bystander36
Diamond Member
- Apr 1, 2013
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Btw, that is not a 100% increase. He is saying the minimums are improved by 100%. The averages may be much closer to each other.100%+ increase...pics or it didn't happen.
Btw, that is not a 100% increase. He is saying the minimums are improved by 100%. The averages may be much closer to each other.100%+ increase...pics or it didn't happen.
so for me no nvidia card on the planet would give me this type of performance, unless i built a new PC from the ground up around a new top of the line i7
But the main reason why you got such a large increase with Mantle, is because AMD's Direct3D drivers perform so poorly to begin with.
Is this one of those things where if you repeat it enough times it becomes reality?
Not a living soul on this board knows to what level or what degree AMD's drivers are optimized in whatever regard. Just because Nvidia can pull a rabbit out of their drivers doesnt mean AMD can. It could be. It could also be not.
So, everyone here, who is a GPU driver developer AND has working experience on AMD's stack, raise your hands. Thats what I thought.
Anyway it may be, the why and why not speculation of AMD's Direct3D drivers has zero concern for this thread.
Just saying.
Is this one of those things where if you repeat it enough times it becomes reality?
Not a living soul on this board knows to what level or what degree AMD's drivers are optimized in whatever regard. Just because Nvidia can pull a rabbit out of their drivers doesnt mean AMD can. It could be. It could also be not.
So, everyone here, who is a GPU driver developer AND has working experience on AMD's stack, raise your hands. Thats what I thought.
Anyway it may be, the why and why not speculation of AMD's Direct3D drivers has zero concern for this thread.
Just saying.
I think it's possible that you received such a large performance increase with Mantle seeing as you are completely CPU bound.
But the main reason why you got such a large increase with Mantle, is because AMD's Direct3D drivers perform so poorly to begin with.
Mantle does work very effectively for lower performing CPUs though admittedly..
Anyway, it doesn't really matter. The biggest hope Mantle can achieve is that Microsoft incorporates some it's aspects into future Direct3D versions.
So you are saying the same cpu would not bottleneck an nvidia card of the same performance tier? Give it a rest man.
NVidia's multithreading enhancements relies on the game engine. The more threaded an engine is, the better it scales on NVidia hardware. That's why NVidia has the edge in the Frostbite 2 and 3 engine, plus CryEngine 3 as well.Its far more likely that nvidias larger dies brute force more performance than amd's smaller dies do, and both sides just have outliers that perform better on their hardware. No one claims nvidia drivers don't multithread based on sleeping dogs or dirt benchmarks. Should we start would you say that we are right?
I said no such thing. That's something YOU said, not me, so don't put words in my mouth.
I merely said that the reason for such a large increase (100% is massive) is because AMD's DirectX drivers start at such a low base level.
I've enumerated many times that Mantle is definitely more efficient than Direct3D. But then again, it's not really a fair comparison as Direct3D does WAY more than Mantle, is backward compatible and runs on various architectures.
Suffice to say though, that Direct3D already has a solution for CPU limitations, and it seems to be pretty effective.....not as effective as Mantle perhaps, but good enough.
NVidia's multithreading enhancements relies on the game engine. The more threaded an engine is, the better it scales on NVidia hardware. That's why NVidia has the edge in the Frostbite 2 and 3 engine, plus CryEngine 3 as well.
I've never played Sleeping Dogs so I have no idea how many threads the engine supports.
Then again, if people are willing to defend AMD on this, it's easy to see why they've gotten away with making subpar drivers for so long and why uninformed people believe DX is the problem, and not AMD.
If AMD's DX drivers were/are so bad how come in all previous generations the cards have been so competitive?
Ok, I'm starting to think you're purposefully spreading misinformation and FUD now. There were several drivers for the 6xxx and 7xxx series that improved performance significantly.Last time I remember seeing AMD pulling some increased power from drivers were back when the 5xxx series came out. I think it was around the 5th month after release they extracted a good bit of performance.
However this also caused some issues for crossfire and eyefinity users as a side effect .
Ok, I'm starting to think you're purposefully spreading misinformation and FUD now. There were several drivers for the 6xxx and 7xxx series that improved performance significantly.
Ok, I'm starting to think you're purposefully spreading misinformation and FUD now. There were several drivers for the 6xxx and 7xxx series that improved performance significantly.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6393/amds-holiday-plans-cat1211-new-bundle
so you are saying he would get those same results with a gk110 ? yes or no question .I think it's possible that you received such a large performance increase with Mantle seeing as you are completely CPU bound.
But the main reason why you got such a large increase with Mantle, is because AMD's Direct3D drivers perform so poorly to begin with.
Mantle does work very effectively for lower performing CPUs though admittedly..
You seriously need to get a life and learn how to comprehend sentences because I specifically said 5xxx series. Throwing out random benchmarks from 2 generations ahead is elementary.
If you earnestly believe Nvidia's driver would equal Mantle on an i7-920 then you are taking delusion to heights never before reached by man.
So the D3D drivers are putting the bar "so low" yet they are very competitive between the tiers. What a bunch of fud.
Don't take it personal man. That is what anyone reading your posts about nvidia vs. Amd multi threading is under the impression you are saying. That's what I took away from it all.
Like I said some games just work better on either vendor. Civ 5 is one such instance and it is in no way a reason to say that amd drivers are sub par. The same can just as easily be said if nvidia drivers in the right benchmark.
I say we stick to what we know, discuss the numbers and leave EVERYTHING we dont know behind. This should be about mantle and nothing else, not my gut feeling about amd's sub par direct3d whatever - whatever. There is a difference between educated guesses(and stating just that) and making stuff up ..and this is making stuff up.
Game devs pushed for mantle, not AMD. You are pretty much telling the guy that uses a hammer what kind of hammer he should be using! I'd argue the hammer man(cant touch this) has a pretty good idea about what kind of hammer suits his job.