The flu shot hysteria makes me laugh.

[Imp]

It makes me sad that on a tech site, there are so many scientifically illiterate individuals, especially when it's already been stated in the thread that what they appear to believe is incorrect.

Don't be. Just like how doctors can suck at business/finances yet are capable of memorizing multiple phonebooks worth of facts on medical stuff. Being a tech requires a fraction of a doctor's education...

 

[disappoint]

Sixteen hours after deciding to end it all watching internet numbskulls spew forth how detached from reality they are and writing the note, I realized that my plan for a slow but painless suicide by rolling my eyes repeatedly was not working.

 

[sportage]

ANYONE that works with the public should get the shot.
Especially my friend at Walmart that is a checkout clerk.
He has the flu.
Slept on the bathroom floor for 3 nights just because he got tired running back and forth between the bed and the bathroom.
As he told me, "its coming out of both ends".
So why didn't you get the shot, I asked?
Answer, "Oh... I heard someone got it and died afterwards".

He did recover. But now has come down with the flu AGAIN. Twice now in a month.

 

[SparkyJJO]

It makes me sad that on a tech site, there are so many scientifically illiterate individuals, especially when it's already been stated in the thread that what they appear to believe is incorrect.

It has been known for a long time that the flu shot isn't 100% effective. It's usually about 60-70% effective.

Hmmmm... I'll attempt to explain using an analogy. The mathematical models are somewhat similar. Let's turn to nuclear bombs. I think just about everyone has heard of "critical mass" - below which, you're not getting a boom. Above which, bad shit starts to happen. It's similar to that in the population. If below a certain percentage of the people are vaccinated (and really, the vaccination is only affective about 3 to 4 out of 5 times), then the flu spreads very rapidly and infects a high percentage of individuals. This results in more people (young, elderly) dying from the flu. But, if the percentage of the population that is successfully vaccinated is high enough, then the flu spreads, but not as rapidly, and not infecting as high a percentage of the population.

Even so, that's a horrible effectiveness rate, then add in the mercury and it really sounds even worse of an idea. Besides, if I don't have the flu I'm not passing it on to anyone, and if I do have the flu, I stay home so I'm not passing it on anyway. BTW, last time I got the flu was several years ago.

Amuses me how we all know how toxic mercury is, even in small amounts, then it gets used in tooth fillings and vaccinations Yes, there are mercury-free alternatives now (took them long enough to come out with those) but mercury is still used a lot.

 

[Brainonska511]

Even so, that's a horrible effectiveness rate, then add in the mercury and it really sounds even worse of an idea. Besides, if I don't have the flu I'm not passing it on to anyone, and if I do have the flu, I stay home so I'm not passing it on anyway.

Amuses me how we all know how toxic mercury is, even in small amounts, then it gets used in tooth fillings and vaccinations Yes, there are mercury-free alternatives now (took them long enough to come out with those) but mercury is still used a lot.

A) No mercury in any single-dose vaccines in pretty much the last 10 years in the US.
B) The form of mercury present in multi-dose vials breaks down and passes through the human body quickly and is not nearly as toxic as the form of mercury present in tuna.
C) You can pass illnesses before you show symptoms. How are you going to know to stay home when you can be passing the virus and still feel fine?
D) And by the way, 60% > 0%.

 

[BladeVenom]

ANYONE that works with the public should get the shot.
Especially my friend at Walmart that is a checkout clerk.
He has the flu.
Slept on the bathroom floor for 3 nights just because he got tired running back and forth between the bed and the bathroom.
As he told me, "its coming out of both ends".
So why didn't you get the shot, I asked?
Answer, "Oh... I heard someone got it and died afterwards".

He did recover. But now has come down with the flu AGAIN. Twice now in a month.

That most likely wasn't even the flu.

 

[SparkyJJO]

A) No mercury in any single-dose vaccines in pretty much the last 10 years in the US.
B) The form of mercury present in multi-dose vials breaks down and passes through the human body quickly and is not nearly as toxic as the form of mercury present in tuna.
C) You can pass illnesses before you show symptoms. How are you going to know to stay home when you can be passing the virus and still feel fine?
D) And by the way, 60% > 0%.

And given how often I get the flu (rarely, so I'm also rarely a carrier) I'd rather not take the shot and increase my risks of getting it (and therefore increase my carrier risk also if you want to play the guilt game). I simply get the flu less often than those people who get the flu shot.

Besides, every time they'd give the flu shot out on the ship when my brother was in the navy, half the ship would get the flu within a few days afterwards. Since he's been out of the navy he's gotten the flu far less often. Sounds like that shot does its job... not.

 

[Gooberlx2]

And given how often I get the flu (rarely, so I'm also rarely a carrier) I'd rather not take the shot and increase my risks of getting it (and therefore increase my carrier risk also if you want to play the guilt game). I simply get the flu less often than those people who get the flu shot.

Besides, every time they'd give the flu shot out on the ship when my brother was in the navy, half the ship would get the flu within a few days afterwards. Since he's been out of the navy he's gotten the flu far less often. Sounds like that shot does its job... not.

You don't actually get the flu, nor are you contagious from receiving the vaccine. I doubt even one person on that ship had the flu as a result of receiving a vaccine. You do experience an immune reaction for a couple days as your body reacts and naturally develops antibodies.

Additionally, while you may rarely experience flu symptoms, that doesn't mean you never get the flu and aren't a carrier. It only means that you lucky, healthy, person had the advantage of a working immune system to develop antibodies and fight infection before symptoms presented themselves. It doesn't mean you didn't expose someone else to what infection you did have, however small, while your immune system was in the process of working that out.

 

[SparkyJJO]

You don't actually get the flu, nor are you contagious from receiving the vaccine. I doubt even one person on that ship had the flu. You do experience an immune reaction for a couple days as your body reacts and naturally develops antibodies.

I'd rather go by what the people who actually dealt with it said than someone else who claims they didn't have it without even seeing any of them once.

 

[Gooberlx2]

I'd rather go by what the people who actually dealt with it said than someone else who claims they didn't have it without even seeing any of them once.

Sure, you do that. By all means, disregard any factual information of the topic because your brother told you so.

 

[Ackmed]

I haven't taken it since the Marine Corps made me, it was actually the flu mist. Up the nose it went. I never get the flu, in fact I never get sick at all. No allergies, no nothing. Just blessed I guess.

 

[SparkyJJO]

Sure, you do that. By all means, disregard any factual information of the topic because your brother told you so.

I was referring to your claims that you knew better than a few thousand men. Sorry if you didn't understand that. Maybe the mercury is getting to your brain cells

 

[Gooberlx2]

I was referring to your claims that you knew better than a few thousand men.

I'm referring to the secondhand information given to you by your brother. I mean, unless you interviewed those few thousand men. I doubt it, so you're at the mercy of your brother's understanding of exactly what the flu is and symptoms/severity; versus a normal, expected immune reaction to the vaccine.

"Man, half the ship got the flu from those damn vaccines" does not actually mean half the ship actually experienced the actual flu from those vaccines.

If 50% of personnel were contracting full blown influenza every time they were vaccinated, the military would shut that program down quick.

 

[Raizinman]

Does Flu Vaccine contain Mercury?

Do a search for flu vaccine and mercury?

According to the CDC, vaccines labeled “thimerosal-free” often have a little asterisk next to those words which lead you to something like: “This vaccine has ‘trace’ amounts of thimerosal, which the FDA says is equivalent to thimerosal-free products.” If we look closer into “thimerosal-free” vaccines, we will actually find that there is still a toxic amount of mercury contained in them.

There are two kinds of flu shots given. One contains 25 mcg of mercury (in the form of thimerosal with is 50% mercury. There is 50mcg of thimerosal in this flu shot) and is often given as the “regular” flu shot to those with no special circumstances. The other kind of flu shot is labeled “thimerasol-free” (containing less than 3mcg of mercury) and is given to young children and pregnant women.

If we look at “safe” and “un-safe” levels of mercury, per the FDA, we find this:
2 ppb is the maximum amount of mercury that deems water “safe” for drinking
Anything over 200 ppb mercury is considered TOXIC [source - EPA]

After doing some math [you can check my math in the article: Vaccine Ingredients – A Comprehensive Guide], we find this:
There is up to 300 ppb mercury is in the “thimerosal-free” flu vaccine.
There is 25,000 ppb mercury given in the flu shot containing 25 mcg of thimerosal as a preservative.
No matter how you cut it, flu vaccines contain toxic amounts of mercury. So yes, the flu vaccines still DOES contain thimerosal. The claim that there is “no thimerasol” in the flu vaccine is a complete fallacy.

Personally, I would rather take my chances with the flu than be exposed to chemicals, such as mercury.

 

[PhoKingGuy]

This health science in this thread is the equivalent of me telling some of you idiots that installing Norton/McAffee and using IE for porn is ok.

<---- Not even going to bother

 

[DrPizza]

Even so, that's a horrible effectiveness rate, then add in the mercury and it really sounds even worse of an idea. Besides, if I don't have the flu I'm not passing it on to anyone, and if I do have the flu, I stay home so I'm not passing it on anyway. BTW, last time I got the flu was several years ago.

Amuses me how we all know how toxic mercury is, even in small amounts, then it gets used in tooth fillings and vaccinations Yes, there are mercury-free alternatives now (took them long enough to come out with those) but mercury is still used a lot.

Uhhh, mercury isn't in flu vaccines. And, the compound with mercury in it isn't particularly toxic & passes through the body.

And given how often I get the flu (rarely, so I'm also rarely a carrier) I'd rather not take the shot and increase my risks of getting it (and therefore increase my carrier risk also if you want to play the guilt game). I simply get the flu less often than those people who get the flu shot.

Besides, every time they'd give the flu shot out on the ship when my brother was in the navy, half the ship would get the flu within a few days afterwards. Since he's been out of the navy he's gotten the flu far less often. Sounds like that shot does its job... not.

Getting the flu shot does NOT increase your risks of getting it. In fact, that sounds so retarded that I'm going to assume you're trolling - no one is that stupid. Further, as I pointed out either in this thread or the other vaccine thread, part of the problem with the "I got the flu shot, then got sick" is that the vaccine isn't effective within minutes. It takes a week or longer before the body's immunity builds up responding to the vaccine. If the people on that ship truly had the flu, then what likely happened is that they decided to vaccinate for the flu AFTER a couple of cases started showing up. On a ship, people are in exceptionally close proximity to each other & the rate of transmission is much higher. Also, as incorrectly pointed out earlier in this thread, and a probable contributor in that ship example, people are contagious before they start showing symptoms.

Or, to put it another way:
Observation: people living in very close proximity to one another get the flu shot. 50% end up with the flu anyway.
Your Hypothesis: the flu shot causes the flu in 50% of people.

Further evidence: how the vaccine works is fairly well understood - and it is impossible for it to cause someone to get the flu. In the general population, no one who hasn't been exposed to the flu prior to or shortly after getting the shot has gotten the flu.

 

[Brainonska511]

If we look at &#8220;safe&#8221; and &#8220;un-safe&#8221; levels of mercury, per the FDA, we find this: 2 ppb is the maximum amount of mercury that deems water &#8220;safe&#8221; for drinking Anything over 200 ppb mercury is considered TOXIC [source - EPA] After doing some math [you can check my math in the article: Vaccine Ingredients &#8211; A Comprehensive Guide], we find this: There is up to 300 ppb mercury is in the &#8220;thimerosal-free&#8221; flu vaccine. There is 25,000 ppb mercury given in the flu shot containing 25 mcg of thimerosal as a preservative. No matter how you cut it, flu vaccines contain toxic amounts of mercury. So yes, the flu vaccines still DOES contain thimerosal. The claim that there is &#8220;no thimerasol&#8221; in the flu vaccine is a complete fallacy.

It's like people are sticking their fingers in their ears (or eyes in this case).

Different forms of chemicals are toxic and others can be nearly inert. Mercury vapor is very toxic and bioaccumulates while ethylmercury (the metabolitic bioproduct from thiomerosal) has far lower toxicity and its half life in the body is fairly short.

Your ppb argument is also nonsense. ppb is concentration, not total amount. You need to look at the total amount of bioaccumulateable mercury in drinking water and in a flu shot. If your drinking water was 2 ppb mercury and you drink 1L per day, you're already consuming 2 ug of mercury(and usually in a toxic form when it is found in drinking water) per day. Are you getting the flu shot daily and does yours come in the super-mega dose size of 500 ml?

 

[Fausto]

Sixteen hours after deciding to end it all watching internet numbskulls spew forth how detached from reality they are and writing the note, I realized that my plan for a slow but painless suicide by rolling my eyes repeatedly was not working.

Not gonna lie, I rofled.

 

[Sulaco]

If the HepB vaccine can be something like 99% effective, then what is the issue with the flu vaccine?

Let me guess, its because the flu virus mutates so fast? But for some reason the polio and hepB viruses do not mutate?

If the small pox vaccine was ineffective as the flu vaccine, millions of people would have died in the past 5 decades. Its a good thing we had real scientist that actually cared about public health working on the polio vaccine.

You are such a hopeless moron it's almost shameful.

If you're ignorant, fine. If you're outspoken, fine. But if you truly have to beat the drums of your idiocy every time a topic comes up that you clearly don't understand, you deserve every ounce of derision that's heaped on you.

In other words, if you have no knowledge of science or medicine, please just stfu with your worthless opinions and ideas that would make a high school chemistry or anatomy student blush.

 

[PhoKingGuy]

Average american:

OMG HURRRRRRRRRR VACCINES IZ BAD FOR ME, I AIN'T TAKING THAT SHIZZZ

Goes to lunch:

I'll have a large coke with a double bacon cheezeburger and fries.

Lol

 

[krose]

My career was in QA for a pharmaceutical company that made Flu vaccine. Each year about this time the CDC would decide what Flu strains would be used to make the next Flu season's vaccine. There were always three strains, two A's and a B strain. We would produce them until late Summer or early Fall, then start combining the final purified strains into a trivalent bulk product which was subsequently filled into the various final dosage forms for distribution prior to Flu season.

So it was only an educated guess as to which strains would be present in the next Flu season. Given that the flu virus mutates rather quickly it is questionable how effective is a vaccine being produced months ahead of time.

We were always offered free vaccination but I always declined, except for one year in 1976 when the Swine Flu was supposed to be rampant. I received the shot and felt crappy for days so I said never again. I have never had the Flu but would get the vaccine if I was in one of the high risk groups mentioned. While it may not protect you altogether, if you do get the Flu it may be less severe. My $0.02 FWIW.

 

[7window]

twice i had the flu shot twice I feel sick after the flu shot . Full me once shame on you full me twice shame on me. never again.

 

[xanis]

My career was in QA for a pharmaceutical company that made Flu vaccine. Each year about this time the CDC would decide what Flu strains would be used to make the next Flu season's vaccine. There were always three strains, two A's and a B strain. We would produce them until late Summer or early Fall, then start combining the final purified strains into a trivalent bulk product which was subsequently filled into the various final dosage forms for distribution prior to Flu season.

So it was only an educated guess as to which strains would be present in the next Flu season. Given that the flu virus mutates rather quickly it is questionable how effective is a vaccine being produced months ahead of time.

We were always offered free vaccination but I always declined, except for one year in 1976 when the Swine Flu was supposed to be rampant. I received the shot and felt crappy for days so I said never again. I have never had the Flu but would get the vaccine if I was in one of the high risk groups mentioned. While it may not protect you altogether, if you do get the Flu it may be less severe. My $0.02 FWIW.

Probably the best post in the thread. :thumbsup:

 

[SP33Demon]

Still not getting the shot. Haven't been sick in 5 years with the flu and I take public city transit a good amount. Just wash your fcking hands like a religious freak and you'll be fine.

 

[Rockinacoustic]

Average american:

OMG HURRRRRRRRRR VACCINES IZ BAD FOR ME, I AIN'T TAKING THAT SHIZZZ

Goes to lunch:

I'll have a large coke with a double bacon cheezeburger and fries.

Lol

This... so much this.