Suggestions for an HDTV

Suture

Senior member
Sep 17, 2003
454
0
0
Hoping this is the right forum for this. I currently own a 32" Samsung HDTV (4:3). It's less than 2 years old, and I'm giving it to my brother. I'd like to get a 16:9 HDTV, at least 40" for screen size. I really like the clarity/colors on a tube-based TV, so I've been reluctant to consider a projection, however I want to spend around $1500 or so, so LCD is out of the question. I want one that supports 780p -- mine only did 480p and 1080i. One with an HDMI input would be nice as well, since I plan on getting a PS3 eventually when it's released.

I don't know much about DLP and all that, just what I've found on some HD forums, so I'm looking for suggestions for sets from Anand users. I don't really ever watch any TV except for sports. Not sure if I am going to even get any pay service like Dish Network or cable. I mainly play video games occassionally and watch movies. Thanks in-advance.
 

Matthias99

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2003
8,808
0
0
Originally posted by: Suture
Hoping this is the right forum for this. I currently own a 32" Samsung HDTV (4:3). It's less than 2 years old, and I'm giving it to my brother. I'd like to get a 16:9 HDTV, at least 40" for screen size. I really like the clarity/colors on a tube-based TV, so I've been reluctant to consider a projection, however I want to spend around $1500 or so, so LCD is out of the question. I want one that supports 780p -- mine only did 480p and 1080i. One with an HDMI input would be nice as well, since I plan on getting a PS3 eventually when it's released.

I don't know much about DLP and all that, just what I've found on some HD forums, so I'm looking for suggestions for sets from Anand users. I don't really ever watch any TV except for sports. Not sure if I am going to even get any pay service like Dish Network or cable. I mainly play video games occassionally and watch movies. Thanks in-advance.

1) The "video" forum here is really geared mostly towards computer video cards and computer-related video applications. You may have better luck at AVSForum, which has multiple forums dedicated to just HDTVs.

2) I think your first question should be if you want a direct-view CRT, an RPTV (either LCD or DLP), or a front projection system (at ~$1500, a plasma/LCD screen of decent size is just not happening). In CRTs, it's hard to recommend anything but the Sony 34XS955 (34" 16:9) or 36XS955 (36" 4:3). They're about the biggest, best CRTs you can get (unless something newer has come out very recently that I don't know about). I don't know much about projection TVs, but basically you'd be trading some resolution and picture quality for a bigger screen (and portability, in the case of a front projector, but the setup is more involved).

3) DVD movies are only 480p (unless you get an upconverting DVD player, but it's still only a 480p source to begin with), so a super-high-end TV is not going to help so much there -- a good EDTV would probably do just fine. The XBox360 and PS3 are supposed to have all their games capable of HD output, but depending on how much gaming you are going to do, a full high-end HDTV might be overkill. The price difference there could pay for a next-gen console and a whole bunch of games by itself. Just a thought.
 

CMC79

Senior member
May 31, 2003
313
0
71
I second the recommendation for AVSforum, however, much like this video forum, people are given to having their favorites and it's not always easy to get an accurate read of what's true or not. Imagine not knowing much about graphics cards and walking into one of these SM2 vs SM3 debates...so, while I know this is lengthy, maybe this will help you and others...

I researched HDTV's for months before buying. CNET's HDTV reviews are decent, as is their overall guide to HDTV. Their main problem is that there are way more models than they can review, so some worthy models are overlooked.

For another CRT, Matthias99's recommendations are mine as well. No one has beaten the Sony's for CRT quality, although I like Samsung as well. The XBR series is the highest end Sony--about $1600-$2000 for the 34" 16x9. Sony also has a 40" 4x3--the largest currently available tube television weighing in at over 300 pounds. It goes for about $2000-2500.

The other technologies--plasma, LCD, LCD projection, D-Ila, and DLP, projection CRT--all have their ups and downs. For what you say you want to do, you are right to want 720p. (1080p TV's are starting to become available in the high-end, although I remain doubtful, for a variety of reasons, of 1080p becoming a broadcast standard like 720p and 1080i.) Fast motion on the screen benefits from having the progressive image versus the interlaced. The problem for you is your price range. $1500 for a HDTV bascially gives you two choices: CRT, which limits you to a size of 40" in 4x3 or 34" in 16x9 (and 4x3 shouldn't be an option frankly) while giving the best picture quality, or projection CRT. Projection CRT's have the advantage in that you can get huge screens for the money, but it's old tech. They are dying off--slowly, but surely. They also are 1080i, require calibration to look their best, and despite the strides made, you must still contend with the "burn-in" issue, which raises a question mark for gaming. That said, they are cheap, and produce the best blacks of any TV. So there are your options at that price point. Of those two, regular tube CRT's are better, but the size/weight can be a problem. You should measure your space, and aim to sit no closer than 2x the size of the screen, and no further away than 3x. That means for the largest CRT (34") you should sit no further back than 8.5 feet away. Sit outside of that zone, and the HDTV effect will be wasted in some way.

I recommend you save your money, or finance your purchase, and get a DLP projection set. I like them over the LCD projection, although LCD has its fans and the price is often a bit better. The smallest DLP you will find starts in the low 40" range. I also recommend that you go to your local electronics store at a time when they aren't very busy, like a mid-week day afternoon. Negotiate the price--managers have significant leeway to drop prices, and during a slow sales day they are more likely to do so. I also recommend getting the service plans. Though they are a waste of money for 99% of things sold, for DLP's they are not, esp. if the bulb is covered. DLP is still new tech, and I had to take my first DLP back due to a flawed screen. Second one has been perfect. WARNING: Although much more rare now, take a good look at DLP's and make sure you don't see rainbows!

For DLP's:
HD2+ or HD3 chipset only for 720p; xHD3 is the 1080p chip, which should be rather expensive. Avoid the HD2 chip if it's even still around--it's outdated. The HD2+ is actually the superior chip--it actually has mirrors for every pixel of a 720p signal, while the HD3 has half as many pixels, and uses a "wobulation" technique to mimic full 720p. The HD3 chip many people claim to be superior when using standard quality TV as it has a "softness" which conceals the inferiority of 480i SDTV. The HD3 chip is common in the 63 series Samsung models, which are now being phased out, so you may get a good deal on them. They lack a HDTV tuner, but give both a HDMI and a DVI hookup, so they're expandable. A few of the RCA models (165 series, IIRC) use the HD3 chip as well.

IMO, the Samsungs (the new 74 series is their HD2+ model--don't know much about them other than they finally added cable card support), and the Mitsubishis are a bit overpriced, although the Mitsu's are usually ranked very, very high and have strong feature sets. Many people are turned off by their incredibly reflective screens--THEY ARE REMOVABLE--which most people don't seem to understand. Panasonic and Toshiba have nice DLP sets, but I don't like their looks due to the elephant ears speaker style. RCA has wide variety of DLP sets--I own one, the 162 series--and they are probably your price/performance leader. Many people are wary of RCA because of their disastrous first DLP set (the 151 series), but the newer ones are very nice for the money. Keep in mind your needs for a separate tuner if necessary (many newer models do feature an ATSC tuner and a CableCard slot), your need for HDMI ports and component inputs, and the size of your room versus the screen size, and the cost of a replacement lamp (every couple of years on average--ymmv). There's a LOT to go over, but a good HDTV is big investment. Hope this helps.
 

Suture

Senior member
Sep 17, 2003
454
0
0
All good info, thanks, guys. I'll check out that AVS forum as well.

After looking a little more into it, I was thinking maybe that Sony 34" CRT might be what I would want. Only bad thing is the weight and size. I am going to consider just spending some more and getting a DLP. Again, thanks.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
When HD-DVDs start coming out at the end of the year will they be done in 720p,1080i, or 1080p, or all of the above?

 

VIAN

Diamond Member
Aug 22, 2003
6,575
1
0
I'd go LCD, to me it's the only HDTV worth getting, but it's probably too late to tell you that.
 

Matthias99

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2003
8,808
0
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
When HD-DVDs start coming out at the end of the year will they be done in 720p,1080i, or 1080p, or all of the above?

Probably 720p and/or 1080i -- I don't think the specs have been finalized. There are no HDTVs that can truly display 1080p (other than the Dell 2405FPW, and that's technically a computer monitor and doesn't have HDCP support), so it would be kind of wasted unless you are going to watch the movies on your computer screen. I'm also pretty sure that component doesn't have enough bandwidth for 1080p, and single-link DVI only works if you use reduced blanking intervals.
 

jrphoenix

Golden Member
Feb 29, 2004
1,295
2
81
If you can fit one in your budget I would recommend a Samsung DLP... They have several models "sizes". I went for the 50" but, they do have some smaller ones.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: Matthias99
Originally posted by: Genx87
When HD-DVDs start coming out at the end of the year will they be done in 720p,1080i, or 1080p, or all of the above?

Probably 720p and/or 1080i -- I don't think the specs have been finalized. There are no HDTVs that can truly display 1080p (other than the Dell 2405FPW, and that's technically a computer monitor and doesn't have HDCP support), so it would be kind of wasted unless you are going to watch the movies on your computer screen. I'm also pretty sure that component doesn't have enough bandwidth for 1080p, and single-link DVI only works if you use reduced blanking intervals.

Am I wasting my time waiting on these 1080p sets that are starting to show up? They arent true 1080p?

 

Matthias99

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2003
8,808
0
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Matthias99
Originally posted by: Genx87
When HD-DVDs start coming out at the end of the year will they be done in 720p,1080i, or 1080p, or all of the above?

Probably 720p and/or 1080i -- I don't think the specs have been finalized. There are no HDTVs that can truly display 1080p (other than the Dell 2405FPW, and that's technically a computer monitor and doesn't have HDCP support), so it would be kind of wasted unless you are going to watch the movies on your computer screen. I'm also pretty sure that component doesn't have enough bandwidth for 1080p, and single-link DVI only works if you use reduced blanking intervals.

Am I wasting my time waiting on these 1080p sets that are starting to show up? They arent true 1080p?

I wasn't aware of any that were imminent on the market... link?

It's certainly possible to have plasma/LCD/DLP sets/projectors that are truly 1080p, or a CRT display with that many lines of resolution, but I didn't think anything would be out until at least next year (and it won't be cheap at first). I don't exactly live and breathe cutting-edge CE news, though.
 

CMC79

Senior member
May 31, 2003
313
0
71
Texas Instruments' xHD3 DLP chip is capable of true 1080p, and it will be available this year in higher end models. I believe that Samsung's 2005 line includes the 74 series, which will be the mainstream products with 720p HD2+ chips, and a higher end that does 1080p. I have seen a Sony XBR LCD projection that did 1080p IIRC--it was immense, at 70". They will become more common, however, I do not believe that 1080p will supplant the other two as broadcast standards. I believe it is possible that HDDVD/Blu-Ray may have 1080p movies and perhaps games. But I don't see it for TV. First of all, companies have already spent a lot of money on their current HD equipment, and aren't likely to want to change standards again, esp. when 1080p offers such little increased quality over its competitors. Secondly, cable companies just don't have the bandwidth to offer 1080p with 5.1 audio, and for that reason a lot of cable companies prefer 720p--they can offer many more channels of HD at that standard, and it still looks fabulous. I would be very pleased if at least all digital channels were moved to 480p!

I think the new standard(s), HD-DVD or Blu-Ray, will have their work cut out for them in convincing people to buy movies all over again. I see them having just as much success in cutting costs by offering an immense amount of 480p video on a single disc (such as multiple movies, or an entire season of a TV show) rather than enhanced quality. The reason I believe this is that if you have a good HDTV now, a quality DVD player, good wiring on either a component or digital connection, 480p looks ALMOST as good as true HD in many cases. The crappiest HD channel I get (a PBS station) looks scarcely better than my best DVD's. And for older movies--why bother? The ultra-clarity can actually be a hindrance to a film's success in creating mood. Compared with huge leap that DVD's offered over VHS (storage, quality, features, cost, durability), the new formats don't offer that much added value to charge a premium for. This is why I support HD-DVD, since it won't require the disc factories to be completed re-tooled and hopefully would be cheaper.
 
Feb 8, 2005
53
0
0
Panasonic makes awesome quality - beats out nearly everyone, even Sony runs for their money on this one. I don't know the exact model, but we got a Panasonic 42" something.....3 tuners, KICK ASS lol. No wonder my dad won't let me upgrade my comp - we're broke! *runs*
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: Matthias99
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Matthias99
Originally posted by: Genx87
When HD-DVDs start coming out at the end of the year will they be done in 720p,1080i, or 1080p, or all of the above?

Probably 720p and/or 1080i -- I don't think the specs have been finalized. There are no HDTVs that can truly display 1080p (other than the Dell 2405FPW, and that's technically a computer monitor and doesn't have HDCP support), so it would be kind of wasted unless you are going to watch the movies on your computer screen. I'm also pretty sure that component doesn't have enough bandwidth for 1080p, and single-link DVI only works if you use reduced blanking intervals.

Am I wasting my time waiting on these 1080p sets that are starting to show up? They arent true 1080p?

I wasn't aware of any that were imminent on the market... link?

It's certainly possible to have plasma/LCD/DLP sets/projectors that are truly 1080p, or a CRT display with that many lines of resolution, but I didn't think anything would be out until at least next year (and it won't be cheap at first). I don't exactly live and breathe cutting-edge CE news, though.


Yeah either do I which is why I was wondering

http://www.sharpusa.com/products/ModelLanding/0,1058,1426,00.html

Bestbuy has this baby for a mere 7K hehe
 

hans030390

Diamond Member
Feb 3, 2005
7,326
2
76
My family bought one of these

http://store.yahoo.com/aboutgizmos/hitachi50v715.html

It's amazing. The picture quality is up there with the Sony grand WEGA and is better than DLP. Yes, I did compare them. One thing is, it's NOT LCD. It's a very very nice type of projection tv with basically an LCD screen that the image is projected onto. There is one HUGE advantage to this tv over Plasma or REAL LCD. LCD and Plasma have a minimun lifespan: Once the gases in them die out, you need a new tv (which is an extra few thousand). With DLP or LCD Projection, all you do is replace the projecter/lightbulb (only a few hundred dollars) and the lifetime on those is still really good.

Personally, I like this picture better than plasma. Plasma picture still looks to much like CRT (just get really close to it) and LCD picture quality is just way to thick and not crisp sometimes (and overly expensive). The LCD Projection has an almost seamless picture, and really shines with HDTV. OK, normal cable tv or games running on composite cables (EVIL!!! get at least S-video) look terrible, BUT HDTV and games using pro-scan (as well as dvd's) all look simply stunning. I have yet to see a plasma that looks this good. In fact, it comes with the HDTV tuner built in so you don't have to buy the box. I actually picked up 3 HDTV channels without ordering them (because it descrambles the code) and I also pick up movies that others watch (pay-per-view, Insight on Demand, etc)...one time we turned on this HDTV channel, and it was Elf. We thought it was cool. Then, it played a scene, and it rewound to the beginning of it...then it played...and rewound again...we were picking this up from someone elses TV (it was picked up from the local cable line)!!! It is very interesting. There are downsides, because sometimes you'll pick up porn that someone is watching (which i guess could be bad or good lol) but you can easily block out that channel (or any you want.)

Overall, there are slight downsides to it, but it is still really compact for a projection tv (about a foot from front to back, and it's a trapezoidal shape). Personally, I would give it a 10/10. It is really amazing.

So look into it. That page has info. It's usually around $3000 with the stand, but it highly worth it.

 

Pr0d1gy

Diamond Member
Jan 30, 2005
7,774
0
76
Over the next 12 months the price of LCoS sets is going to drop & 1080p will become the top end market. Thus you can probably find a very nice 720p LCoS set in that time period for half what it originally retailed for. I got the Phillips Cineos 55" LCoS HDTV for less than half of it's original retail price and it is unbelievable. I watched the NFL playoffs in HD with my dad & after the first game he went out & bought a new HDTV...lol

BTW, LCoS does away with the common problems LCD & DLP suffer from via the better technology it uses. Check AVS forums if you have more questions.
 

Brute

Senior member
Apr 3, 2000
224
0
0
I give a very enthusiastic thumbs up for the Toshiba TheaterWide 52HM84. This TV is gorgeous. Runs $2400 though.
 
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