The anti-crypto thread

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DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
22,020
11,590
136
I still don't think anyone is seriously entertaining the notion of blockchain voting anyway. So whether or not we'd like it, it's not going to appear anytime soon.
 

njdevilsfan87

Platinum Member
Apr 19, 2007
2,331
251
126
Not in the political realm, but a lot of blockchain startups are utilizing voting to try to appease token holders. As I mentioned before - voting will be within the private industry long before it ever, if ever, hits the political realm.
 

Insert_Nickname

Diamond Member
May 6, 2012
4,971
1,693
136
Not in the political realm, but a lot of blockchain startups are utilizing voting to try to appease token holders. As I mentioned before - voting will be within the private industry long before it ever, if ever, hits the political realm.

As long as you don't mind what you voted is on the public record, there really isn't anything wrong with blockchain voting.

It's only if there needs to be a secret ballot there are issues. This isn't so much apparent in f.x. the US where there are only two parties of consequence, and the public tend to be vocal about which they support. But if f.x. you have a member of a family who supports of one of the parties, but personally supports the other party, there could be serious consequences for that individuel who voted "wrongly". That's why we have secret ballots, and thus you can lie as much as you want on how you voted.
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
22,020
11,590
136
As long as you don't mind what you voted is on the public record, there really isn't anything wrong with blockchain voting.

Remember, when voting through something like a smart contract, the only public information will be that there was a transaction between two addresses and that some kind of data token was passed between them. The actual contents of that token may be unknown.
 
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GodisanAtheist

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2006
7,142
7,637
136
So, Bitconnect was interesting because it was shady from the start and people kept going with it long after it was clear the thing was a scam. The various cryptobros don't actually care if something's a scam, they only care about if they can make money off it. And Bitconnect isn't alone. Just look at Safemoon, an objectively pointless coin that even people here were talking up (I hope they got out while the getting was good). Safemoon has a built-in 10% fee on EVERY transaction (5% to holders, 5% to a 'reserve currency' fund controlled by the devs), rendering it completely and totally useless for literally everything. A 10% fee means it can never be competitive as a currency or as a tech. I've yet to hear a single use for the damn thing that wasn't "but duh price will go upppp!" People bought into it in the hopes of dumping coins on suckers who would sign up once their mobile app was released (iirc, the app was broken on release, because of course it was) and they're now waiting on the devs to release an exchange (can't wait to see that mess) to somehow pump their useless coins up. It needs new suckers to keep buying into the hype to keep the price going up, because there's literally no use for it otherwise.

At this point, I'm not sure I blame the scumbags running scams in the cryptosphere anymore. When you're in an industry that keeps growing exponentially with millions of dollars flowing in despite crypto projects having an astounding 0% success rate, you might as well fleece the suckers for all they got while you can.

-Conspiracy Theory time: the alt coin market is all controlled by the illumi... I mean federal reserve... To soak up Fiat currency and keep inflation rates under control.

*THINK ABOUT IT SHEEPLE*

Its a great tool to take a bunch of fiat out of the market and have it all up and disappear like a fart in a hurricane!
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
22,020
11,590
136
Its a great tool to take a bunch of fiat out of the market and have it all up and disappear like a fart in a hurricane!

That's not how money works. Securities and such don't just soak up USD in such a way that USD vanishes and is then not spent. It just means USD changed hands in a transaction of a security/token/whatever that has inflated value due to an oversupply of fiat currency (in this case, USD). The seller still receives the money and then can go on to spend it in other markets.

If I run an ICO and sell billions of tokens raking in tens or hundreds of millions of USD, I can then turn around and spend it on real estate, precious metals, or something else. Then I inflate the value of THAT stuff since the supply is either finite (real estate) or relatively fixed (metals, based on mining/production) and I'm outbidding other buyers through brute force. Then the people who sold me the property/metals turn around and spend that money on luxury items, so now the luxury items go up in price because they're either reducing supplies @ MSRP or paying scalper prices (suppliers of luxury items usually would rather charge a higher rate than produce more product). Then the reseller of luxury items turns around and buys essentials - food, fuel, clothing, medicine, what have you. Unless the supply of that stuff goes up to match the increase in money supply, eventually the prices on those essentials will creep upwards just from all the money that some people can throw at it, all thanks to the overprinted USD.

The people who have not tapped into this new money supply still get screwed. That extra USD doesn't just disappear. The only way that happens is if it gets locked up in accounts where absolutely no one will spend it OR lend it to anyone else through things like fractional reserve banking.

The only way to cope with increased money supply is:

Stop printing so much
Encourage your economy to produce more essentials to balance out the money supply and bring down prices. Today that means lowering energy costs, drastically.

. . . and that's it fam.

Unfortunately, what the US seems to be doing right now is increasing energy costs and printing too much currency. That double whammy is going to make life hell for anyone that isn't swimming in overprinted USD. Cryptocurrency is just one way that everyday schmucks can tap into that money supply if they trade intelligently. It only takes a few moonshots for you to become financially secure, if not rich, depending on how much beer & cigarette money you're willing to throw into the arena. I've personally witnessed dozens of them since 2016, and at least two of them were (for me) easy to read from a distance. Crypto is still much more-accessible than the stock market for bargain buyers, too. Sucks for anyone who misses out though, or for anyone who buys the top and sells out of frustration when crashes happen.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
Cryptocurrency is just one way that everyday schmucks can tap into that money supply if they trade intelligently. It only takes a few moonshots for you to become financially secure, if not rich, depending on how much beer & cigarette money you're willing to throw into the arena. I've personally witnessed dozens of them since 2016, and at least two of them were (for me) easy to read from a distance.
So, what you're saying is, day-trade crypto with your cig&beer money, until you hit it big, and strike it rich?

How does mining figure in?

Because it's clear to me, that other than some lucky spec-mining that you might be able to do with some nobody-coins early in their existence, early enough to actually mine a big bag 'o that coin, that mining is no-where near a get-rich quick scheme. At least, not by itself. Maybe if I move some of that BTC into sh*tcoins, and hope that they moon, then it could be.
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
22,020
11,590
136
So, what you're saying is, day-trade crypto with your cig&beer money, until you hit it big, and strike it rich?

Nah buy and hold. Find a depreciated asset or a startup and get in when the prices are low. Wait until the market goes irrational, and sell before it hits the top. Ride out the crash and then buy back in.

How does mining figure in?

I mined ETH until I was more-or-less power limited (I only had one room I could use for mining, so I maxed out the circuit more-or-less) back in 2016, and figured I would never get enough to make any money, so I just started buying ETH on the side. That year I was pulling ~70 hour weeks so there was extra cash to spare. Mining is essentially a convoluted form of DCA. But you have to HODL over extended periods of time to make any real money doing it, in my opinion.

The last big buy-in opportunity was late 2018 when ETH was trading for around $90-$110. I think it bottomed out in Oct or Nov of that year. Lots of other projects tanked as well. If you got ETH at $100 and held until this year, you made some serious bank.
 

alcoholbob

Diamond Member
May 24, 2005
6,308
355
126
Unfortunately, what the US seems to be doing right now is increasing energy costs and printing too much currency. That double whammy is going to make life hell for anyone that isn't swimming in overprinted USD. Cryptocurrency is just one way that everyday schmucks can tap into that money supply if they trade intelligently. It only takes a few moonshots for you to become financially secure, if not rich, depending on how much beer & cigarette money you're willing to throw into the arena. I've personally witnessed dozens of them since 2016, and at least two of them were (for me) easy to read from a distance. Crypto is still much more-accessible than the stock market for bargain buyers, too. Sucks for anyone who misses out though, or for anyone who buys the top and sells out of frustration when crashes happen.

As the hard money folks would say, the federal reserve has created a lot of cantillionaires this cycle. Elon Musk goes from being worth 50 billion to 330 billion in the span of a year even though his underlying business hasn't changed, in fact Covid negatively impacted Tesla's production. And there's all those businesses that are still closed with little to minimal revenue yet their market cap has exploded by tens or hundreds of multiples during the pandemic.
 

BFG10K

Lifer
Aug 14, 2000
22,709
2,995
126
The cancerous parasites have fled China and are now descending on Kazakhstan and Sweden to rape the local power grids.


Once again the "secure decentralized blockchain" utopia is a complete failure and the Crypto bros continue to run to government cops paid by fiat to help them.

 
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VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
Wouldn't it be funny, if someone surveyed all of the pizza ovens around the world, and found out that it was pizza, and not Bitcoin, that was drawing excessive power.

BTW, 8 percent power consumption growth isn't surprising, given the increased prevalence of air conditioning, and oh, this thing called global warming / climate change. Perhaps you've heard of that?
 

AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,524
3,234
136
The only reason why I wouldn't want crypto to collapse is that I would worry too much about VirtualLarry. He wouldn't know what to do with himself.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
The only reason why I wouldn't want crypto to collapse is that I would worry too much about VirtualLarry. He wouldn't know what to do with himself.
Sure, because I live in the Northeast, and it's roughly winter now, and I have electric heat, but because I'm using my talent and skills to operate mining rigs as a form of "smart heat", and making money rather than spending money on heat, I'm a "Cancerous Parasite"?

WTH is WRONG with you people. You act like I personally plucked my GPUs out of the hands of "baby gamers", rather than camping Newegg sales and ebay.
 
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AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,524
3,234
136
Sure, because I live in the Northeast, and it's roughly winter now, and I have electric heat, but because I'm using my talent and skills to operate mining rigs as a form of "smart heat", and making money rather than spending money on heat, I'm a "Cancerous Parasite"?

WTH is WRONG with you people. You act like I personally plucked my GPUs out of the hands of "baby gamers", rather than camping Newegg sales and ebay.
Larry, I'm worried.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
The cancerous parasites have fled China and are now descending on Kazakhstan and Sweden to rape the local power grids.
BTW, I'm pretty certain that a certain sub-set of the American population considers Wall St. Bankers and investors from private equity firms to be "Cancerous Parasites" too. And yet they don't get thrown in jail for destroying jobs and the economy, just to make a bigger "shareholder return".
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
Larry, I'm very worried!
Yeah, me too. The fact that so many "gamers" have been "trained to hate" on "murder simulators", and now they're unleashing that hate on a largely innocent group of people, that have done nothing wrong, other than they were really clever, and found a way to create internet-wide "virtual currency economies", and actually make real-world profits, rather than the ephemera that gamers acquire. Miners are not this cut-throat band of thieves, in fact, they form a secretive but largely-supporting grass-roots community. Instead of hating, they're encouraging, and learning.
 
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AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,524
3,234
136
Yeah, me too. The fact that so many "gamers" have been "trained to hate" on "murder simulators", and now they're unleashing that hate on a largely innocent group of people, that have done nothing wrong, other than they were really clever, and found a way to create internet-wide "virtual currency economies", and actually make real-world profits, rather than the ephemera that gamers acquire. Miners are not this cut-throat band of thieves, in fact, they form a secretive but largely-supporting grass-roots community. Instead of hating, they're encouraging, and learning.
Larry, I'm seriously worried for your well-being!
 

Shmee

Memory & Storage, Graphics Cards Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 13, 2008
7,708
2,691
146
Yeah, me too. The fact that so many "gamers" have been "trained to hate" on "murder simulators", and now they're unleashing that hate on a largely innocent group of people, that have done nothing wrong, other than they were really clever, and found a way to create internet-wide "virtual currency economies", and actually make real-world profits, rather than the ephemera that gamers acquire. Miners are not this cut-throat band of thieves, in fact, they form a secretive but largely-supporting grass-roots community. Instead of hating, they're encouraging, and learning.
While I am a gamer, I do agree that too many people are too toxic about this. I think games and crypto are both great fun to be had. I just wish people could be more civil.
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
22,020
11,590
136
The cancerous parasites have fled China and are now descending on Kazakhstan and Sweden to rape the local power grids.

Old news, and those miners cut deals with the power providers only to get hit with rolling blackouts. They were sold production capacity the gub'ment didn't have. Are you sure you know who is raping whom?

Personally I think the BTC miners can go to hell since it's so useless, but they persist in pouring time/money into PoW so, whatever.

Once again the "secure decentralized blockchain" utopia is a complete failure and the Crypto bros continue to run to government cops paid by fiat to help them.

ZzZzZZz

Learn to tell the difference between an actual on-chain hack and a badly-coded smart contract.

While I am a gamer, I do agree that too many people are too toxic about this. I think games and crypto are both great fun to be had. I just wish people could be more civil.

If people insist on vitriol, they should at least be well-informed. Which is sadly often not the case.

IN OTHER NEWS, crypto markets are bleeding, most likely due to liquidation of assets related to the Evergrande bankruptcy. Expect the market to continue to get pummeled until at least Monday.
 

amenx

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 2004
4,097
2,367
136
Crypto mining map by country. WIth China out of the picture, the U.S. is now top in mining operations. Surprised how big Kazakhstan has become in this.
 

ultimatebob

Lifer
Jul 1, 2001
25,134
2,446
126
If the crypto collapse was going to happen (and I'm not convinced that it will), maybe they'll look at the bloodbath that happened last night as the trigger for it.

Don't forget... if you're a crypto fan OR a crypto hater, you can still place a bet on the price of crypto next year here:

 
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