Teachers pay is a disgrace.

[everman]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb

Then say that the catch is, the standards are going to be much higher, so we don't have the substandard idiots that we have teaching now.
Specify that schools offering teaching degrees must produce grads that meet these standards, or they won't be hired.

What will happen is this: the current teachers will be tested and the ones who are not up to par will be weeded out.
Then, better, smarter students will start studying for teaching degrees since you can actually make a good salary now.
Better-educated students and happier teachers will be the result.

I think any of us who have gone to a university know that you can still get supposedly well educated morons. Or sometimes they are very smart and really are experts, but just don't really know how to teach.

This happens practically everywhere though. Such as not all highly paid business execs really deserve it, and surely not all high paid lawyers are worth it.

 

[compfreak999]

teachers really do deserve more money, well at least the good dedicated teachers, they teach the future generation and without them there wouldnt be any more high tech sectors in the business field. Do teachers really deserve next to minimal wage for carrying such a heavy task? i believe that the good teachers deserve better pay. i personally had a extreamly good teacher that devoted her time to helping anyone after school if they needed help. (jumped to a higher math class so yea needed help)

 

[zener]

as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

 

[gotsmack]

Originally posted by: zener
as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

Europe has better grade school and maybe better High schools, but the US has better Universities.

I would also like to point out that Masters and PhD programs are easier in Europe than in the US. I could see an exception in the case of a Masters program in the US from a crappy no name school.


If you don't believe me then skim through a few PhD dissertations from a second tier school in the US and a top tier european university.

There are maybe 4 schools in Europe that come close to top tier US quality.




and what do you mean by atleast a PhD? A PhD is a terminal degree.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: gotsmack

Originally posted by: zener
as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

Europe has better grade school and maybe better High schools, but the US has better Universities.

I would also like to point out that Masters and PhD programs are easier in Europe than in the US. I could see an exception in the case of a Masters program in the US from a crappy no name school.


If you don't believe me then skim through a few PhD dissertations from a second tier school in the US and a top tier european university.

There are maybe 4 schools in Europe that come close to top tier US quality.




and what do you mean by atleast a PhD? A PhD is a terminal degree.

I agree that we have the best post high school education in the world but the professors get paid pretty well. When I'm talking about teachers, I'm talking about pre-college. I still stand that their pay is fine the way it is. What they need are more resources to make their job easier. Teachers in the US are under educated thus don't deserver the higher pay. Maybe if we have a better way to measure a teacher, then I'm not going to object to them getting a raise.

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: MadCowDisease

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: lucrioual
teachers get paid crap, and i think waitress's get paid crap also
but thats besides the point
teachers work to hard for what they get paid

They deserve crappy pay because it's easy being a teacher and they don't do as much.

Have you ever been in a classroom situation as a teacher? Have you ever prepared lesson plans? Are you capable of simultaneously controlling 30-odd children and getting them to pay rapt attention when you want to without hitting, screaming, or shouting? Depending on the neighborhood and school, do you put yourself in harm's way potentially every day? Have you spent hundreds of dollars of your own money to supply understocked classrooms with basic school supplies like pencils, paper, and erasers? Do you put in over forty hours a week (sometimes more) educating the next generation of US citizens? Are you willing to do so for measly pay and benefits?

If you have never been in the role of teacher, you have no right to say anything about 'how easy' the job is, because I can tell you it's a helluva lot more than simply teaching addition.

I bet a engineer can teacher better then a teacher can be an engineer. That's why teachers don't get paid as much. They don't deserve to get paid more.

That's a pretty stupid analogy. It's like saying a doctor can be a better teacher than a teacher can be a doctor. Well, duh. The teacher has no medical training, whereas it's pretty simple for a doctor to go in front of a classroom and spout medical terminology and molecular charts until they fall asleep. But if the class gets rowdy, out of hand, etc...can they control them? No. Once again, you sidestep the points made above with mindless drivel. Any moron can stand in front of a classroom, call themselves a 'teacher' and spout facts. An eighth-grader can do that. But if that's all you think teachers do, then my friend, you are horribly wrong.

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: gotsmack

Originally posted by: zener
as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

Europe has better grade school and maybe better High schools, but the US has better Universities.

I would also like to point out that Masters and PhD programs are easier in Europe than in the US. I could see an exception in the case of a Masters program in the US from a crappy no name school.


If you don't believe me then skim through a few PhD dissertations from a second tier school in the US and a top tier european university.

There are maybe 4 schools in Europe that come close to top tier US quality.




and what do you mean by atleast a PhD? A PhD is a terminal degree.

I agree that we have the best post high school education in the world but the professors get paid pretty well. When I'm talking about teachers, I'm talking about pre-college. I still stand that their pay is fine the way it is. What they need are more resources to make their job easier. Teachers in the US are under educated thus don't deserver the higher pay. Maybe if we have a better way to measure a teacher, then I'm not going to object to them getting a raise.

You can have six Ph.D's yet have no idea how to manage a classroom effectively. When it comes down to it, 70-year old Mrs. Brown is going to be able to control a class full of rowdy six-year olds better than an education Ph.D who's spent her days in academia simply because Mrs. Brown has real-world experience, which you can't replace with any type of degree or any type of grades. Level of education is not a symbol of quality. It seems to me that you're caught up in the modern rat race to accumulate as many credentials as possible. When it comes down to it, as a school administrator I'd probably choose the teacher with ten years' experience over the guy with a doctorate but no experience.

You also have to look at what you value in an education. If you value a group of mindless automatons with no creativity but can regurgitate facts and quote historical dates like they're on Jeopardy, then go ahead, keep the teachers' pay low. But if you want quality educators who go above and beyond the classroom, teaching not only the students knowledge but HOW TO LIVE, then you'd better start ramping up salaries and benefits, because frankly, those people are all going to the private sector.

 

[Jzero]

Originally posted by: JoeKing

Originally posted by: Jzero
I have stated clearly why teachers are adequately paid. You have INVENTED that idea that I think "education is a farce, a job for security," to support your argument. I never stated that once during any of these posts, not even words remotely to that effect. I have said over and over and over that teachers get paid quite adequately for what they do. Not overpaid, definitely not underpaid. If you like to put words in people's mouths, perhaps it's YOU that shouldn't have children

defintion of racket : an illegal enterprise (such as extortion or fraud or drug peddling or prostitution) carried on for profit

Since your education seems to be lacking, use of the word "racket" to describe a job that provides unbelievable perks is common slang. In none of the quotes you listed did I ever state that "education is a farce, a job for security."

I will not repeat this again if you can't figure it out:
Teachers are handsomely paid for their work in cash, paid time off, benefits and job security and should not be pissing and moainging about their lots in life.

<snip another emotional rant>

As for the BS I'm talking about. It's people like you that is the BS I'm talking about that stopped me from pursuing education as a profession. Those that think education is a racket and unimportant.

Oh, so you mean people who won't kiss your ass as a teacher?
Guilty as charged.
You should do your job because you love it, not because you want people to bow down before you.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: MadCowDisease

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: MadCowDisease

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: lucrioual
teachers get paid crap, and i think waitress's get paid crap also
but thats besides the point
teachers work to hard for what they get paid

They deserve crappy pay because it's easy being a teacher and they don't do as much.

Have you ever been in a classroom situation as a teacher? Have you ever prepared lesson plans? Are you capable of simultaneously controlling 30-odd children and getting them to pay rapt attention when you want to without hitting, screaming, or shouting? Depending on the neighborhood and school, do you put yourself in harm's way potentially every day? Have you spent hundreds of dollars of your own money to supply understocked classrooms with basic school supplies like pencils, paper, and erasers? Do you put in over forty hours a week (sometimes more) educating the next generation of US citizens? Are you willing to do so for measly pay and benefits?

If you have never been in the role of teacher, you have no right to say anything about 'how easy' the job is, because I can tell you it's a helluva lot more than simply teaching addition.

I bet a engineer can teacher better then a teacher can be an engineer. That's why teachers don't get paid as much. They don't deserve to get paid more.

That's a pretty stupid analogy. It's like saying a doctor can be a better teacher than a teacher can be a doctor. Well, duh. The teacher has no medical training, whereas it's pretty simple for a doctor to go in front of a classroom and spout medical terminology and molecular charts until they fall asleep. But if the class gets rowdy, out of hand, etc...can they control them? No. Once again, you sidestep the points made above with mindless drivel. Any moron can stand in front of a classroom, call themselves a 'teacher' and spout facts. An eighth-grader can do that. But if that's all you think teachers do, then my friend, you are horribly wrong.

The comparison stems from the educational stand point. What percentage of students actually graduate as a teacher versus the percentage of students graduate as an engineer. The fail rate for engineers are so much higher meaning that it's a harder field to go into. If i decide to change my career now and become a teacher, then I bet it's a heck easier then if I decide to change and become an engineer if I was a teacher.

 

[tec699]

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: gotsmack

Originally posted by: zener
as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

Europe has better grade school and maybe better High schools, but the US has better Universities.

I would also like to point out that Masters and PhD programs are easier in Europe than in the US. I could see an exception in the case of a Masters program in the US from a crappy no name school.


If you don't believe me then skim through a few PhD dissertations from a second tier school in the US and a top tier european university.

There are maybe 4 schools in Europe that come close to top tier US quality.




and what do you mean by atleast a PhD? A PhD is a terminal degree.

I agree that we have the best post high school education in the world but the professors get paid pretty well. When I'm talking about teachers, I'm talking about pre-college. I still stand that their pay is fine the way it is. What they need are more resources to make their job easier. Teachers in the US are under educated thus don't deserver the higher pay. Maybe if we have a better way to measure a teacher, then I'm not going to object to them getting a raise.

Why bother Madcow? I can't even read what the F*ck he said? Ha...

Here is a suggestion Long Ace. Go the f*ck back to school. Also, your dead wrong about a engineer teaching a classroom better then a regular teacher. What are his classroom behavioral skills? What if he has a disabled student who is LD, ADD, BD and ED. Of course you know what those Acronyms are right? Oh comeon, teachers suck right? So anyway you have a studnet that is behaviorally and emotionally disabled, learning disabled, and has attention deficit disorder. How would you tailor your lesson plan to fit his needs? C'mon you seem to have all the answers. I'll keep checking back and I guaranteee you that you will not have an answer to my question.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: MadCowDisease

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: gotsmack

Originally posted by: zener
as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

Europe has better grade school and maybe better High schools, but the US has better Universities.

I would also like to point out that Masters and PhD programs are easier in Europe than in the US. I could see an exception in the case of a Masters program in the US from a crappy no name school.


If you don't believe me then skim through a few PhD dissertations from a second tier school in the US and a top tier european university.

There are maybe 4 schools in Europe that come close to top tier US quality.




and what do you mean by atleast a PhD? A PhD is a terminal degree.

I agree that we have the best post high school education in the world but the professors get paid pretty well. When I'm talking about teachers, I'm talking about pre-college. I still stand that their pay is fine the way it is. What they need are more resources to make their job easier. Teachers in the US are under educated thus don't deserver the higher pay. Maybe if we have a better way to measure a teacher, then I'm not going to object to them getting a raise.

You can have six Ph.D's yet have no idea how to manage a classroom effectively. When it comes down to it, 70-year old Mrs. Brown is going to be able to control a class full of rowdy six-year olds better than an education Ph.D who's spent her days in academia simply because Mrs. Brown has real-world experience, which you can't replace with any type of degree or any type of grades. Level of education is not a symbol of quality. It seems to me that you're caught up in the modern rat race to accumulate as many credentials as possible. When it comes down to it, as a school administrator I'd probably choose the teacher with ten years' experience over the guy with a doctorate but no experience.

You also have to look at what you value in an education. If you value a group of mindless automatons with no creativity but can regurgitate facts and quote historical dates like they're on Jeopardy, then go ahead, keep the teachers' pay low. But if you want quality educators who go above and beyond the classroom, teaching not only the students knowledge but HOW TO LIVE, then you'd better start ramping up salaries and benefits, because frankly, those people are all going to the private sector.

I'd rather have a Ph.D with 10 years experience versus a BS person with 10 years experience. There is a reason why our pre-college program is one of the worst in the world vs. our universities being number 1.

 

[tec699]

Again LongAce you miss the point. You have a student that tells you that he's not going to do his in-classroom assignment and then he tells you to go f*ck yourself! What are you going to do? You can't throw him out of your classroom because he's labeled as behaviorally disabled. So what do you do? I guarantee you that you wouldn't last a week.

I doubt most people on this forum wouldn't last a month in a teacher's position, especially since most members are socially incomptent. AKA- Lacking social skills.

Follow a teacher for a week. Until you do exactly this then you can't really talk and your opinion really means squat.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: tec699

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: gotsmack

Originally posted by: zener
as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

Europe has better grade school and maybe better High schools, but the US has better Universities.

I would also like to point out that Masters and PhD programs are easier in Europe than in the US. I could see an exception in the case of a Masters program in the US from a crappy no name school.


If you don't believe me then skim through a few PhD dissertations from a second tier school in the US and a top tier european university.

There are maybe 4 schools in Europe that come close to top tier US quality.




and what do you mean by atleast a PhD? A PhD is a terminal degree.

I agree that we have the best post high school education in the world but the professors get paid pretty well. When I'm talking about teachers, I'm talking about pre-college. I still stand that their pay is fine the way it is. What they need are more resources to make their job easier. Teachers in the US are under educated thus don't deserver the higher pay. Maybe if we have a better way to measure a teacher, then I'm not going to object to them getting a raise.

Why bother Madcow? I can't even read what the F*ck he said? Ha...

Here is a suggestion Long Ace. Go the f*ck back to school. Also, your dead wrong about a engineer teaching a classroom better then a regular teacher. What are his classroom behavioral skills? What if he has a disabled student who is LD, ADD, BD and ED. Of course you know what those Acronyms are right? Oh comeon, teachers suck right? So anyway you have a studnet that is behaviorally and emotionally disabled, learning disabled, and has attention deficit disorder. How would you tailor your lesson plan to fit his needs? C'mon you seem to have all the answers. I'll keep checking back and I guaranteee you that you will not have an answer to my question.

Go back to school? Are you upset that people knows for a fact that being a teacher is nothing to cheer about or give acknowledgement to being smart. When have you heard anyone say, ?Wow, you?re majoring in education? That must be hard?? I?ve heard plenty of compliments for people that are engineers or doctors.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: tec699
Again LongAce you miss the point. You have a student that tells you that he's not going to do his in-classroom assignment and then he tells you to go f*ck yourself! What are you going to do? You can't throw him out of your classroom because he's labeled as behaviorally disabled. So what do you do? I guarantee you that you wouldn't last a week.

I doubt most people on this forum wouldn't last a month in a teacher's position, especially since most members are socially incomptent. AKA- Lacking social skills.

Follow a teacher for a week. Until you do exactly this then you can't really talk and your opinion really means squat.

Actually, you don't understand what I'm saying. If I were to become teacher, then I would go back to school. More then likely I would past versus if someone where to try to have a career change and become an engineer. Each career needs some kind of training and qualification to do what they do. To get that qualification would depends on how hard the field is and the education field is not that hard.

 

[Regs]

I'll be happy with 40-60k.


But yeah, we pay our teachers less then we pay our hookers. Thats a disgrace, we should pay our hookers as much as we pay our teachers.

 

[Triforceofcourage]

Atleast hookers give you something to smile about so I think thats worth the additional pay

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: tec699

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: gotsmack

Originally posted by: zener
as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

Europe has better grade school and maybe better High schools, but the US has better Universities.

I would also like to point out that Masters and PhD programs are easier in Europe than in the US. I could see an exception in the case of a Masters program in the US from a crappy no name school.


If you don't believe me then skim through a few PhD dissertations from a second tier school in the US and a top tier european university.

There are maybe 4 schools in Europe that come close to top tier US quality.




and what do you mean by atleast a PhD? A PhD is a terminal degree.

I agree that we have the best post high school education in the world but the professors get paid pretty well. When I'm talking about teachers, I'm talking about pre-college. I still stand that their pay is fine the way it is. What they need are more resources to make their job easier. Teachers in the US are under educated thus don't deserver the higher pay. Maybe if we have a better way to measure a teacher, then I'm not going to object to them getting a raise.

Why bother Madcow? I can't even read what the F*ck he said? Ha...

Here is a suggestion Long Ace. Go the f*ck back to school. Also, your dead wrong about a engineer teaching a classroom better then a regular teacher. What are his classroom behavioral skills? What if he has a disabled student who is LD, ADD, BD and ED. Of course you know what those Acronyms are right? Oh comeon, teachers suck right? So anyway you have a studnet that is behaviorally and emotionally disabled, learning disabled, and has attention deficit disorder. How would you tailor your lesson plan to fit his needs? C'mon you seem to have all the answers. I'll keep checking back and I guaranteee you that you will not have an answer to my question.

Go back to school? Are you upset that people knows for a fact that being a teacher is nothing to cheer about or give acknowledgement to being smart. When have you heard anyone say, ?Wow, you?re majoring in education? That must be hard?? I?ve heard plenty of compliments for people that are engineers or doctors.

I know a number of education majors, and they are intelligent people, believe it or not! WOW! A couple are math majors and doubling in elementary education. The comments they get is usually: "The world needs more teachers and less doctors and lawyers." So before you decide like you know everything it is about being a teacher and call them all morons (because clearly you know) why don't you put yourself in a teaching position before you knock it.

I'm headed to grad school after I graduate, and I'll probably end up in academia but I know I could never teach high school or elementary school - I don't have the patience, and I sure as hell don't have the ability to control students like my teachers were able to.

The argument you make about certain careers being 'harder' than others is entirely up to how you look at things. Most people would consider Psychology or English 'easy' majors and Physics or Biology 'hard' majors. However, when it comes down to it the Bio/Physics majors spend hours writing and revising their papers, while the English majors can churn them out by the dozen. Similarly, stick an author in front of a problem set and he has no idea how to complete it. They all have their respective strengths and weaknesses.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: MadCowDisease

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: tec699

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: gotsmack

Originally posted by: zener
as far as teachers go, the US is sad for teachers. In Europe, they have to have at least a PHD just for elementary. Teachers here are not educated enough to know what they teach. Besides, the bureaucrats keep them from actually teaching. Most US students are not able to compete globally because of such poor education. Concerning pay, teachers generally have 3 months off unlike other workers so I do not have a problem with less pay than year round workers. However, if a teacher is qualified and teaches year round, then they should get pay commensurate with their abillitiesn not tenure. Competition is what produces viable, compentant teachers. I know that no simple answer exists but first there needs to be teachers that are taught first and no bureaucratic influence. Ck out the European system

Europe has better grade school and maybe better High schools, but the US has better Universities.

I would also like to point out that Masters and PhD programs are easier in Europe than in the US. I could see an exception in the case of a Masters program in the US from a crappy no name school.


If you don't believe me then skim through a few PhD dissertations from a second tier school in the US and a top tier european university.

There are maybe 4 schools in Europe that come close to top tier US quality.




and what do you mean by atleast a PhD? A PhD is a terminal degree.

I agree that we have the best post high school education in the world but the professors get paid pretty well. When I'm talking about teachers, I'm talking about pre-college. I still stand that their pay is fine the way it is. What they need are more resources to make their job easier. Teachers in the US are under educated thus don't deserver the higher pay. Maybe if we have a better way to measure a teacher, then I'm not going to object to them getting a raise.

Why bother Madcow? I can't even read what the F*ck he said? Ha...

Here is a suggestion Long Ace. Go the f*ck back to school. Also, your dead wrong about a engineer teaching a classroom better then a regular teacher. What are his classroom behavioral skills? What if he has a disabled student who is LD, ADD, BD and ED. Of course you know what those Acronyms are right? Oh comeon, teachers suck right? So anyway you have a studnet that is behaviorally and emotionally disabled, learning disabled, and has attention deficit disorder. How would you tailor your lesson plan to fit his needs? C'mon you seem to have all the answers. I'll keep checking back and I guaranteee you that you will not have an answer to my question.

Go back to school? Are you upset that people knows for a fact that being a teacher is nothing to cheer about or give acknowledgement to being smart. When have you heard anyone say, ?Wow, you?re majoring in education? That must be hard?? I?ve heard plenty of compliments for people that are engineers or doctors.

I know a number of education majors, and they are intelligent people, believe it or not! WOW! A couple are math majors and doubling in elementary education. The comments they get is usually: "The world needs more teachers and less doctors and lawyers." So before you decide like you know everything it is about being a teacher and call them all morons (because clearly you know) why don't you put yourself in a teaching position before you knock it.

I'm headed to grad school after I graduate, and I'll probably end up in academia but I know I could never teach high school or elementary school - I don't have the patience, and I sure as hell don't have the ability to control students like my teachers were able to.

The argument you make about certain careers being 'harder' than others is entirely up to how you look at things. Most people would consider Psychology or English 'easy' majors and Physics or Biology 'hard' majors. However, when it comes down to it the Bio/Physics majors spend hours writing and revising their papers, while the English majors can churn them out by the dozen. Similarly, stick an author in front of a problem set and he has no idea how to complete it. They all have their respective strengths and weaknesses.

Here you are telling someone to go back to school but you haven't even graduated yet. That's very interesting.

 

[Triforceofcourage]

This thread is getting very long winded. The simple fact is Teachers get payed fair for the amount of work they do and the summers they have off with a less stressful job that includes very good job security and benefits. So in the words of DMX, "Stop being greedy".

 

[Triforceofcourage]

Funny thing I just got an email from my university and they are increasing my cost per credit hour to $105 for undergrad courses so forgive me if I don't shed tears for these poor teachers.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: Triforceofcourage
Funny thing I just got an email from my university and they are increasing my cost per credit hour to $105 for undergrad courses so forgive me if I don't shed tears for these poor teachers.

I second that.

 

[Haps]

Forget the hrs and forget the vacation aspect. Yes teachers can put in long hrs. Any teacher that says this is everyday is full of it. I doubt on average most teachers work more the 50hrs a week. Yes there will be 65hr weeks but there will also be 40hr weeks. So if you average out at 10hrs a day for 185days of the year. That's 1850 workign hrs. Most people with a full time job work 2080hrs in a year.

So forgetting about unpaid summer vacation and everything. I think teachers get paid an adequate salary for the amount of hrs worked.

 

[GeneralGrievous]

Again LongAce you miss the point. You have a student that tells you that he's not going to do his in-classroom assignment and then he tells you to go f*ck yourself! What are you going to do? You can't throw him out of your classroom because he's labeled as behaviorally disabled. So what do you do? I guarantee you that you wouldn't last a week.

But at least where I live, it doesn't work that way.

A lot of people here keep bringing up the point of controlling 30+ children. Realistically, it is more like 20+, and even that is only in elementary schools. In middle and high school that's really not an issue for the most part. If you choose to teach special ed that's your problem, a run of the mill teacher doesn't have to deal with that.

And if a student tells you to go f*ck yourself? Well, either fill out a discipline slip or ignore it. Students call each other far worse than they call their teachers anyway.

Where I live (a wealthy NJ district), teachers start at $41000 and get tenured in 3 years, which is absolutely ridiculous. At least, for most teachers anyway. Over the past 3 years of high school, we've had an onslaught of new teachers in history and english, but nothing in math/science. IMO they should lower history and english salaries $5k, lower gym teachers and electives $10k, and increase math and science teachers $5k. The principal makes a lot of money (6 figures), but that really doesn't matter, even if you cut his salary in half, the $50k or so distributed among 200 faculty in the school building really doesn't do much.

As for teachers themselves, most of them are garbage. That really is the truth, even in a strict hiring district like mine. There isn't enough quality teachers around to raise the standards, and having such a large scale evalutation process costs a lot of money.

Bottom Line: From my experience the prescense and quality of a teacher is really irrelevant. If a student is motivated and/or bright he/she will do great regardless, and if they're not having even a great teacher is unlikely to help.

And to the OP: Most of my teachers live in PA. You might want to consider living there for cheaper taxes and whatnot, if you school is near the border.

 

[KillaBong]

They have low pay because it's a woman's job.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: Haps
Forget the hrs and forget the vacation aspect. Yes teachers can put in long hrs. Any teacher that says this is everyday is full of it. I doubt on average most teachers work more the 50hrs a week. Yes there will be 65hr weeks but there will also be 40hr weeks. So if you average out at 10hrs a day for 185days of the year. That's 1850 workign hrs. Most people with a full time job work 2080hrs in a year.

So forgetting about unpaid summer vacation and everything. I think teachers get paid an adequate salary for the amount of hrs worked.

No way the average teacher even works 40 hours a week. Both my ex-in-laws were teachers. The mom was a math teacher,(jr high) and the dad was a PE/Coach teacher.
Dad followed the buses out of the parking lot every day, and went straight to the golf course.
Mom worked sometimes until 4pm....but not all the time. And she was a VERY slow and inefficient person in all aspects of life. Did everything the hard way, it seemed. And still didn't work 40 hours a week.
Both made over 50k a year, and this was in 1994. Both had nearly a year of sick days built up, plus vacation and all the normal holidays they got, PLUS the summers off.