The American Dream Is Gone

[dmcowen674]

6-10-12

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/dail...seph-stiglitz-price-inequality-124338674.html

The American Dream Is a Myth


Income inequality has become the subject of much debate in this country, in large part because of the Occupy Wall Street movement.


In his latest book, The Price of Inequality, Columbia Professor and Nobel laureate Joseph Stiglitz examines the causes of income inequality and offers some remedies. In between, he reaches some startling conclusions, including that America is "no longer the land of opportunity" and "the 'American dream' is a myth."


While we all know stories of people who've moved up the social stratosphere, Stiglitz says the statistics tell a very different story. In the last 30 years the share of national income held by the top 1% of Americans has doubled; for to the top 0.1%, their share has tripled, he reports.



Meanwhile, median incomes for American workers have stagnated.


Even more than income inequality, "America has the least equality of opportunity of any of the advanced industrial economies," Stiglitz says. In short, the status you're born into — whether rich or poor — is more likely to be the status of your adult life in America vs. any other advanced economy, including 'Old Europe'.


If the root causes of income inequality go unaddressed, America will truly become a two-class society and look much more like a third world economy, Stiglitz warns. "People will live in gated communities with armed guards. It's a ugly picture. There will be political, social and economic turmoil."


For example, he cites the provision in Medicare Part D which forbids the federal government from negotiating prices with the drug companies. Over 10 years, that rule will generate approximately $500 billion for the industry, he estimates, but no tangible benefit for taxpayers or the economy as a whole.


Importantly, Stiglitz believes inequality of wealth and opportunity are hurting the overall economy, by limiting competition, promoting cronyism and keeping those at the bottom from reaching their potential.


"What I want is a more dynamic economy and a fairer society," he says, suggesting income inequality is ultimately detrimental to those at the top, too.



"My point is we've created an economy that is not in accord with the principles of the free market."


6-12-2012

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/dail...shrinks-avg-net-worth-falls-40-160150749.html

The American Dream Shrinks: Avg. Net Worth Falls 40% From 2007-2010

 

[dmcowen674]

No surprise here

Most of the people that support Corporations controlling the 99% are right here posting.

 

[Matt1970]

No surprise here

Most of the people that support Corporations controlling the 99% are right here posting.

I don't know about you but the 99% are free to choose a career that pays more or start their own business.

 

[glenn1]

The American Dream Is Gone

For those people who define it as the economic situation that was in place in the 1950s, that's true. That was a one-time event caused by the complete destruction of world war 2, and we're not going back to those days. So you can pine all you want for the days where someone could drop out of high-school and get a job for life on an assembly lines. The rest of the world has caught up now, and folks like the OP can't coast with little to no effort anymore and expect to live a middle class or upper middle-class lifestyle.

 

[gingermeggs]

For those people who define it as the economic situation that was in place in the 1950s, that's true. That was a one-time event caused by the complete destruction of world war 2, and we're not going back to those days. So you can pine all you want for the days where someone could drop out of high-school and get a job for life on an assembly lines. The rest of the world has caught up now, and folks like the OP can't coast with little to no effort anymore and expect to live a middle class or upper middle-class lifestyle.

And the mega rich can DO AS THEY PLEASE?????
At some point the corruption they are the instigators of; they will be brought to justice for.
I hope that justice is as right wing and eugenic as they are....every last one of their seed!

 

[gingermeggs]

I don't know about you but the 99% are free to choose a career that pays more or start their own business.

A Hobson's choice
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hobson's_choice

or a Morton's fork?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morton's_fork

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally Posted by dmcowen674
No surprise here

Most of the people that support Corporations controlling the 99% are right here posting.

I don't know about you but the 99% are free to choose a career that pays more or start their own business.

You didn't read the article apparently. That is not true anymore.

What do you know that a Nobel laureate does not?

 

[sportage]

I don't see the American dream as gone, I see the sanity of the American voter as gone.

In Iowa, for example, the unemployment rate is well below the national average.
You might start hearing that a lot in the coming days as the election heats up.
Iowa being one of the swing states and all...

But people should know the reason why this is, is simply because most of the last three true American based employment opportunities are located in Iowa.
1. Banking...
2. Insurance...
3. Health... (Blue Cross/Wellmark)

This is my challenge for Mitt Romney...

Can president Romney with his republican congress figure out ways to move those last few unique American based jobs off to foreign lands?
You betcha they can....! Given the chance.
After all, that was Mitt Romney's job. That is what he does.
That is exactly how our possible future president made himself, and his investors, very very wealthy.

So here we have the last three remaining, true employment opportunities unique to America.

I give them two years under a Mitt Romney/republican congress.
After all... Romney has already said, and said often, that as president "he" would have let the US car industry go bankrupt.
Yep! Two years at best, and gone!

So again I wonder, and ask, why do so many of our voting public insist on electing traitors into the highest office in the land? The job killers. Nixon, Bush, and possibly Romney (just to name a few).
Why?
I'd really like to know....

 

[dmcowen674]

I don't see the American dream as gone, I see the sanity of the American voter as gone.

In Iowa, for example, the unemployment rate is well below the national average.
You might start hearing that a lot in the coming days as the election heats up.
Iowa being one of the swing states and all...

But people should know the reason why this is, is simply because most of the last three true American based employment opportunities are located in Iowa.
1. Banking...
2. Insurance...
3. Health... (Blue Cross/Wellmark)

How has Iowa managed to hold on to those three?

 

[Charles Kozierok]

Most of the claims made in the article are born out by statistics. For example:

... but I take issue with this conclusion:

"My point is we've created an economy that is not in accord with the principles of the free market."

On the contrary, I'd say that wealth stratification of the sort we are seeing now is precisely what you get from a free market. Preventing gross inequality and lack of social mobility is a function of government. And the reason the disparities have gotten especially bad in the last 30 years is a combination of the post-WW2 "free ride" being over, and a Republican Party that has been very successful at using identity politics to manipulate well-intentioned but ignorant regular Joes into voting against their economic interests.

 

[ccbadd]

Originally Posted by dmcowen674
No surprise here

Most of the people that support Corporations controlling the 99% are right here posting.




You didn't read the article apparently. That is not true anymore.

What do you know that a Nobel laureate does not?

The true cause of this is education which has been destroyed by the left. Then look at how the left is continuing to destroy the family unit in order to try to maintain political power. Now add all the stupid "payoff laws" to help all the politicos use to finance their campaigns. Both ideologies are guilty of producing laws that directly hurt the population to the benefit of big business(can you say Telco and IP laws) and you start to see the real picture.

By the way, being a Nobel laureate means squat. Just a bunch of lefties who formed a club.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

The American Dream Is Gone

So should I give back my two promotions and 28% (15%, 3%, & 10%) in raises I've gotten in the last three years?

 

[Matt1970]

I don't think a lot of you understand what the dream is all about. The American dream is not a guaranteed 6 figure job. It is not a guaranteed new off the lot car. And the American dream is certainly not racking up 250K in student loans for an Art History Degree. The American Dream has absolutely NOTHING to do with what the Government can hand out to you.

The American Dream is still alive and well. People are still flocking to American for their piece of the pie. You never hear about people wanting to live the German Dream, or the French Dream, or the Scandanvian Dream.

 

[Incorruptible]

The Democrats and Republicans have both contributed to this mess. If the government just got out of the way and Ron Paul was president the situation would be much better

 

[Murloc]

this is no news, everybody knows that the US is more similar to a developing country like Brazil than to the rich parts of Europe. Ghettos and stuff.
On the page "gated communities" of wikipedia you can find this list of countries who have a meaningful quantity of gated communities:

5.1 Argentina
5.2 Australia
5.3 Brazil
5.4 Canada
5.5 China
5.6 Ecuador
5.7 Indonesia
5.8 Mexico
5.9 New Zealand
5.10 Peru
5.11 Philippines
5.12 Saudi Arabia
5.13 South Africa
5.14 Thailand
5.15 Turkey
5.16 United Arab Emirates
5.17 United Kingdom
5.18 United States

Basically: anglosaxons confirmed for third world.

People are still flocking to American for their piece of the pie. You never hear about people wanting to live the German Dream, or the French Dream, or the Scandanvian Dream.

Hurp, you've never been on 4chan evidently. There's a bunch of 20yo unemployable/uneducated united statians who have dreams of moving to Germany or Scandinavia to live off welfare. No one talks about moving to France though.
People are flocking to Europe too, there's an endless stream of africans crossing the mediterranean.

 

[FaaR]

I don't know about you but the 99% are free to choose a career that pays more or start their own business.

Life is never quite that simple, you know. Well, I guess you don't.

Free to choose a carreer that pays more? Just like that? Ok, assuming everyone has the education for such a carreer (or at least the economic means, and the time neccessary to obtain one), how would society cope with a workforce consisting of only copywriters and stock brokers, and no garbage collectors or postal workers?

It's not as if high-paying jobs just grow on trees you know... There's a reason some jobs pay less than others, and that's because there's more of them available, and they have less stringent requirements of the workers.

Start their own business? Yes, everyone has the hours to sink into a business. Or the competence. Right. You have really thought this through, I can see...

 

[FaaR]

You never hear about people wanting to live the German Dream, or the French Dream, or the Scandanvian Dream.

That's because you're an Ignorant American, who neither care, nor know anything about the world outside the borders of your own country.

 

[Matt1970]

Life is never quite that simple, you know. Well, I guess you don't.

Free to choose a carreer that pays more? Just like that? Ok, assuming everyone has the education for such a carreer (or at least the economic means, and the time neccessary to obtain one), how would society cope with a workforce consisting of only copywriters and stock brokers, and no garbage collectors or postal workers?

It's not as if high-paying jobs just grow on trees you know... There's a reason some jobs pay less than others, and that's because there's more of them available, and they have less stringent requirements of the workers.

Start their own business? Yes, everyone has the hours to sink into a business. Or the competence. Right. You have really thought this through, I can see...

OMG, you argument is that if everyone has an education there will be nobody to pick up trash? Then you have the nerve to call me ignorant. Maybe you should finish school before you comment on what it is like in the real world.

 

[Rainsford]

So should I give back my two promotions and 28% (15%, 3%, & 10%) in raises I've gotten in the last three years?

I'm not sure I see how your personal experience disproves the problem in the general case, even if overall income context was provided (maybe you're part of the top few percent, or maybe you were dramatically underpaid to begin with).

 

[Rainsford]

I don't know about you but the 99% are free to choose a career that pays more or start their own business.

That seems to be the popular answer, but it's not a very good one. Even in a society with perfect economic mobility, massive and increasing income inequality between professions is an issue. No society can consist entirely of stock brokers. Sure, the mechanic who fixes my car MIGHT be able to go back to school and learn how to trade futures or start his own shop if he also has business skills in addition to mechanic skills...but I still need someone to fix my car.

Edit: Basically the problem with your answer is that you're confusing "anyone can choose a new career" with "everyone can choose a new career". What MIGHT be a reasonable response for an individual (although I don't see why it's OK that it's getting harder and harder for people with valuable skills to earn a good living) is a crummy answer for society as a whole.

 

[IGBT]

the NEW american dream is to get your adult kids to move out and STAY out and live within their income. And if they show up looking for a job with a mess of tat's/nose bolts/fishing lures/piercings/ guess who gets to live in mom and dads basement for the rest of their life!!

 

[FaaR]

OMG, you argument is that if everyone has an education there will be nobody to pick up trash?

I think you need to work on your reading comprehension, but I'm sure that in your mind, since you've finished school you know as much about that as you do about "the real world", which seems to be...well, the United States in your case, and not much more. Probably WASP middle-class US as well, but I admit that'd be an ass-umption on my part.

After all, many GOP voters including low income earners, gays and minorities vote decidedly against their own interests because they simply don't know any better.

Then you have the nerve to call me ignorant. Maybe you should finish school before you comment on what it is like in the real world.

You think that because I'm not agreeing with you, I haven't finished school? I'm sorry, but your logic does not compute.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

I'm not sure I see how your personal experience disproves the problem in the general case, even if overall income context was provided (maybe you're part of the top few percent, or maybe you were dramatically underpaid to begin with).

Or I have skills and many years experience in a field that's in demand. The company where I work is doing everything they can to hang on to experienced people. I average 2 to 3 job offers a month on LinkedIn.

 

[Rainsford]

Or I have skills and many years experience in a field that's in demand. The company where I work is doing everything they can to hang on to experienced people. I average 2 to 3 job offers a month on LinkedIn.

OK...but what's your point? Your job/career is working out well for you? Great, me too! I just don't think that has much to do with the bigger picture.

 

[epidemis]

But liberalism and welfare deincentivizes people and make them lazy. If you want to blame someone for the unemployment, blame Clinton. He pushed the offshoring ball in motion. Blame the croonies who's allowed 20 million jobs to be taken by both illegal and legal immigration. Blame the incredibly generous taxation on capital gains, whereas most other nations on earth tax it as ordinary income. Blame the war on family for totally disrupting the integrity of the current generation - not the lack of funding for school, which historically is almost an irrelevant factor for education.