Originally posted by: dszd0g
Originally posted by: hatim
Well obviosuly you will have figured out by now that the middle eastern society don't represent Islamic law. Infact none of them have even made a constant effort to even enforce any part of the Shariah.
And in Islam there are some rights which only women have and some which only men have. To a degree if you look closely some estreictions that have been imposed on either men or women are there for a reason if you look deeper....
You make it sound like you are defending treating men and women differently.
Tell me: Why are there different women sports teams and different men sports teams? Yes becuase they are different. It wouldnt be fair if both of them had to compete on the same feild of competition.
Yes, no one claims that men and women are the same physically. However, trying to extend physical differences to claim that they are different in many other ways is where things start to stretch a little thin. Sports is one of the few cases where men and women have to be treated differently. That does not mean men and women need to be treated differently at school, financially, or as a different class of citizens.
In the United states the overall literacy rate is 97%, and the rate for the genders is 97% male, 97% female (1999 numbers). That shows that at least as far as basic education the United States educates men and women equally. The United States still does not treat men and women equally. In a lot of professions, women make less than men when performing the same job. There still has not been a woman as president or vice president. When buying a car or dealing with a mechanic, women are often charged more.
In Iraq in 2003 the total literacy rate was 40.4%, where the rate was 55.9% male, and 24.4% female. When over twice the number of men can read/write as women, it shows that they are not treated equally.
Even in Turkey, where women are supposedly treated better than in a lot of other middle eastern countries from what I've read the total literacy rate is 86.5%, and it is 94.3% for men, and 78.7% for women.
One can never have a culture where men and women are equal if they are not educated equally.
The university im studyiying has both male and female students. The prophet once said "To gain knowledge is obligatory on every muslim man and every muslim woman" ...In school, in their financial status they are equal and have the SAME rights and are not regarded as secondary citizens. Then only difference from current western society is family resposibilities. Again even in the US there are still more working men than women...But women have not been stopped from working. They have theior freewill in anything. They can get a divorce. Again in divorce a man will give some of his dealth to the women...And the women no matter how rich will not be entitled to give anything....
And literacy definately has more to do with culture than religion. In my coutry hardly anyone selnds their daugters to school. This is more true for the poorer...Apparently they think its not important for women to get education as they will be working at home. But then it was the prophet who told both men and women to get knowledge.
And yes women are encouraged to work. However more from home. And who says women cannot drive. Thats just a stupid law thought up by some stupid people who think they know a lot about islam.....And they ARE allowed their free will....And have the same rights as any man...Theres nothing a man can do that a women can't.....
And physical differences to equate to mental differences. Man and woman have had different roles since the pre historic stone age. There are so many things that women must do and some which men...Just because you donont see more women on the street working doesnt mean that they are oppressed. Thats part of Islamic culture. Men are supposed to earn bread while women are supposed to take care of things at home...Physical differences = emotional differences = different roles
Any way God has not created us to just live life as it comes. There is nothing in Islam that says that God prefers men over women. Nothing! They will both be treated equally after death so why would they be treated unfairly now. We have been created in the end worship God. So obviosly the ideal Islamic society would be the most suitable for this to take place. SEX is not everything. Thats just an instint. A man may only have sex with his wife and vice versa...And honeslty by wearning mini skirts and roaming topless only attracts men. So point of that? When sex outside marriage is forbidden. Even men have restrictions on what they can wear and what they can do. But you must all agree with me that men are more crazy about sex then women. Hell why would a man want to have sex with a women outside marraige and vice versa if his/her husband/wife can satisfy all their needs??? And in Islam having sex with your wife is sawab or good...Women working right longside men wearing nothing but half torn skirts will do nothing more than attract the men's attraction....And then sexual instincts can do almost anything. How easy would it be to seduce. Women are not forbidden to work but importantly must keep themselves well covered. In Islam SEX is such a big sin. And God has given us other ways to satisy this need. He was giving us laws that would stop us from committing this sin.
And remember that in the Prophets SAW time there was no "voting" system. He was the head of state. SO this women rights in voting doesnt even start there. Making up stuff urself just because you one thinkgs its right is haram in islam. Same way is not letting women drive. Its just absurd...
And madrassahs...Some madrassahs: You just learn the Quran Sunnah and Hadith and forget about what they mean. Just so you know what was said. Some however deal with the foundations of Islam it self. Philosophy, law, history, meaning of the Quran, and thats in Arabic....To add to that they have Maths, Sciences, Social sciences, finances...Thats the regular classe,
And personally no women in my part of the world has any problem with rights. Again its culture...Women uneducated, men working earning $2 a day...And children working too...Sad really....But thats more in the rural areas.......It is just the way their customs treat them...not law...And certainly not Islam.
And yes you can just go on rambling about women rights in the eastern world to make you feel better....Because there is no reason why a women in Islam woulld be as oppressed as sex symbols like in the US.....
And you feel Bush is a good president? :/ If not again you ae being oppressed. Because one person is against the government. :/ :/
And Discrimination: Even if differenciate between men and women in sports it would still be discrimination. You will not let a man play in a women's team just because he is a man and not women. Thats DISCRIMINATION....Why? Becasue they arephysically different and emotionally different...And to each there are things which he/she can do better. So if God created us different the why should men try to imitate women and women try to imitate men? If you take out SEX from the american society or half it...You will see more women covering themselves up to avoid the gazes of men...Its only natural....The same way a small boy would not let any girl stare at him.....