The Cognitive Decline Disinformation Campaign Being Launched Against Biden

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HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,277
28,135
136
I won't make that promise, but will attempt not to. However, if he is the candidate, I'm quite certain Trump gets re-elected.
Because the guy who promised to raise taxes on the middle class and give free college and healthcare to the undocumented has a better shot at beating Trump. What a tough thing for Republicans to demonize!!

Do I really need to /s??
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,127
5,657
126
Because the guy who promised to raise taxes on the middle class and give free college and healthcare to the undocumented has a better shot at beating Trump. What a tough thing for Republicans to demonize!!

Do I really need to /s??

Bernie offers solutions that are reasonable and popular. Biden offers, not being Trump.
 

Chromagnus

Senior member
Feb 28, 2017
255
111
86
I won't make that promise, but will attempt not to. However, if he is the candidate, I'm quite certain Trump gets re-elected.

This is probably a conversation for a different thread but what makes you think Bernie has a better shot against Trump based on what we've seen in the primaries so far? Bernie's strategy has been about getting big turnout in the youth vote and that hasn't happened in the primaries. In 2018 we saw a large turnout of moderate voters from the suburbs and it looks like that is also happening in the primary. That seems like the most likely thing to continue based on what we've seen so far. Bernie just hasn't been able to get people to turnout to vote for him yet.

I don't think either candidate is guaranteed to beat Trump. If the economy tanks over the next few months and COVID-19 gets really bad then I think either Biden or Bernie would beat Trump. If the opposite happens and this is just a blip with COVID not being as bad and the economy staying strong, than neither Bernie or Biden is likely to beat Trump. That being said, based on the turnout numbers/demographics in the primaries, I'd put Biden's odds higher than Bernie's in either scenario.
 
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sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,127
5,657
126
Let us not forget that defeating Dubyah was a given, because he fucked up royally. Let us also see that Kerry was a better Candidate than Biden is. Nevertheless, largely due to being the Incumbent, Dubyah won.
 
Dec 10, 2005
24,376
7,266
136
The biggest handicap to the Democrats is that they care more about fighting amongst themselves over ideological purity than they do about winning. A good example of this can be found in the thread about the recent market drop in oil prices which keeps getting veered off topic into a 'purity' discussion about how people should drive less. Compromise and pragmatic are lost to the left. And so will elections until those return

Good article on the subject: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/08/opinion/sanders-democratic-primary.html
Exactly. Progressives play an important role in the platform, but you need to take wins when they come. If you can't win anything, you'll just be left screaming at the wind. Take the wins where they come and keep pushing on the platform and expanding the progressive base.

I get that this approach sucks, from an ethical point of view, because you're often compromising on the backs of people that are suffering, but a lot of the population isn't as high-minded.
 

Chromagnus

Senior member
Feb 28, 2017
255
111
86
Let us not forget that defeating Dubyah was a given, because he fucked up royally. Let us also see that Kerry was a better Candidate than Biden is. Nevertheless, largely due to being the Incumbent, Dubyah won.

Anyone who thinks beating Trump is a given is completely misinformed and out of the loop. Beating an incumbent president is always very difficult and near impossible when the economy is good. He is still very popular among Republicans, has an electoral advantage and his campaign has a lot of money. His fate is probably tied to the economy at this point, hence why he freaked out yesterday when the market plunged. He is going to do whatever it takes to try and prop it up until November.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,127
5,657
126
This is probably a conversation for a different thread but what makes you think Bernie has a better shot against Trump based on what we've seen in the primaries so far? Bernie's strategy has been about getting big turnout in the youth vote and that hasn't happened in the primaries. In 2018 we saw a large turnout of moderate voters from the suburbs and it looks like that is also happening in the primary. That seems like the most likely thing to continue based on what we've seen so far. Bernie just hasn't been able to get people to turnout to vote for him yet.

I don't think either candidate is guaranteed to beat Trump. If the economy tanks over the next few months and COVID-19 gets really bad then I think either Biden or Bernie would beat Trump. If the opposite happens and this is just a blip with COVID not being as bad and the economy staying strong, than neither Bernie or Biden is likely to beat Trump. That being said, based on the turnout numbers/demographics in the primaries, I'd put Biden's odds higher than Bernie's in either scenario.

Bernie offers a Vision, Biden does not. Do you think that the Democratic faithful will refuse to vote for Bernie? I seriously doubt it.

Biden will certainly not bring in new blood, especially when he has repeatedly told some of them to vote for Trump when he didn't like their questions. The Youth vote is a difficult voting block to motivate, they have been for decades. They are too busy, disinterested, and/or cynical about politics. They need to be inspired, Bernie offers this.
 

NostaSeronx

Diamond Member
Sep 18, 2011
3,688
1,222
136
America is suffering from cognitive decline how can I not vote for the president to best represent all of us.

Voting Biden, #NeverBernie

Bernie has a track record of requiring us to show intelligence how crude! We are getting dumber Sanders, not smarter. How dare he think he can win the dumb and getting dumber vote! Thinks just because he is an intellectual we don't see his mind games... huh, where was I? Ah, it's Tom's Hardware guide my favorite forum website.
 
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Chromagnus

Senior member
Feb 28, 2017
255
111
86
Bernie offers a Vision, Biden does not. Do you think that the Democratic faithful will refuse to vote for Bernie? I seriously doubt it.

Biden will certainly not bring in new blood, especially when he has repeatedly told some of them to vote for Trump when he didn't like their questions. The Youth vote is a difficult voting block to motivate, they have been for decades. They are too busy, disinterested, and/or cynical about politics. They need to be inspired, Bernie offers this.

Bernie is dominating the youth vote but he is not getting them to turn out and he would need them to turn out in November to beat Trump. Had Bernie won the nomination by getting those people out to vote I would have felt much better about his chances in November but there just hasn't been any evidence yet that he can. Bernie has a ton of money and a strong ground game and he still isn't getting people out to vote for him.

The facts are that Biden has gotten more people to come out and vote for him than Bernie has. The people that are voting for Biden are more consistent voters that are going to come out again in November. Many of those people would still come out and vote for Bernie but they've made their voices clear that they'd rather vote for Biden.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
Let us not forget that defeating Dubyah was a given, because he fucked up royally. Let us also see that Kerry was a better Candidate than Biden is. Nevertheless, largely due to being the Incumbent, Dubyah won.

False. The folly of GWB's policy was not apparent until after the 2004 election.
 

Chromagnus

Senior member
Feb 28, 2017
255
111
86
The housing boom was in full swing & the disaster in Iraq & Afghanistan was just beginning to unfold. 9/11! 9/11! 9/11! still occupied the public consciousness.

The full folly of his actions weren't fully recognized until his second term but by the 4th year of his presidency the 9/11 swoon was definitely gone and it looked many like normal R/D divide. His net approval rating was in low single digits and went negative for a while during that 4th year before getting reelected. That being said anyone who thought beating him was a lock was also very misinformed.

I can't link it as a picture but 538 has some good graphs that show his approval ratings over time along with that of all the recent presidents:
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/trump-approval-ratings/?ex_cid=rrpromo
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,277
28,135
136
Bernie offers a Vision, Biden does not. Do you think that the Democratic faithful will refuse to vote for Bernie? I seriously doubt it.

Biden will certainly not bring in new blood, especially when he has repeatedly told some of them to vote for Trump when he didn't like their questions. The Youth vote is a difficult voting block to motivate, they have been for decades. They are too busy, disinterested, and/or cynical about politics. They need to be inspired, Bernie offers this.
Bernie wins the nomination suburban women will leave in droves.

Besides even if Sanders managed to win in Nov, people will vote in a check for Congress. Senate will not change and chance House is lost.

What do you have then? Mitch McConnell passing NOTHING
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,277
28,135
136
Let us not forget that defeating Dubyah was a given, because he fucked up royally. Let us also see that Kerry was a better Candidate than Biden is. Nevertheless, largely due to being the Incumbent, Dubyah won.
One of the reasons Kerry lost he wouldn't fight back against the Swiftboat so called Vets
 

senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
35,787
6,195
126
I heard that Trump is so senile, he forgot to order enough coronavirus tests ahead of time. Story checked out.
 

alcoholbob

Diamond Member
May 24, 2005
6,271
323
126
No, because this is politics, not manufacturing. It's almost like apples aren't oranges.

What I don't see here from you is any denial nor any suitable reckoning of the fact that Sanders has always been Russia's second favorite presidential candidate -- the other being Trump.

It's it you suggestion that Russia is supporting Sanders because they also sometimes want what's best for our country? Or are you just trying to change the subject?

Ok, let's try this one, maybe this one you will understand, or most likely you are going to try obfuscating again and pretend not to understand. If Russia is for peace in the Afghanistan or Iraq, is your position that we continue wars in the Mid East to oppose them?
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
Ok, let's try this one, maybe this one you will understand, or most likely you are going to try obfuscating again and pretending not to understand. If Russia is for peace in the Afghanistan or Iraq, is your position that we continue wars in the Mid East to oppose them?

The Russia people are the farthest gone, it's QAnon for liberals. We've never even seen evidence that they actually support Sanders.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,127
5,657
126
Bernie wins the nomination suburban women will leave in droves.

Besides even if Sanders managed to win in Nov, people will vote in a check for Congress. Senate will not change and chance House is lost.

What do you have then? Mitch McConnell passing NOTHING

Why would they leave?
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,708
49,291
136
The Russia people are the farthest gone, it's QAnon for liberals. We've never even seen evidence that they actually support Sanders.

Interesting, as Sanders himself appears to believe the Russians have acted to support him. Are you calling him a Qanon?



Russian state run media also treats him considerably more favorably than his opponent:


Facebook shared its data with Graphika, a social media analytics firm, which said that four of the suspended accounts had a focus on praising Sanders.

A 2019 report from the social media analytics firm Graphika showed screenshots of suspended Instagram accounts. One, which praised Sanders, reads: "Millions of people in America want to get an education. And Bernie Sanders is their last hope."

He was the only candidate on the Democratic side who was a focus of these fake accounts, according to a Graphika report. And in some cases, these accounts plagiarized memes and comments directly from the Sanders campaign.

Now I 100% agree with Sanders that Russia does not actually want him to win the presidency and their goal is to sow chaos and weaken Biden as opposed to elect Sanders, but to say there's no evidence that Russia is trying to boost his campaign like it has in the past is just living in a fantasy world.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
Interesting, as Sanders himself appears to believe the Russians have acted to support him. Are you calling him a Qanon?



Russian state run media also treats him considerably more favorably than his opponent:




Now I 100% agree with Sanders that Russia does not actually want him to win the presidency and their goal is to sow chaos and weaken Biden as opposed to elect Sanders, but to say there's no evidence that Russia is trying to boost his campaign like it has in the past is just living in a fantasy world.

I don't fucking care what Sanders or his campaign say. These two paragraphs perfectly summarize the allegations:

"It isn't clear precisely how much Russia is doing to help Sanders via the anonymity of cyberspace, but national security officials warned on Monday that social media agitation and disinformation have continued through this year's presidential race.

A statement signed by top Trump administration officials stressed that foreign actors were spreading "false information and propaganda about political processes and candidates on social media in hopes to cause confusion and create doubt in our system."

Zero evidence presented. But credulous rubes like you will gobble it up because it's what you want to hear.
 
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