SweClockers: Geforce GTX 590 burns @ 772MHz & 1.025V

[Barfo]

So Techpowerup can kiss their nvidia review samples goodbye.

 

[sandorski]

How did I miss that, Ive seen that page before and never noticed!

lmao it spells out Epic Fail.

Oh, lol

 

[BD231]

So Techpowerup can kiss their nvidia review samples goodbye.

It's evident they don't want nVidia sending them any more hazardous waste that's for sure, and honestly I can't blame them.

No clue how you could miss something like this when you knowingly allow your vendors to run your chips out of spec. I'm interested to hear the true cause of the problem.

 

[Dark Shroud]

Unless this is happening at stock voltages/clocks then it’s a non-issue. Overclocking operates hardware outside of its rated spec which it was technically never designed to do. Just because some people get lucky with some hardware it doesn’t mean it should be an expectation.

And what of us who live in hot climates for at least part of the year? I don't over clock/volt for several reasons. Starting with how many systems I've seen have massive issues that caused some type of burn out.

When it's 90F+ I have to move to the basement & turn on the AC. I have a big heavy CPU cooler with duel fans and my case is loaded with fans. I wouldn't feel safe running a GTX 590.

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

They modded the bios. Probably tried some of the volt mods on it on the pcb.

 

[BFG10K]

Did you ask me if I were for real and bullshitting afterwards?

Sincerely why?

You 're taking an extreme stance that a lucky few manage to overclock their cards. And that it is a non issue that many cards blow if you try to overclock them.

All other cards in history where you rolled down the over clock when you hit the your limit instead of throwing it in the garbage can? They haven't existed?

Nvidia s not agree with you they told sweclockers that the card should be able to take the overclock ann explicitly asked them to proceed so with the second card.

You'r right in that it is a non issue for the seller since warranty is no more. But that's a very narrow view of it.

You don't seem to understand the basic concept that overclocking/overvolting runs the card outside of its operating parameters; it’s being run in a manner it was not designed to. So if the card doesn’t work properly as a result, it’s the user’s fault for operating it in such a manner.

Everything you posted above is completely irrelevant to this simple fact.

nVidia asking sweclocker to overclock the card is all well and good, but unless nVidia issues a factory guarantee on sweclocker’s scores with all GTX590 units then it’s not really relevant to anything. It’s about as relevant as little Timmy on the internet being able to put his sliders at X/Y.

 

[BFG10K]

And what of us who live in hot climates for at least part of the year? I don't over clock/volt for several reasons. Starting with how many systems I've seen have massive issues that caused some type of burn out.

When it's 90F+ I have to move to the basement & turn on the AC. I have a big heavy CPU cooler with duel fans and my case is loaded with fans. I wouldn't feel safe running a GTX 590.

Like I said earlier, if the card doesn’t work at stock then it’s definitely faulty. But this business of being outraged because it doesn’t overclock/overvolt is simply ludicrous.

 

[taltamir]

You don't seem to understand the basic concept that overclocking/overvolting runs the card outside of its operating parameters; it’s being run in a manner it was not designed to. So if the card doesn’t work properly as a result, it’s the user’s fault for operating it in such a manner.

I think he understands the concepts overclocking / overvolting perfectly.
he clearly states that you are not entitled to any warranty if you overclock, and he clearly states that he is comparing it to other cards.

Generally speaking, most hardware does not explode when overclocked. Other cards from nvidia, cards from AMD, cpus from intel or AMD... they don't explode. And typically they have overvoltage protection as well.
the nVidia card in question actually HAS overvoltage protection, but it only works to artificially lower power draw measurements during benchmarking (according to anandtech) instead of properly protecting the card.

I think it's hardly a dealbraker, just consider them not overclockable and that is it. However, I find the claims of many cards exploding at stock setting concerning.

 

[TerabyteX]

Like I said earlier, if the card doesn’t work at stock then it’s definitely faulty. But this business of being outraged because it doesn’t overclock/overvolt is simply ludicrous.

I think that from an enthusiast point of view, buying a $700.00 card that can't be overclocked well, it is a reason to be enraged. Because usually cards that costs over $380 or more, comes with high quality components and a overclocking margin for further enhancements in performance, something that the already maxed GTX 590 can't offer. It isn't the first time that high end cards doesn't overclock very well, did you remember the Radeon X800XT PE? Or the 6800 Ultra Extreme?

But if you see the GTX 590 from another perspective, it is a very fast card that offers enthusiast performance and has unique features. But I do understand your point, AFAIK the GTX 590 hasn't crapped at default settings (It ins't like the dying 8800GT driver fan issue).

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

I think that from an enthusiast point of view, buying a $700.00 card that can't be overclocked well, it is a reason to be enraged. Because usually cards that costs over $380 or more, comes with high quality components and a overclocking margin for further enhancements in performance, something that the already maxed GTX 590 can't offer. It isn't the first time that high end cards doesn't overclock very well, did you remember the Radeon X800XT PE? Or the 6800 Ultra Extreme?

But if you see the GTX 590 from another perspective, it is a very fast card that offers enthusiast performance and has unique features. But I do understand your point, AFAIK the GTX 590 hasn't crapped at default settings (It ins't like the dying 8800GT driver fan issue).

that cards that was used in the reviews. Were they plain reference models or were they from a third party source eg Asus, Gigabyte etc etc?

 

[TerabyteX]

I'm not sure as some received them with retail boxes and other's not.

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

I'm not sure as some received them with retail boxes and other's not.

that is very important. Coz for anyone to run them out of spec right from boot you need to hide edit or add the voltage table for it. Maybe nvidia messed up the table on it. Maybe someone try to flash believing it will remove thermal throttling. But those bioses were the cause. A driver can't make a card go poof unless the tables are wrong in the bios. If you got Rivatuner run its diagnostic tool it will display the tables I'm referring to.

 

[SlowSpyder]

You don't seem to understand the basic concept that overclocking/overvolting runs the card outside of its operating parameters; it’s being run in a manner it was not designed to. So if the card doesn’t work properly as a result, it’s the user’s fault for operating it in such a manner.

Everything you posted above is completely irrelevant to this simple fact.

nVidia asking sweclocker to overclock the card is all well and good, but unless nVidia issues a factory guarantee on sweclocker’s scores with all GTX590 units then it’s not really relevant to anything. It’s about as relevant as little Timmy on the internet being able to put his sliders at X/Y.

I agree somewhat with what you are saying, Nvidia only guarantees that the GPU's on this card will run at 607MHz. BUT, this is an enthusiast level card. Both AMD and Nvidia know that the type of people who are willing to drop $700 on just their graphics cards are often the type that do enthusiast type things to their hardware... this isn't a Radeon 5550 or GTS250 we are talking about here. This is a high end enthusiast product. So yes, on one hand the card presumably runs fine at it's advertised specs. But on the other hand the enthusiast crowd that is likely to buy this type of card may still consider it a failure in some regards. For a flagship product it seems some corners were cut.

 

[ArchAngel777]

I think that from an enthusiast point of view, buying a $700.00 card that can't be overclocked well, it is a reason to be enraged. Because usually cards that costs over $380 or more, comes with high quality components and a overclocking margin for further enhancements in performance, something that the already maxed GTX 590 can't offer. It isn't the first time that high end cards doesn't overclock very well, did you remember the Radeon X800XT PE? Or the 6800 Ultra Extreme?

But if you see the GTX 590 from another perspective, it is a very fast card that offers enthusiast performance and has unique features. But I do understand your point, AFAIK the GTX 590 hasn't crapped at default settings (It ins't like the dying 8800GT driver fan issue).

Yeah, in this scenario my opinion is four fold (I may be repeating myself)

1) The 6990 can be overclocked, so far it does not appear to blow up (but, voltage + time = Failure).
2) Most people (err, Enthusiests) have been overclocking video cards for as long as I can remember. I cannot honestly think of a time where an overclock would result in smoke and flames asside from an isolated defect.
3) nVidia recalled the 590. At least, that it appears to be a recall. Is that confirmed?
4) EVGA covers overclocked cards... I am not sure if the other brands do but since EVGA is basically an extention of nVidia as far as a close knit partnership, it stands to reason that EVGA expected these things to overclock without frying.

I think it is very fair to say that the 590 has a problem and is defective.

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

Yeah, in this scenario my opinion is four fold (I may be repeating myself)

1) The 6990 can be overclocked, so far it does not appear to blow up (but, voltage + time = Failure).
2) Most people (err, Enthusiests) have been overclocking video cards for as long as I can remember. I cannot honestly think of a time where an overclock would result in smoke and flames asside from an isolated defect.
3) nVidia recalled the 590. At least, that it appears to be a recall. Is that confirmed?
4) EVGA covers overclocked cards... I am not sure if the other brands do but since EVGA is basically an extention of nVidia as far as a close knit partnership, it stands to reason that EVGA expected these things to overclock without frying.

I think it is very fair to say that the 590 has a problem and is defective.

still if its defective it shouldn't take a dump like that. Someone messed up with the table entries

 

[ArchAngel777]

still if its defective it shouldn't take a dump like that. Someone messed up with the table entries

True, at least in the sense that I am surprised Q&A did not catch it. However, Q&A is a very difficult department. It is easy to say "Shoulda, coulda, woulda, etc..." but in the real world, things get missed. Sometimes you do the face palm, sometimes you think "Who would have ever thought to do that?". In either cases, someone made a mistake or they perhaps received a bad batch of components from a 3rd party. It happens...

But, maybe this is a wake-up call for both nVidia and ATI. Maybe they should stop pushing the envelope, so to speak on power consumption. Intel basically ran into a thermal limit before they decided how important performance per watt was. I hope this is a wake-up call for nVidia and ATI to start focusing on performance per watt and not simply relying on die shrinks to let them increase performance.

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

True, at least in the sense that I am surprised Q&A did not catch it. However, Q&A is a very difficult department. It is easy to say "Shoulda, coulda, woulda, etc..." but in the real world, things get missed. Sometimes you do the face palm, sometimes you think "Who would have ever thought to do that?". In either cases, someone made a mistake or they perhaps received a bad batch of components from a 3rd party. It happens...

But, maybe this is a wake-up call for both nVidia and ATI. Maybe they should stop pushing the envelope, so to speak on power consumption. Intel basically ran into a thermal limit before they decided how important performance per watt was. I hope this is a wake-up call for nVidia and ATI to start focusing on performance per watt and not simply relying on die shrinks to let them increase performance.

don't know if you can remember back in the 6600 ultra days what happen to Asus cards when they changed the voltage regulation on the pcb but they didn't add any of the new voltage and performance tables to the bios.

Now I would love to see what the eventlog of the miniport driver said. Not many people know nvidia got a miniport driver that logs all gpu thermal and throttling related entries which you are able to see what coz the card to act up eg lack of auxiliary power.

 

[Grooveriding]

don't know if you can remember back in the 6600 ultra days what happen to Asus cards when they changed the voltage regulation on the pcb but they didn't add any of the new voltage and performance tables to the bios.

Now I would love to see what the eventlog of the miniport driver said. Not many people know nvidia got a miniport driver that logs all gpu thermal and throttling related entries which you are able to see what coz the card to act up eg lack of auxiliary power.

It has happened before where cards were simply designed wrong or used faulty components.

There were tons of RMAS on the 9600GT due to faulty caps.

 

[SlowSpyder]

It has happened before where cards were simply designed wrong or used faulty components.

There were tons of RMAS on the 9600GT due to faulty caps.

I'll probably get flamed by the green team for this, but...

You have to wonder about the quality of Nvidia products lately. I read that some of these reviewers destroyed their GTX590's with retail, boxed parts. That and the faulty drivers in the past that bricked cards. GTX570's appear to be dying at a high rate when overclocked. How many here have had to put their 8xxx or 9xxx cards in an oven and cross their fingers to see if it works again? Bumpgate.

Not too confidence inspiring as of late.

 

[AtenRa]

Any hardware will go poof or stop working when we exceed the manufacturer operational limits. Most of the time hardware is set to work way below the operational limit by the manufacturer and that is why we can Overclock with conventional means (Air cooling).

GTX590 maximum voltage limit with Air Cooling is about at 1.0V and exceeding that will result in hardware failure. If we want to go beyond the 1.0V we need Water cooling or better but even so that doesn’t guaranty the hardware will still be working and it will not fail.

Ask extreme overclockers (LN2) how many times they have destroyed the hardware even at subzero temps like -100/-160 C or below.

I know the 1.0V limit seems low for that card but at that voltage the card can operate at 750-800MHz on air but it needs to manual UP the fan speed at more than 60% (I will say 80% to 100%.At that speeds GTX590 is very competitive against HD6990 at 900-950MHz Overclock.

When you Overclock remember to first know the limits of your hardware and never exceed them if you don’t have the necessary equipment or the will to be ready for the worst case scenario.

 

[wahdangun]

Any hardware will go poof or stop working when we exceed the manufacturer operational limits. Most of the time hardware is set to work way below the operational limit by the manufacturer and that is why we can Overclock with conventional means (Air cooling).

GTX590 maximum voltage limit with Air Cooling is about at 1.0V and exceeding that will result in hardware failure. If we want to go beyond the 1.0V we need Water cooling or better but even so that doesn’t guaranty the hardware will still be working and it will not fail.

Ask extreme overclockers (LN2) how many times they have destroyed the hardware even at subzero temps like -100/-160 C or below.

I know the 1.0V limit seems low for that card but at that voltage the card can operate at 750-800MHz on air but it needs to manual UP the fan speed at more than 60% (I will say 80% to 100%.At that speeds GTX590 is very competitive against HD6990 at 900-950MHz Overclock.

When you Overclock remember to first know the limits of your hardware and never exceed them if you don’t have the necessary equipment or the will to be ready for the worst case scenario.

i'm agree with you that if you are run it out of spec then its your fault, but the fact is several gtx 590 was dead on STOCK VOLTAGE, i think that was the real problem is. And we need to know what exactly happen to this card

 

[Grooveriding]

I'm not sure as some received them with retail boxes and other's not.

So basically they all have the chance of explosion.

 

[AtenRa]

i'm agree with you that if you are run it out of spec then its your fault, but the fact is several gtx 590 was dead on STOCK VOLTAGE, i think that was the real problem is. And we need to know what exactly happen to this card

Well i haven't read a review where the card blow up in default settings. Do we have any link ??

 

[Grooveriding]

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2235832#post2235832

W1zzard has been directly addressing the defective 590 issues. So if you think his methodology of card testing is flawed, you can ask him for some clarity here :ninja:

Of course there are also the 7 other reviewers and reports of people who purchased the cards at xtremesystems having them incinerate...

 

[AtenRa]

I was not talking about W1zzard but after he said the following i have to question hes knowledge in electronics.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2235832&postcount=274

why didnt the powercolor card blow up at 1.45 v ?!

Because another card didnt blowup at 1.45V doesnt mean he can over-voltage all cards at 1.45V

And i will ask again to give me a review link where the card blowup in default settings.