Teachers pay is a disgrace.

[SeTeS]

Well, I taught CAD, Trig and Geom at a technical college for the first year after I graduted (mid 80s)... I loved the work, and would do it in a flash again if the pay was better.

One of my responsibilities was assisting in job placement for graduating students. The school had several big tech companies that would skim the cream of the graduating class each quarter... well, it didn't take too long for me to get tired of placing students in starting positions that were paying higher than my own...

That being said, I do think that there are a large number of teachers currently in the system who should not be there. Alas, a degree does not a teacher make. I know I had several over the course of my education who, while they were degreed, had no idea how to convey their knowledge to others (much less inspire passion in the subject matter).

 

[edro]

I haven't read any other posts... (just a warning)

I don't think their pay is a disgrace. You need a master's degree to become a teacher... that is it. You don't have to know that much stuff... If you have graduated from college, you obviously know how to retain knowledge. As a teacher, all you do is recite it.

Don't get me wrong, I am not degrading teachers... their job is the most important in the world... and being a good teacher is very difficult, but there is not real way to measure how good a teacher is, that is why they all get the same, crappy pay.

 

[Idex]

Originally posted by: Sysadmin
I think the teachers in my School district are OVERPAID...They get unbelievable benefits and still bitch that they don't make enough money? I would be more willing to support my local teachers if the teaching in my district was not so substandard.

Sysadmin

 

[Titan]

I didn't read the previous 202 posts, just as note in case no one brought it up: crappy jobs pay crap. It doesn't make sense in this world, but that's just the way that it is and i'm not saying we can change it. Farmers are the most important in a society and they are at the bottom of the pay scale at the end of a day. Food service and retail distribution also pay crap but are essential to our economy. Teachers are also important and they aren't paid very well. Same for police. But in corporate america, the more you make, the less you do. They guy at the top makes all the money and does none of the work compared to the farmer or the teacher. That's just the way it is. At least good teachers feel that the job is rewarding in other ways, but i guess you could say that about any crap job.

 

[Triforceofcourage]

Teachers are part of the public sector like policemen, firemen, and all of the other civil servants. They do not pay extremely well but make up for it with job security and benefits. People in the private sector have jobs that are less stable and have more risk than government jobs. Business 101 the more financial risk you take the more you SHOULD be earning. I am still a college student so I guess you could say I am impartial on the matter but thats just how business works.

 

[SeTeS]

but isn't there a big 'you get what you pay for' element in education? Shouldn't there be? Certainly there are those teachers who are excellent at their craft and are willing to tolerate less than scale wages, but wouldn't society as a whole be better off with better teachers?

 

[Thump553]

I personally know two lawyers and one CPA that quit their professions to teach. In my state the pay is extremely good, the workweek and workday are short and two months off a year. The longest vacation I've had since I left school 25 years ago was two weeks, and that was between jobs. Teaching public school is a very lucrative profession from the numbers I've seen and teachers I've talked to.

Substitutes earn very crummy pay, but teachers have one of the best deals there is.

 

[DT4K]

Teachers make plenty of money.
They make as much or more than a lot of other jobs that require bachelor's or masters degrees.
And they have much better benefits and 3 FVCKING MONTHS OF VACATION EVERY YEAR.

Wait, you have to take work home with you?
Well guess what, so do a lot of us who already work 5 or 6 days a week for all 12 months of the year.

Teachers don't take summer jobs because they have to. They take summer jobs because they can and it's a great opportunity to make extra money. Unfortunately, those of us who work all 12 months of the year don't have the opportunity to work a summer job and get two paychecks every week even though we are only working at one job at the time.

 

[Ornery]

Originally posted by: SeTeS
but isn't there a big 'you get what you pay for' element in education? Shouldn't there be? Certainly there are those teachers who are excellent at their craft and are willing to tolerate less than scale wages, but wouldn't society as a whole be better off with better teachers?

Yeah, get rid of the GD teacher's union and we can do stuff like that. Fire the lamers and reward the good ones.

 

[Triforceofcourage]

Stupidest........ thread.......... ever........

 

[UglyCasanova]

Originally posted by: Triforceofcourage
Stupidest........ thread.......... ever........

Care to explain why you think this is the "stupidest" thread ever?

 

[edro]

The job market is the exact same as everything else in capitalism... SUPPLY AND DEMAND.

Teachers are a dime a dozen... that's why they don't get paid anything.

 

[Dissipate]

Originally posted by: edro13
The job market is the exact same as everything else in capitalism... SUPPLY AND DEMAND.

Teachers are a dime a dozen... that's why they don't get paid anything.

That's partly because public education is adminstered by bureaucrats who set the wages. It is socialism at its finest. Public education needs to end as we know it before teacher's salaries can reach their true equilibrium price, end of story.

 

[tec699]

Originally posted by: Triforceofcourage
Stupidest........ thread.......... ever........

:roll:

 

[Ornery]

"...please try to tell me otherwise."

Guess the results were pretty in your face, eh?

 

[Triforceofcourage]

We need public education because most of America cannot afford Private Education and will only help the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Public Education is having trouble but that doesn't mean we need to get rid of it. It just means we need to improve it and paying the already crappy teachers we already have more money won't do it.

 

[lucrioual]

teachers get paid crap, and i think waitress's get paid crap also
but thats besides the point
teachers work to hard for what they get paid

 

[UglyCasanova]

Originally posted by: lucrioual
teachers get paid crap, and i think waitress's get paid crap also
but thats besides the point
teachers work to hard for what they get paid

So waitress's don't?

<-- I'm currently a waiter who works pretty damn hard for my $10 an hour thank you very much.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: lucrioual
teachers get paid crap, and i think waitress's get paid crap also
but thats besides the point
teachers work to hard for what they get paid

They deserve crappy pay because it's easy being a teacher and they don't do as much.

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: lucrioual
teachers get paid crap, and i think waitress's get paid crap also
but thats besides the point
teachers work to hard for what they get paid

They deserve crappy pay because it's easy being a teacher and they don't do as much.

Have you ever been in a classroom situation as a teacher? Have you ever prepared lesson plans? Are you capable of simultaneously controlling 30-odd children and getting them to pay rapt attention when you want to without hitting, screaming, or shouting? Depending on the neighborhood and school, do you put yourself in harm's way potentially every day? Have you spent hundreds of dollars of your own money to supply understocked classrooms with basic school supplies like pencils, paper, and erasers? Do you put in over forty hours a week (sometimes more) educating the next generation of US citizens? Are you willing to do so for measly pay and benefits?

If you have never been in the role of teacher, you have no right to say anything about 'how easy' the job is, because I can tell you it's a helluva lot more than simply teaching addition.

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: Triforceofcourage
We need public education because most of America cannot afford Private Education and will only help the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Public Education is having trouble but that doesn't mean we need to get rid of it. It just means we need to improve it and paying the already crappy teachers we already have more money won't do it.

We need more money for schools in general to fund textbook purchases, supplies and to find better teachers. Many elementary school teachers across the country are supplying their classrooms out-of-pocket, unreimbursed by the districts.

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: edro13
I haven't read any other posts... (just a warning)

I don't think their pay is a disgrace. You need a master's degree to become a teacher... that is it. You don't have to know that much stuff... If you have graduated from college, you obviously know how to retain knowledge. As a teacher, all you do is recite it.

Don't get me wrong, I am not degrading teachers... their job is the most important in the world... and being a good teacher is very difficult, but there is not real way to measure how good a teacher is, that is why they all get the same, crappy pay.

If all your teachers did for you was drill you with facts, then you had pretty crappy teachers.

 

[LongAce]

Originally posted by: MadCowDisease

Originally posted by: LongAce

Originally posted by: lucrioual
teachers get paid crap, and i think waitress's get paid crap also
but thats besides the point
teachers work to hard for what they get paid

They deserve crappy pay because it's easy being a teacher and they don't do as much.

Have you ever been in a classroom situation as a teacher? Have you ever prepared lesson plans? Are you capable of simultaneously controlling 30-odd children and getting them to pay rapt attention when you want to without hitting, screaming, or shouting? Depending on the neighborhood and school, do you put yourself in harm's way potentially every day? Have you spent hundreds of dollars of your own money to supply understocked classrooms with basic school supplies like pencils, paper, and erasers? Do you put in over forty hours a week (sometimes more) educating the next generation of US citizens? Are you willing to do so for measly pay and benefits?

If you have never been in the role of teacher, you have no right to say anything about 'how easy' the job is, because I can tell you it's a helluva lot more than simply teaching addition.

I bet a engineer can teacher better then a teacher can be an engineer. That's why teachers don't get paid as much. They don't deserve to get paid more.

 

[jaydee]

Hmmm...

Teachers:
Teachers in my district get a raise no matter what.
Unparalleled job security (the only way to get fired after 5 years is to pretty much molest a kid).
Nearly 4 months of vacation per year starting year one (2.5 months in the summer, 2 weeks each for Christmas and Easter, plus random holidays that no one else gets off like Presidents day).
Fairly stable working hours 7am-3pm.
It really doesn't matter where you get your degree, or what your GPA is (unless you really suck).
Always is and will be a job market.
Can find work anywhere in the country.
Outstanding benefits package

Engineers:
May or may not get a raise/bonus based on performance
If you suck, you get fired. If there's a downturn in the economy, you may lose your job.
Usually a week of vacation a year to start and maybe up to 3 weeks after 10-15 years.
I don't know many (in any) engineers that work less than 45 hours a week consistently.
To get a great job, your chances are significantly better if you go to a private $35k per year school or lucky enough to live in a state with a good public program (UM, PSU, UNC, ect.) and work you butt off to get good grades and perhaps go to grad school.
Job market fluctuates significantly.
Almost mandatory to live in, around a city or face a long commute.
Usually a good benefits package if you work for a large company, but this will fluctuate as well.


Ya, they get paid more, but you know what? Money != happiness. If you hate the city life, are always worried about your job being outsourced to Asia, and only get to see your kids an hour before their bedtime each night, which job would you prefer?

I'm not seeking pity for all the engineers out there, there's nothing I'd rather be. My point is, there's hardly an occupation out there that's perfect, I wish people would stop complaining about teachers pay, like it's the only job out there that has a downside to it. It's called real life.

 

[rainypickles]

as a teacher, i think teachers are underpaid. i agree with what has been said about measuring good teachers. if they had a reliable way (not standardized test scores) to measure teaching ability/success, they could pay people accordingly. teachers do not create tangible products. that said, i think that teachers who are paid more can worry less about mortgage, etc, and can focus on better teaching. if i'm starving and living from check to check, the students are going to get screwed over.

if i produced 10 albert einsteins (or whatevers) and it was obvious that it was me, i would get paid more. if i produced 10 dubya's i'd get fired. it's not that cut and dry with teachers. it takes forever to see results.

teachers do not work 7-3. or at least i dont. you cant expect to just teach the hours you are in class and that is it. there is so much more to be done. and you have to put up with management, but thats all jobs.

and you know, i'm not sure that engineers could teach better than teachers could engineer. maybe if you were talking about english or history teachers. but if you are talking about science or math teachers, the teachers would probably fare better. being a teacher, you learn to multitask ALOT and put up with ALOT of crap from kids/management. i can see engineers just drowned in a sea of students, easily. teaching seems easy, but man is it a monster.