Terminator 4nnihilation. Spoiled.

[zinfamous]

Originally posted by: ShawnD1

Originally posted by: zinfamous
the first doubt would be when hot chick lays next to him for body warmth, and never mentions anything about him being cold.

You're thinking of Robocop. Robocop has cold skin. Terminator 1 and 2 repeatedly state that cyborgs like Arnold are living organisms with living tissue. One would expect a terminator to be warm, not cold.

What's with all this T3 hate? I remember laughing my ass off when I saw that in the theatre. The first clothing match Arnold sees is on a fat woman and the display reads "INAPPROPRIATE". He yells at a stripper to take off his clothes. He wears Elton John glasses and immediately realizes how silly he looks. T-X has expanding tits. When the psychiatrist sees Arnold in the cemetary, he freaks out and starts running away. After completely destroying their car to the point where the engine is smoking and there is no roof, Arnold says something like "we may need a new vehicle" with a serious tone. What's interesting about that movie is that choosing an attractive female villain really lightens the mood so we're more receptive to these kinds of jokes. If it was like T2 where the bad guy is hard core scary and there's intense music when he's on camera, the jokes wouldn't fit in at all. They took the movie in a strange direction but it's clear that they at least put some thought into how it was done.

yep.

but as for teh warmth part.

a simple layer of skin does not produce warmth, as an actual metabolism requires the heart and other organs. This is true of mammals and the few other endothermic critters.

The T-800, etc never had an actual metabolism and iirc, it has been shown that those models were certainly never "warm."

Either way, it has been explained that they lack that crucial capacity, so they share that requirement with reptiles (though I wouldn't think they actually need to produce their own body warmth in the sun.)

 

[NFS4]

I find it more interesting that "Night at the Museum: Battle of the Smithsonian" beat it in ticket sales over the weekend

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/...jjYlo&refer=technology

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: ScottyB
I don't want to sound like a dick, but here goes. Highly plot-driven is the bottom of the barrel as far as fiction is concerned. And your analysis of what current movies depict is even more alarming. The best films should be concerned with character development first and foremost. Plot comes second.

It's not that you sound like a dick. But it does sound like you have a slightly warped viewpoint of what plot actually is. Plot is the series of events and how they unfold. Just because 1 movie has a bad guy and another movie has a bad guy does not mean they have a similar "plot". I'm going to repeat again, how they unfold. Which is crucially important. This means I can have 2 movies about a shark, both having extremely good character development but 1 can still be much better than the other because of pacing and how the events are presented to the viewer. Jaws had this, in fact, jaws had a lot of things besides character development, especially given the time it was released at. You are blatantly ignoring a lot of aspects of the film to try and drive a point home.

 

[oddyager]

Stand-alone film it was passable entertainment (along the lines of Transformers absurdity but still cool to see shit blow up). Since McG made it a point to tell the fans this movie is going to be along the same vain as T1 and T2 it fails, miserably. Hey how come that controlling chip was placed in such an accessible spot on Marcus' head? It took him all of 3 seconds to totally rip that thing out like its some nicotine patch and regain control of himself.

 

[NikolaeVarius]

Originally posted by: zinfamous

Originally posted by: ShawnD1

Originally posted by: zinfamous
the first doubt would be when hot chick lays next to him for body warmth, and never mentions anything about him being cold.

You're thinking of Robocop. Robocop has cold skin. Terminator 1 and 2 repeatedly state that cyborgs like Arnold are living organisms with living tissue. One would expect a terminator to be warm, not cold.

What's with all this T3 hate? I remember laughing my ass off when I saw that in the theatre. The first clothing match Arnold sees is on a fat woman and the display reads "INAPPROPRIATE". He yells at a stripper to take off his clothes. He wears Elton John glasses and immediately realizes how silly he looks. T-X has expanding tits. When the psychiatrist sees Arnold in the cemetary, he freaks out and starts running away. After completely destroying their car to the point where the engine is smoking and there is no roof, Arnold says something like "we may need a new vehicle" with a serious tone. What's interesting about that movie is that choosing an attractive female villain really lightens the mood so we're more receptive to these kinds of jokes. If it was like T2 where the bad guy is hard core scary and there's intense music when he's on camera, the jokes wouldn't fit in at all. They took the movie in a strange direction but it's clear that they at least put some thought into how it was done.

yep.

but as for teh warmth part.

a simple layer of skin does not produce warmth, as an actual metabolism requires the heart and other organs. This is true of mammals and the few other endothermic critters.

The T-800, etc never had an actual metabolism and iirc, it has been shown that those models were certainly never "warm."

Either way, it has been explained that they lack that crucial capacity, so they share that requirement with reptiles (though I wouldn't think they actually need to produce their own body warmth in the sun.)

However, you would think a machine that advanced would generate an appreciable amount of heat.

Anyway, Marcus was half human, so he had a metabolism, which meant he was generating body heat.

 

[BrokenVisage]

Here's something I forgot to ask that kinda bothered me throughout the movie and don't think was ever answered... who was Marcus looking for in the first place?? The question is broached in several scenes but they never follow through with who he was actually looking for. Since the beginning he stated he needed to find somebody "up north" but the only person I can think of would be the cancer lady from the first scene... who you'd think would be dead by then (though I guess he wouldn't know that, he didn't even know it was the year 2018, but how does he know she was "north"). Was that just programming by the machines to lure him to the base to trap and capture John Connor there? Geez, spelling it out like that makes me realize how convoluted this movie really was. So many things being glossed over, and I didn't even mention how John gets the crap beat out of him, thrown into countless metal obstacles, yet is spry and fully-functional until he's impalled by that bar. BTW.. did he damage his heart? Damage a ventricle? How could he survive the.. ah forget it.

Oh yeah.. how the hell does he get into the submarine like that?? One second they show him jumping into a stormy ocean, the next he's drip-drying inside the sub... helllooooo??

 

[oddyager]

Originally posted by: BrokenVisage
Here's something I forgot to ask that kinda bothered me throughout the movie and don't think was ever answered... who was Marcus looking for in the first place?? The question is broached in several scenes but they never follow through with who he was actually looking for. Since the beginning he stated he needed to find somebody "up north" but the only person I can think of would be the cancer lady from the first scene... who you'd think would be dead by then (though I guess he wouldn't know that, he didn't even know it was the year 2018, but how does he know she was "north"). Was that just programming by the machines to lure him to the base to trap and capture John Connor there?

Pretty sure that was just part of the "programming". This also leads to the question why if they wanted to kill both Connor and Reese they couldn't have off-ed Reese then and there (neither Marcus nor John knew if he were still alive AT the camp) and then send every Terminator in base to kill John when he was trapped inside. Or simply just detonate the fuel cells (LOL they are still using this in the story) and take out everyone. It's not like there was only one Terminator producing factory on Earth.

Geez, spelling it out like that makes me realize how convoluted this movie really was. So many things being glossed over, and I didn't even mention how John gets the crap beat out of him, thrown into countless metal obstacles, yet is spry and fully-functional until he's impalled by that bar. BTW.. did he damage his heart? Damage a ventricle? How could he survive the.. ah forget it.

What I found hilarious was the fact the T-800 took out Marcus by clobbering the heart and it somehow misses Bale's heart completely.

 

[BrokenVisage]

Originally posted by: oddyager

Geez, spelling it out like that makes me realize how convoluted this movie really was. So many things being glossed over, and I didn't even mention how John gets the crap beat out of him, thrown into countless metal obstacles, yet is spry and fully-functional until he's impalled by that bar. BTW.. did he damage his heart? Damage a ventricle? How could he survive the.. ah forget it.

What I found hilarious was the fact the T-800 took out Marcus by clobbering the heart and it somehow misses Bale's heart completely.

I forgot all about that lol. And better yet.. so the T-800 locks in on Marcus's heart, gives him a "death blow" and it still doesn't kill him. Better yet, his heart remains intact to the point it can be transfered to John Conner down the line. It's a good thing I wasn't a devout TSCC fan, this movie coupled with the cancellation would've stopped MY heart!

 

[dainthomas]

Originally posted by: ScottyB

Originally posted by: zinfamous

Originally posted by: lokiju
OK, just saw it this morning and after reading how bad the reviews were, that it was directed by McG, threads like this, etc, etc, etc. I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed the movie.

WTF is everyone looking for? It's a movie about robots FFS! Do you want some deep movie that also has big explosions and amazing special effects?

T! & T2 set the bar high, and so people expect a good movie with robots and explosions.

This ISN'T supposed to be fucking Transformers. That is a movie about explosion adn robots (and it's terrible).

Terminator has always been clever, and highly plot-driven.

this generation of film-goers sucks ass, frankly. Plot drives film, action supports plot. Not the other way around.

Go suck on Michael Bay's tit if you prefer a shitty crash boom smash bang flick.

I don't want to sound like a dick, but here goes. Highly plot-driven is the bottom of the barrel as far as fiction is concerned. And your analysis of what current movies depict is even more alarming. The best films should be concerned with character development first and foremost. Plot comes second.

Think of some of the films (even blockbusters) that remain memorable even to this day. Take Jaws for example. How much action (plot devices) is really in the film? The shark is shown for what, a few minutes at most? The movie is memorable for character development such as the speech by Quinn about his time in the water after the Indianapolis disaster. ?Sometimes that shark he looks right into ya. Right into your eyes. And, you know, the thing about a shark... he's got lifeless eyes. Black eyes. Like a doll's eyes. When he comes at ya, doesn't seem to be living... until he bites ya, and those black eyes roll over white and then... ah then you hear that terrible high-pitched screamin'. The ocean turns red, and despite all the poundin' and the hollerin', they all come in and they... rip you to pieces.? Then there is Chief Brody and his fear of the water, and his interaction with the town council and the woman whose child has died. There is the tension between Quinn and Hooper with their champagne liberal and working class conservative bickering. The story is in the characters, the plot is coincidental.

Now think of a film that is plot driven--a Sci-Fi original for instance. Often they have a similar plot as Jaws. A town is overtaken by some monstrous creature and a group must band together to hunt it down. These films are not as memorable. It is not that they don't have interesting plots. Many do. It is that the characters are flat. They have no qualities that make them into something to remember. They aren't human. Fictional pieces should be like a history of a place that hasn't been. The characters should be "real" people.

We can see how Terminator Salvation fails in this regard. Think of the moment when Marcus and Blair bond. A deep relationship is supposed to have emerged in one night. It is highly unrealistic. He cuts her down, beats up a gang of miscreants, and suddenly she is supposed to trust him with the fate of humanity. This isn't real character development. It is a plot point that the characters must achieve to move the film along to a new event. There is no connection made with the characters. We can't "feel" what they are feeling and therefore there is nothing to relate to in the film. It is merely pictorial events shown on the screen. And, like a picture taken of some obscure artifact that is inconsequential to our existence, we have no reason to remember the film for any length of time as there is nothing to remember.

Wow, such a deep, insightful, intellectual analysis about character and relationship development in a movie about killer time-traveling robots.

You people crack me up. The fact is that it was an entertaining summer movie that will appeal to most people (apart from wannabe film school students). As such, it will make a ton of money from theater and DVD. And two more will also be made whether you like them or not.

Sorry, but next time go watch something with subtitles and people gazing for hours into eachother's eyes.

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: cirrrocco
why the fuck do terminators have displays in english.
1. the part where base defense is breached. why should all that shit have to be in english.?? Not realistic at all.
2. If I was skynet, I would have killed Kyle as soon as I saw him in the clearing area. I would have actually have blown the transporter up as soos as he was captured and processed.
3. Sync complete. WTF?? So basically Skynet has this clean room, just because Marcus eventually would come back. why the fuck does the room have to be clean and stuff. Eveyrthing else is a big fuckin WHat was the need for clean rooms? he is a fvcking robt, he is not gonna die of infection.
4. skynet is stupid.

I decided to assume that the facility was designed by humans pre-robot war and simply taken over/adapted by skynet.

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: ChaoZ
The best part of the movie was the Bruno trailer. Oh, and that asian chick being tied up and cleavage showing.

Heh, the Bruno trailer was awesome.

 

[KeithTalent]

Originally posted by: foghorn67
All franchises are dead. Stop thinking they are long lost family members resurrected just for you. It's time that we just accept they are just vehicles to entertain.
T4 was entertaining.
It was never intended for a bunch of wannabe film students to slobber over.
As much as I loved T2, I could never understand why myself or anybody else holds it on a pedestal.
Furlong was more annoying than even LeBouf could ever be. However, they magically made it work for young John Conner. It's funny that Furlong can squeal and look dumb through a whole movie, and nobody mentions it.
Yet, LeBouf (an ATOT perquisite is to hate him) was doing what was asked to do. Play a gregarious and awkward kid common amongst today's high school students, and yet everyone complains. And Arnold was never accepted as a great actor. Maybe at times, a great personality on screen.
The guy that played T1000 (or whatever the liquid metal thing was) didn't really have to do much. He was probably extremely good at the body language needed.
The only thing that made the T2 exceptional was a decent pace of action and CG/special effects that set a new bar for everyone to catch up to. (I think it could be the awesome photography and lighting as well.)

I think we are at an age where we can't decide whether we want movies just to be entertaining, or if we need mind blowing stuff of mythical proportions just to say it was worth 9 bucks.
It's almost as if we are getting too arrogant. We complain about a waste of 9 bucks and over two hours of wasted time. Just start renting movies and waiting a few months.
If you think about it, it's not the best decision to pay someone 9 bucks and sit on your ass for two hours while staring at a screen. I mean, can you really expect mountains to move while doing this?

I saw T2 for the first time recently and I mentioned in my review of it how annoying I found Furlong. It almost ruined the movie for me actually, but there was enough other stuff to offset and make it enjoyable. T1 was by far the best in the series as far as I'm concerned and a lot of that has to do with what ScottyB mentioned in his post.

Your definition of what makes a movie entertaining may not be the same as mine, because I did not find T4 all that entertaining and a big reason for that I think is due to the fact it felt it was trying to be an epic story, with a strong sense of morality (the ending really was heavy-handed), but it just failed miserably and ended up being a mindless action movie with a bunch of incoherent morality plays and under-developed relationships .

If you are going to be a mindless action flick, then be on, I have no problem with that and can really enjoy them, but don't try and sell love stories and morals to me, unless you are going to commit to that avenue and do it properly.

KT

 

[KeithTalent]

Originally posted by: Aikouka

Originally posted by: ChaoZ
The best part of the movie was the Bruno trailer. Oh, and that asian chick being tied up and cleavage showing.

Heh, the Bruno trailer was awesome.

We didn't get that one. We got The Hangover trailer and the entire theatre was dying of laughter. Definitely going to be seeing that.

KT

 

[imported_Imp]

Well, I had nothing to do, so paid to see this a second time today. Gotta say I enjoyed it more without a theatre filled with annoying teenagers/twenty-year-olds reacting to every little action (last time I watch something opening weekend).

It also felt more cohesive this time around. Overall, it's a fun, action movie. Come on, it doesn't go 5 minutes without someone yelling, or shit blowing up, take it for what it is and you'll be satisfied.

 

[purbeast0]

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: ScottyB

Originally posted by: zinfamous

Originally posted by: lokiju
OK, just saw it this morning and after reading how bad the reviews were, that it was directed by McG, threads like this, etc, etc, etc. I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed the movie.

WTF is everyone looking for? It's a movie about robots FFS! Do you want some deep movie that also has big explosions and amazing special effects?

T! & T2 set the bar high, and so people expect a good movie with robots and explosions.

This ISN'T supposed to be fucking Transformers. That is a movie about explosion adn robots (and it's terrible).

Terminator has always been clever, and highly plot-driven.

this generation of film-goers sucks ass, frankly. Plot drives film, action supports plot. Not the other way around.

Go suck on Michael Bay's tit if you prefer a shitty crash boom smash bang flick.

I don't want to sound like a dick, but here goes. Highly plot-driven is the bottom of the barrel as far as fiction is concerned. And your analysis of what current movies depict is even more alarming. The best films should be concerned with character development first and foremost. Plot comes second.

Think of some of the films (even blockbusters) that remain memorable even to this day. Take Jaws for example. How much action (plot devices) is really in the film? The shark is shown for what, a few minutes at most? The movie is memorable for character development such as the speech by Quinn about his time in the water after the Indianapolis disaster. ?Sometimes that shark he looks right into ya. Right into your eyes. And, you know, the thing about a shark... he's got lifeless eyes. Black eyes. Like a doll's eyes. When he comes at ya, doesn't seem to be living... until he bites ya, and those black eyes roll over white and then... ah then you hear that terrible high-pitched screamin'. The ocean turns red, and despite all the poundin' and the hollerin', they all come in and they... rip you to pieces.? Then there is Chief Brody and his fear of the water, and his interaction with the town council and the woman whose child has died. There is the tension between Quinn and Hooper with their champagne liberal and working class conservative bickering. The story is in the characters, the plot is coincidental.

Now think of a film that is plot driven--a Sci-Fi original for instance. Often they have a similar plot as Jaws. A town is overtaken by some monstrous creature and a group must band together to hunt it down. These films are not as memorable. It is not that they don't have interesting plots. Many do. It is that the characters are flat. They have no qualities that make them into something to remember. They aren't human. Fictional pieces should be like a history of a place that hasn't been. The characters should be "real" people.

We can see how Terminator Salvation fails in this regard. Think of the moment when Marcus and Blair bond. A deep relationship is supposed to have emerged in one night. It is highly unrealistic. He cuts her down, beats up a gang of miscreants, and suddenly she is supposed to trust him with the fate of humanity. This isn't real character development. It is a plot point that the characters must achieve to move the film along to a new event. There is no connection made with the characters. We can't "feel" what they are feeling and therefore there is nothing to relate to in the film. It is merely pictorial events shown on the screen. And, like a picture taken of some obscure artifact that is inconsequential to our existence, we have no reason to remember the film for any length of time as there is nothing to remember.

Wow, such a deep, insightful, intellectual analysis about character and relationship development in a movie about killer time-traveling robots.

You people crack me up. The fact is that it was an entertaining summer movie that will appeal to most people (apart from wannabe film school students). As such, it will make a ton of money from theater and DVD. And two more will also be made whether you like them or not.

Sorry, but next time go watch something with subtitles and people gazing for hours into eachother's eyes.

agreed 110%.

T4 was badass for what it is. People now a days are too damn picky with movies and expect everything to be worth awards when they watch something. Granted, movies are $10+ now a days for tickets alone, so maybe the expectations being higher are warranted.

But my wife and I go spend $30 for a night out at the movies to go and be entertained for 2 hours or so and don't expect to go watch a Braveheart or Saving Private Ryan everytime we step into a movie theatre.

I will be buying it on bluray when it comes out.

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: ScottyB

Originally posted by: zinfamous

Originally posted by: lokiju
OK, just saw it this morning and after reading how bad the reviews were, that it was directed by McG, threads like this, etc, etc, etc. I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed the movie.

WTF is everyone looking for? It's a movie about robots FFS! Do you want some deep movie that also has big explosions and amazing special effects?

T! & T2 set the bar high, and so people expect a good movie with robots and explosions.

This ISN'T supposed to be fucking Transformers. That is a movie about explosion adn robots (and it's terrible).

Terminator has always been clever, and highly plot-driven.

this generation of film-goers sucks ass, frankly. Plot drives film, action supports plot. Not the other way around.

Go suck on Michael Bay's tit if you prefer a shitty crash boom smash bang flick.

I don't want to sound like a dick, but here goes. Highly plot-driven is the bottom of the barrel as far as fiction is concerned. And your analysis of what current movies depict is even more alarming. The best films should be concerned with character development first and foremost. Plot comes second.

Think of some of the films (even blockbusters) that remain memorable even to this day. Take Jaws for example. How much action (plot devices) is really in the film? The shark is shown for what, a few minutes at most? The movie is memorable for character development such as the speech by Quinn about his time in the water after the Indianapolis disaster. ?Sometimes that shark he looks right into ya. Right into your eyes. And, you know, the thing about a shark... he's got lifeless eyes. Black eyes. Like a doll's eyes. When he comes at ya, doesn't seem to be living... until he bites ya, and those black eyes roll over white and then... ah then you hear that terrible high-pitched screamin'. The ocean turns red, and despite all the poundin' and the hollerin', they all come in and they... rip you to pieces.? Then there is Chief Brody and his fear of the water, and his interaction with the town council and the woman whose child has died. There is the tension between Quinn and Hooper with their champagne liberal and working class conservative bickering. The story is in the characters, the plot is coincidental.

Now think of a film that is plot driven--a Sci-Fi original for instance. Often they have a similar plot as Jaws. A town is overtaken by some monstrous creature and a group must band together to hunt it down. These films are not as memorable. It is not that they don't have interesting plots. Many do. It is that the characters are flat. They have no qualities that make them into something to remember. They aren't human. Fictional pieces should be like a history of a place that hasn't been. The characters should be "real" people.

We can see how Terminator Salvation fails in this regard. Think of the moment when Marcus and Blair bond. A deep relationship is supposed to have emerged in one night. It is highly unrealistic. He cuts her down, beats up a gang of miscreants, and suddenly she is supposed to trust him with the fate of humanity. This isn't real character development. It is a plot point that the characters must achieve to move the film along to a new event. There is no connection made with the characters. We can't "feel" what they are feeling and therefore there is nothing to relate to in the film. It is merely pictorial events shown on the screen. And, like a picture taken of some obscure artifact that is inconsequential to our existence, we have no reason to remember the film for any length of time as there is nothing to remember.

Wow, such a deep, insightful, intellectual analysis about character and relationship development in a movie about killer time-traveling robots.

You people crack me up. The fact is that it was an entertaining summer movie that will appeal to most people (apart from wannabe film school students). As such, it will make a ton of money from theater and DVD. And two more will also be made whether you like them or not.

Sorry, but next time go watch something with subtitles and people gazing for hours into eachother's eyes.

agreed 110%.

T4 was badass for what it is. People now a days are too damn picky with movies and expect everything to be worth awards when they watch something. Granted, movies are $10+ now a days for tickets alone, so maybe the expectations being higher are warranted.

But my wife and I go spend $30 for a night out at the movies to go and be entertained for 2 hours or so and don't expect to go watch a Braveheart or Saving Private Ryan everytime we step into a movie theatre.

I will be buying it on bluray when it comes out.

No I don't expect a movie to win awards, I expect a movie to be cohesive and not totally dismiss an entire trilogy before it and make out the machines like they are as dumb as dogs and have plot holes galore and not feel a need to explain any of it. You're at a machine factory and the number one and number two targets are there and only one machine comes to kill you, ONE!!!!!!!! This movie was disappointing in many ways.

 

[EGGO]

Originally posted by: mAdMaLuDaWg

Originally posted by: BrokenVisage
Just got back from a "double feature" and Angels & Demons put Terminator 4 to shame in terms of believability, watchability, and story. I mean.. what a cheesy cash grab, everything about it reeked. The stupid mute black girl, the base infiltration, the signal, the computer generated female architect.. I'm in total agreement with the OP here. I always thought people gave T3 a bad shake and enjoyed it almost as much as the first 2, but if there's any justice in the world "4nnihilarious" will eclipse T3 as the franchise killer.

Oh yeah, The Prestige and Batman (not TDK) continue to be the only movies I like Bale in.

Blasphemy! How could you leave out American Psycho!

And Equilibrium?

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: KeithTalent

Originally posted by: Aikouka

Originally posted by: ChaoZ
The best part of the movie was the Bruno trailer. Oh, and that asian chick being tied up and cleavage showing.

Heh, the Bruno trailer was awesome.

We didn't get that one. We got The Hangover trailer and the entire theatre was dying of laughter. Definitely going to be seeing that.

KT

Yea I got that one too. It looks funny as hell. I really wanted to see the Bruno trailer though.

 

[purbeast0]

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: ScottyB

Originally posted by: zinfamous

Originally posted by: lokiju
OK, just saw it this morning and after reading how bad the reviews were, that it was directed by McG, threads like this, etc, etc, etc. I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed the movie.

WTF is everyone looking for? It's a movie about robots FFS! Do you want some deep movie that also has big explosions and amazing special effects?

T! & T2 set the bar high, and so people expect a good movie with robots and explosions.

This ISN'T supposed to be fucking Transformers. That is a movie about explosion adn robots (and it's terrible).

Terminator has always been clever, and highly plot-driven.

this generation of film-goers sucks ass, frankly. Plot drives film, action supports plot. Not the other way around.

Go suck on Michael Bay's tit if you prefer a shitty crash boom smash bang flick.

I don't want to sound like a dick, but here goes. Highly plot-driven is the bottom of the barrel as far as fiction is concerned. And your analysis of what current movies depict is even more alarming. The best films should be concerned with character development first and foremost. Plot comes second.

Think of some of the films (even blockbusters) that remain memorable even to this day. Take Jaws for example. How much action (plot devices) is really in the film? The shark is shown for what, a few minutes at most? The movie is memorable for character development such as the speech by Quinn about his time in the water after the Indianapolis disaster. ?Sometimes that shark he looks right into ya. Right into your eyes. And, you know, the thing about a shark... he's got lifeless eyes. Black eyes. Like a doll's eyes. When he comes at ya, doesn't seem to be living... until he bites ya, and those black eyes roll over white and then... ah then you hear that terrible high-pitched screamin'. The ocean turns red, and despite all the poundin' and the hollerin', they all come in and they... rip you to pieces.? Then there is Chief Brody and his fear of the water, and his interaction with the town council and the woman whose child has died. There is the tension between Quinn and Hooper with their champagne liberal and working class conservative bickering. The story is in the characters, the plot is coincidental.

Now think of a film that is plot driven--a Sci-Fi original for instance. Often they have a similar plot as Jaws. A town is overtaken by some monstrous creature and a group must band together to hunt it down. These films are not as memorable. It is not that they don't have interesting plots. Many do. It is that the characters are flat. They have no qualities that make them into something to remember. They aren't human. Fictional pieces should be like a history of a place that hasn't been. The characters should be "real" people.

We can see how Terminator Salvation fails in this regard. Think of the moment when Marcus and Blair bond. A deep relationship is supposed to have emerged in one night. It is highly unrealistic. He cuts her down, beats up a gang of miscreants, and suddenly she is supposed to trust him with the fate of humanity. This isn't real character development. It is a plot point that the characters must achieve to move the film along to a new event. There is no connection made with the characters. We can't "feel" what they are feeling and therefore there is nothing to relate to in the film. It is merely pictorial events shown on the screen. And, like a picture taken of some obscure artifact that is inconsequential to our existence, we have no reason to remember the film for any length of time as there is nothing to remember.

Wow, such a deep, insightful, intellectual analysis about character and relationship development in a movie about killer time-traveling robots.

You people crack me up. The fact is that it was an entertaining summer movie that will appeal to most people (apart from wannabe film school students). As such, it will make a ton of money from theater and DVD. And two more will also be made whether you like them or not.

Sorry, but next time go watch something with subtitles and people gazing for hours into eachother's eyes.

agreed 110%.

T4 was badass for what it is. People now a days are too damn picky with movies and expect everything to be worth awards when they watch something. Granted, movies are $10+ now a days for tickets alone, so maybe the expectations being higher are warranted.

But my wife and I go spend $30 for a night out at the movies to go and be entertained for 2 hours or so and don't expect to go watch a Braveheart or Saving Private Ryan everytime we step into a movie theatre.

I will be buying it on bluray when it comes out.

No I don't expect a movie to win awards, I expect a movie to be cohesive and not totally dismiss an entire trilogy before it and make out the machines like they are as dumb as dogs and have plot holes galore and not feel a need to explain any of it. You're at a machine factory and the number one and number two targets are there and only one machine comes to kill you, ONE!!!!!!!! This movie was disappointing in many ways.

you can say the same fucking tihng about the whole damn trilogy.

why did they only send 1 terminator back in T1 and T2 to kill Sarah and John Conner? Why not send a whole army? Why didn't either terminator know where to find their targets since they are so super duper smart and since they were in the past, there should have been records of where they lived?

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: ScottyB

Originally posted by: zinfamous

Originally posted by: lokiju
OK, just saw it this morning and after reading how bad the reviews were, that it was directed by McG, threads like this, etc, etc, etc. I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed the movie.

WTF is everyone looking for? It's a movie about robots FFS! Do you want some deep movie that also has big explosions and amazing special effects?

T! & T2 set the bar high, and so people expect a good movie with robots and explosions.

This ISN'T supposed to be fucking Transformers. That is a movie about explosion adn robots (and it's terrible).

Terminator has always been clever, and highly plot-driven.

this generation of film-goers sucks ass, frankly. Plot drives film, action supports plot. Not the other way around.

Go suck on Michael Bay's tit if you prefer a shitty crash boom smash bang flick.

I don't want to sound like a dick, but here goes. Highly plot-driven is the bottom of the barrel as far as fiction is concerned. And your analysis of what current movies depict is even more alarming. The best films should be concerned with character development first and foremost. Plot comes second.

Think of some of the films (even blockbusters) that remain memorable even to this day. Take Jaws for example. How much action (plot devices) is really in the film? The shark is shown for what, a few minutes at most? The movie is memorable for character development such as the speech by Quinn about his time in the water after the Indianapolis disaster. ?Sometimes that shark he looks right into ya. Right into your eyes. And, you know, the thing about a shark... he's got lifeless eyes. Black eyes. Like a doll's eyes. When he comes at ya, doesn't seem to be living... until he bites ya, and those black eyes roll over white and then... ah then you hear that terrible high-pitched screamin'. The ocean turns red, and despite all the poundin' and the hollerin', they all come in and they... rip you to pieces.? Then there is Chief Brody and his fear of the water, and his interaction with the town council and the woman whose child has died. There is the tension between Quinn and Hooper with their champagne liberal and working class conservative bickering. The story is in the characters, the plot is coincidental.

Now think of a film that is plot driven--a Sci-Fi original for instance. Often they have a similar plot as Jaws. A town is overtaken by some monstrous creature and a group must band together to hunt it down. These films are not as memorable. It is not that they don't have interesting plots. Many do. It is that the characters are flat. They have no qualities that make them into something to remember. They aren't human. Fictional pieces should be like a history of a place that hasn't been. The characters should be "real" people.

We can see how Terminator Salvation fails in this regard. Think of the moment when Marcus and Blair bond. A deep relationship is supposed to have emerged in one night. It is highly unrealistic. He cuts her down, beats up a gang of miscreants, and suddenly she is supposed to trust him with the fate of humanity. This isn't real character development. It is a plot point that the characters must achieve to move the film along to a new event. There is no connection made with the characters. We can't "feel" what they are feeling and therefore there is nothing to relate to in the film. It is merely pictorial events shown on the screen. And, like a picture taken of some obscure artifact that is inconsequential to our existence, we have no reason to remember the film for any length of time as there is nothing to remember.

Wow, such a deep, insightful, intellectual analysis about character and relationship development in a movie about killer time-traveling robots.

You people crack me up. The fact is that it was an entertaining summer movie that will appeal to most people (apart from wannabe film school students). As such, it will make a ton of money from theater and DVD. And two more will also be made whether you like them or not.

Sorry, but next time go watch something with subtitles and people gazing for hours into eachother's eyes.

agreed 110%.

T4 was badass for what it is. People now a days are too damn picky with movies and expect everything to be worth awards when they watch something. Granted, movies are $10+ now a days for tickets alone, so maybe the expectations being higher are warranted.

But my wife and I go spend $30 for a night out at the movies to go and be entertained for 2 hours or so and don't expect to go watch a Braveheart or Saving Private Ryan everytime we step into a movie theatre.

I will be buying it on bluray when it comes out.

No I don't expect a movie to win awards, I expect a movie to be cohesive and not totally dismiss an entire trilogy before it and make out the machines like they are as dumb as dogs and have plot holes galore and not feel a need to explain any of it. You're at a machine factory and the number one and number two targets are there and only one machine comes to kill you, ONE!!!!!!!! This movie was disappointing in many ways.

you can say the same fucking tihng about the whole damn trilogy.

why did they only send 1 terminator back in T1 and T2 to kill Sarah and John Conner? Why not send a whole army? Why didn't either terminator know where to find their targets since they are so super duper smart and since they were in the past, there should have been records of where they lived?

In the beginning they say the machines didn't have full records of Sarah Conner. They obviously got the area of where she lived and the terminator read the phone book of the city where she was at and got all the Sarah Conners. They also talk about how they blew the time machine after Reese went through so the machines couldn't send any more back and since it was a new technology they couldn't send more than one at a time. It doesn't go into much more detail than that though so yea.

And remember after they sent back the initial machine, all of history would have obviously been changed so where John Conner lived at in the past, it could have been changed. You learn that because the machines sent back one that Skynet gets the technology and has the arm of the first machine probably changing the history of how it happened. Yet again they don't talk about this in super much detail but it would be the most plausible explanation.

 

[imported_Imp]

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: KeithTalent

Originally posted by: Aikouka

Originally posted by: ChaoZ
The best part of the movie was the Bruno trailer. Oh, and that asian chick being tied up and cleavage showing.

Heh, the Bruno trailer was awesome.

We didn't get that one. We got The Hangover trailer and the entire theatre was dying of laughter. Definitely going to be seeing that.

KT

Yea I got that one too. It looks funny as hell. I really wanted to see the Bruno trailer though.

The first time I saw it, I got the Bruno trailer. Looks kinda fun to watch, but I'm not sure if I want to sit in a theatre with people freaking out/ROFLin'.

 

[dainthomas]

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: ScottyB

Originally posted by: zinfamous

Originally posted by: lokiju
OK, just saw it this morning and after reading how bad the reviews were, that it was directed by McG, threads like this, etc, etc, etc. I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed the movie.

WTF is everyone looking for? It's a movie about robots FFS! Do you want some deep movie that also has big explosions and amazing special effects?

T! & T2 set the bar high, and so people expect a good movie with robots and explosions.

This ISN'T supposed to be fucking Transformers. That is a movie about explosion adn robots (and it's terrible).

Terminator has always been clever, and highly plot-driven.

this generation of film-goers sucks ass, frankly. Plot drives film, action supports plot. Not the other way around.

Go suck on Michael Bay's tit if you prefer a shitty crash boom smash bang flick.

I don't want to sound like a dick, but here goes. Highly plot-driven is the bottom of the barrel as far as fiction is concerned. And your analysis of what current movies depict is even more alarming. The best films should be concerned with character development first and foremost. Plot comes second.

Think of some of the films (even blockbusters) that remain memorable even to this day. Take Jaws for example. How much action (plot devices) is really in the film? The shark is shown for what, a few minutes at most? The movie is memorable for character development such as the speech by Quinn about his time in the water after the Indianapolis disaster. ?Sometimes that shark he looks right into ya. Right into your eyes. And, you know, the thing about a shark... he's got lifeless eyes. Black eyes. Like a doll's eyes. When he comes at ya, doesn't seem to be living... until he bites ya, and those black eyes roll over white and then... ah then you hear that terrible high-pitched screamin'. The ocean turns red, and despite all the poundin' and the hollerin', they all come in and they... rip you to pieces.? Then there is Chief Brody and his fear of the water, and his interaction with the town council and the woman whose child has died. There is the tension between Quinn and Hooper with their champagne liberal and working class conservative bickering. The story is in the characters, the plot is coincidental.

Now think of a film that is plot driven--a Sci-Fi original for instance. Often they have a similar plot as Jaws. A town is overtaken by some monstrous creature and a group must band together to hunt it down. These films are not as memorable. It is not that they don't have interesting plots. Many do. It is that the characters are flat. They have no qualities that make them into something to remember. They aren't human. Fictional pieces should be like a history of a place that hasn't been. The characters should be "real" people.

We can see how Terminator Salvation fails in this regard. Think of the moment when Marcus and Blair bond. A deep relationship is supposed to have emerged in one night. It is highly unrealistic. He cuts her down, beats up a gang of miscreants, and suddenly she is supposed to trust him with the fate of humanity. This isn't real character development. It is a plot point that the characters must achieve to move the film along to a new event. There is no connection made with the characters. We can't "feel" what they are feeling and therefore there is nothing to relate to in the film. It is merely pictorial events shown on the screen. And, like a picture taken of some obscure artifact that is inconsequential to our existence, we have no reason to remember the film for any length of time as there is nothing to remember.

Wow, such a deep, insightful, intellectual analysis about character and relationship development in a movie about killer time-traveling robots.

You people crack me up. The fact is that it was an entertaining summer movie that will appeal to most people (apart from wannabe film school students). As such, it will make a ton of money from theater and DVD. And two more will also be made whether you like them or not.

Sorry, but next time go watch something with subtitles and people gazing for hours into eachother's eyes.

agreed 110%.

T4 was badass for what it is. People now a days are too damn picky with movies and expect everything to be worth awards when they watch something. Granted, movies are $10+ now a days for tickets alone, so maybe the expectations being higher are warranted.

But my wife and I go spend $30 for a night out at the movies to go and be entertained for 2 hours or so and don't expect to go watch a Braveheart or Saving Private Ryan everytime we step into a movie theatre.

I will be buying it on bluray when it comes out.

No I don't expect a movie to win awards, I expect a movie to be cohesive and not totally dismiss an entire trilogy before it and make out the machines like they are as dumb as dogs and have plot holes galore and not feel a need to explain any of it. You're at a machine factory and the number one and number two targets are there and only one machine comes to kill you, ONE!!!!!!!! This movie was disappointing in many ways.

OK, then then in T2 why did Skynet only send one T1000. Why not 50? It's not like there are tons of steel mills around (which appear to be it's only vulnerability). Why only one T-X in T3? Why not send ten T-X's to kill his lieutenants and another ten T1000s for Connor?

How about the fact that if this was a "real life" self-aware time traveling army of robots hunting down some guy and his mom then they'd be dead two seconds into the first movie.

:roll:

 

[imported_Imp]

Surprising niblet in the paper today. Terminator beat out 'Night at the Museum' in Canada in terms of box office performance ($1.2 million versus $600k-ish). Can't find an online source right now.

 

[IHateMyJob2004]

Just saw it.

All I have to say is that it is good enough for a rental. Don't waste your money at the theaters. The 34% at Rotten Tomatoes is just about right.

T1: well done classic
T2: Just WOW!
T3: Good, dumb action movie.
T4: Pretty stupid action movie. Pretty poorly done.

Conclusion. I do hope to se a T5 and T6, but I doubt it will ever happen.

 

[fire400]

1-3 were good

but 4 looks stupid