Tap This: New drilling method opens vast oil fields in US

Page 3 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

Jadow

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2003
5,962
2
0
we should just save the shlt and not touch it until the rest of the world runs out of oil.
 

DCal430

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2011
6,020
9
81
This story makes me . Really we need to stop and look at what we are doing to our planet, to the land we live on, to the air we breath, and to the water we drink. It is time to take a hard look and start investing in more cleaner and alternative sources of energy.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
69,466
27,737
136
this doesn't solve the problem of the eventual decline of crude oil...
True, but we have to put it in perspective. "Will this development push the end of oil past the end of my life expectancy?" Those who come after will consider us all a bunch of ass ponchos no matter what we do so we might as well grab the oil and drive the V8s God wants us to.
 

Hacp

Lifer
Jun 8, 2005
13,923
2
81
Hope the EPA doesn't hinder this. This is millions of jobs on the line. Which side is Obama on? Jobs or regulation?
 

herm0016

Diamond Member
Feb 26, 2005
8,420
1,047
126
how much do any of you really know about this process?
we are pumping fluid and chemicals( fairly low concentrations most of the time) 10 to 15000 feet into the earth, into rock formations that already have the ability to trap gas and oil under huge pressures. we are regulated to run cement bond logs to insure that the casing of the well is sealed above and below each zone. I have even had BLM people in my truck while running cement bond logs to monitor them.

the countries natural gas production in three of our biggest fields ( pinedale anticline, waumsutter, johna ) would be next to nothing without hydraulic fracturing.

we have been doing this for a long,long time. there is nothing new happening. my state does regulate it and requires each fracturing company to tell the state what is in the chemicals/fluid that is being pumped underground. also, i believe that they require the oil companies to support periodic ground water tests for these chemicals. I have never heard of a positive test. we have water treatment facilities in each of the fields mentioned, they bring the water back to drinking quality and then we re-use the treated water in the oilfield. i can only speak of the fields here, but we do manage our wast pretty effectively. the pinedale field has a collection system, they string long plastic pipes to each location where we are working and we pump the wast directly to the treatment facility so that we do not have to use trucks or risk spills.

do you have any questions that you do not want answered by some alarmist news article?
 
Last edited:

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
27,947
38,326
136
the reason we don't is because the sun provides us with about 1 watt/sq meter. not nearly enough, even under the best of circumstances. are you going to cover the entire country with panels, including farmland? they are pretty worthless under a foot of snow, too.


Pretty sure that's waaayyy off there Dangle, I believe it's more like 1000watts per hour, per sq. m (at peak time albeit). The energy is there, we just need to refine our method of collecting and in particular, storing it.

Arizona and New Mexico are the places that have been considered for large solar farms, not Maine and Minnesota.

edit: oop didn't see yh125d's post
 
Last edited:
May 13, 2009
12,333
612
126
All the people crying about the drilling could you please stop driving your cars and also while you're at it go ahead and turn your electricity off since 40% of your electricity is powered by natural gas. It's a perfectly safe proven technique. Yeah you're gonna have some drilling rigs and a shitload of eighteen wheelers in the area but that's as bad as the problem gets. And I can't even tell you how the natural gas/ oilfield has improved the economy where I'm at. There are going to be a lot of well paying jobs coming to the areas they plan on drilling in. Would you guys rather keep funding the asshole countries that hate us? Sure there is gonna be some mishaps. If you drive a car you have a chance of wrecking. Does that stop you from driving? Of course not. The rewards outweigh the risks. I can't believe you guys actually buy that shit spouted in gasland.
 

Pliablemoose

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
25,195
0
56
http://www.businessinsider.com/punk-us-oil-demand-and-export-confusion-2011-2

US domestic demand for oil was up a weak 1.1% in 2010, coming off a low, crashy, base in 2009. But worldwide demand for oil especially from developing nations is soaring. The result? The US is using its spare refining capacity to turn oil into products, like diesel–for export. Behold the growth oil Total Oil Product exports since the start of 2008. These have nearly doubled from near 1.2 million barrels per day at the start of 2008, to just above 2.2 million barrels per day as of mid-January 2011. | see: US Total Oil Product Exports 2008 -2010 in kb (thousand barrels).
When you hear a newsletter writer, oil analyst, or podcast saying that US domestic oil demand has rebounded strongly since 2008–talking in terms of millions of barrels of restored demand–the mistake they are making is obvious: they are missing the heroic rise in US exports of gasoline, diesel, and distillate. The error comes in part with the myriad measures EIA uses to measure US demand for oil. Hopefully my disentangling of this data here, is of some help]
The petro energy web is not as simple as most think.

US consumption no longer drives energy prices, we're becoming the tail of the dog.
 
Last edited:

yh125d

Diamond Member
Dec 23, 2006
6,907
0
76
how much do any of you really know about this process?
we are pumping fluid and chemicals( fairly low concentrations most of the time) 10 to 15000 feet into the earth, into rock formations that already have the ability to trap gas and oil under huge pressures. we are regulated to run cement bond logs to insure that the casing of the well is sealed above and below each zone. I have even had BLM people in my truck while running cement bond logs to monitor them.

the countries natural gas production in three of our biggest fields ( pinedale anticline, waumsutter, johna ) would be next to nothing without hydraulic fracturing.

we have been doing this for a long,long time. there is nothing new happening. my state does regulate it and requires each fracturing company to tell the state what is in the chemicals/fluid that is being pumped underground. also, i believe that they require the oil companies to support periodic ground water tests for these chemicals. I have never heard of a positive test. we have water treatment facilities in each of the fields mentioned, they bring the water back to drinking quality and then we re-use the treated water in the oilfield. i can only speak of the fields here, but we do manage our wast pretty effectively. the pinedale field has a collection system, they string long plastic pipes to each location where we are working and we pump the wast directly to the treatment facility so that we do not have to use trucks or risk spills.

do you have any questions that you do not want answered by some alarmist news article?

Yep. My family owns a small local oil company and they're been pumping that shit into the ground for decades


You re-treat and re-use the reclaimed water? Isn't that what disposal wells are for?

(I work on the drafting side of the business, no firsthand experience in the actual field techniques)
 

Hacp

Lifer
Jun 8, 2005
13,923
2
81
So we're exporting oil when our very own gas prices are at an all time high for the months of Jan/Feb?

While importing 12 million barrels per day? uh?

We're importing crude, Refining it, then exporting it. Not exactly exporting oil we drill.
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
31,789
10,309
136
1w/m^2? Good thing you're way off, cause Earth sure would be chilly if that were the case

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2c/Us_pv_annual_may2004.jpg

and that graph shows kWh/m^2/day. which is the total radiant energy per day. divide by 24 to get kW/m^2 and you end up with something less than 1 (kW/m^2 being a flux, or rate per unit area)

most solar plants are a few hundred MW output at peak operation. nuclear plants are ~1GW *per reactor* and run with uptimes of 99%.

you want clean? go nuclear.
 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,234
701
126
We're importing crude, Refining it, then exporting it. Not exactly exporting oil we drill.

OK, missed that. I assume that the new "worlds largest refinery" that was built in India and opened in 2008, just to serve the US needs, is now serving the rest of the world.

Also, the US "consumption" of oil is at or below 2006 level and according to the last article I read on that, is never expected to return to "above" those levels. Not sure how that is possible.
 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,234
701
126
I can see it now...either:

The US uses this to steal oil from Mexico and Canada...or

Canada and Mexico steal oil from the US.

:biggrin:

By the way, nothing would make me happier than to tell the middle east to shove their oil up their ass and then charge them $200 per bushel of corn!
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
9,001
113
106
Thats nice. Best thing to do is to ignore those deposits until the rest of the world is running low on oil. It makes both strategic and economic sense. Besides, long term we need to get away from oil as an energy source as it is far too valuable to simply burn. (it is better used for materials, etc.)
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
9,001
113
106
Hope the EPA doesn't hinder this. This is millions of jobs on the line. Which side is Obama on? Jobs or regulation?

The side that allows us to breathe clean air, drink clean water, etc. without having to worry too much about doing so. Seriously, Hacp, not all regulation is bad. We simply cannot blindly trust modern corporations to do the right things regarding valuable public ecological resources/services without proper verification. Trust but verify, my friend.
 

wirednuts

Diamond Member
Jan 26, 2007
7,121
4
0
the reason we don't is because the sun provides us with about 1 watt/sq meter. not nearly enough, even under the best of circumstances. are you going to cover the entire country with panels, including farmland? they are pretty worthless under a foot of snow, too.

todays mass produced solar tech isnt that good, but we know how to make it better. i think its becoming very clear that every house in america has enough shingle space to harvest all the energy the home needs... we just need to start making the solar harvesting shingles.
 

Hacp

Lifer
Jun 8, 2005
13,923
2
81
The side that allows us to breathe clean air, drink clean water, etc. without having to worry too much about doing so. Seriously, Hacp, not all regulation is bad. We simply cannot blindly trust modern corporations to do the right things regarding valuable public ecological resources/services without proper verification. Trust but verify, my friend.

You aren't limited to using oil when making ethylene. You can get it from other feedstock.
 

NL5

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2003
3,287
12
81
and that graph shows kWh/m^2/day. which is the total radiant energy per day. divide by 24 to get kW/m^2 and you end up with something less than 1 (kW/m^2 being a flux, or rate per unit area)

most solar plants are a few hundred MW output at peak operation. nuclear plants are ~1GW *per reactor* and run with uptimes of 99%.

you want clean? go nuclear.

I think 1 kW is nearly a thousand times more than a watt though........
 

herm0016

Diamond Member
Feb 26, 2005
8,420
1,047
126
Yep. My family owns a small local oil company and they're been pumping that shit into the ground for decades


You re-treat and re-use the reclaimed water? Isn't that what disposal wells are for?

(I work on the drafting side of the business, no firsthand experience in the actual field techniques)

we do re-use the water that we flow back during completions operations. the water normally pumped back into the formation is water that is produced with the gas after completions operations is done and the well is producing gas. water from the fracturing operations is cleaned and re-used.

here is an article that my girlfriend wrote about the environmental improvements in a local field:
http://www.mywesttexas.com/business/oil/article_86293b57-aa9d-5cbc-b9fd-da6bb651c53f.html
 
Nov 20, 2009
10,051
2,577
136
I watched an episode of Dan Rather ports on HDnet about this process. I guess it took Yahoo a few months to get around to watching it, too.
 
sale-70-410-exam    | Exam-200-125-pdf    | we-sale-70-410-exam    | hot-sale-70-410-exam    | Latest-exam-700-603-Dumps    | Dumps-98-363-exams-date    | Certs-200-125-date    | Dumps-300-075-exams-date    | hot-sale-book-C8010-726-book    | Hot-Sale-200-310-Exam    | Exam-Description-200-310-dumps?    | hot-sale-book-200-125-book    | Latest-Updated-300-209-Exam    | Dumps-210-260-exams-date    | Download-200-125-Exam-PDF    | Exam-Description-300-101-dumps    | Certs-300-101-date    | Hot-Sale-300-075-Exam    | Latest-exam-200-125-Dumps    | Exam-Description-200-125-dumps    | Latest-Updated-300-075-Exam    | hot-sale-book-210-260-book    | Dumps-200-901-exams-date    | Certs-200-901-date    | Latest-exam-1Z0-062-Dumps    | Hot-Sale-1Z0-062-Exam    | Certs-CSSLP-date    | 100%-Pass-70-383-Exams    | Latest-JN0-360-real-exam-questions    | 100%-Pass-4A0-100-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-300-135-exams-date    | Passed-200-105-Tech-Exams    | Latest-Updated-200-310-Exam    | Download-300-070-Exam-PDF    | Hot-Sale-JN0-360-Exam    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Exams    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-JN0-360-exams-date    | Exam-Description-1Z0-876-dumps    | Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps    | Dumps-HPE0-Y53-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-HPE0-Y53-Exam    | 100%-Pass-HPE0-Y53-Real-Exam-Questions    | Pass-4A0-100-Exam    | Latest-4A0-100-Questions    | Dumps-98-365-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-98-365-Exam    | 100%-Pass-VCS-254-Exams    | 2017-Latest-VCS-273-Exam    | Dumps-200-355-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-300-320-Exam    | Pass-300-101-Exam    | 100%-Pass-300-115-Exams    |
http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    | http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    |