The Gospel of Consumption

[Gonad the Barbarian]

http://www.orionmagazine.org/i...articles/article/2962/

This might be OFN, but I just came across it and thought it was pretty interesting. It talks about the "problem" that arose shortly after the industrial revolution, the fact that we could produce enough goods to fill society's needs without factories and the workforce running at full capacity. If you've seen the BBC documentary "Century of the Self" mentioned on here and not had the 4 hours to invest watching it this is a pretty decent summary. And I'd also recommend the vid at storyofstuff.com as somewhat of a companion to this.

 

[JS80]

This "gospel" is what gives us the high standard of living, vs living in huts and starving to death. Go look at your non-consuming countries.

 

[ElFenix]

you and bamacre can go farm in your 17th century economy.

 

[TruePaige]

Many, many a person died of consumption in times past. Everyone knows this. 0.o

 

[bobsmith1492]

It's not really a new problem. The same problem occurred when people could grow enough food for more than their own family; then, people could specialize so that Bob was the farmer while Sam built carts, houses, and horseshoes and traded them with Bob for food.

Multiply that scenario up a few notches and we have the current times where someone can live quite comfortably teaching Women's Studies at a local college and thousands live on welfare and disability from the government...

As long as people find useful work so that other will pay them, there are enough people producing necessities, and the transportation infrastructure doesn't break down, we will continue to do fine.

 

[mxyzptlk]

Yea, I wonder about that sometimes. It became really apparent last holiday season when the media was acting as if people spending slightly less on mostly bullshit consumer items(read: christmas presents) would lead to our entire financial system grinding to a complete halt. The first question that came to my mind was, "how stupid is our financial system if it's reliant upon people constantly consuming shit, whether they need it or not?"

It seems like a system that's destined to expand and expand until it explodes in the most catastrophic of ways. I just don't understand how we're supposed to continuously expand the economy with more and more consumer goods without approaching critical mass at some point (albeit far) in the future.

There has to be some kind of happy balance between uncontrolled, geometric expansion of consumerism and living in mud huts.. Some point where we still have medicine and personal transportation and video games and all the niceties of life, but we aren't teetering on the brink of collapse when people stop running up their credit cards playing "keep up with the Jones's"

 

[Munky]

Well, where did the whole consumerism economy get you? You are basing your whole standard of living based on the almighty dollar, little knowing that the dollar is just a garbage piece of paper, or more likely a data record in some computer, whose actual value is a function of how many other garbage pieces of paper the Fed has printed so far.

 

[MovingTarget]

Consumerism has its place in our society, but problems arise when people consume like zombies thinking that it is the be-all and end-all of success. There is much more to life (and quality thereof) than blind materialism.

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Consumerism has its place in our society, but problems arise when people consume like zombies thinking that it is the be-all and end-all of success. There is much more to life (and quality thereof) than blind materialism.

And if you're spending your money on stupid bullshit (thanks George Carlin), and other people are spending their lives working jobs to create that stupid bullshit, then that doesn't move a society forward. The society just sits there, wallowing in a pool of...yup, bullshit, somehow convinced that it's the greatest thing ever.

 

[n yusef]

Industrialization and consumerism have not improved our quality of life in every dimension. Certain things, such as diet, are very negatively effected by industrialization. Processed food and factory farms have made us fat and diseased. Go to any "third world" nation, and you will eat much better than you do in the so-called civilized world.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: Jeff7

And if you're spending your money on stupid bullshit (thanks George Carlin), and other people are spending their lives working jobs to create that stupid bullshit, then that doesn't move a society forward. The society just sits there, wallowing in a pool of...yup, bullshit, somehow convinced that it's the greatest thing ever.

RIP Carlin, this ^

 

[0marTheZealot]

Smart consumerism would be great.

Unfortunately, we have dumb consumerism. The economy has been built on a Ponzi scheme for the last 20 years. Robbing the future to pay today. The future is here and it wants to collect.

This "gospel" is what gives us the high standard of living, vs living in huts and starving to death. Go look at your non-consuming countries.

Those non-consuming countries have much more to blame than just a lack of consumption. Politics, strife, warfare, etc etc, these are all major factors. The US has been blessed, but it seems instead of being grateful, it has turned our population into being people with entitlement complexes.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: n yusef
Industrialization and consumerism have not improved our quality of life in every dimension. Certain things, such as diet, are very negatively effected by industrialization. Processed food and factory farms have made us fat and diseased. Go to any "third world" nation, and you will eat much better than you do in the so-called civilized world.

which is why people are so much taller in the third world than they are here.

 

[sandorski]

Karl Marx thought Capitalism would fail because of Over Production. I think he was wrong for the same reason many are wrong on many issues. That is, he/they assume the Present Status Quo will remain the Status Quo of the Future. He had no idea about the myriad of Technologies and Products that would soon be unleashed and continue to grow in number exponentially as Time progressed. However, there are certainly times when Over Production occurs and there is a lag time before new Tech/Product becomes available to start the process anew.

That said, First World Economies have become far too reliant on Consumption. It needs to find a better Balance between Consumption and other Economic Activity.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: n yusef
Industrialization and consumerism have not improved our quality of life in every dimension. Certain things, such as diet, are very negatively effected by industrialization. Processed food and factory farms have made us fat and diseased. Go to any "third world" nation, and you will eat much better than you do in the so-called civilized world.

Lol, what

 

[rchiu]

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed

Originally posted by: Jeff7

And if you're spending your money on stupid bullshit (thanks George Carlin), and other people are spending their lives working jobs to create that stupid bullshit, then that doesn't move a society forward. The society just sits there, wallowing in a pool of...yup, bullshit, somehow convinced that it's the greatest thing ever.

RIP Carlin, this ^

Well when you spend your money on stupid shit, it pays people who create that stupid shit.

But those people creating stupid shit with your money don't necessary have to spend that money on stupid shit, they maybe smarter than you and spend the money to put food on their table or something that advances the society.

Rising tide floats all boat. Boat with dumb ppl and smart ppl alike.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: n yusef
Industrialization and consumerism have not improved our quality of life in every dimension. Certain things, such as diet, are very negatively effected by industrialization. Processed food and factory farms have made us fat and diseased. Go to any "third world" nation, and you will eat much better than you do in the so-called civilized world.

Lol, what

Or

 

[IGBT]

Originally posted by: JS80
This "gospel" is what gives us the high standard of living, vs living in huts and starving to death. Go look at your non-consuming countries.

the eco-KOOKS say this is what's needed. go read their bible, "The World Without Us".

 

[Atreus21]

"A major source of objection to a free economy is precisely that it ... gives people what they want instead of what a particular group thinks they ought to want. Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself."

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

According to Edward Bernays, one of the founders of the field of public relations and a principal architect of the American Way, the choices available in the polling booth are akin to those at the department store; both should consist of a limited set of offerings that are carefully determined by what Bernays called an ?invisible government? of public-relations experts and advertisers working on behalf of business leaders. Bernays claimed that in a ?democratic society? we are and should be ?governed, our minds . . . molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of.?

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

According to Edward Bernays, one of the founders of the field of public relations and a principal architect of the American Way, the choices available in the polling booth are akin to those at the department store; both should consist of a limited set of offerings that are carefully determined by what Bernays called an ?invisible government? of public-relations experts and advertisers working on behalf of business leaders. Bernays claimed that in a ?democratic society? we are and should be ?governed, our minds . . . molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of.?

I've long believed that the existence of the advertising industry makes the idea of a "free market" ridiculous.

When Mercedes Benz makes commercials for $40,000 cars, it means that they think that a thirty second video will influence someone's $40,000 purchase. And I'm sure it does, because every car maker has these commercials.

Let me repeat: a thirty second video influences a $40,000 purchase. Capitalism, and everything else, fails because people--even people with $40,000 cars--are stupid.

 

[Munky]

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

According to Edward Bernays, one of the founders of the field of public relations and a principal architect of the American Way, the choices available in the polling booth are akin to those at the department store; both should consist of a limited set of offerings that are carefully determined by what Bernays called an ?invisible government? of public-relations experts and advertisers working on behalf of business leaders. Bernays claimed that in a ?democratic society? we are and should be ?governed, our minds . . . molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of.?

I've long believed that the existence of the advertising industry makes the idea of a "free market" ridiculous.

When Mercedes Benz makes commercials for $40,000 cars, it means that they think that a thirty second video will influence someone's $40,000 purchase. And I'm sure it does, because every car maker has these commercials.

Let me repeat: a thirty second video influences a $40,000 purchase. Capitalism, and everything else, fails because people--even people with $40,000 cars--are stupid.

How is that any more stupid than Joe Schmoe buying something because his neighbor has it, or because someone recommended it to him? People aren't just stupid, they are also easily influenced by popular belief. But that's not a fault of the free market.

Advertising and marketing are a necessary part of running a business. That doesn't mean the free market and capitalism is a failure, just like sports aren't a failure because someone did it wrong and got injured. It just means some people fail at knowing how to "play" capitalism.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

Lot's of people fail at capitalism. A lot of it is due to manipulation, coercion, misinformation, etc. There are active forces at play that people seem oblivious to. Plus there's the fact that our education system simply does not teach one how to be a smart consumer. Or that one even needs to be one. I'm very much in favor of free markets, but we are just flat doing it wrong. It's analogous to democracy today for a lot of the same reasons. The influential stack the system in favor of themselves while us peasants are too busy raising kids, paying bills, watching trash on TV, and keeping up with the neighbors to notice or do anything about it. It's like there is some mass mental affliction of people's priorities where, to use a TV analogy, MTV or ESPN > CSPAN.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian
Lot's of people fail at capitalism. A lot of it is due to manipulation, coercion, misinformation, etc. There are active forces at play that people seem oblivious to. Plus there's the fact that our education system simply does not teach one how to be a smart consumer. Or that one even needs to be one. I'm very much in favor of free markets, but we are just flat doing it wrong. It's analogous to democracy today for a lot of the same reasons. The influential stack the system in favor of themselves while us peasants are too busy raising kids, paying bills, watching trash on TV, and keeping up with the neighbors to notice or do anything about it. It's like there is some mass mental affliction of people's priorities where, to use a TV analogy, MTV or ESPN > CSPAN.

I would agree completely. The $1,000,00 question is: How do we change that?

Democrats believe the key is a nanny state telling people how to live

Republicans are clueless and don't have any answers

I believe the key is education, and beyond that caveat emptor

 

[Moonbeam]

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