The F-35 is a piece of garbage!

[Puffnstuff]

I just came across this story of the F-35 being grounded http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/16/politics/us-air-force-grounds-f-35/index.html which I find interesting. As for my suggestion of a sky born battleship/carrier it doesn't have to stay aloft. It could fly up to a point within range of the target and set down behind cover like a mountain range so it isn't visible to radar and launch from a protected area and once done pick up and relocate before the enemy could locate and retaliate against it. This would provide a versatility not found in water based carriers and would offer more firepower than a single aircraft does.

 

[walrus]

Long article discussing the problems with the F-35

F-35 May Never Be Ready for Combat Testing Report Contradicts Air Force Leadership’s Rosy Pronouncements


http://www.pogo.org/straus/issues/w...er-may-never-be-ready-for-combat-5c1180d6e2b1

 

[spacejamz]

I just came across this story of the F-35 being grounded http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/16/politics/us-air-force-grounds-f-35/index.html which I find interesting. As for my suggestion of a sky born battleship/carrier it doesn't have to stay aloft. It could fly up to a point within range of the target and set down behind cover like a mountain range so it isn't visible to radar and launch from a protected area and once done pick up and relocate before the enemy could locate and retaliate against it. This would provide a versatility not found in water based carriers and would offer more firepower than a single aircraft does.

 

[pauldun170]

Long article discussing the problems with the F-35

F-35 May Never Be Ready for Combat Testing Report Contradicts Air Force Leadership’s Rosy Pronouncements


http://www.pogo.org/straus/issues/w...er-may-never-be-ready-for-combat-5c1180d6e2b1

Long article discussing the problems with the F-35

F-35 May Never Be Ready for Combat Testing Report Contradicts Air Force Leadership’s Rosy Pronouncements


http://www.pogo.org/straus/issues/w...er-may-never-be-ready-for-combat-5c1180d6e2b1

Root cause is Michael Gilmore trying to justify DOT&E budget and playing cover my ass.
Already discussed earlier in the thread from the last time Gilmore put out a memo on the F-35.

 

[IronWing]

No, it's an awesome idea! Totally un-achievable but still, Star Blazers fans can dream.... someday.

 

[spacejamz]

No, it's an awesome idea! Totally un-achievable but still, Star Blazers fans can dream.... someday.

we don't even have flying cars yet...how are we supposed to make a flying aircraft carrier (i.e., the world's biggest sitting duck)?

But a wave motion gun would be totally kick ass!!!

 

[norseamd]

http://www.defensenews.com/articles/f-35a-damaged-in-fire-at-air-force-base

 

[gorobei]

general rebuttal from RNAF Major Morten “Dolby” Hanche on f35 issues. published in the official blog of the Norwegian F-35 Program Office within the Norwegian Ministry of Defence.
https://nettsteder.regjeringen.no/k...-disaster-how-i-read-test-reports-as-a-pilot/
at the very least the engine sounds like it is a winner.

 

[John Connor]

There seems to be a lot of people here in the know about military tech. So I ask this question: Is there an air to air missile that's guided (steered) by the jet's computer to the enemy aircraft by using GPS assistance getting its coordinates from the jet's radar to steer the missile on target? There by not alerting the foe aircraft? Or can the foe aircraft see the heat signal from the missile blazing at him at like mach 3?

If we don't have this tech, we NEED IT! Imagine the capability! Not only could a F-35 or F-22 sit 50 miles away from the foe, but fire a missile and say forgetabout it.

I can't wait till DARPA brings that miniature, practically stamp size INS to market. It's a chip with a timer, accelerometer, and gyro. This will make GPS a thing of the past! Would change a lot of things and GPS jamming will be a thing of the past. Until the counter measure is developed which my gears have already thought about. Namely small impact zone EMP's. I have said to myself time and time again that we need to EMP shield our military hardware.

I thought of another idea for DARPA about air conditioned suits for soldiers in the desert. It uses pelter devices. I even thought of a way that they could be used with Biohazzard suits as well.

 

[norseamd]

There seems to be a lot of people here in the know about military tech. So I ask this question: Is there an air to air missile that's guided (steered) by the jet's computer to the enemy aircraft by using GPS assistance getting its coordinates from the jet's radar to steer the missile on target? There by not alerting the foe aircraft? Or can the foe aircraft see the heat signal from the missile blazing at him at like mach 3?

If we don't have this tech, we NEED IT! Imagine the capability! Not only could a F-35 or F-22 sit 50 miles away from the foe, but fire a missile and say forgetabout it.

I can't wait till DARPA brings that miniature, practically stamp size INS to market. It's a chip with a timer, accelerometer, and gyro. This will make GPS a thing of the past! Would change a lot of things and GPS jamming will be a thing of the past. Until the counter measure is developed which my gears have already thought about. Namely small impact zone EMP's. I have said to myself time and time again that we need to EMP shield or military hardware.

I thought of another idea for DARPA about air conditioned suits for soldiers in the desert. It uses pelter devices. I even thought of a way that they could be used with Biohazzard suits as well.

You might be able to guide a missile into the general vicinity of any target aircraft with GPS, but GPS is certainly not accurate enough today to score a hit on an aircraft, especially an aircraft moving at hundreds or even thousands of miles per minute, nevermind you would also need altitude data, and I am not sure if GPS actually handles any altitude data. You could however switch over to another guidance system for the terminal phase once you reach the vicinity of the target aircraft. You could use radar, infrared tracking, or some other type of guidance to hit the aircraft.

 

[norseamd]

There seems to be a lot of people here in the know about military tech. So I ask this question: Is there an air to air missile that's guided (steered) by the jet's computer to the enemy aircraft by using GPS assistance getting its coordinates from the jet's radar to steer the missile on target? There by not alerting the foe aircraft? Or can the foe aircraft see the heat signal from the missile blazing at him at like mach 3?

If we don't have this tech, we NEED IT! Imagine the capability! Not only could a F-35 or F-22 sit 50 miles away from the foe, but fire a missile and say forgetabout it.

I can't wait till DARPA brings that miniature, practically stamp size INS to market. It's a chip with a timer, accelerometer, and gyro. This will make GPS a thing of the past! Would change a lot of things and GPS jamming will be a thing of the past. Until the counter measure is developed which my gears have already thought about. Namely small impact zone EMP's. I have said to myself time and time again that we need to EMP shield or military hardware.

I thought of another idea for DARPA about air conditioned suits for soldiers in the desert. It uses pelter devices. I even thought of a way that they could be used with Biohazzard suits as well.

Interception course stage



Grumman F-14 Tomcat carrying an AMRAAM during a 1982 test

AMRAAM uses two-stage guidance when fired at long range. The aircraft passes data to the missile just before launch, giving it information about the location of the target aircraft from the launch point and its direction and speed. The missile uses this information to fly on an interception course to the target using its built-in inertial navigation system (INS). This information is generally obtained using the launching aircraft's radar, although it could come from an Infra-red search and track system, from a data link from another fighter aircraft, or from an AWACS aircraft.

After launch, if the firing aircraft or surrogate continues to track the target, periodic updates—such as changes in the target's direction and speed—are sent from the launch aircraft to the missile, allowing the missile to adjust its course, via actuation of the rear fins, so that it is able to close to a self-homing distance where it will be close enough to "catch" the target aircraft in the basket (the missile's radar field of view in which it will be able to lock onto the target aircraft, unassisted by the launch aircraft).

Not all armed services using the AMRAAM have elected to purchase the mid-course update option, which limits AMRAAM's effectiveness in some scenarios. The RAF initially opted not to use mid-course update for its Tornado F3 force, only to discover that without it, testing proved the AMRAAM was less effective in beyond visual range (BVR) engagements than the older semi-active radar homing BAE Skyflash weapon—the AIM-120's own radar is necessarily of limited range and power compared to that of the launch aircraft.

Terminal stage and impact
Once the missile closes to self-homing distance, it turns on its active radar seeker and searches for the target aircraft. If the target is in or near the expected location, the missile will find it and guide itself to the target from this point. If the missile is fired at short range, within visual range (WVR) or the near BVR, it can use its active seeker just after launch, making the missile truly "fire and forget".[citation needed]

Boresight mode
Apart from the slave mode, there is a free guidance mode, called boresight. This mode is radar guidance-free, the missile just fires and locks the first thing it sees. This mode can be used for defensive shot, i.e. when the enemy has numerical superiority.

 

[John Connor]

They complicated the hell out of it! LOL! I would have NOT made it radar seeking on close range. I think the F-22 and 35 radar is good enough where you could fire and send inputs to the missile's INS from 50 miles all the way to the foe. My idea is that it would make it hard for the foe to jam or counter. But it looks like I was thinking in the right direction, but damn the complication they made it! LOL

 

[John Connor]

You might be able to guide a missile into the general vicinity of any target aircraft with GPS, but GPS is certainly not accurate enough today to score a hit on an aircraft, especially an aircraft moving at hundreds or even thousands of miles per minute, nevermind you would also need altitude data, and I am not sure if GPS actually handles any altitude data. You could however switch over to another guidance system for the terminal phase once you reach the vicinity of the target aircraft. You could use radar, infrared tracking, or some other type of guidance to hit the aircraft.

GPS does have altitude. Have you seen elevation in a GPS or smartphone App? It's on timing. Very precise timing. But I think you're right. At that speed GPS may not work as well. But INS is pretty damn accurate. I know, because though my reading and learning about the 737 and its INS, if you pick the aircraft up and move it to the next gate without correction in the FMC, you jack up the whole navigation.

 

[norseamd]

GPS does have altitude. Have you seen elevation in a GPS or smartphone App? It's on timing. Very precise timing. But I think you're right. At that speed GPS may not work as well. But INS is pretty damn accurate. I know, because though my reading and learning about the 737 and its INS, if you pick the aircraft up and move it to the next gate without correction in the FMC, you jack up the whole navigation.

Also .....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-satellite_weapon

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/war-in-space-may-be-closer-than-ever/

http://www.globalsecurity.org/space/systems/asat-overview.htm

https://www.stratfor.com/analysis/real-danger-space-weapons

 

[John Connor]

I've read that the X-37B was a space type weapon for secretly disabling Sats. But I digress, an INS doesn't use GPS.

 

[norseamd]

I've read that the X-37B was a space type weapon for secretly disabling Sats. But I digress, an INS doesn't use GPS.

Right, but anything that has to rely on GPS is entirely worthless in the long term.

Anything and everything up in space can get shot down very easily and very early.

And all that destruction would cause a ton of space debris.

And if you were to enter Kessler Syndrome .....

.....

.....

.....

.....

 

[John Connor]

Right, but anything that has to rely on GPS is entirely worthless in the long term.

That's why I said this:

I can't wait till DARPA brings that miniature, practically stamp size INS to market. It's a chip with a timer, accelerometer, and gyro. This will make GPS a thing of the past! Would change a lot of things and GPS jamming will be a thing of the past. Until the counter measure is developed which my gears have already thought about. Namely small impact zone EMP's. I have said to myself time and time again that we need to EMP shield our military hardware.

 

[Puffnstuff]

we don't even have flying cars yet...how are we supposed to make a flying aircraft carrier (i.e., the world's biggest sitting duck)?

You know when the C-130 was created nobody envisioned it becoming an airborne assault platform yet here we are with the spectre gunship. Of course long range stand off weapons can be used at great expense to reach interior targets but security is like an onion with lots of layers. Weapons systems operate in a similar manner with tiers of service and some overlap to eliminate mutual exclusiveness for greater combat effectiveness.

 

[norseamd]

You know when the C-130 was created nobody envisioned it becoming an airborne assault platform yet here we are with the spectre gunship. Of course long range stand off weapons can be used at great expense to reach interior targets but security is like an onion with lots of layers. Weapons systems operate in a similar manner with tiers of service and some overlap to eliminate mutual exclusiveness for greater combat effectiveness.

One involved the lack of creative thought, the other involves no lack of creative thought and absolutely huge technical challenges.

 

[norseamd]

You know when the C-130 was created nobody envisioned it becoming an airborne assault platform yet here we are with the spectre gunship. Of course long range stand off weapons can be used at great expense to reach interior targets but security is like an onion with lots of layers. Weapons systems operate in a similar manner with tiers of service and some overlap to eliminate mutual exclusiveness for greater combat effectiveness.

Some of your thinking is not bad at all, and is in fact actually quite accurate.

You should read these.

http://breakingdefense.com/2015/04/no-mans-sea-csbas-lethal-vision-of-future-naval-war/

http://thediplomat.com/2015/04/what-is-the-future-of-naval-warfare/

https://issuu.com/csbaonline/docs/mmpsr-web?e=15123547/14384833

http://cimsec.org/strategic-architectures

 

[Puffnstuff]

Some of your thinking is not bad at all, and is in fact actually quite accurate.

You should read these.

http://breakingdefense.com/2015/04/no-mans-sea-csbas-lethal-vision-of-future-naval-war/

http://thediplomat.com/2015/04/what-is-the-future-of-naval-warfare/

https://issuu.com/csbaonline/docs/mmpsr-web?e=15123547/14384833

http://cimsec.org/strategic-architectures

Thanks for the links. I'm reading the no man's sea article now which mirrors the /Army's air land battle doctrine..

 

[Darwin333]

I must say that I'm a geek and really like cool warplane tech like the F-22. Granted I'm not a fan of the money spent but fuck it if we are going to spend so much on military we might as well have some cool ass shit. I have very high hopes for the F-35 but if what just popped up on my google feed is true it's a serious clusterfuck.

The Pentagon’s top testing office warns that the F-35 is in no way ready for combat since it is “not effective and not suitable across the required mission areas and against currently fielded threats.”

As it stands now, the F-35 would need to run away from combat and have other planes come to its rescue, since it “will need support to locate and avoid modern threats, acquire targets, and engage formations of enemy fighter aircraft due to outstanding performance deficiencies and limited weapons carriage available (i.e., two bombs and two air-to-air missiles).”

In several instances, the memo rated the F-35A less capable than the aircraftwe already have.

https://warisboring.com/the-f-35-st...r-be-ready-for-combat-852317be3368#.dhmcsz1cg

 

[Fenixgoon]

There seems to be a lot of people here in the know about military tech. So I ask this question: Is there an air to air missile that's guided (steered) by the jet's computer to the enemy aircraft by using GPS assistance getting its coordinates from the jet's radar to steer the missile on target? There by not alerting the foe aircraft? Or can the foe aircraft see the heat signal from the missile blazing at him at like mach 3?

If we don't have this tech, we NEED IT! Imagine the capability! Not only could a F-35 or F-22 sit 50 miles away from the foe, but fire a missile and say forgetabout it.

I can't wait till DARPA brings that miniature, practically stamp size INS to market. It's a chip with a timer, accelerometer, and gyro. This will make GPS a thing of the past! Would change a lot of things and GPS jamming will be a thing of the past. Until the counter measure is developed which my gears have already thought about. Namely small impact zone EMP's. I have said to myself time and time again that we need to EMP shield our military hardware.

I thought of another idea for DARPA about air conditioned suits for soldiers in the desert. It uses pelter devices. I even thought of a way that they could be used with Biohazzard suits as well.

modern missiles are already fire-and-forget - the missiles have their own guidance systems built in that do final guidance to the target craft. the front end of the AIM9, for example, contains the IR seeker.

also, missiles are more like shotguns in the air. they don't actually hit aircraft - they fragment and try to destroy critical systems.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIM-9_Sidewinder

edit: modern military hardware is EMP tested. at least navy aircraft are - http://www.navair.navy.mil/ibst/03_E3/emp.html

 

[alcoholbob]

The per unit cost of the F35 (so called afforadable model) has exceeded the cost of the F22 (the flagship air superiority model). Thing is the F-22 pretty much does everything better than the F35, so were just doubling down on a failed program here, and I dont even get why so many countries or the navy is thinking its a good idea to use a single engine, flying trashcan that isnt even very fast to be used in a primary interceptor role.

I mean i get many allies buying it as a way to pay tribute to the US since they assume their actual defense is outsourced to the US, but this seems to be a terrible plane for the Navy.

 

[norseamd]

modern missiles are already fire-and-forget - the missiles have their own guidance systems built in that do final guidance to the target craft. the front end of the AIM9, for example, contains the IR seeker.

also, missiles are more like shotguns in the air. they don't actually hit aircraft - they fragment and try to destroy critical systems.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIM-9_Sidewinder

edit: modern military hardware is EMP tested. at least navy aircraft are - http://www.navair.navy.mil/ibst/03_E3/emp.html

Apparently when it comes to stuff like tanks, the tank armor is already so thick it effectively acts as an EMP shield for everything inside the vehicle.