The Intel Atom Thread

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monstercameron

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2013
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Such assumes that the A4-5000 in the two systems with lower delta power consumption wasn't throttling in some manner. Which wouldn't make sense as the previous section regarding temperature states that throttling was not observed in any of the cases... though there's also the marked peculiarity in that section of the CPU reporting a temperature of 61 degrees centigrade under load in all three laptops? Doesn't necessarily mean anything, it's just quite bizarre and suggests a thermal target for the cooling system at the very least.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that the variance in delta power consumption between the various Kabini/Temash devices that we have data for is downright bizarre. The reference laptop is showing 1.5x the delta power consumption of the Acer. If we assume that we could be seeing the same kind of variance with the A6-1450 and the one data point we have is the peak then the equivalent 'low' would be ~7.7W. But that's just speculation, not hard data.

Put another way, do we actually have any third party reviews that measure the expected low power consumption of Temash? Because if throwing out the notebookcheck results then far as I know we have the same amount of real-world power data for Temash as we do Baytrail - none. (Technically less data for Temash since I see no reason to ignore the figures from the preview, but I have no problem with putting them on 'equal' footing in that regard.)

that is fair enough. I am sure we are all waiting on anand's indepth analysis when he gets an actual atom tablet to review, just hope that he gives temash another try[preferable not using the v5-122p]
 

Khato

Golden Member
Jul 15, 2001
1,225
280
136
Holy crap thats a lot of voltage for a tablet SOC!

Assuming it's correct. Wouldn't be the first time that CPU-z incorrectly reports parameters on a processor for which they have not yet added support.
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
8,548
2
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Is it Intel's bribery..., I mean, marketing budget?

Oh yeah, of course. It's the bribery, it's the compilers, it's the cheating, it's the pulling the wool over Anand's eyes. Of course it isn't a good product. Can't admit that.

OEMs are using the BT-T because it's a nice product. The temash does well for it's niche but it is more suited to convertibles, not tablets. (I don't know how the 1200 fares, no real world data yet). The CPU performance on BT-T is pretty much amazing and the GPU could be better, but it's acceptable for 2W class thin tablets. It's not going to remove qualcomm from the picture but qualcomm and other ARM SOC manufacturers have a legitimate reason to worry now since the successor to BT-T is coming in 6 months and will be that much of an improvement over BT-T. Already BT-T has a huge CPU performance advantage over even the snapdragon 800 which is pretty impressive. Intel just needs to improve the GPU that much more with Airmont...
 
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Shivansps

Diamond Member
Sep 11, 2013
3,873
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Is it Intel's bribery..., I mean, marketing budget?

Seriusly? its just business man, "Intel Inside" sells.

Also Temash has been avalible for a while now, there are no devices... that should tell you that something is going on, OEMs are better informed than us.

When AMD launched the Brazos, especially, the E-350, OEMs where all over it, there where a large number of devices in the first month, and the number increased with the time.
That was because Intel had nothing, and to make things worse, Nvidia said "bye bye" to Atom/ION combos because of Intel that they where not even giving enoght pci-e lanes to keep offering ION2 like solutions.

Then AMD screwed up with Brazos 2.0, Brazos 2.0 did not deliver, that crappy CPU performance was not longer acceptable, and Intel was starting to launch ULV Celerons Based on Sandy Bridge that ended up with better CPU performance, lower power comsuption and that could even give then a fight in the GPU department.
In fact many OEMs started to use ULV Celerons instead of Brazos... Im not sure why Intel took so long to release ULV Celerons based on Ivy Bridge.

Then it comes Kabini and Temash, and with Haswell-Y, and all BTs im not sure where they gona end up, it will depend on pricing, and the fact there are little interest on OEMs should tell you that those dont perform very good.
 

USER8000

Golden Member
Jun 23, 2012
1,542
780
136
This is the bottom line.

The bottom line is that many OEMs are waiting for the impending release of Windows 8.1 on October 18th,2013.

There was really no impetus for launching multiple new models in volume for the summer,for them to be shipping with an "older" version of Windows 8 within two to three months,especially with the prebuilt Windows PC market being the way it is ATM,ie,declining.

That is the reality of it TBH.
 
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Imouto

Golden Member
Jul 6, 2011
1,241
2
81
The bottom line is that no one cares about AMD, Intel, Nvidia or Microsoft in the mobile space.

Windows is currently holding about a 5% tablet market share. Bay Trail is targeting that market and that's beyond lame.
 

bullzz

Senior member
Jul 12, 2013
405
23
81
I dont get the point of waiting for win 8.1. MS has announced win 8.1 is free for all win 8 devices. so that should not make win 8 devices obsolete. also there is usually good PC sales during back to school season
 

Shivansps

Diamond Member
Sep 11, 2013
3,873
1,527
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The bottom line is that many OEMs are waiting for the impending release of Windows 8.1 on October 18th,2013.

There was really no impetus for launching multiple new models in volume for the summer,for them to be shipping with an "older" version of Windows 8 within two to three months,especially with the prebuilt Windows PC market being the way it is ATM,ie,declining.

That is the reality of it TBH.

All Windows 8 devices can be upgraded to 8.1 on the Windows market on October 18th, there is no reason to wait.
 

USER8000

Golden Member
Jun 23, 2012
1,542
780
136
All Windows 8 devices can be upgraded to 8.1 on the Windows market on October 18th, there is no reason to wait.

Again,you don't seem to understand the market. This is not targeted towards an enthusiast,but Joe or Jane who walks into a shop(or orders online).

One computer will be sporting a Windows 8.1 sticker and the other a Windows 8 sticker. One is "older" than the other and hence has less perceived value.

Also,MS wants to big up Windows 8.1 to improve Windows 8 sales,especially to distance itself from all the negative connotations Windows 8 has had(Windows 8.1 is "new and improved" and "better"),so a whole bevy of new models being available to buy in October is good for them and will be for the OEMs. Even the timing of the Bay Trail previews is strongly indicative that Intel wanted to target the Windows 8.1 release for some of the mobile products. As you know desktop products like the Bay Trail NUC are being released next year.

Remember,PC sales are decreasing,so adding as many tick box "new improvements" as possible is seen as adding "value" by many companies,and creating compelling arguments(in their view) for people to buy their new shiny product,instead of hanging onto their older computers.

Its all PR,but this has been happening for decades in this space. Its not targeted towards people more knowledgeable about these things. We are a minority.

Most enthusiasts on the internet assemble their own PCs and own desktops,but,most desktops are prebuilt and more people have laptops only. You have to be careful of falling into the trap that just because it is common on forums,that it is true of most PC owners.

Thats it.
 
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monstercameron

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2013
3,818
1
0
Seriusly? its just business man, "Intel Inside" sells.

Also Temash has been avalible for a while now, there are no devices... that should tell you that something is going on, OEMs are better informed than us.

When AMD launched the Brazos, especially, the E-350, OEMs where all over it, there where a large number of devices in the first month, and the number increased with the time.
That was because Intel had nothing, and to make things worse, Nvidia said "bye bye" to Atom/ION combos because of Intel that they where not even giving enoght pci-e lanes to keep offering ION2 like solutions.

Then AMD screwed up with Brazos 2.0, Brazos 2.0 did not deliver, that crappy CPU performance was not longer acceptable, and Intel was starting to launch ULV Celerons Based on Sandy Bridge that ended up with better CPU performance, lower power comsuption and that could even give then a fight in the GPU department.
In fact many OEMs started to use ULV Celerons instead of Brazos... Im not sure why Intel took so long to release ULV Celerons based on Ivy Bridge.

Then it comes Kabini and Temash, and with Haswell-Y, and all BTs im not sure where they gona end up, it will depend on pricing, and the fact there are little interest on OEMs should tell you that those dont perform very good.

that is a lie out now:
samsung ativ book 9 lite [premium ssd toting 13" touch ultrathin]
acer v5-122p [meh er decent 11.6" touch netbook]
hp touchsmart 11z [more meh cheap 11.6" touch netbook]
toshiba w30dt [convertible 13.3" ips touch]
asus x102ba [10.1" touch netbook]
 
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Vesku

Diamond Member
Aug 25, 2005
3,743
28
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Seriusly? its just business man, "Intel Inside" sells.

Also Temash has been avalible for a while now, there are no devices... that should tell you that something is going on, OEMs are better informed than us.

Yes, when producing 10s of thousands all the way up into millions of devices there are a lot more concerns than what's good for the consumer. Strength of brand, piggy-back marketing, consistency of supply and the particulars of the business relationship are just a few of the factors involved. Heck there is a bit of a hardware news vibe that big OEMs are seizing the opportunity to tweak Microsoft's nose over Windows license costs now that Windows appears to be in a vulnerable position.

Still, as a consumer, I wonder why there weren't more Jaguar devices for the back to school season. Judging by the lack of any Jaguar mini-itx boards in retail I really think AMD is having its typical supply issues. Jaguar SoCs have to contend with AMD's GPUs for their allocation of TSMC wafers.

Will the Bay Trail netbook/notebook versions have a bit more GPU performance than this Z3770?
 
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monstercameron

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2013
3,818
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Yes, when producing 10s of thousands all the way up into millions of devices there are a lot more concerns than what's good for the consumer. Strength of brand, piggy-back marketing, consistency of supply and the particulars of the business relationship are just a few of the factors involved. Heck there is a bit of a hardware news vibe that big OEMs are seizing the opportunity to tweak Microsoft's nose over Windows license costs now that Windows appears to be in a vulnerable position.

Still, as a consumer, I wonder why there weren't more Jaguar devices for the back to school season. Judging by the lack of any Jaguar mini-itx boards in retail I really think AMD is having its typical supply issues. Jaguar SoCs have to contend with AMD's GPUs for their allocation of TSMC wafers.

Will the Bay Trail netbook/notebook versions have a bit more GPU performance than this Z3770?

if the z3770 isnt boosting gpu to ~750Mhz then yes
http://liliputing.com/2013/07/leake...eron-and-pentium-chips-use-less-than-10w.html
 

bullzz

Senior member
Jul 12, 2013
405
23
81
"that is a lie out now:
samsung ativ book 9 lite [premium ssd toting 13" touch ultrathin]
acer v5-122p [meh er decent 11.6" touch netbook]
hp touchsmart 11z [more meh cheap 11.6" touch netbook]
toshiba w30dt [convertible 13.3" ips touch]
asus x102ba [10.1" touch netbook]"

except for the samsung one, none of these devices are of decent specs/quality. and buying the samsung one for $750 makes no sense when u can get a ivy bridge ultrabook for the same price. hopefully some decent devices come out later
 

erunion

Senior member
Jan 20, 2013
765
0
0
The bottom line is that many OEMs are waiting for the impending release of Windows 8.1 on October 18th,2013.

There was really no impetus for launching multiple new models in volume for the summer,for them to be shipping with an "older" version of Windows 8 within two to three months,especially with the prebuilt Windows PC market being the way it is ATM,ie,declining.

That is the reality of it TBH.

So if a batch of temash tablets doesn't launch along side BT-T we can safely say they aren't going to happen?
 

USER8000

Golden Member
Jun 23, 2012
1,542
780
136
So if a batch of temash tablets doesn't launch along side BT-T we can safely say they aren't going to happen?

We will find out soon.

There are a few I have seen so far:

http://blog.laptopmag.com/msi-w20-3m-hands-on-amd-powered-windows-8-tablet
http://blog.laptopmag.com/toshiba-satellite-click-hands-on

There are also a few touchscreen netbooks such as the low cost Asus X102BA too.

Intel is still likely to have more models with Bay Trail just even down to the fact they ship more CPUs anyway(let alone any other reason). It was the same with Brazos and that sold tens of millions of examples.
 
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Shivansps

Diamond Member
Sep 11, 2013
3,873
1,527
136
I think some OEM will be able to just put a low power a usb3 to sata chip on BT-T and provide a fast mSATA SSD.


BT-M
 

FwFred

Member
Sep 8, 2011
149
7
81
The bottom line is that no one cares about AMD, Intel, Nvidia or Microsoft in the mobile space.

Windows is currently holding about a 5% tablet market share. Bay Trail is targeting that market and that's beyond lame.

Definition target: select as an object of attention or attack.

Are you intentionally ignoring Anand's preview?

"The first Bay Trail tablets will be shipping by the end of the year, across both Android and Windows 8.1."
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
8,548
2
0
I think some OEM will be able to just put a low power a usb3 to sata chip on BT-T and provide a fast mSATA SSD.

Wouldn't it make more sense for such an OEM to just opt for Bay Trail-M? From what I recall , Bay Trail-D and Bay Trail M both support mSATA SSDs natively.
 
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