Thank God Almighty!!!The ORIGINAL nVidia BRAND NEW 43.45DETs are here!!!

[ultimatebob]

I would be happy if ATI released some stinking Radeon 8500 drivers what worked correctly with Windows 98 and Direct X 9! Right now, anything that's 3D accelerated looks like crap.

 

[nemesismk2]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

2. The set is not even WHQL candidate...Seems that even nvidia is tired of Microsoft...

From what I hear nVidia cannot get WHQL certification because their drivers do not meet the minimum level of colour precision required for DirectX 9.

BFG10K where's the link to backup your claim because I havn't heard anything like that?

 

[nemesismk2]

After doing some testing this morning my scores have remained virtually the same as the 40.72 drivers I was using previously. However I have noticed an increase of between 12fps and 19fps in my scores with anisotropic filtering enabled, I have so far only tested with opengl based games.

 

[NYHoustonman]

I have noticed an increase of between 12fps and 19fps in my scores with anisotropic filtering enabled

That is DAMN promising for me. Hopefully I see the same in Direct3D games, as I have been waiting for a chance to justify my purchase of a ti4400 over a 9500 pro, although I DID manage to get it for 149 bucks, afterwards when the new 9500pro benchmarks were released it kind of "burst my bubble" so to speak. What video card do you have?

I can always hope ...

 

[mboy]

I havent tested all that much for performance games, but on both my G4 ti4200s at home (gainward and abit siluro otes), they look noticeably better in 2d.
Even desktop looks a bunch better.
just instaled them on my geforce2 integrated on my nforce1 based chipset at work and the 2d is better for sure.

I will have to instal it on my wife's g2 gts pro tonite as well.

I will also play a little unreal II tonite and see how they look/perform! I only played a little black hawk down last nie and since those graphics blow anyway, I didnt notice a big performance jump at all.

 

[Bopple]

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

BFG10K where's the link to backup your claim because I havn't heard anything like that?

If you browse through forums like nvnews, beyond3d and so on, you'd find bunch of them.

And here's a quick reference.
This link is of screen shot comparison between Det drivers for 3DMark03 Game Test 4, 'Mother Nature' from a hardware site named Darkcrow.
Screen Shot Comparison Link

You see the difference of the sky? Among 3 of them, only 43.03 does correct. And that's the much slower one.

 

[Hikari]

I noticed a few people mention 2D...

I still think the 2D is a bit subpar, at least at 1600x1200@100hz where I run it (22" iiyama). I can't tell any improvements with the latest detonators. I have a Chaintech G60? (gf4 ti4600 card) that I am using...actually a replacement unit, both looked a tad blurry at this res. It's not the monitor since I tried it on a matrox and it looked fine.

Anyway, it certainly didn't break anything.

 

[ErikaeanLogic]

ATI pwns you, NVidia fanboiz! (how? 2D, image quality, FPS, AA, AF)



edit: this comment is only directed at those in this thread who are trashing ATI with senseless biased commentary, instead of keeping it positively-slanted toward their NVidia product of choice.

 

[dbal]

Originally posted by: BFG10K
Well I'd probably say that nVidia still have the edge in driver quality but they've slipped quite far in the last 12 months, especially in light of the recent image quality fiasco. In contrast ATi have really rocketed skyward and I'd say they're almost as good as nVidia now.

I also enjoy the regular monthly releases of official WHQL certified drivers from ATi and I much prefer this to the leaked beta driver strategy from nVidia.

What else can I add? I just fully agree with BFG's statement...Even though I happen to own an NVIDIA card, I am always willing to see the truth...

 

[Mem]

Quote

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

BFG10K where's the link to backup your claim because I havn't heard anything like that?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you browse through forums like nvnews, beyond3d and so on, you'd find bunch of them.

And here's a quick reference.
This link is of screen shot comparison between Det drivers for 3DMark03 Game Test 4, 'Mother Nature' from a hardware site named Darkcrow.
Screen Shot Comparison Link

You see the difference of the sky? Among 3 of them, only 43.03 does correct. And that's the much slower one.

I read this over at NVMAX,

NVIDIA will release a WHQL-certified driver complete with new control panel enhancements in early April. It is expected that 3DMark 2003 optimisations will be included in any WHQL version.

Link

 

[Bopple]

Originally posted by: Mem

NVIDIA will release a WHQL-certified driver complete with new control panel enhancements in early April. It is expected that 3DMark 2003 optimisations will be included in any WHQL version.

Yeah, i read that already. A bit of good news for it seems they aren't giving up on FP32.
But i'm tired of their endless bs like "this should do something in the future...that would do something soon...blahblahblah."
That comment sounds like the new whgl driver will have the option(perhaps automatical) to turn on/off the FP32 mode.
Bah...DX9 support? Partially compatible they define it. Like they've done with 8 "zixel"

PS) A funny story here.
It's the small useage of PS 2.0 that is the one of the main reason nvidia bashed 3DMark03.
But funny part is, their product not doing PS 2.0 right. How gracious they are.

 

[Shamrock]

Originally posted by: Mem
Quote

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

BFG10K where's the link to backup your claim because I havn't heard anything like that?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you browse through forums like nvnews, beyond3d and so on, you'd find bunch of them.

And here's a quick reference.
This link is of screen shot comparison between Det drivers for 3DMark03 Game Test 4, 'Mother Nature' from a hardware site named Darkcrow.
Screen Shot Comparison Link

You see the difference of the sky? Among 3 of them, only 43.03 does correct. And that's the much slower one.

I read this over at NVMAX,

NVIDIA will release a WHQL-certified driver complete with new control panel enhancements in early April. It is expected that 3DMark 2003 optimisations will be included in any WHQL version.

Link

HAHAHAHA, looks like NVidia is gonna expose 3dMark's "flaw" and gonna release "3DMark 2003 optimisations"

That'll teach ya to trust a synthetic benchmark

Use REAL games for benchmarking....

 

[Uclagamer_99]

umm what do those 3 screenshots prove? the sky is barely visible...are you telling me u can find a noticeable difference? if so i applaud u and ur great vision! :Q

 

[DClark]

While I don't really want to get into an argument with regards to floating point precision and whether FP16 is "cheating", a large GIF image comparing the Radeon 9700 Pro and GeForceFX 5800 Ultra can be found here. I think it's pretty evident that the images are quite different. If nVidia succeeds in getting Microsoft to lower the Dx9 specs to include FP16, then all the power to them - they'll have a fast, WHQL certified Dx9 driver. If they don't, they'll be at a disadvantage because as far as I've read the NV30 can only do FP16 and FP32. The R300 does FP24 (Dx9's specs currently call for at least 24 bit precision), so either Microsoft is going to have to continue to screw nVidia, or change the specs and start screwing ATi.

As for 3DMark optimizations, both ATi and nVidia do it; it's just that the FP16 optimization means the GeForceFX is operating at below Dx9 specs when using those drivers.

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: HenHowC
umm what do those 3 screenshots prove? the sky is barely visible...are you telling me u can find a noticeable difference? if so i applaud u and ur great vision! :Q

Look on the far left where there is sky, there is a big difference bwteen all 3 drivers.

 

[nemesismk2]

Originally posted by: Shamrock

Originally posted by: Mem
Quote

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

BFG10K where's the link to backup your claim because I havn't heard anything like that?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you browse through forums like nvnews, beyond3d and so on, you'd find bunch of them.

And here's a quick reference.
This link is of screen shot comparison between Det drivers for 3DMark03 Game Test 4, 'Mother Nature' from a hardware site named Darkcrow.
Screen Shot Comparison Link

You see the difference of the sky? Among 3 of them, only 43.03 does correct. And that's the much slower one.

I read this over at NVMAX,

NVIDIA will release a WHQL-certified driver complete with new control panel enhancements in early April. It is expected that 3DMark 2003 optimisations will be included in any WHQL version.

Link

HAHAHAHA, looks like NVidia is gonna expose 3dMark's "flaw" and gonna release "3DMark 2003 optimisations"

That'll teach ya to trust a synthetic benchmark

Use REAL games for benchmarking....

I agree fully with your comments about using real games for benchmarking. 3dmark03 can't in any sense be called a reliable method for testing dx9 support, even 3dmark2001 has been shown countless times that it's scores are way off the mark.

Hey madonion, futuremark or whatever you call yourself these days, how about a name change to lamemark03 because that's what 3dmark03 is!

 

[Mem]

HAHAHAHA, looks like NVidia is gonna expose 3dMark's "flaw" and gonna release "3DMark 2003 optimisations"

That'll teach ya to trust a synthetic benchmark

Use REAL games for benchmarking....

Actually the point I was trying to make is WHQL drivers are down the road,as for 3Dmark,well you know I don`t give a monkeys about that.

 

[Bopple]

It seems you guys missing or dodging the point.
Be 3DMark03 synthetic or not, the point is nvidia got the FP precision problem.
Game Test 4 is the evidence regardless of the fluidity of gaming. And if game developers code to DX9 standard, there will be game evidences also.
Though it'd be no problem if MS tone down the DX9 FP standard or game developers disregard the DX9 standard.
But until then, there's a problem, and there will be. It's simple.

 

[Mem]

And if game developers code to DX9 standard, there will be game evidences also.
Though it'd be no problem if MS tone down the DX9 FP standard or game developers disregard the DX9 standard.
But until then, there's a problem, and there will be. It's simple.

It`s all relative,April is virtually here and if Nvidia do get WHQL drivers out then, there will be no problem,besides it`s not like there are any DX9 games out let alone a full range of DX9 cards(FX range) out by Nvidia you can buy right now.

So at this time its really a minor issue.

 

[Bopple]

Originally posted by: Mem

It`s all relative,April is virtually here and if Nvidia do get WHQL drivers out then, there will be no problem,besides it`s not like there are any DX9 games out let alone a full range of DX9 cards(FX range) out by Nvidia you can buy right now.

So at this time its really a minor issue.

But it has to be seen if they can get both FP32 and speed altogether.
Till now, their drivers doing GT4 correct like 43.03 are much slower than the optimized drivers like 42.68, 42.72, 43.45 and so on.
If they can do it with 5x.xx drivers, it'd be very nice. i doubt it tho. for they haven't been able to do that for so many months.

PS1) and those optimized drivers have issues like...
object covering shadows, not shadows covering object. (splinter cell)
missing textures. (3DMark03, unreal 2, CS and so on)

PS2) I agree with you on the DX9 gaming.
We see neither R300 nor NV30 is good enough for the shader intensive programs like 3DMark03 or splinter cell.
I think we have to wait for the next gen vga for that type of games.
But then again, that doesn't justify the bs of nvidia claiming 'cinematic gaming'

PS3) And i don't get it why ppl say the self-contradictory things at the same time.
When some point out NV30 performance is not on par with R300 on the same IQ level, others say about future gaming.
Then the former point out again that NV30 doesn't have a bright future considering horrible shaders, the latter say it doesn't matter at this time.

 

[Mem]

PS3) And i don't get it why ppl say the self-contradictory things at the same time.

Bopple,

Image quality is subjective and other hardware like the monitor used will give different results.I`ve seen ATI,Nvidia on my monitor and too be honest there was no difference for the resolution I use,I`ve also seen Matrox image quality on my friends PC and it was very good(best you can get IMHO) however it was not a massive improvement.

There`s so many things that effect image quality,like quality of the monitor used, your eyes,drivers,brand of card (especially with Nvidia models),resolution and even the refresh rate used can effect image quality and last whether a clean or dusty monitor.

I currently own a humble Leadtek GF2 Ti and have been very happy with my image quality,and yes I can tell the difference between different Nvidia drivers image quality wise.

As for NV30,I`ve not seen it in action so can`t comment on the image quality,however I would be more interested to see if the different brands NV30 wise will have the same IQ standard between the NV30 brands,I guess only time will tell.

 

[Bopple]

Originally posted by: Mem

Bopple,

Image quality is subjective and other hardware like the monitor used will give different results.I`ve seen ATI,Nvidia on my monitor and too be honest there was no difference for the resolution I use,I`ve also seen Matrox image quality on my friends PC and it was very good(best you can get IMHO) however it was not a massive improvement.

There`s so many things that effect image quality,like quality of the monitor used, your eyes,drivers,brand of card (especially with Nvidia models),resolution and even the refresh rate used can effect image quality and last whether a clean or dusty monitor.

I currently own a humble Leadtek GF2 Ti and have been very happy with my image quality,and yes I can tell the difference between different Nvidia drivers image quality wise.

As for NV30,I`ve not seen it in action so can`t comment on the image quality,however I would be more interested to see if the different brands NV30 wise will have the same IQ standard between the NV30 brands,I guess only time will tell.

It seems you're missing or dodging the point again.

Yes, image quality is subjective. But that's when you're generally speaking.
If you standardize the situation and do specific comparisons like zooming, colored filtering check,
synthetic aa/af comparisons and so on, there be objective differences.
And we're talking on this basis though we didn't announce it aloud.
Such stances as applying general situation on anything can get us nowhere.
Only leading to something like 'nothing really matters on this planet.'

Monitors? Brands? What in the world do brands or monitors have to do with 3D gaming IQ?
There be some distortions due to signal noises or compatibility issues. But no differences on the original objects that vga creates.
This is not really what we're talking about. What do you want to do with these irrelevant concepts?

Driver is quite a factor. But you can't overcome the hardware limit with drivers.
It can be worse than it's supposed to be, dependent on drivers, but not better.

There are types of detonators it seems. The optimized drivers like 42.6x, 42.7x, 43.45, and so on. Then quality drivers like 43.03.
What do you propose? Use the optimized drivers when you compare fps, then use the quality drivers when you do IQ? How convenient.
Besides, no detonator version has shown better aa/af IQ than that of R300 considering the reviews till now, even if we disregard the texture corrupts or FP32 problem. And no better IQ per performace also. or vice versa (performance per IQ)

 

[Mem]

no detonator version has shown better aa/af IQ than that of R300 considering the reviews till now, even if we disregard the texture corrupts or FP32 problem. And no better IQ per performace also. or vice versa (performance per IQ)

I`m not clear on what point you`re trying to make since I never made any comments about the R300 ,I don`t know how the R300 came into the subject being this thread is about 43.45 drivers and not ATI ,anyway I don`t use FSAA or care about benchmarks,I only upgrade my drivers to official drivers on Nvidia`s website.

Main things I look for are stability and image quality (on my current card),as a gamer running games without problems is more important to me then 3dmark or few extra FPS here or there.

Monitors? Brands? What in the world do brands or monitors have to do with 3D gaming IQ?

I guess you`ve never seen some crappy monitors and are trying to say all monitors are created equal .
Btw I for one cannot say anything bad or have said anything bad about the R300 image quality.
I`ve said all I`m going to say ,back to gaming online.

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: DClark
While I don't really want to get into an argument with regards to floating point precision and whether FP16 is "cheating", a large GIF image comparing the Radeon 9700 Pro and GeForceFX 5800 Ultra can be found here.

doh, sorry i was done with that so i took it down, its back up for you all now; and cheating or not, it is prety damn lame.

 

[Apatewnas]

Hey dbal you freekin geek hehehe
I will not go into this "driver war" but I really want to state something.
WHO CARES if Geforce4 Ti gives 100s of frames per sec in Unreal.
WHO CARES when ATI does blah blah...
This isn't computing evolution. They're selling us crap hardware that don't work together and blame the poor user afterwards. What's the difference between my P3@1G with 786RAM with a P4@3G? I can still play 3d games, i can still put up a whole lot of software and the only thing the freakin P4 has is DDR or RDRAM and some extra USB ports. Amazing! P4 mobos still have 16 IRQs right? Ha! Why is all this power wasted?? Why can't the freaking computer understand my voice huh? Why isn't it safe to use over the NET?
This kind of computing sucks! I'll stick with my P3 for an age cause it can handle anything and everything.
One last thing folks and u can go on and buy all the freakin h/w and d/l all the freakin s/w in the world and u will remember my words.... WE'RE STILL USING KEYBOARDS AND CRT MONITORS.