The anti-crypto thread

[BFG10K]

Great news, crypto's collapsing across the board: https://www.techpowerup.com/282380/...ions-in-less-than-24-hours-did-the-bubble-pop

Also China's banned crypto, though individuals can still have it: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/chinese-financial-payment-bodies-barred-122712260.html

The sooner this cancerous parasite is wiped out, the better.

 

[njdevilsfan87]

You don't need ponzi coins to use block chain/hash chain. That's just a basic computer security technology.

Go setup your own blockchain without any cryptocurrency, see how many people use/adopt it: Zero. Your single node is no more secure than any other centralized database solution.

Blockchains have grown and become as secure as they are today because people developed trust and faith in the built in rewards and payment mechanism: cryptocurrency (and really only 10-20 really of the tens of thousands that have been released).

 

[DisarmedDespot]

Go setup your own blockchain without any cryptocurrency, see how many people use/adopt it: Zero. Your single node is no more secure than any other centralized database solution.

Blockchains have grown and become as secure as they are today because people developed trust and faith in the built in rewards and payment mechanism: cryptocurrency (and really only 10-20 really of the tens of thousands that have been released).

I mean, if you rip the cryptocurrency out of a blockchain, you get the merkle tree it was built on. Which is an actually useful data structure that actual people use for actual productive things, just look at Git.

Nah, crypto's grown because of hype. Do you really think bitcoin's hit 60k 30k because it's just that useful?

 

[AdamK47]

I mean, if you rip the cryptocurrency out of a blockchain, you get the merkle tree it was built on. Which is an actually useful data structure that actual people use for actual productive things, just look at Git.

Nah, crypto's grown because of hype. Do you really think bitcoin's hit 60k 30k because it's just that useful?

Crypto has grown because some people believed it had worth and told others it had worth. Those people then believed it had worth and told others it had worth. Those people then believed it had worth and told others it had worth. Those people then believed it had worth and told others it had worth. Those people then believed it had worth and told others it had worth. Those people then believed it had worth and told others it had worth.

 

[beginner99]

Nah, crypto's grown because of hype. Do you really think bitcoin's hit 60k 30k because it's just that useful?

You could say the same thin about gold. Is it really that useful?
It's about being rare and finite supply. With a finite supply but more buyers, price will natural go up.But yeah, bitocin simply is first to market as well. Other chains for sure have much better usability.

 

[MrSquished]

You could say the same thin about gold. Is it really that useful?
It's about being rare and finite supply. With a finite supply but more buyers, price will natural go up.But yeah, bitocin simply is first to market as well. Other chains for sure have much better usability.

Gold hype was the creation of pretty primitive humans compared to what we are now. Like literally it's shiny and hard to dig out so it's amazing. You really want to go there?

 

[Zorba]

And yet he's still claiming it's a zero-sum gain, which is false. Nice appeal to authority also.

I just hate it when people qualified to talk about a subject do. It is so much better when I go into surgery and I get a guy that washes cars down the street, as opposed to someone with MD and 20 years of surgical experience.

Logical Fallacies: Appeal to Authority

Appeal to Authority: A fundamental reason why the Appeal to Authority can be a fallacy is that a proposition can be well supported only by facts and logically valid inferences. But by using an authority, the argument is relying upon testimony, not facts. A testimony is not an argument and it is...

www.thoughtco.com

Testimony Can Be Strong or Weak

Now, such testimony might be strong or it might be weak. The better the authority, the stronger the testimony will be and the worse the authority, the weaker the testimony will be. Thus, the way to differentiate between a legitimate and a fallacious appeal to authority is by evaluating the nature and strength of who is giving the testimony.

Obviously, the best way to avoid making the fallacy is to avoid relying upon testimony as much as possible, and instead to rely upon original facts and data. But the truth of the matter is, this isnt always possible: we cant verify every single thing ourselves, and thus will always have to make use of the testimony of experts. Nevertheless, we must do so carefully and judiciously.

Legitimate Appeal to Authority

Legitimate appeals to authority involve testimony from individuals who are truly experts in their fields and are giving advice that is within the realm of their expertise, such as a real estate lawyer giving advice about real estate law, or a physician giving a patient medical advice.

 

[njdevilsfan87]

I mean, if you rip the cryptocurrency out of a blockchain, you get the merkle tree it was built on. Which is an actually useful data structure that actual people use for actual productive things, just look at Git.

Nah, crypto's grown because of hype. Do you really think bitcoin's hit 60k 30k because it's just that useful?

I can't tell you why Bitcoin is priced at 30k. But put it this way: in the scenario that this "ponzi scheme" reaches maximum saturation and there's no other human being to sell to, so long as people have faith in it (like they do anything, be it cash, gold, or whatever) - it is limited in supply and trades against an infinite future supply of fiat currencies. If people lose faith then it crashes to zero too.

And before someone tries to throw the whole Greater Fool argument against for the 9th year in a row: it's not that bad of an idea to have a very small portion of your net worth stored on a secure on a hardware wallet despite price volatility. Because short-term volatility doesn't mean a thing when you slot it next to another asset class that only intends to move in the worst of emergencies. But you should have seen this use case coming when it was $3K and not $30K. How one decides to split up their gold bars vs offline crypto hardware wallet is personal preference. And I know this use case doesn't apply to most here: but the general population only controls a small fraction of the wealth in existence. Actually, I take that back. Crypto offers a use case that was previously not economically friendly for most people. Because prior to crypto, there wasn't really a means of "wealth preservation" due to liquidity issues and premium overheads.

 

[MrSquished]

I can't tell you why Bitcoin is priced at 30k. But put it this way: in the scenario that this "ponzi scheme" reaches maximum saturation and there's no other human being to sell to, so long as people have faith in it (like they do anything, be it cash, gold, or whatever) - it is limited in supply and trades against an infinite future supply of fiat currencies. If people lose faith then it crashes to zero too.

And before someone tries to throw the whole Greater Fool argument against for the 9th year in a row: it's not that bad of an idea to have a very small portion of your net worth stored on a secure on a hardware wallet despite price volatility. Because short-term volatility doesn't mean a thing when you slot it next to another asset class that only intends to move in the worst of emergencies. But you should have seen this use case coming when it was $3K and not $30K. How one decides to split up their gold bars vs offline crypto hardware wallet is personal preference. And I know this use case doesn't apply to most here: but the general population only controls a small fraction of the wealth in existence. Actually, I take that back. Crypto offers a use case that was previously not economically friendly for most people. Because prior to crypto, there wasn't really a means of "wealth preservation" due to liquidity issues and premium overheads.

Wealth preservation is this kind of value fluctuation over this amount of time? What are you smoking and can I have some of it?

 

[njdevilsfan87]

Wealth preservation is this kind of value fluctuation over this amount of time? What are you smoking and can I have some of it?

1. Look up the definition of wealth preservation, and then understand it applies to more than just tracking inflation.
2. USDC exists and has for years if you're bent on crypto going up too quickly over the years.

 

[MrSquished]

1. Look up the definition of wealth preservation, and then understand it applies to more than just tracking inflation.
2. USDC exists and has for years if you're bent on crypto going up too quickly over the years.

You are implying the value fluctuations of crypto are due to inflation?

Please please please tell me your dealer's contact info.

 

[njdevilsfan87]

You are implying the value fluctuations of crypto are due to inflation?

Please please please tell me your dealer's contact info.

Am I? Where?

 

[MrSquished]

Am I? Where?

Good luck Crypto Bro

Crypto believers insist this is all worth it. Is it?

After bitcoin’s price crash and major meltdowns in the cryptocurrency space, crypto believers insist Web3 and blockchain and NFTs and bitcoin are all still worth it. Are they?

www.vox.com

 

[beginner99]

Gold hype was the creation of pretty primitive humans compared to what we are now. Like literally it's shiny and hard to dig out so it's amazing. You really want to go there?

That is the point, that it is hard to dig out, eg rare. If it is easy to make it can't have any value. Same reason why certain jobs are paid very badly. Because almost everyone could do them satisfactorily. jobs aren't paid by the value the provide to society but by how many people exist that can do it good enough.

"rareness" or "difficulty" have value. abundance doesn't.

 

[MrSquished]

That is the point, that it is hard to dig out, eg rare. If it is easy to make it can't have any value. Same reason why certain jobs are paid very badly. Because almost everyone could do them satisfactorily. jobs aren't paid by the value the provide to society but by how many people exist that can do it good enough.

"rareness" or "difficulty" have value. abundance doesn't.

For the sake of being shiny and harder to find back in those days, which was literally meaningless in comparison to the state of a human being's life, but it at least has more value than crypto in manufacturing efforts these days. You are primitive.

Regardless, human labor is not a mineral or rock. The Human experience and existence is not a rock or mineral. That is an absolutely inhumane way to look at the value of a human beings time and life. But you are being a shitty person so what else do I expect.

You people are terrible. You are ethically worth about 1,000 stablecoin.

 

[BFG10K]

You could say the same thin about gold.

No you couldn't because gold is real and has highly desirable intrinsic physical properties, like conductivity, corrosion-resistance, reaction-resistance, malleability, luster, and non-toxic.

What valuable intrinsic physical properties does DonkeyLickingCamelScrotumMax have?

Is it really that useful?

Electronics, jewelry, aerospace, construction, computers, dentistry, glass, and medicine.

What use does KittyToungeHippoAnalCoin have, aside from a ponzi scheme that rips off stupid suckers to pay fiat for it?

 

[Meghan54]

You could say the same thin about gold. Is it really that useful?

Is gold useful? Gotta laugh at that question.....which qualifies as one of the stupidest questions of the day. No use for gold....what a laugh.

 

[DrMrLordX]

I'ts a pretty strong claim, since it demonstrably 100% correct.

Pay attention. Nano works. Next!

I just hate it when people qualified to talk about a subject do.

What makes you think he's qualified to discuss the matter? Think carefully before you answer. You may also want to read up on the Appeal to Authority fallacy, since nobody seems to be paying attention that the guy was wrong straight out of the gate, but people are defending his analysis anyway.

Is gold useful? Gotta laugh at that question.....which qualifies as one of the stupidest questions of the day. No use for gold....what a laugh.

It is useful. Demand for the metal in industrial applications is far below production, though.

 

[beginner99]

What use does KittyToungeHippoAnalCoin have, aside from a ponzi scheme that rips off stupid suckers to pay fiat for it?

Your are right. But then there is also BTC, ETH, XMR, ADA, ALGO and potentially others with actual use.

It is useful. Demand for the metal in industrial applications is far below production, though.

Thanks. Excatly my point but haters can't see nuance can't they? Jewelry isn't exactly useful.

 

[sdifox]

You could say the same thin about gold. Is it really that useful?
It's about being rare and finite supply. With a finite supply but more buyers, price will natural go up.But yeah, bitocin simply is first to market as well. Other chains for sure have much better usability.

Gold is valuable partly because it is very useful. About 11% of all gold produced goes into industrial use.

Gold in Industry | Education

Explore an overview of the science of gold as it is used in industry, including the many applications that it holds for development and advancement of technological and scientific ideas. You'll see explanations of fascinating uses and detailed pictures that illustrate how gold is used in our lives.

www.thenaturalsapphirecompany.com

 

[beginner99]

Gold is valuable partly because it is very useful. About 11% of all gold produced goes into industrial use.

Which means by standards of people claiming crypto is useless, 89% of mined gold is useless.

 

[sdifox]

Which means by standards of people claiming crypto is useless, 89% of mined gold is useless.

LoL gold has value in non industrial use as well. What is your crypto currency used for?

Jewelry has its use, or it would have faded into history.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Jewelry has its use, or it would have faded into history.

It looks nice, but it doesn't really do anything for you.

 

[IronWing]

It looks nice, but it doesn't really do anything for you.

You just need the right jewelry.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Pay attention. Nano works. Next!

What makes you think he's qualified to discuss the matter? Think carefully before you answer. You may also want to read up on the Appeal to Authority fallacy, since nobody seems to be paying attention that the guy was wrong straight out of the gate, but people are defending his analysis anyway.

You haven't demonstrated he's wrong, just that you disagree with him.

So far the only thing demonstrated, is that you don't understand what a Zero Sum Game is.

Crypto-Ponzi-Coins are textbook Zero Sum game.

There is no underlying value. 100% of the Value comes from another "player", AKA the next greater fool.

The Coin zealots confuse value of technology, with the value of the coins.

There is some value in block-chain technology but it's vastly overhyped. It's value is just like any software technology like a relational database, or a linked list, but that has ZERO to do with the coins.

Anyone can write their own block-chain software, and they don't pay any usage fees to bitcoin to use blockchain.

It should be obvious that anyone can just freely write their own blockchain based software with zero royalties or anything, just given all the different coins trying to get in on the ponzi scheme game.

 

[beginner99]

LoL gold has value in non industrial use as well. What is your crypto currency used for?

Jewelry has its use, or it would have faded into history.

Thanks for biting. Use is purely subjective That is the point. Just because you think it has no use doesn't mean it is useless. And just because I think jewelry is a waste of money doesn't mean everybody thinks that.

I did link a video that tells you a lot why I support crypto. I'm pro freedom. freedom to be your own bank, freedom from the gripes of the banking system and governments. Of course freedom has it's price and it's not for everyone. But having the choice is important.

Also you can buy drugs with it for a more mundane usability scenario that however falls in the above part as well. Drugs should be legal. Everyone is about "my body my decision" when it comes to abortions. Same for drugs. "my body my decision" what I put in it and not the governments. So yeah the main utility is freedom and while we might not need it that much yet, just look at the trucker strike in Canada were they started to freeze funds of people incl. non-anonymous crypto. That is why we need monero, decentralized exchanges and atomic swaps. Freedom.

There is no underlying value. 100% of the Value comes from another "player", AKA the next greater fool.

How is the dollar any different to that? Dollar isn't backed by gold since decades.

When things go real bad, people will stop accepting your dollars because they don't have any underlying worth in terms of survival.