[techpowerup] Radeon HD 7970 FOB Price Cut to $475

[blackened23]

Who the hell uses full scene SSAA? Even YOU said that it's way too much of a performance hit, so why do you keep bringing it up? Even if AMD's FSSSAA worked in DX10+ (which it doesn't, but you keep arguing), you wouldn't use it because no demanding DX10+ title will run at acceptable fps with FSSSAA.

Instead you down play the importance of TrSSAA, which gives like 90% of the visual improvement of FSSSAA without the penalty. The only thing it doesn't fix is shader aliasing, and that's what FXAA/MLAA is for.

Does AMD have TrSSAA in DX10+? No.

Oh come on. AMD takes a different approach and has a different type of AA - AMD has EQAA while nvidia uses TrAA.

DX11 titles are demanding enough that using SSAA or any type of high end AA is unrealistic, but it is a *nice* option to have for older titles.
In addition, Nvidia inspector is highly unreliable for reasons outlined earlier and is a hassle to use, I don't feel like scouring the internet for AA compatibility bits.

I thought a lot of this, because at one point I did have both sets of hardware on 2 PC's and was continually confused by why it was so difficult to make Dead Space 1/2 look nice on nvidia hardware. AMD will let you use SSAA with ease,
while with nvidia its a huge hassle. Not to mention SSAA via nvidia inspector turns both of those games into a slideshow for some reason.

 

[96Firebird]

Please stop viewing the world through nvidia glasses. I know that regardless of what is said, you will view AMD as a big bad evil company. And you must defend nvidias honor. Whatever dude.

This is the second time I've seen you say this, does it make you feel "cool" to attack posters on an internet forum? Knock it off and get over yourself...

 

[blackened23]

This is the second time I've seen you say this, does it make you feel "cool" to attack posters on an internet forum? Knock it off and get over yourself...

I didn't really mean it that way, sorry if thats how it was construed. (edited) I guess I get wound up in these discussions sometimes -- I guess I like pulling for the underdog? Shrug.

Still --- this is something I feel is worth discussing. Nvidia makes it really difficult sometimes to alter IQ -- for some games it will work but for others, you have to go through a lot of hoops. Fiddling with nvidia inspector/windows registry
is something I feel is a bit over the top. In my mind AMD definitely makes all of these settings more accessible, easier, and reliable to use.

 

[Madcatatlas]

This is the second time I've seen you say this, does it make you feel "cool" to attack posters on an internet forum? Knock it off and get over yourself...

You are doing the same think you are accusing him of doing. Instead you should report such posts.

*thing

 

[JAG87]

Oh come on. AMD takes a different approach and has a different type of AA - AMD has EQAA while nvidia uses TrAA.

DX11 titles are demanding enough that using SSAA or any type of high end AA is unrealistic, but it is a *nice* option to have for older titles.
In addition, Nvidia inspector is highly unreliable for reasons outlined earlier and is a hassle to use, I don't feel like scouring the internet for AA compatibility bits.

I thought a lot of this, because at one point I did have both sets of hardware on 2 PC's and was continually confused by why it was so difficult to make Dead Space 1/2 look nice on nvidia hardware. AMD will let you use SSAA with ease,
while with nvidia its a huge hassle. Not to mention SSAA via nvidia inspector turns both of those games into a slideshow for some reason.

EQAA is the equivalent of CSAA, it's an increased MSAA for less performance hit. It has nothing to do with transparency.

Seriously dude, Dead Space is ONE game. ONE game that doesn't have any AA options. Show me more games where it's sooooo hard to enable SGSSAA with NV hardware. All you need is the small SGSSAA tool provided by NV (not even third party), and the understanding that SGSSAA will be triggered the same way TrSSAA is, by the amount of MSAA you apply in game.

And again why is this relevant? Dead Space is ONE game, ONE game that needs FSSSAA as it's only form of AA because none other was implemented by the developer. On almost every other game you are way better off with MSAA+TrSSAA. Of course, you can't do that in DX10+ with AMD cards.

 

[Madcatatlas]

Im pretty happy thinking like this: I didnt like a game because of the fancy pancy graphics nessesarily, it can contribute ofcourse. No, i liked a game which is dx8,9,10 or 11, mostly because of the gameplay. And behold, because of that, it really doesnt matter that it could have looked a very tiny little bit better graphically.

noone here can with sincerity say they play a game only for the looks of it. Even crysis had good gameplay elements to go with the great graphics. it helped immersion. But if the gameplay sucked, it would be another..cryostasis.? which i have no idea how looks, im just naming it since some phyx lovers think it looks great..

 

[blackened23]

EQAA is the equivalent of CSAA, it's an increased MSAA for less performance hit. It has nothing to do with transparency.

Seriously dude, Dead Space is ONE game. ONE game that doesn't have any AA options. Show me more games where it's sooooo hard to enable SGSSAA with NV hardware. All you need is the small SGSSAA tool provided by NV (not even third party), and the understanding that SGSSAA will be triggered the same way TrSSAA is, by the amount of MSAA you apply in game.

And again why is this relevant? Dead Space is ONE game, ONE game that needs FSSSAA as it's only form of AA because none other was implemented by the developer. On almost every other game you are way better off with MSAA+TrSSAA. Of course, you can't do that in DX10+ with AMD cards.

It doesn't work with nvidia cards either. I'll try to find some exceptions, but generally every DX11 game made will not support override AA due to how they're coded. I know this is true for dragon age 2, crysis 2, Batman: AC, homefront, and metro 2033. You have to stick to their native modes instead.

The good news is that practically every DX11 that comes to my mind has a host of AA options built in.

Also, I think you overestimate the reliability of nvidia inspector. Those settings do not work a great deal of the time, and its not just dead space. Just because you can fiddle with it doesn't mean it actually works. I had a list of games at home that just didn't obey anything in nvidia inspector, i'll try to dig that up later.

 

[JAG87]

It doesn't work with nvidia cards either. I'll try to find some exceptions, but generally every DX11 game made will not support override AA due to how they're coded. I know this is true for dragon age 2, crysis 2, Batman: AC, homefront, and metro 2033. You have to stick to their native modes instead.

The good news is that practically every DX11 that comes to my mind has a host of AA options built in.

Also, I think you overestimate the reliability of nvidia inspector. Those settings do not work a great deal of the time, and its not just dead space. Just because you can fiddle with it doesn't mean it actually works. I had a list of games at home that just didn't obey anything in nvidia inspector, i'll try to dig that up later.

I honestly wouldn't know, I've never had to override anything with NV inspector. Out of all the games I played, I've had to maybe tweak 2 or so profiles just to turn off TrSSAA (because they ran too slow), which I keep turned on globally and can be turned off per-game in NVCP, you don't need NV inspector. One more I remember from the past is I used to force MSAA on the Half-Life profile (because it has no AA options), and that too can be done in NVCP without third party tools. Wait a second, isn't game profiles something AMD just now finally implemented?

Apart from that, I've never had any issues with MSAA+TrSSAA in every game I've played, including DX11 games like BC2 for example. I haven't had the chance of verifying if TrSSAA is triggered in BF3 because I can't even afford MSAA to begin with, so I guess I'll find out later when I have the hardware capable. NV hardware that is.

 

[SirPauly]

Im pretty happy thinking like this: I didnt like a game because of the fancy pancy graphics nessesarily, it can contribute ofcourse. No, i liked a game which is dx8,9,10 or 11, mostly because of the gameplay. And behold, because of that, it really doesnt matter that it could have looked a very tiny little bit better graphically.

noone here can with sincerity say they play a game only for the looks of it. Even crysis had good gameplay elements to go with the great graphics. it helped immersion. But if the gameplay sucked, it would be another..cryostasis.? which i have no idea how looks, im just naming it since some phyx lovers think it looks great..

Game-play is important but so are the abilities to add fancy, pancy enhancements and features.

 

[SirPauly]

Lets be clear here. You will never use SSAA in a DX11 game unless you have something like 2-3 new GPU's - the performance hit is ridiculously high due to how SSAA works. Even if nvidia supports SSAA, it is NOT in the driver for users to enable. It is also not realistic to use because SSAA will easily lower your performance by 60% or more. It is far more demanding than any other type of AA.

I think you misunderstand what i'm saying. This is not a proper means for an end user to enable SSAA. First of all, it is highly unreliable. I've tested this on various games with both sets of hardware (6970 xfire and GTX 580 SLI) and in the end AMD is far more reliable. Aside from that, this is not how an end user should have to enable SSAA - with nvidia the only way to enable it is with a combination of a huge list of AA compatibility bits (for applicable titles) and entering it in nvidia inspector. This is probably less than 1% of enthusiasts, nobody should have to go through this hassle. And even when you do, its still unreliable.

Secondly, SSAA should work for DX10+ with CCC version 12 that was just released. This I will double check on. Nvidia has their AA, and AMD has their own (EQAA). Quality wise, they are roughly equal but AMD is far more reliable in terms of successfully overriding AA.

I don't believe in blanket views. Sites like this, and many posters were vocal about it, hence why nVidia allows the feature and offering the tool.

http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,...tched-image-quality-in-modern-games/Practice/

Enjoy talking with Blaire from time-to-time, the passionate gamer that discovered it and shared his findings.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

It's odd what works and what doesn't... F1 2011 accepts SGSSAA.

SGSSAAx8 + MSAAx8 + FXAA vs MSAAx8 + FXAA

Daily Driver Clocks: i5 @ 5GHz 470s @ 800MHz'

Spoiler

MSAAx8 + FXAA

SGSSAAx8 + MSAAx8 + FXAA

The performance hit is pretty obvious D:

 

[blackened23]

Dude. Your avatar freaks me the heck out.