Do what?
Huh????
Conroe wasn't a 300 chip, it was an entire line up. Your not making much sense here. There were expensive chips and budget.
You do realize that the 970 was a 300 dollar chip that can best the original 1000$ Titan, don't you?
Kind of a strange and out of logic response to my post. I am not sure you got it.
Or you should re-read my post above and realize its much more valid than calling everyone who buys nvidia loyalist fanboy.
Headfoot said:It's about either wanting the shiny new one, or buying nVidia even when its more expensive for the same thing out of brand loyalty/fanaticism.
I was going to make a new sub but thought......the one works...
AMD stated that it will release new GPU and APU products starting Q2-2015, or only after March.
AMD will launch its latest Radeon Rx 300 series graphics processors. Its performance-segment part, the R9 380, will feature 4,096 GCN 1.2 cores, double that of its predecessor, and 4 GB of stacked HBM (high-bandwidth memory). Its mid-range chip, codenamed "Trinidad" will succeed "Curacao," and offer performance competitive to the $200-ish price-point.
http://www.techpowerup.com/209135/amd-to-launch-new-gpus-and-apus-only-after-march-ceo.html
Well, they better not make it another Radeon 2900XT launch.
how are they even remotely similar?
a far more comparable launch would be rv770
380x just need to beat 980 by 20% any sane gamer would want it by that point.
I honestly don't know when gamers becomes so green that they care about 50 watt in power usage when under full load.
They don't...haven't you noticed that most are overclocking?
@RS
Just note that at 4K, MSAA is worth a lot less than it is at 1080p or 1440p due to pixel density. I've tested 4K 28 inch monitors in action, the aliasing is minimal without any AA. Very tolerable.
Add in more games with SMAA (without the blur-fest that is FXAA), gamers will be fine at 4K with 4GB vram in CF/SLI.
Really, MSAA at 4K is just e-peen for the sake of it.
Exactly. Power consumption arguments are sophistry
And both the expensive and budget chips absolutely drubbed anything resembling competition and hit incredible new levels of performance. Your statement was that people want to be part of the impressive new hotness and don't care about a few dollars, and to back it up you're talking about something that redefined the price/performance curve so hard that it permanently changed the landscape of the CPU industry at all levels. A lot of the people who got that bought at the price/performance high point.
Maxwell as a whole isn't Conroe. It isn't a simple matter of buy the Maxwell that performs best because nothing else matters. It's more complicated than that and that's a pretty significant difference between the narrative around Conroe and the one around Maxwell and their relation to reality.
Both are over spec'd on the memory side but the former was a total disappointment. (512MB / 512bit memory bus).how are they even remotely similar?
a far more comparable launch would be rv770
Real talk:
Paying $100 more for a 970 instead of a 290 isn't about power consumption, because the difference isn't enough to amount to anything unless you're absolutely pushing your PSU. It's not about performance, because aftermarket to aftermarket the performance difference amounts to 5-7% which is imperceptible. It's about either wanting the shiny new one, or buying nVidia even when its more expensive for the same thing out of brand loyalty/fanaticism. Maybe a few small exceptions for people who need CUDA or other nVidia specific feature sets. Then, people realize that's actually emotionally driven and then after the fact rationalize their purchase via power consumption or something else measurable, so they can act like they did it due to some objective superiority. (In fact -- I predict when the 380x/390x/3xx comes out it'll be pretty easy to spot the nVidia loyalty buyers versus the newest-shiniest buyers because some of the new-shinys will move over if the 380x really does have HBM)
For whatever reason people fear saying simply "it's new tech and I like new tech" and derail thread after thread with rationalizations and the people debunking those rationalizations. I don't see anything wrong with wanting the new shiny tech. It's part of being a tech enthusiast. It's tiring seeing repeated dishonest sophistry and rationalization instead of honesty. You can buy on emotion. Just don't try and tell me it's logical...
That, and it's a great straw man to use for posters seeking to divert attention away from less desireable comparisons when they irrationally favor one brand over another; (e.g. to distract discussion onto meager differences in power consumption in order to prevent discussion about performance per dollar or max performance at a given price point)
Oh come on. Are we really devolving to "premium product" hand waving? I get wanting the newest, shiniest bit and bobbles but calling it "premium" as if that 1) means anything, 2) is in any way measurable, 3) isn't 100% subjective
Real talk:
Paying $100 more for a 970 instead of a 290 isn't about power consumption, because the difference isn't enough to amount to anything unless you're absolutely pushing your PSU. It's not about performance, because aftermarket to aftermarket the performance difference amounts to 5-7% which is imperceptible. It's about either wanting the shiny new one, or buying nVidia even when its more expensive for the same thing out of brand loyalty/fanaticism. Maybe a few small exceptions for people who need CUDA or other nVidia specific feature sets. Then, people realize that's actually emotionally driven and then after the fact rationalize their purchase via power consumption or something else measurable, so they can act like they did it due to some objective superiority. (In fact -- I predict when the 380x/390x/3xx comes out it'll be pretty easy to spot the nVidia loyalty buyers versus the newest-shiniest buyers because some of the new-shinys will move over if the 380x really does have HBM)
For whatever reason people fear saying simply "it's new tech and I like new tech" and derail thread after thread with rationalizations and the people debunking those rationalizations. I don't see anything wrong with wanting the new shiny tech. It's part of being a tech enthusiast. It's tiring seeing repeated dishonest sophistry and rationalization instead of honesty. You can buy on emotion. Just don't try and tell me it's logical...
It is not so simple a situation to say that paying more = brand loyalty without fail. TDP = heat = concern for some, not for others. For valid reasons.
Headfoot said:It's about either wanting the shiny new one, or buying nVidia even when its more expensive for the same thing out of brand loyalty/fanaticism.
970 SLI vs 290 CF = $200 more for negligible performance differences, maybe 80 total more watts aftermarket to aftermarket. For that $200 you could buy a new expensive case with better air flow, equip that new case with all new fans, and still have money left over. For the $200 you could buy two AIO water coolers and put them on the 290s and still be out less cash than the 970s.
So, as I have a thread going on the debate between what multi-GPU solution is better for my system, let me ask you this:
Would you not say there will be an obvious heat output difference between 290X in Crossfire and 970 in SLI? That factors in many use cases, heat and fan noise very much factor into buying decisions for many. Increased TDP = increased power. Sure, you may overclock, but there's still a gap between the two variants, OC'ing the 970 will still use less power, and produce less heat, then a stock 290X, and if you OC that, well, you should get the idea. Not every cooling arrangement can accommodate whatever you want, without increasing the chance of throttling somewhere in the line.
Without any concern, I might still buy a 970 SLI or even one 970 over the 290, and pay more for it, because there are times when there is a performance delta that I would find significant enough to warrant that decision. Now, if you compared the 970 to the 290X, my opinion is different, as you can possibly pay the same or just a little less for the 290X and get more performance in many scenarios, but it also comes down to past experiences. Some people have noticed more issues with frametime variance in multi-GPU solutions comparing one brand to another, or noticed more consistency or improvements in drivers from one manufacturer.
It is not so simple a situation to say that paying more = brand loyalty without fail. TDP = heat = concern for some, not for others. For valid reasons.
Without any concern, I might still buy a 970 SLI or even one 970 over the 290, and pay more for it, because there are times when there is a performance delta that I would find significant enough to warrant that decision.
It is not so simple a situation to say that paying more = brand loyalty without fail. TDP = heat = concern for some, not for others. For valid reasons.
295X2 costs the same as a GTX970 SLI and operates below 75C.
A 295X2 is as quiet as a single reference GTX980, while GTX970 reference blowers like PNY/Palit 970s (not the BestBuy units) are loud and can't sustain high clocks because out of the box they are already hitting the 80*C thermal level.
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...-nvidia-gtx-970-sli-performance-review-3.html
Because it has a 120mm radiator, almost all of the heat is exhausted out of the case, something no GTX970 solution can claim, unless one gets Reference "GTX980" GTX970 from BestBuy which cost about $400 each last time I checked. That means without a mover's coupon, you'd be paying $800 for 970s with the same performance as a $660 295X2.
Granted, if you don't mind spending $660-700 on a single GPU, and if you aren't in a rush to upgrade, maybe wait for R9 380X or GM200 and see how fast they are. Also, there should be crazy blow-out sales on a 295X2 and additional pricing pressure on the 980 from 2nd tier 300 series cards.
If that is a problem, i'll recommend saving some dough to buy newer cards to be launched in q2... and upgrade chassis CPU cooling at the same time. Unless, you're itching to play a new game, which you must. In that case, a single 290 should be more than enough for most games.I've been looking into that heavily, but I do have a few concerns. First is an AMD-centric concern: game streaming. I haven't had a chance to even test how well Nvidia GPUs handle it, they have worked their hardware support into Steam. I don't have my home theater setup right now due to the living situation, but when I get my HTPC connected again, I'd love to be able to stream with Steam Big Picture and have a good experience using the desktop as the horsepower in another room. I don't know if that will be necessary, as if my next place has a good size living room, my computer will be out there too, unless I have a spare bedroom for a dedicated office/game room.
I don't necessarily want to pay more just to have a nice bonus feature, but it might still be important.
More of a concern than anything:
I don't think I can mount the radiator anywhere, not in my Corsair Carbide 400R with the Noctua NH-D14 on the CPU.
I'm not sure that I see enough clearance at either the top or the rear exhaust. If it can fit on the rear exhaust, it's going to be super tight, and also dealing with the pure exhaust out of the CPU cooler, which is currently has 2 fans push-pull through the dual towers of the heatsink, with a third fan at the rear exhaust of the case, all in a line.
My next build, far down the line, I'll go CLC for the CPU as well, and have a different case. But I'm not making the investment to change out the CPU cooler and a case just to fit GPUs. That seems like the backward way to approach things. I'll be making sure my next build can fit anything next time around, but I think it is more logical to stick with what I have when I do have the plan to completely rebuild some time down the line.