Laywers now: The job market was great when you started and it seemed like a great choice but by the time you could work in the field it was complete and utter shit. This isn't just 'pick a high paying degree' as there are a lot of outside forces that you can't predict acting on the job market during your education. We are talking things that tank your formerly well compensated job choice in less than a year so there may be a lot of luck involved as well

Edit: I believe only focusing on the 'good' degrees will compound this problem unless college enrollment goes down. If too many people flock to a degree that is good in 2014 and 2015 when they graduate in 2018-2019 they will find the market flooded with all those other people that chose the 'good' degree. What seemed like a good choice in 2014 turns out to be a terrible choice

 

[Atomic Playboy]

one of my facebook friends was complaining about how she has 30k in student loan left and will be paying it off for a long time (she's a teacher). well here's a brilliant idea, don't get a bazillion dollars in student loans if you can't pay them back.

i busted my ass in school, got multiple scholarships, and paid all 17k of my loans back in about 2 years. then again, i majored in engineering where we can actually get paid a decent amount to pay back all those loans.

so maybe we shouldn't be handing out loans like candy. maybe people should take a hard look at whether it's actually worth going into such massive debt for a degree that will end up paying little

OK, but by that logic, literally no one should become a teacher. Most teaching positions require post-graduate work or a Masters, and the median pay for teachers is far less than that of engineers. In fact, there are lots of professional occupations that require at least a bachelor's degree and pay far less than engineering. Should no one go into these fields because it's not as lucrative as engineering? How would society fare with no teachers? I don't think it's as simple as "the career that makes the most money is the best."

 

[piasabird]

Shortly after Obama took over student loans, making the federal government a bank, Congress increased the percentage rates for student loans by almost twice the interest rate. Good luck. Students loans cant be forgiven, and they can hold it against you when you apply for loans. They can even deduct it from your Social Security.

 

[piasabird]

My advice on degrees is get a dual degree. There are a lot of Engineers and phd's who can not get a job in their narrow field of study. The federal government is behind this lack of demand in certain professions. They keep issuing h1b visas making it hard for Americans to find work.

 

[Anubis]

but I'm not sure what the definition of a state school is.

.

State university system, most states have them, and they are generally pretty inexpensive for people who live in that state, compared to going to a private college someplace else

 

[Jhhnn]

College serves multiple purposes at this juncture.

First, it imposes high entry fees on more & more increasingly scarce positions that also provide less ability to pay those fees. It reinforces wage slavery even in the face of fewer decent paying wage slave jobs.

Second, it parks young people in the education system rather than having them participate in the work force. That's because the Job Creators aren't, you know, creating enough jobs. Offshoring & automation have eliminated the need for them to do that to make money.

It supports & creates the illusion that there will be enough jobs somewhere down the road, too. There won't be, certainly not in sufficient numbers to carry our protestant work ethic headset & distribution system forward.

Yes, we are reaping the benefits of automation, no doubt, but we can't seem to figure out how to spread that around the same way we could with the plentiful jobs/ work/ growth model of the decades following WW2. That's what we need to figure out, & right wing headsets sure as Hell can't accomplish that.

 

[Moonbeam]

When Americans are too stupid to flip a burger a college education will be free. As long as students pay ransom for a livelihood the ransom demands will go up. With CEO's making billions, you didn't think your greed wouldn't put a ring in your nose, did you?

 

[dphantom]

That's because the Job Creators aren't, you know, creating enough jobs.

Did you know you could be a job creator too if you do not like what the current job creators are doing or not doing? Or you can whine about no jobs.

of course my work ethic has rewarded me with only being between jobs once (for 3 weeks) in my 40 year work career.

 

[Jhhnn]

Did you know you could be a job creator too if you do not like what the current job creators are doing or not doing? Or you can whine about no jobs.

of course my work ethic has rewarded me with only being between jobs once (for 3 weeks) in my 40 year work career.

Do you know I never claimed to be a job creator so as to justify an enormous income & extreme wealth? There is a whole political leadership faction who have, so it seems appropriate to judge their performance in that regard, not mine.

I have been similarly lucky wrt employment, although I recognize some of it to be the simple fact that fortune has smiled upon me. I'm not so emotionally needy & my ego isn't so fragile that I need to pretend otherwise.

But, please feel free to wear your smug like a badge of honor. It doesn't really look good on anybody.

 

[Moonbeam]

Did you know you could be a job creator too if you do not like what the current job creators are doing or not doing? Or you can whine about no jobs.

of course my work ethic has rewarded me with only being between jobs once (for 3 weeks) in my 40 year work career.

What the f are you doing working 40 years. Are you nuts, or just broke?

 

[squarecut1]

of course my work ethic has rewarded me with only being between jobs once (for 3 weeks) in my 40 year work career.

Be thankful, instead of bragging about it.

 

[Fern]

What Old people think when people argue if college is worth it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vz-6-MfpsJo

What young people who actually have a ton of student loans think: http://www.dwmgmt.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Student-Loans.png

I don't have audio so don't know what the youtube link says, but this 'old person' thinks college tuition has become stupid expensive. I don't think it's worth it for most degrees.

Fern

 

[TheVrolok]

I wish I only had five figure student loan debt. Damn you sixth figure! :-(

 

[SandEagle]

tuition is ridonkulous. it is meant to keep you in debt. those in debt do not question what the government does. it forces poverty and welfare on them. 37% of Americans are on welfare today. guaranteed they don't complain or give a shit what is going on with our foreign policies. they are waiting for the next welfare check and probably won't vote this upcoming election.

 

[Jhhnn]

I don't have audio so don't know what the youtube link says, but this 'old person' thinks college tuition has become stupid expensive. I don't think it's worth it for most degrees.

Fern

A big part of the reason is that State support for State schools has dwindled enormously over the years.

OTOH, why pay taxes to educate people to perform jobs that you have no intention of creating at all? Particularly when you can convince them it'll do 'em some good, loan them the money instead & have the govt guarantee payment?

Hell, let the Chinese govt pay for it & hire them instead. It's easy once you've gone multi-national & exist above the system.

 

[alcoholbob]

How was it that there was a time when average people could afford a college education and they can't today?

You could ask the same about medical costs.

 

[OverVolt]

I don't have audio so don't know what the youtube link says, but this 'old person' thinks college tuition has become stupid expensive. I don't think it's worth it for most degrees.

Fern

Haha, its from Mr. Deeds. It was playing one day on cable which is what gave me the idea. "Whatcha going to do with your $20,000? Quit school... ohh yea!" And the bum goes "Thats a great idea, school is for fools! Look at me! wooOooOOoOhoooOooo!!!"

Such a 2002 thing. It embodied pretty well what everyone thought back then.

 

[Victorian Gray]

tuition is ridonkulous. it is meant to keep you in debt. those in debt do not question what the government does. it forces poverty and welfare on them. 37% of Americans are on welfare today. guaranteed they don't complain or give a shit what is going on with our foreign policies. they are waiting for the next welfare check and probably won't vote this upcoming election.

4.1% of the population of the United States is on welfare.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/welfare-statistics/

 

[MongGrel]

tuition is ridonkulous. it is meant to keep you in debt. those in debt do not question what the government does. it forces poverty and welfare on them. 37% of Americans are on welfare today. guaranteed they don't complain or give a shit what is going on with our foreign policies. they are waiting for the next welfare check and probably won't vote this upcoming election.

4.1% of the population of the United States is on welfare.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/welfare-statistics/

I was going to post a few comments on that one, but it's unnecessary.