Suggestions for A Mobo

[Nerdz]

A friend of Mine is going to let me have a E6600 (well a complete system) for $125, I told him I plan to overclock so I plan on getting my own mobo. Now I currently have a system that still uses DDR, which I know I cant use, and I know life was simple back then.

First question: What Speed ram do I get If I want DDR3 and want to overclock? Like 1066, 1333, or 1600..etc? I remember from the ol days, you can just get PC3200 and go as fast as you want! Seems its more complex than that. Also, the reason for going DDR3 is because its Cheaper.

2nd question, Motherboards. Ive used Asus, Bio-star, and Gigabyte boards in the past, But Im not sure which mobo for socket 775 to chose. So Far I have this selected

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813128496

I was told to go with a P45 Chipset but it seems P43 is just a good. My price range for a Mobo is around $50 to 75 as for Ram its around $50

 

[Blitz KriegeR]

Spending money on old engineering is not a good idea. If a cheap PC is what you are after and one has been provided great, clock the shit out of it while it lasts. Spending money to "improve" the OC on an old chip will net you very bad performance per $$$. If you are looking to spend money on a board and RAM, don't. Spend the same cash on an entry level modern system and it will run circles around an older design.

To answer your questions anyway: Overclocking DDR3 I personally like 1600. 1333 Minimum, but the sky is the limit. Since your suggest rig would gets is memory speed just as much from the FSB as the dividers I would get 1600. All the new Intel chips are frequency locked at 100Mhz (give or take a few, seen up to 103.5) you get all your memory tuning from the memory dividers and CPU overclock stays pretty separate.

As far as the board, it is fine expect the price of out dated engineering comment.

 

[mfenn]

Spending money on old engineering is not a good idea. If a cheap PC is what you are after and one has been provided great, clock the shit out of it while it lasts. Spending money to "improve" the OC on an old chip will net you very bad performance per $$$. If you are looking to spend money on a board and RAM, don't. Spend the same cash on an entry level modern system and it will run circles around an older design.

:thumbsup: Agree. I can't see the sense in spending $125 to "upgrade" a $125 Core 2.

 

[Nerdz]

And your right about that, I could get a cheap quad core and clock it just as fast and still come in under budget, I just wondered if dual core was "better" at a higher clock than quad.

Really the only thing the system would need Is a graphics card with PSU upgrade. I might still buy it, and if it doesnt reach my expectations well I'll just replace the family PC with it.

Thanks

ADD : Im a AMD fan boy I might add, quad core for $79 (link) is cheap, But Im also concerned with overclocking potential (however Im open to any proc that will give me the best bang for my buck within the $100 range-Which Does seem to be only AMD) However, I also read that some tri-cores can be unlocked to quads

Incase this Doesnt work out, Ram, GPU and cooler are all pretty much universal. Worst Case Im looking at: Spending $200 for a CPU + mobo.

GPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814127534
Cooler: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835106150
Ram: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231277
Case: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119227&Tpk=430%20elite

I just worry about the size of the heatsink, it looks HUGE.

 

[Gigantopithecus]

The Athlon II X4 630 at $80 is an incredible value. In my experience (couple dozen Athlon II X4 systems), the AIIX4s hit 3.3GHz on air at stock volts reliably. I've had a few up to ~3.6GHz with aftermarket cooling and very slight voltage bumps.

 

[Nerdz]

I wanted to add, after some thinking, I wont be buying this system...Your [all] right in saying Im better off getting a better (and newer) system for that Price. For 125 I can spend it on a Decent proc (hell maybe even a BE).

For some reason or another I couldnt get my logic right. Blinded by the light.

So now the question Becomes, what Mobo Does anyone suggest for Overclocking AM3 in the $50 to $85 range? One of the features I want is PCI-E 2.0 although I have no particular reason for this, I just dont want a 2.0 card to be limited by a 1.x mobo

ADD : Also is 4Gb enough ram for gaming?

So 3 choices for CPU's:
AMD Phenom X4 925 89.99
AMD Athlon X4 630 -79.99
AMD Phenom X4 955 BE-113 *drool*
The rest inbetween seem like Overclocked versions of the lower ones. Difference between the 925 and 630 seems to be L3 Cache but I cant find much info on the 925.

 

[betasub]

I just dont want a 2.0 card to be limited by a 1.x mobo

Unless you are getting expensive high-end graphics (like a monster dual-GPU card), this really isn't a problem to worry about. Still, you should have plenty of choice of boards with PCIe2.0

 

[mfenn]

I wanted to add, after some thinking, I wont be buying this system...Your [all] right in saying Im better off getting a better (and newer) system for that Price. For 125 I can spend it on a Decent proc (hell maybe even a BE).

For some reason or another I couldnt get my logic right. Blinded by the light.

So now the question Becomes, what Mobo Does anyone suggest for Overclocking AM3 in the $50 to $85 range? One of the features I want is PCI-E 2.0 although I have no particular reason for this, I just dont want a 2.0 card to be limited by a 1.x mobo

ADD : Also is 4Gb enough ram for gaming?

So 3 choices for CPU's:
AMD Phenom X4 925 89.99
AMD Athlon X4 630 -79.99
AMD Phenom X4 955 BE-113 *drool*
The rest inbetween seem like Overclocked versions of the lower ones. Difference between the 925 and 630 seems to be L3 Cache but I cant find much info on the 925.

Do you have an overall budget? With that info, I can fully spec out a well-balanced gaming rig for you. The reason I ask is that there are some subtle trade offs to be made in the budget space that can really make a difference in gaming performance. If you try to lock us (the forum posters) down to specific budgets for various parts, you can end up with a really unbalanced machine.

 

[Nerdz]

Grand Total: $400 to $600 (tops) and I would prefer AMD. Intel quads are too expensive.

Also, I have to use nvidia cards, because I run some applications on linux that use 3d (more or less two games), and ATI drivers suck :/, unless someone can prove otherwise. My current setup uses two computers, One for gaming and one for everything else. I used a windows box for gaming and a linux rig for everything else (net surfing, word processing, multi-tasking at times,etc). Id like just to have one comp now, so I will be dual booting. The only thing I will keep out of my current comps is the storage Drives and the DVD burner (both IDE).

 

[mfenn]

You really don't want to be using any IDE drives in this day and age. They're slow and not well supported by modern mobos.

I can throw together a complete box for under $600, no problem.

Athlon II X4 630 + TA870U3+ $150
Kingston DDR3 1600 8GB $57 AR
GTX 560 $170 AR
Samsung F3 1TB $65
Samsung DVD Burner $20
Corsair 430CX $35 AR
Antec Three Hundred $45 AR
Xigmatek SD1283 $24 AR
Total: $566 AR

 

[Nerdz]

I meant to mention I will be buying this in "Stages" Tommrow I get paid and plan on putting down $250 towards this.

You really don't want to be using any IDE drives in this day and age. They're slow and not well supported by modern mobos.

I can throw together a complete box for under $600, no problem.

Athlon II X4 630 + TA870U3+ $150
Kingston DDR3 1600 8GB $57 AR
GTX 560 $170 AR
Samsung F3 1TB $65
Samsung DVD Burner $20
Corsair 430CX $35 AR
Antec Three Hundred $45 AR
Xigmatek SD1283 $24 AR
Total: $566 AR

Interesting (thanks). But is 430W enough? Id be worried when I OC the proc I would hit a wall with power, as I dont plan on OC'ing the GPU much, I think their a bit more sensitive to OCing than CPUs are.

How good are Samsung Drives? Ive never owned one, Ive had WD which have been pretty much bulletproof (other than one failing after 6 years), Ive heard good things about Seagate but not so much about Samsung.

 

[Gigantopithecus]

Yes, & they're fine. Have fun!

 

[Nerdz]

Another question: Is L3 Cache Really that Important? Is it worth a extra few bucks? I mean will it give me a huge performance boost or only a small one, Like 5%?

 

[mfenn]

Yes, & they're fine. Have fun!

:thumbsup:

Another question: Is L3 Cache Really that Important? Is it worth a extra few bucks? I mean will it give me a huge performance boost or only a small one, Like 5%?

Yes, it is important. However, in games the GPU is more important. In a choice between getting a better GPU and getting a CPU with L3, it's better to get the better GPU.

 

[Nerdz]

Awesome, and with AM3 the option is always there to upgrade to a better CPU (although with overclocking, I dont know why I would). Unless ofc Bulldozer is going to be better than The current Gen CPU's, which Id hope so.

This is the List of stuff I finally decided on, most of it was taken from the suggestion above and just re-tweaked to my liking (case for example)

The following 4 I have ordered today:
Thermaltake Frio
NZXT Gamma
Athlon II X4 630 + TA870U3+

This is the next part I have *not* ordered but will be ordered everypay check depending on how much I have left.
(3)Gigabyte GTX 560
(2)Corsair CX600
(2)Samsung F3
(3 or 2)Samsung DVD Burner
(2)G.Skill Ripjaw Series

(numbers in ( ) just mean thats the route I will take when I buy them, since I am buying in stages). The logic behind stage two is atleast I can get the comp up and running, and get linux on it atleast which will allow me to do some sort of benchmarks (I am curious to see if Theres is a difference performance wise between Linux and Windows 7)

I know, Im being a pain about the RAM, and should just go for the 8gb but Im being a Tad Cheap. Theres no particular Reason why Im going with these either. I also forgot I have to get windows 7, but I dont know if the "Upgrade" can do a clean install. It seems it can according to newegg videos.

I'll add Im probably going to put 120mm fans in the case, and I will be making my own fan controller...probably based on the ambiguous 555 timer. I dont need fans at 100% if Im just going to surf the net.

Is there a program that will allow me to overclock on the fly from the desktop? Or Is there a way I can make the computer "dynamic" about changing the CPU freq. depending on its needs (Ie, Max freq when gaming but lowered down when doing something less intensive, like surfing the web, or typing a document)

Thanks for the help

 

[betasub]

Is there a way I can make the computer "dynamic" about changing the CPU freq. depending on its needs (Ie, Max freq when gaming but lowered down when doing something less intensive, like surfing the web, or typing a document)

It will do this automatically. Just make sure you have all power saving states enabled in BIOS, and your OS will handle the rest.

 

[Nerdz]

I just realized that the mobo has a 24 pin connector and another 4 pin connector for "CPU Power". Do I use Both connectors or can the 4 pin one be left out?

 

[mfenn]

I know, Im being a pain about the RAM, and should just go for the 8gb but Im being a Tad Cheap. Theres no particular Reason why Im going with these either. I also forgot I have to get windows 7, but I dont know if the "Upgrade" can do a clean install. It seems it can according to newegg videos.

If you get the recommended 430CX, you can afford 8GB of RAM from the get go. If you absolutely insist on getting 4GB of RAM, at least get a single 4GB stick so that you can easily upgrade to 8GB.

The upgrade version of Windows 7 can do a clean install, but you sometimes have to be a little tricky. You're violating the upgrade version EULA if you don't (a) have a valid Windows 2K or later license and (b) discontinue using it after you install the upgrade.

I just realized that the mobo has a 24 pin connector and another 4 pin connector for "CPU Power". Do I use Both connectors or can the 4 pin one be left out?

Yes, you need to hook them both up. The PSU has plenty of power connections, no need to skimp! :awe:

 

[Nerdz]

Yes, you need to hook them both up. The PSU has plenty of power connections, no need to skimp! :awe:

But on the connectors it looks like theres just the 24 pin connector and not a "extra" 4 pin Connector,Unless the 4 pin connector comes off of the 24 pin so I can put it in the 4 pin CPU power socket.

Add: Ok I think I see it. Its called a "4+4 pin EPS" connector, right?

 

[mfenn]

But on the connectors it looks like theres just the 24 pin connector and not a "extra" 4 pin Connector,Unless the 4 pin connector comes off of the 24 pin so I can put it in the 4 pin CPU power socket.

No, you need to use the 24-pin ATX as is.

Add: Ok I think I see it. Its called a "4+4 pin EPS" connector, right?

Yes, that's correct.

 

[Nerdz]

The upgrade version of Windows 7 can do a clean install, but you sometimes have to be a little tricky. You're violating the upgrade version EULA if you don't (a) have a valid Windows 2K or later license and (b) discontinue using it after you install the upgrade.

So its against the EULA to stop using windows 7 after I install it? Lol Thats Funny. But how do they Know if I have ever used windows XP at all? I could have been using linux all these years (not that I havent).

 

[Davidh373]

So its against the EULA to stop using windows 7 after I install it? Lol Thats Funny. But how do they Know if I have ever used windows XP at all? I could have been using linux all these years (not that I havent).

XP needs to be installed on the HDD in order to have the option. and it's against the EULA to continue use of your current copy of Windows XP, which you have then upgraded to 7. That is the whole point of it being called an "upgrade" and not a "discount" just because you've owned windows in the past.

I agree with everyone else even though we're past talking about not buying old hardware. It seems like you've already ordered the parts, but I would get an AM3+ mobo so you can have a substantial upgrade path to bulldozer. Upgrading to a Phenom II from an overclocked Athlon II is not really an upgrade by any means. It will give you very limited returns.

As far as everything else is concerned, you're in the clear. Good suggestions.

 

[mfenn]

So its against the EULA to stop using windows 7 after I install it? Lol Thats Funny. But how do they Know if I have ever used windows XP at all? I could have been using linux all these years (not that I havent).

"discontinue using the previous version of Windows after you install the upgrade."

 

[Nerdz]

I agree with everyone else even though we're past talking about not buying old hardware. It seems like you've already ordered the parts, but I would get an AM3+ mobo so you can have a substantial upgrade path to bulldozer. Upgrading to a Phenom II from an overclocked Athlon II is not really an upgrade by any means. It will give you very limited returns.

Honestly I expect this new build to last 5 years or more before I upgrade again or until I find it doesnt work well with those generation games. I didnt realize there was a AM3+, so bulldozer wont work with AM3? Worst case I have to buy a new mobo cpu and hsf.

Ive been out of the PC loop for the past 5 years so this is all "new" to me, but I do have comp experience

 

[Davidh373]

This won't last you 5 years. Come back with a total of $800 and I can get you something that MIGHT squeak by for 4. $400-$600 will get you around 2-3 (being very liberal). You'll probably see that 560 go to the slow side within 1.5, and the CPU will be ashes (it's already old as dirt) in about 2 years. Save another $200, or expect things to be dead slow compared to everything in 2 years.