The AMD Mantle Thread

[frozentundra123456]

It's funny seeing Mantle make the i3-4330 a better buy for BF4 than the A10-7850K or even the FX-8350

Not sure about these results, but if true, amd sort of shot themselves in the foot CPU wise. I thought mantle was supposed to give a big boost to the FX series, because of using all cores, but now a dual core is even faster. It would be great if a dual core suddenly became a strong option again, but as I said earlier, you still need a fast quad for all the other CPU demanding games.

 

[ASM-coder]

but if true, amd sort of shot themselves in the foot CPU wise. I thought mantle was supposed to give a big boost to the FX series, because of using all cores, but now a dual core is even faster.

Not true, because it was an i3 with an GCN card. The i3 alone is useless.
The A10-7850K alone is still playable.

I never saw any Mantle marketing that suggested that "mantle was supposed to give a big boost to the FX series'"

Where did you see this?

 

[Shivansps]

Are you suggesting that it was intentional?

I hope not, but after what im seeing at Star Swarm, im not sure, just dont belive everything they say.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Are you suggesting that it was intentional?

The fog, draw distance and other rendering issues is rather...console like. So it seems rather convient to say it doesnt change performance and let everyone review it with the bugs.

And the swarm demo is already heavily rigged to artificially boost mantle performance.

So consider me sceptic.

 

[Unoid]

The fog, draw distance and other rendering issues is rather...console like. So it seems rather convient to say it doesnt change performance and let everyone review it with the bugs.

And the swarm demo is already heavily rigged to artificially boost mantle performance.

So consider me sceptic.

you a skeptic?

Don't worry, I was skeptical about the consoles going with an APU

We'll have to wait for full reviews and also hopefully official drivers.

 

[Teizo]

I'm impressed by what I'm reading. I feel that the talk of 'ridiculing the Titan' added unnecessary hype but that aside Mantle seems genuinely promising., especially for Crossfire users.

The issue that is going to potentially hold it back from fully flourishing is being limited to AMD hardware though. There is no doubt it does offer a performance increase but as someone who does not game without AA, I don't see the gains drastic enough to warrant dumping DX/Nivida in favor of it. Game developers are not going to have that luxury either so this is just going to be another API that is going to have to coded for requiring more development time. Unless Mantle patches came after official game launches. That is for the time being anyway. Perhaps in the future things will change. If I did have a GCN AMD card though, there would be no doubt I would use it for BF4 because any gain in performance is good.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Not true, because it was an i3 with an GCN card. The i3 alone is useless.
The A10-7850K alone is still playable.

I never saw any Mantle marketing that suggested that "mantle was supposed to give a big boost to the FX series'"

Where did you see this?

Not sure if it was one of the AMD or Dice APU13 slides, but it was emphasizing how it would use all cores optimally, and make the 8350 equal to a 4770k.

In any case, with a discrete card, the i3 is faster than any amd cpu, and kaveri is the absolute worst except for the pentium. If someone wants to torture themselves and play on the igp, then yes, Kaveri is the best option, but there are much better options with a cheaper cpu and a discrete card in the 7750, 7770, 7790 range for very close to the same price.

 

[VulgarDisplay]

The fog, draw distance and other rendering issues is rather...console like. So it seems rather convient to say it doesnt change performance and let everyone review it with the bugs.

And the swarm demo is already heavily rigged to artificially boost mantle performance.

So consider me sceptic.

What issues are there other than the fog? I haven't noticed a reduction in draw distance at all, and no other rendering issues.

To be completely honest you wouldn't even notice the fog if you didn't compare ss's. It doesn't affect my gameplay at all.

 

[3DVagabond]

Since win8.1 when CPU bound. Mantle certainly closes that gap though, or surpasses it.

I've seen reviews as recent as this month and it's not reflected in them. Until the top sites we typically use reflect those numbers, it's a one off fluke in my book. You can believe it if you want, but it doesn't make sense to me.

 

[el etro]

For Mantle bashers: Everyone with a bit of knowledge of Graphical Computing know Mantle is not a hype.

Tested on Windows 7.

Majority of users still use Win 7.

PCGH results look amazing - not sure if they've been posted already or not.

http://www.pcgameshardware.de/AMD-R...ecials/AMD-Mantle-Test-Battlefield-4-1107754/

29% in SP at 1080p + 4xMSAA + FXAA

39% in MP same settings 4770K.

Most 290x users will go 4770k or even 8350/4570 processors.

 

[3DVagabond]

We don't know the clocks of the AMD card. At ~900Mhz clocks, surely will not beat 780Ghz/780Ti. At 1050Mhz clocks beat the first and tie the second.




This seems like linustechtips graph style.




That's why I put the GameGPU test with 3970x, to remove any CPU advantage of both sides:

Spoiler

1Ghz locked 290x(XFX Double Dissipation). Important Test.

Sounds like you want to blame the differences on the 290X throttling. If so, don't ignore the sites that have shown the 780's also throttle.

 

[el etro]

Sounds like you want to blame the differences on the 290X throttling. If so, don't ignore the sites that have shown the 780's also throttle.

Considering that both 290(quiet) and 780 reference cards are under the same heat conditions, what card will clock higher? And i'm not even talking about comparing a card with aftermarket cooler(GTX 780Ghz).

 

[ShintaiDK]

you a skeptic?

Don't worry, I was skeptical about the consoles going with an APU

We'll have to wait for full reviews and also hopefully official drivers.

That turned out great. Those APIs gave us 720p, 900p and 30FPS caps.

 

[Adampa1006]

The fog, draw distance and other rendering issues is rather...console like. So it seems rather convient to say it doesnt change performance and let everyone review it with the bugs.

And the swarm demo is already heavily rigged to artificially boost mantle performance.

So consider me sceptic.

I love this forum. According to the Mantle haters, everyone at DICE, AMD, OXIDE, all liars, all rigged benchmarks, all fake. Its all a conspiracy, they are all lying about everything. Did you read the FAQ posted by the Oxide devs? They have spent more time optimizing for DirectX than for Mantle.

Let me guess, thats a lie just like every single thing coming out of dozens of peoples mouths about Mantle, right? Its clearly all a massive conspiracy, thats the only logical explanation. occams razor in action

Warning issued for inflammatory language.
-- stahlhart

 

[ASM-coder]

That turned out great. Those APIs gave us 720p, 900p and 30FPS caps.

Nothing to do with the limitations of the APU.

 

[Slomo4shO]

Majority of users still use Win 7.

8 is on the rise, at least according to Steam:

Also, from Oxide:

We just deployed a new build of our Star Swarm stress test that significantly improves the demo’s performance using AMD’s Mantle API. We suggest that those of you interested in benchmarking and performance numbers re-run your Mantle scenarios; you may be surprised at the results.
Did we crack some secret code or find a crazy new optimization? No, nothing so spectacular. The truth is that we made a mistake in our haste to deploy the build that stripped out the activation process. We didn’t follow our normal release process, and missed how a minor change in that build had disabled some of the Nitrous engine’s multi-threading features when using Mantle. Unfortunately we didn’t notice that at first, as nobody was running Mantle last week due to the beta driver being delayed.
It’s all fixed now, so Mantle users should see a noticeable boost in performance on most configurations (this fix doesn’t have a huge effect on powerful-CPU/slow-GPU systems). We’ve also addressed the “gray screen” issue that was affecting some non-English Windows systems.
We appreciate everyone’s patience and feedback as we hunt down some of these hard-to-reach bugs for this alpha test of the Nitrous Engine.

 

[SiliconWars]

What issues are there other than the fog? I haven't noticed a reduction in draw distance at all, and no other rendering issues.

To be completely honest you wouldn't even notice the fog if you didn't compare ss's. It doesn't affect my gameplay at all.

In fact - as was mentioned previously on numerous occasions - the Mantle screenshots clearly show higher shadow details.

 

[Dresdenboy]

For Mantle bashers: Everyone with a bit of knowledge of Graphical Computing know Mantle is not a hype.

+1

 

[7stars]

Star Swarm (don't know in BF4, not tried yet)
bug reported to Oxide and AMD both

maybe can help someone with 2+ cards on the system to better test that tech demo without stuttering (case 7000 series):
2 cards on the system (here 7850 2GB), even if crossfire is disabled choosing the mantle exe it oddly selects the second card on the 2nd pci-express and not only it stutters but the voltage is not correct at default settings...set at 1.075v instead of 1.210v. While if i enable crossfire (also oddly here :biggrin: ) the selected card is the first as usual and doesn't stutter and doesn't seem that the memory usage is irregular. AMD doesn't report such a situation in the notes of the beta drivers, they only suggest to not use crossfire (enabled, i guess)...
so please try to enable crossfire and even if it uses the first single card only the memory usage and the scenes should be regular...
bye
p.s.: total 3 monitors - 1 monitor connected to the second card, don't know if it involves the bug too...

 

[faseman]

That turned out great. Those APIs gave us 720p, 900p and 30FPS caps.

I think it's time for you to find another hobby.

You're constantly wrong. You're constantly negative. You've posted nearly 9000 times since April 2012 and you barely contribute anything worthwhile.

Give it a thought, would you?

Warning issued for thread crapping and personal attack.
-- stahlhart

 

[7stars]

another issue with multigpu: Win 8.1 64bit
trying to enable Crossfire, it may happen that the operation is not successful.
I have not tried unplugging the monitors and do not even think about it!
So, if you have 2 GPUs and want to fully test Mantle shutdown, remove the second card and reboot ... or nothing :biggrin: it's a mess at the moment

 

[mindbomb]

I have a question -
BF4 does a lot of directcompute stuff. Does directcompute work with mantle or are they converting it to opencl?

 

[Gloomy]

I have a question -
BF4 does a lot of directcompute stuff. Does directcompute work with mantle or are they converting it to opencl?

DirectCompute is separate from Direct3D, DirectInput etc. Mantle replaces only Direct3D as far as I know.

 

[desprado]

AMD Mantle Currently Causes Washed Out Graphics Compared to Direct X in Battlefield 4

Read more: http://wccftech.com/amd-mantle-washed-graphics-compared-direct-battlefield-4/#ixzz2sPUDpBs1
​

 

[Abwx]

AMD Mantle Currently Causes Washed Out Graphics Compared to Direct X in Battlefield 4

Read more: http://wccftech.com/amd-mantle-washed-graphics-compared-direct-battlefield-4/#ixzz2sPUDpBs1
​

The pics posted at WCCFtech , Mantle on the left and DX on the right :