The difference between Dems and Repubs on 'Bush tax cuts'

[Craig234]

Sometimes, a visual does especially well at showing information.

Watch the following Rachel Maddow clip from 5:30 to 7:00; be sure to watch to the end of that because the first version you see changes.

This is an especially clear picture of the difference between the two parties on this.

And this is in a time that the concentration of wealth has returned to the peaks not seen since just before the Great Depression, when the top has gotten all economic growth.

There has been a massive shift of wealth to the top from everyone else, and the Republicans want to shift more.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/ns/msnbc_tv-rachel_maddow_show/#40099652

 

[manimal]

First thing they will do is scream wealth redistribution..sadly they are right but in the opposite direction..

 

[EagleKeeper]

When the progressives are willing to increase their taxes, then it will be interesting.

Otherwise it is just sour grapes, people wanting what some else has and are not willing to work as hard for it.

 

[Craig234]

When the progressives are willing to increase their taxes, then it will be interesting.

Otherwise it is just sour grapes, people wanting what some else has and are not willing to work as hard for it.

You didn't use the word 'jealousy', for which I have a rule the person is an idiot, but you came too close, and are just as wrong.

Your post really shows the wrong, uninformed, ideological poison that has infected so many people who have no idea about wealth as their nation is stolen from them.

Your comments affect ranges in the middle class. They are not relevant to the ultra wealthy - in this post's graphic, the $1 million+ per year income group.

The issue isn't that not one person can move into that group - but that it's impossible for more than a very few, and that the group's interests can slash opportunity for others.

 

[jiggahertz]

Where is the pretty little graphic that shows in absolute $ how much each tax bracket pays? Of course when you use absolute $ instead of a percentage of income you'll see tax hikes will always hit the upper brackets disproportionately. Also, the last row has no upper bound so using absolute $ here is even more disingenuous. If you don't concern yourself with silly little details and look at the balls though, you can clearly see the republican plan to not raise taxes on anyone is evil.

 

[Throckmorton]

 

[Double Trouble]

Where is the pretty little graphic that shows in absolute $ how much each tax bracket pays? Of course when you use absolute $ instead of a percentage of income you'll see tax hikes will always hit the upper brackets disproportionately. Also, the last row has no upper bound so using absolute $ here is even more disingenuous. If you don't concern yourself with silly little details and look at the balls though, you can clearly see the republican plan to not raise taxes on anyone is evil.

Yep, pretty much the kind of "progressive" drivel you'd expect to see from that moron Maddow.

 

[Phokus]

When the progressives are willing to increase their taxes, then it will be interesting.

Otherwise it is just sour grapes, people wanting what some else has and are not willing to work as hard for it.

Yes, clearly someone like Warren Buffet or Bill Gates wanting more taxes are jealous and lazy.

 

[cubby1223]

Your post really shows the wrong, uninformed, ideological poison that has infected so many people who have no idea about wealth as their nation is stolen from them.

This is just comical at this point Do you seriously write this with a straight face?

 

[Double Trouble]

This is just comical at this point Do you seriously write this with a straight face?

Common now, you should know Craig by now, he lives that drivel, he's one of the few "true believers". Most "progressives" spout off this nonsense, but eventually figure out that it's garbage. Craig actually believes it.

 

[xj0hnx]

This is just comical at this point Do you seriously write this with a straight face?

Shilling is serious biz'.

 

[HomerJS]

This bout sums it up...

 

[manimal]

This is just comical at this point Do you seriously write this with a straight face?

whats comical is the the majority of the rebutals from the mental giants in this thread goes along the lines of "your stupid" or "hes a moron" instead of attacking the substance of the argument.

While I may not agree with everything craig says I can at least look at the issues substantively. If your incapable of doing that 4 chan is that way ------>>>

 

[trenchfoot]

whats comical is the the majority of the rebutals from the mental giants in this thread goes along the lines of "your stupid" or "hes a moron" instead of attacking the substance of the argument.

While I may not agree with everything craig says I can at least look at the issues substantively. If your incapable of doing that 4 chan is that way ------>>>

In reference to the mental giants: Karl Rove Multiple Mind Meld via FOX strikes again. :biggrin:

edit - OT: If Fox was forced to always tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, they'd have absolutely nothing to report, except that their first amendment rights to lie at will were violated.

On topic, those charts and graphs are actually pretty telling.

 

[hal2kilo]

whats comical is the the majority of the rebutals from the mental giants in this thread goes along the lines of "your stupid" or "hes a moron" instead of attacking the substance of the argument.

While I may not agree with everything craig says I can at least look at the issues substantively. If your incapable of doing that 4 chan is that way ------>>>

Facts is librul, duh!

 

[CycloWizard]

Yes, clearly someone like Warren Buffet or Bill Gates wanting more taxes are jealous and lazy.

I'm still waiting for them to cut a check to the US Treasury. Until then, it's meaningless to use them as an example.

 

[jackace]

Where is the pretty little graphic that shows in absolute $ how much each tax bracket pays? Of course when you use absolute $ instead of a percentage of income you'll see tax hikes will always hit the upper brackets disproportionately. Also, the last row has no upper bound so using absolute $ here is even more disingenuous. If you don't concern yourself with silly little details and look at the balls though, you can clearly see the republican plan to not raise taxes on anyone is evil.

Any tax structure we use has to hit the upper tax brackets harder. That is just a fact of economics we can't avoid. If you want to equally burden 2 people who make radically different amounts of money you have to consider marginal utility of money. There is just no way around it. To do anything less results in the burden being unequally shared.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Yes, clearly someone like Warren Buffet or Bill Gates wanting more taxes are jealous and lazy.

Are those the only progressives?

You, Craig and others seem to feel that not enough taxes are being paid by those that are well off.

To some, you are well off; are you increasing your tax payments or that is a burden on you?

 

[Phokus]

I'm still waiting for them to cut a check to the US Treasury. Until then, it's meaningless to use them as an example.

They're giving away all their money, i doubt they give a shit. And this is a stupid cop-out, it's not just about their own money, but they don't want to see the US fall further into a plutocratic hellhole (as much as it already is).

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

whats comical is the the majority of the rebutals from the mental giants in this thread goes along the lines of "your stupid" or "hes a moron" instead of attacking the substance of the argument.

While I may not agree with everything craig says I can at least look at the issues substantively. If your incapable of doing that 4 chan is that way ------>>>

I look forward to your posts on this subject in PJabber's threads.

 

[Phokus]

This bout sums it up...

There is literally no reason for the poor, working class, middle class, and even upper middle class to vote Republican when it comes to taxes.

 

[CycloWizard]

They're giving away all their money, i doubt they give a shit. And this is a stupid cop-out, it's not just about their own money, but they don't want to see the US fall further into a plutocratic hellhole (as much as it already is).

Apparently it's not at all about their money, or they'd be putting it where their mouths are. What you failed to notice is that, rather than giving their money to government, they are using it to fund private charities. Maybe this is the bit of their message you're missing.

If you want to live in a socialist society, feel free to do so - there are plenty to choose from. You might very well be better off there. Those of us who are willing to apply some elbow grease and know-how to try to make something of ourselves, like Bill Gates and Warren Buffett, are free to do so. It's funny that the richest people around are self-made, yet they are somehow a symbol of everything that's wrong rather than what is possible.

edit: I'll also point out that most of the work the Gates Foundation does is overseas to help the real poor. I have never been able to understand why liberals are so vocal about foreign citizens being equal in worth to Americans when it comes to war, but not when it comes to addressing real poverty. My guess is that they've never dealt with poverty in the US, so they have no baseline for reference. Or it's because they just use it as an anti-war talking point rather than being sincere in believing that human life itself has value, regardless of where it lives.

 

[CycloWizard]

There is literally no reason for the poor, working class, middle class, and even upper middle class to vote Republican when it comes to taxes.

Irony of ironies! All of the federal taxes they pay now or would pay under either of the proposed plans would be the same (within $2 a year anyway) and would go entirely towards FICA. See what you did there?

 

[Genx87]

Irony of ironies! All of the federal taxes they pay now or would pay under either of the proposed plans would be the same (within $2 a year anyway) and would go entirely towards FICA. See what you did there?

Yeah, looking at that chart. The difference between the repubs and dems for anybody making upto 500K is a very small amount. It isnt until you get into the top brackets there is a disparity.

 

[Phokus]

Apparently it's not at all about their money, or they'd be putting it where their mouths are. What you failed to notice is that, rather than giving their money to government, they are using it to fund private charities. Maybe this is the bit of their message you're missing.

If you want to live in a socialist society, feel free to do so - there are plenty to choose from. You might very well be better off there. Those of us who are willing to apply some elbow grease and know-how to try to make something of ourselves, like Bill Gates and Warren Buffett, are free to do so. It's funny that the richest people around are self-made, yet they are somehow a symbol of everything that's wrong rather than what is possible.

edit: I'll also point out that most of the work the Gates Foundation does is overseas to help the real poor. I have never been able to understand why liberals are so vocal about foreign citizens being equal in worth to Americans when it comes to war, but not when it comes to addressing real poverty. My guess is that they've never dealt with poverty in the US, so they have no baseline for reference. Or it's because they just use it as an anti-war talking point rather than being sincere in believing that human life itself has value, regardless of where it lives.

No, you're missing the message. Buffet has stated that he's giving away his money because he doesn't want his children to do nothing, the implication is that they have to earn their own money. It's part of the reason that he, gates, and other superwealthy are in favor of the estate tax, because they are against such egregious wealth accumulation amongst their peers. They started a new initiative to get their superwealthy peers to commit to giving at least 50% of their wealth to charity. Their other initiative is to keep or raise the estate tax and lobby against lowering tax rates for the wealthy.

You just don't get it.