Terri Schiavo

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ
I think the much of the push to keep her alive is based on emotional rather than logical thinking. The people who want to keep her alive use flawed arguments like they saw her smile, or that she might wake up. But if you get an expert's opinion on things, they'll tell you that the body is just randomly doing things and there's not much thought process behind them. It seems that the pro-life people are chasing a dream, basically. One that doesn't exist, but one that they want to exist. They hold an illogical hope that one day she's just going to wake up and be fine. Usually this belief is held by relgious people, who don't trust science and think anything can happen.

Let's look at reality here. You have a body being kept alive by machines. That's it. The person would really be dead, but you're artificially keeping them alive. At what point do you call it quits? Technically, with our science, we can keep someone alive:

1. If their brain is dead
2. If their heart isn't pumping
3. If their liver/kidneys/organs aren't working

I guess technically you could call them "alive", but you're really just keeping cells in their body functioning. The person that you remembered is gone forever, and it's time to let go. The people that want these bodies kept alive are just irrational people whose emotions are blinding out their sense of reason. They want them to come back so bad that they've fooled themselves into thinking that maybe they will if you keep them alive long enough. But they won't. It's time to let go.

I respectfully disagree. Here in Cali we have a state system that I am employed in. We work with people with mental disabilities, behavior dsabilities, every single disability you can think of. We also work with people that are severely disabled and medically fragile, they are dependant upon machines to keep them alive. These machines are used to assist the involuntary systems of our bodies going while our voluntary systems can continue to function, thats the most basic way I can describe it. So in essence, the lady in florida, although she may be dependant upon machines to keep her alive, exhibits tons of activity that shows that she is still using some percentage of her voluntary systems. If she was in california, this wouldnt even be an issue, she is functioning.

I have seen first hand people that are more "brain dead" than her...granted this is only based upon what is portrayed in videos from this womans family.


my .02

 

[xospec1alk]

granted this is only based upon what is portrayed in videos from this womans family

i think thats the root of the problem. the family so desperately wants to keep her alive they'll show any piece of propaganda to keep her alive (for whatever reason)...

 

[glenn beck]

bottom line the husband has put no money into her physical therapy from the settlement money.


The main thing she can't really do is feed herself----Mary-Kate Olson can't feed herself either, yet she's allowed to live.

 

Originally posted by: oldman420
hey atoters
I have been listening to the news regarding Terri Schiavo and I am very disturbed by what I hear.

I would be what some would refer too as left wing liberal very right to life and right to die supportive.

but what gets me here is they are going to starve this woman to death, that is cruel and unusual IMO.

if it was a few mins of pain to die I could accept it but days of starvation really gets me right in the gut.

who has the right to starve a person that you put in that position in the first place.



mm mm

I really don't care what decision is made, as this doesn't concern me and shouldn't be my decision. However, I do care about who makes the final decision. Whatever decision is made, I think that the person(s) that makes the final decision should be someone who has her best interest in mind. I do not believe that her so-called husband is any longer able to make decisions that are for her best interest. Her so-called husband has a conflict of interest here. If he didn't, I wouldn't care about his decision.... If her parents wanted the feeding tube removed, I wouldn't care either--so long as they had her best interest in mind, which I believe they are capable of.

P.S. I'm surprised the media didn't champion the case of a woman who came out of a coma 20 years later (2005). She was able to recognize her dad and do a little chat. The story came out the very week Schavio's case was the hot discussion in February, but no one seemed to give consideration to the recovering woman's story.

 

[xospec1alk]

^^ why do you think the husband has a conflict of interest? why do you distrust the husband?

edit: is coma and PVS the same thing?

 

[franksta]

Pull the plug, use the money to pave the roads in FL, they need it.

 

[Fausto]

Originally posted by: DearQT

Originally posted by: oldman420
hey atoters
I have been listening to the news regarding Terri Schiavo and I am very disturbed by what I hear.

I would be what some would refer too as left wing liberal very right to life and right to die supportive.

but what gets me here is they are going to starve this woman to death, that is cruel and unusual IMO.

if it was a few mins of pain to die I could accept it but days of starvation really gets me right in the gut.

who has the right to starve a person that you put in that position in the first place.



mm mm

I really don't care what decision is made, as this doesn't concern me and shouldn't be my decision. However, I do care about who makes the final decision. Whatever decision is made, I think that the person(s) that makes the final decision should be someone who has her best interest in mind. I do not believe that her so-called husband is any longer able to make decisions that are for her best interest. Her so-called husband has a conflict of interest here. If he didn't, I wouldn't care about his decision.... If her parents wanted the feeding tube removed, I wouldn't care either--so long as they had her best interest in mind, which I believe they are capable of.

P.S. I'm surprised the media didn't champion the case of a woman who came out of a coma 20 years later (2005). She was able to recognize her dad and do a little chat. The story came out the very week Schavio's case was the hot discussion in February, but no one seemed to give consideration to the recovering woman's story.

LAWYER LUVLY HAS SPOKEN. ALL SHALL HEED HER WORDS.

 

[nakedfrog]

Originally posted by: glenn beck
first read this http://www.terrisfight.org/

What dates were those videos made?

 

[Bumrush99]

Regardless of the case, I hate the fact that Republican controlled legislative powers are trying to circumvent and ignore judicial rulings by creating laws that are designed to breach the very system of government that the constitution mandates. The FL Supreme Court judges against the parents and the legislative body tries to pass laws within days, all with the blessing of Jeb Bush. The Supreme Court of the US refuses to block the removal of the tube and Congressional leaders in the House and Senate decide it is time to pass new laws that will prevent the court order from taking effect. These types of strong armed legislation go against our rule of law and should be seen for what they are- An attempt to appease fringe members of the party which only reinforce their support.

 

[xospec1alk]

^^ yeh i hate that also. and now that dude is calling terry to testify in a ploy to keep her alive...what bs.

 

[nakedfrog]

Originally posted by: Bumrush99
Regardless of the case, I hate the fact that Republican controlled legislative powers are trying to circumvent and ignore judicial rulings by creating laws that are designed to breach the very system of government that the constitution mandates. The FL Supreme Court judges against the parents and the legislative body tries to pass laws within days, all with the blessing of Jeb Bush. The Supreme Court of the US refuses to block the removal of the tube and Congressional leaders in the House and Senate decide it is time to pass new laws that will prevent the court order from taking effect. These types of strong armed legislation go against our rule of law and should be seen for what they are- An attempt to appease fringe members of the party which only reinforce their support.

All those attempts do certainly seem like an end run around the system of checks and balances.

 

[Nitemare]

1) Isn't she brain dead?
2) Hasn't she been brain dead for quiet awhile
3) Aren't I as a tax payer paying for her hospitalization

That is all

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: glenn beck
bottom line the husband has put no money into her physical therapy from the settlement money.

The main thing she can't really do is feed herself----Mary-Kate Olson can't feed herself either, yet she's allowed to live.

And what do you think physical therapy is going to do for her? She has severe brain damage.

That Olson argument is pretty weak. She can feed herself.

 

[JDub02]

The way I see it, the "husband" has no standing. He's moved on .. married again, has a few kids. Let the parents keep her as long as they want. Once they pass, and there's no one pushing to keep her alive, then they can pull the tube.

 

[Fausto]

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: Bumrush99
Regardless of the case, I hate the fact that Republican controlled legislative powers are trying to circumvent and ignore judicial rulings by creating laws that are designed to breach the very system of government that the constitution mandates. The FL Supreme Court judges against the parents and the legislative body tries to pass laws within days, all with the blessing of Jeb Bush. The Supreme Court of the US refuses to block the removal of the tube and Congressional leaders in the House and Senate decide it is time to pass new laws that will prevent the court order from taking effect. These types of strong armed legislation go against our rule of law and should be seen for what they are- An attempt to appease fringe members of the party which only reinforce their support.

All those attempts do certainly seem like an end run around the system of checks and balances.

Republicans: Keeping government small unless you are gay, unborn, or dying. :thumbsup:

 

[xeno2060]

I think it's Murder. Pure and simple!

 

[dmcowen674]

The President considers her to be a disabled person:

THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Press Secretary - For Immediate Release March 17, 2005

STATEMENT BY THE PRESIDENT
The case of Terri Schiavo raises complex issues. Yet in instances like this one, where there are serious questions and substantial doubts, our society, our laws, and our courts should have a presumption in favor of life. Those who live at the mercy of others deserve our special care and concern. It should be our goal as a nation to build a culture of life, where all Americans are valued, welcomed, and protected and that culture of life must extend to individuals with disabilities.

 

[0roo0roo]

ugh, you know many people can be kept alive brain dead. imagine if we did that to every case we could. we'd have hospitals full of em.

maybe in the future we'll be able to keep separate limbs alive on artificial support. keep hospitals full of racks of bits and pieces of people we manage to salvage. its life.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
ugh, you know many people can be kept alive brain dead. imagine if we did that to every case we could. we'd have hospitals full of em.

maybe in the future we'll be able to keep separate limbs alive on artificial support. keep hospitals full of racks of bits and pieces of people we manage to salvage. its life.

Reminds me of movie "Mars Attacks" with Sarah Jessica Parker and Pierce Brosnan.

 

[Bumrush99]

Originally posted by: Fausto

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: Bumrush99
Regardless of the case, I hate the fact that Republican controlled legislative powers are trying to circumvent and ignore judicial rulings by creating laws that are designed to breach the very system of government that the constitution mandates. The FL Supreme Court judges against the parents and the legislative body tries to pass laws within days, all with the blessing of Jeb Bush. The Supreme Court of the US refuses to block the removal of the tube and Congressional leaders in the House and Senate decide it is time to pass new laws that will prevent the court order from taking effect. These types of strong armed legislation go against our rule of law and should be seen for what they are- An attempt to appease fringe members of the party which only reinforce their support.

All those attempts do certainly seem like an end run around the system of checks and balances.

Republicans: Keeping government small unless you are gay, unborn, or dying. :thumbsup:

Yup, the party of compassion that criticized the Supreme Court for ruling that mentally retarded people can't be executed and criticized the Supreme Court for ruling that minors can not be executed.
But a woman in a vegitative state who is brain dead deserves legislation, but background checks at guns shows to prevent terrorists from purchasing guns infringes our rights.

 

[Fausto]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
The President considers her to be a disabled person:

THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Press Secretary - For Immediate Release March 17, 2005

STATEMENT BY THE PRESIDENT
The case of Terri Schiavo raises complex issues. Yet in instances like this one, where there are serious questions and substantial doubts, our society, our laws, and our courts should have a presumption in favor of life. Those who live at the mercy of others deserve our special care and concern. It should be our goal as a nation to build a culture of life, where all Americans are valued, welcomed, and protected and that culture of life must extend to individuals with disabilities.

I'm sure this strikes close to home since there are so many mentally disabled persons in the White House these days.

 

[Jfrag Teh Foul]

Nazi's thought it was fun to kill people in cruel ways too. As a matter of fact, they were fond of starving people that were a drain on their society.

 

[classy]

They are feeding her "body", but Terri is dead and gone. Its a shame, but can you imagine how her husband feels to see his wife live like that? They say he's moved on, its a shame the rest of the family can't. And you know this guy still loves her. He turned down 1 million dollars to keep her on the tube. My niece bless her little heart just passed away at the age of 6 a few months ago. She had cerebal palsy real bad and she was fed through a tube so I know a lil how they feel. But she wasn't brain dead. Maybe I would feel different if I was directly connected to the situation, but I doubt it. One of the hardest things to do is to let go.

 

[Chadder007]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: oldman420

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: KK
I agree that it's hopeless to keep her alive. And also if they are going to pull the feeding tube, they need to use a lethal injection.

This country is still too morally weak to use euthanasia, so instead it will take a passive approach to letting her die, instead of an active one to kill her, the result of both being the same thing, but in one case people can pretend their hands are clean of it.

I agree but she seems to me to not be suffering, why not just let her die to start with.
we as a society are confused.

Yeah in this case if she's as brain dead as they claim, it doesn't matter if she starves to death, suffocates, is eaten by rats, etc. In any case it is illegal to kill somebody, so their only option is to take out the tube and let her die.

But it is just the one doctor that has only visited her like twice that has declared her brain dead. There are other doctors that say that she isn't. Even when watching the videos of her you can tell she isn't.....she moves around and makes noises. Someone has to be one sick SOB to let her die from hunger and stop anyone from trying rehabilitation for her.

 

[aphex]

Originally posted by: Chadder007

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: oldman420

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: KK
I agree that it's hopeless to keep her alive. And also if they are going to pull the feeding tube, they need to use a lethal injection.

This country is still too morally weak to use euthanasia, so instead it will take a passive approach to letting her die, instead of an active one to kill her, the result of both being the same thing, but in one case people can pretend their hands are clean of it.

I agree but she seems to me to not be suffering, why not just let her die to start with.
we as a society are confused.

Yeah in this case if she's as brain dead as they claim, it doesn't matter if she starves to death, suffocates, is eaten by rats, etc. In any case it is illegal to kill somebody, so their only option is to take out the tube and let her die.

But it is just the one doctor that has only visited her like twice that has declared her brain dead. There are other doctors that say that she isn't. Even when watching the videos of her you can tell she isn't.....she moves around and makes noises. Someone has to be one sick SOB to let her die from hunger and stop anyone from trying rehabilitation for her.

Well being a local news story here, its pretty much on the news every night for quite awhile now. From what i've heard, its not just one doctor who saw her in person, but from many other doctors who have studied the brain scans, etc... Most of them believe that her motions are involuntary and that there is no rehabilitation that would rescue her from her vegatative state, she is just too far gone.

Personally, i think its time people let her go to a better place.