study finds religious people are less intelligent than atheists

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Nov 29, 2006
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Excepting that they are functionally equivalent.

Really? Atheist say there is no god (as if they have proof, sort of like a theist), while and Agnostic says we have no proof either way so its not worthy of thought basically.

Now some go one step further and mix the 2 like myself. Im an agnostic athiest. Meaning there is no proof, but if i had to guess there wouldnt be a god with what we do currently know.
 

justoh

Diamond Member
Jun 11, 2013
3,686
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Really? Atheist say there is no god (as if they have proof, sort of like a theist), while and Agnostic says we have no proof either way so its not worthy of thought basically.

Now some go one step further and mix the 2 like myself. Im an agnostic athiest. Meaning there is no proof, but if i had to guess there wouldnt be a god with what we do currently know.

Yeah i realize that there are purported differences, though I cannot think of any prominent atheists who, when pressed, claim anything more than a lack of evidence, nor have i personally met any person at all who would claim to be able to prove a negative. I said when pressed as it's reasonable to talk about gods as being non-existent, just in the same way we talk of non-existent unicorns, even though we cannot be certain.

I don't think it makes much sense to refer to people who take it on faith that there aren't any gods as atheists, as it renders the term meaningless at best (at worst it belies reason) - it certainly muddies things. It is true for everyone that there isn't any evidence, and likewise false for all that anyone could reasonably claim more than that, so what's with all the distinctions?
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,774
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What's funny is that each religion thinks it is right and the rest are wrong. And most of the religions have different sects within themselves. It would be a lot more convincing if there was only one religion. If you polled all religious people what percent would say each of the holy books were true?
 

GagHalfrunt

Lifer
Apr 19, 2001
25,297
2,001
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for a whole bunch of people congratulating themselves over their skepticism, there's a distinct lack of skepticism about the original article.

Some theories put forth are so intuitive that they don't lend themselves to in-depth dissection of the scientific method used. If somebody publishes a new theory that confirms gravity I'm not going to feel the need to sit there with a calculator to check if they fudged the numbers. There's a well-deserved preconception that people who believe in things with zero evidence to support those beliefs are inherently stupid.
 

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
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The only kind of intelligent religious person I can imagine is that of someone who is fully aware of how delusional they are, but they are in it for the comforting aspect of having a "father figure" that watches over us, so they stick to it anyway

You have lived a very sheltered existence
 

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
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Some theories put forth are so intuitive that they don't lend themselves to in-depth dissection of the scientific method used.

somebody doesn't understand the scientific method very much

If somebody publishes a new theory that confirms gravity I'm not going to feel the need to sit there with a calculator to check if they fudged the numbers.

a NEW theory of gravity? That would be very noteworthy

There's a well-deserved preconception that people who believe in things with zero evidence to support those beliefs are inherently stupid.

speaking of ignorance . . .
 

Dirigible

Diamond Member
Apr 26, 2006
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Has there been butthurt in this thread yet? I delayed entering because I wanted to make sure there was plenty of butthurt first.
 
Nov 29, 2006
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Has there been butthurt in this thread yet? I delayed entering because I wanted to make sure there was plenty of butthurt first.

Of course there is. Religious people don't like being called out or shown facts that shine a worse light on them.
 

BurnItDwn

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
26,127
1,604
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People who believe in nonsensical mysticism and people who do not care for such things both can agree on one thing. Beer is delicious!
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
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"Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid."
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,774
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People who believe in nonsensical mysticism and people who do not care for such things both can agree on one thing. Beer is delicious!

No, I afraid they can't. Muslims aren't allowed to drink beer. You attempt to reach across the aisle has failed.
 

Cerpin Taxt

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
11,943
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Have we had the atheist vs agnostic argument yet?

Really? Atheist say there is no god (as if they have proof, sort of like a theist), while and Agnostic says we have no proof either way so its not worthy of thought basically.

Now some go one step further and mix the 2 like myself. Im an agnostic athiest. Meaning there is no proof, but if i had to guess there wouldnt be a god with what we do currently know.

I might be able to make something out of this, Gibsons. :awe:
 

pmv

Lifer
May 30, 2008
13,277
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Really? Atheist say there is no god (as if they have proof, sort of like a theist), while and Agnostic says we have no proof either way so its not worthy of thought basically.

Now some go one step further and mix the 2 like myself. Im an agnostic athiest. Meaning there is no proof, but if i had to guess there wouldnt be a god with what we do currently know.


Er, the key word there was 'functionally' - you seem to have ignored that!

Both athiests and agnostics chose to live _as if_ none of the many posited Gods actually exist. Regardless of what blather they come out with in words, in practice they are indistinguishable.

In reality you just couldn't function if you lived as true agnostic, there's no way to cope with that level of uncertainty. How would you manage to _do_ anything if you were genuinely unsure of the result and worried that any given act or non-act might condemn you to eternal damnation?

Bear in mind that the stakes here are literally infinite and eternal. So if you are seriously maintaining that there's even a small chance that there's a God who will condemn you for posting on such an unGodly site as ATOT, you better not risk it.

In reality most claimed agnostics don't live as true agnostics, they live the same way as most atheists.

Now it might be possible to be a little bit agnostic, in that you can't quite chose between a few possible Gods. So you do your best to keep all of them happy, just in case. I've actually known folk like that, I think its not uncommon in some parts of Asia - they will practice several different forms of worship at once, just to be on the safe side. But that only works with a limited selection of Gods and with ones who won't get too angry if you pay attention to rival possible Gods.

But I've yet to find a Western self-proclaimed agnostic who showed any sign of seriously thinking all the multitudinous Gods _might_ exist, and who changed their day-to-day life accordingly.
 
Nov 29, 2006
15,662
4,136
136
Er, the key word there was 'functionally' - you seem to have ignored that!

Both athiests and agnostics chose to live _as if_ none of the many posited Gods actually exist. Regardless of what blather they come out with in words, in practice they are indistinguishable.

In reality you just couldn't function if you lived as true agnostic, there's no way to cope with that level of uncertainty. How would you manage to _do_ anything if you were genuinely unsure of the result and worried that any given act or non-act might condemn you to eternal damnation?

Bear in mind that the stakes here are literally infinite and eternal. So if you are seriously maintaining that there's even a small chance that there's a God who will condemn you for posting on such an unGodly site as ATOT, you better not risk it.

In reality most claimed agnostics don't live as true agnostics, they live the same way as most atheists.

Now it might be possible to be a little bit agnostic, in that you can't quite chose between a few possible Gods. So you do your best to keep all of them happy, just in case. I've actually known folk like that, I think its not uncommon in some parts of Asia - they will practice several different forms of worship at once, just to be on the safe side. But that only works with a limited selection of Gods and with ones who won't get too angry if you pay attention to rival possible Gods.

But I've yet to find a Western self-proclaimed agnostic who showed any sign of seriously thinking all the multitudinous Gods _might_ exist, and who changed their day-to-day life accordingly.

Im an agnostic athiest and i dont worry one damn about eternal damnation and i function like any other normal person. I got a good job, wife etc. Why would i worry about something im not sure even exists? It may, but until i have some kind of proof its not worth my time.

As every other thing in the world without proof we dont believe. Why should religion be any different? You dont see millions of people proclaiming to believe in unicorns, yet we technically cannot prove they dont exist.

Religion is a crutch for the weak.
 
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