The Hobbit.. in HFR (high frame rate) 3D

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slayer202

Lifer
Nov 27, 2005
13,682
119
106
I don't have much interest in the movie but I am interested to see the 48fps effect. But 3D only, I probably won't see it.

The cinematic "look' is very important
 

Gooberlx2

Lifer
May 4, 2001
15,381
6
91
What i mean is, according to my understanding is that in order to not see a jitter/skip the frame-rate needs to at least be 30fps, right? I could be wrong but that is what I thought.

I dunno what made the industry settle on 24fps, but eyes can definitely process a faster frame rate. Moreover, they don't see frame rate the same throughout the eye itself. The center is dominated by cones for color and details. The periphery are weighted towards rods, which are more sensitive to light and motion ....or something like that.

That's why I'm excited for 48fps, especially with 3D, as action on the edges of my vision, and particularly panning motion looks terrible to me.
 

slayer202

Lifer
Nov 27, 2005
13,682
119
106
I dunno what made the industry settle on 24fps, but eyes can definitely process a faster frame rate. Moreover, they don't see frame rate the same throughout the eye itself. The center is dominated by cones for color and details. The periphery are weighted towards rods, which are more sensitive to light and motion ....or something like that.

That's why I'm excited for 48fps, especially with 3D, as action on the edges of my vision, and particularly panning motion looks terrible to me.

http://techland.time.com/2012/12/06/riddles-in-the-dark-the-hobbits-48-frames-per-second-explained/

Nice little article, and part of it explains that 24 fps was the lowest rate that looks continuous and can sync audio. And lowest because that was cheapest(less film needed).

Higher FPS is more clear, but it doesn't look like the movies we are used to
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
82,854
17,365
136
I'm not excited about any movie looking like a soap opera.

A generation from now when kiddies are used to it, they will wonder how you got by on slide-shows.

Kinda like people who think B&W is better. It seems silly to those of us who grew up with color.
 

foghorn67

Lifer
Jan 3, 2006
11,885
53
91
Slideshow? More like blurry show. They blur everything to compensate the lack of frames, you can't make out anything. I noticed this even as a stupid teen decades ago. You can't make out wtf is going on in movies whenever it's panning.


shutter speed does not equal frame rate. That right there is about shutter speed.
 

foghorn67

Lifer
Jan 3, 2006
11,885
53
91
A generation from now when kiddies are used to it, they will wonder how you got by on slide-shows.

Kinda like people who think B&W is better. It seems silly to those of us who grew up with color.

Lol, no. The world embraced color pretty damn fast. The only thing that held it back was printing cost.
 

KeithTalent

Elite Member | Administrator | No Lifer
Administrator
Nov 30, 2005
50,235
117
116
A generation from now when kiddies are used to it, they will wonder how you got by on slide-shows.

Kinda like people who think B&W is better. It seems silly to those of us who grew up with color.

Black & white is amazing and is often better, but I see your point.

However, people have seen soap operas for a long time and they have never looked good. Can't imagine anyone preferring that over anything coming out in cinemas.

KT
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,993
8,709
136
A generation from now when kiddies are used to it, they will wonder how you got by on slide-shows.

Kinda like people who think B&W is better. It seems silly to those of us who grew up with color.

This.

Loads of people complain about Hi-Def, or surround sound, or 3D (actually I'm one of those)...

Fact is 24FPS second was the cheapest they could get away with and it still be watchable. There's nothing magical about it.We are all just used to it and associate it with movies and make up justifications about why its superior.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
82,854
17,365
136
This.

Loads of people complain about Hi-Def, or surround sound, or 3D (actually I'm one of those)...

Fact is 24FPS second was the cheapest they could get away with and it still be watchable. There's nothing magical about it.We are all just used to it and associate it with movies and make up justifications about why its superior.

Bingo. Anything lower and it likely wont appear as motion to the human eye. And back in the day film was fucking expensive.

Of course nowadays rendering 3D is also expensive and if you have twice as many frames to render you are pretty close to doubling your budget. So theres that.
 

foghorn67

Lifer
Jan 3, 2006
11,885
53
91
Black & white is amazing and is often better, but I see your point.

However, people have seen soap operas for a long time and they have never looked good. Can't imagine anyone preferring that over anything coming out in cinemas.

KT

Man, people like you totally ruin my argument. I forgot you guys actually exist.
 

kache

Senior member
Nov 10, 2012
486
0
71
I can't wait for 8k@240fps to become the standard. It would make even Transformers movies' battle scenes understandable.
 

KeithTalent

Elite Member | Administrator | No Lifer
Administrator
Nov 30, 2005
50,235
117
116
I will be more than happy to eat my words if the increased frame rate looks amazing and I want to see very film using it, but as of right now I am dubious.

KT
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,993
8,709
136
Black & white is amazing and is often better, but I see your point.

However, people have seen soap operas for a long time and they have never looked good. Can't imagine anyone preferring that over anything coming out in cinemas.

KT


Thats because they are filmed with cheap equipment, tiny sets, crappy actors, and bad composition.

Its not really a valid comparison.
 

KeithTalent

Elite Member | Administrator | No Lifer
Administrator
Nov 30, 2005
50,235
117
116
Thats because they are filmed with cheap equipment, tiny sets, crappy actors, and bad composition.

Its not really a valid comparison.

Yeah, but the effect appears to be the same on any TV I've looked at which uses the newer technology to either interpolate or use a higher frame rate.

Of course I know very little about the technology in all of this stuff, I just watch a lot of movies, so my ass may currently be speaking on my behalf.

KT
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
30,993
8,709
136
Yeah, but the effect appears to be the same on any TV I've looked at which uses the newer technology to either interpolate or use a higher frame rate.

Of course I know very little about the technology in all of this stuff, I just watch a lot of movies, so my ass may currently be speaking on my behalf.

KT

The stuff on your watching on TV hasnt been filmed at high FPS though, its just the TV showing the same frame over to make it look smoother. (dont cinemas do that, show each frame twice or something?).

I cant see how just filming at higher FPS is going to make things look worse if everything else is the same. Its an objectively higher quality output.
 

SparkyJJO

Lifer
May 16, 2002
13,357
7
81
The stuff on your watching on TV hasnt been filmed at high FPS though, its just the TV showing the same frame over to make it look smoother. (dont cinemas do that, show each frame twice or something?).

I cant see how just filming at higher FPS is going to make things look worse if everything else is the same. Its an objectively higher quality output.

Could be like when HD came out some stuff looked worse on it because you could see all the imperfections.
 

Fingolfin269

Lifer
Feb 28, 2003
17,948
31
91
I'm not going to be brave with this one. Watching 24fps sat morning then plan to eventually watch the 48 later.
 

Geosurface

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2012
5,776
4
0
I was hugely into the LOTR movies and paid crazy levels of attention to them all the way back in 1998 on, every casting decision... etc, I even broke the news of a couple casting calls (I used to work on the main fan site) and ended up getting to go to an Oscar party and shake hands with Peter Jackson and Ian McKellen, and hold a real Oscar.

I have kept much more distant from the news on this, and I'm glad. I think I've spoiled myself less. Loved the book of the Hobbit as a kid, and the '77 cartoon.

I intend to eventually edit the 3 films down in digital form to end up with a runtime and similar scenes to the Hobbit cartoon from '77. Just so I have an option to watch the whole story quickly if I want.

I do feel 3 long movies is a bit bloated for the original story.

But I'm excited. I'm seeing it tonight.

I like to see films for a story, not SFX and gimmickry. It's a film, not an amusement park ride.

Closer to xmas when I'm up in Maine visiting my brother I intend to try to see the 3D 48 fps just to see it like that once, there's a nice IMAX theater up there where he lives.

But tonight at midnight I'm going to see 2D, 24 fps. That's what I prefer.
 
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