The Kaveri Pre-Launch Thread (A10-7800 and A10-6800k @3,5 Ghz)

[monstercameron]

What's funny?

snip

lol don't, you off all members shouldn't be cherry picking results.
more proof needed.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

I only have so many titles, also have no idea what custom is so I can't reproduce those tests even if I had the games.

 

[monstercameron]

I only have so many titles, also have no idea what custom is so I can't reproduce those tests even if I had the games.

ok fair enough, but what is the config on your hd4600? what clocks?

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Dirt slow and only run for the humor factor.

 

[Blitzvogel]

Some pretty decent numbers, but if only AMD had shipped it much earlier, like last summer earlier......

 

[monstercameron]

that is exactly why there was richland.

 

[Hitman928]

ok fair enough, but what is the config on your hd4600? what clocks?

Based off of Anandtech's Tomb Raider results with Trinity and HD4600,

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7032/...-gpu-on-the-desktop-radeon-hd-8670d-hd-4600/2

the 5800K at stock has about a 30% lead on the i7-4770K at stock at higher resolutions. A bit of rough estimating would give you an average of 16.4 fps under 1080p normal settings. To then achieve the 30.6 fps he showed in the bench would mean roughly a 86.6% increase in performance. These are obviously rough estimates, but it's pretty clear that a very large overclock was used to get the 30.6 fps in the benchmark shown. Unless there are some other factors involved which have not been taken into consideration.

 

[Vesku]

Dirt slow and only run for the humor factor.

Might want to add a /s after dirt slow, unless your from the year 2024 or something:

"System Setup:

i5-4670k @ 4.6GHz 1.155v, 4.5GHz Uncore 1.14v
HD4600 @ 1750MHz 1.225v
DDR3 1600 1.5v @ 2400 11-13-12-37 1T 1.7v
Mobo MSI Z87 GD65 Gaming
HX850 delivers the power
M4 SSD
F3 Spinpoint
WD Blue
"

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=35220570&postcount=10

 

[sniffin]

3d segment available!
http://foro.noticias3d.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=421821&p=5036330&viewfull=1#post5036330

3dmarkfor kaveri is1500-1800[after oc] and for gddr5 version of the amd 7750 is ~2100, hell my current gtx650 is ~1900. Kaveri will be almost as fast as my current setup

i3+7750 smacked for non-gaming workloads.

If these results do end up being representative of Kaveri then that's really impressive. I can't help but wonder if AMD ever plan on enabling the additional mem controllers. I don't think they will, simply because of possible cannibalization of their Cape Verde gpus.

Kaveri is their most important product launch in years and it's actually looking like they've pulled it off. I'm really interested in mobile performance, although I'm still skeptical about how it's actually going to do in terms of design wins. To many OEMs in bed with Intel

 

[JDG1980]

If these results do end up being representative of Kaveri then that's really impressive. I can't help but wonder if AMD ever plan on enabling the additional mem controllers. I don't think they will, simply because of possible cannibalization of their Cape Verde gpus.

Cape Verde is a low-end part that isn't (and never was) all that popular. AMD isn't going to deliberately hamstring their flagship APU to preserve those sales, especially since the APU probably has better margins anyway.

In any case, if Kaveri supports fast RAM, they can still pitch Cape Verde chips as a hybrid Crossfire option. But given the way things are going, they might be better off allocating all their TSMC wafers to Tahiti and above...

 

[cbn]

3d segment available!
http://foro.noticias3d.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=421821&p=5036330&viewfull=1#post5036330

3dmarkfor kaveri is1500-1800[after oc] and for gddr5 version of the amd 7750 is ~2100, hell my current gtx650 is ~1900. Kaveri will be almost as fast as my current setup

Even with Kaveri's RAM running at DDR3 2666 --> http://foro.noticias3d.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=421821&p=5036333&viewfull=1#post5036333

.....Core i3 + HD7750 is still winning for gaming:

i3+7750 smacked for non-gaming workloads.

For highly parallel non gaming CPU tasks (encoding, etc) then yes, I would expect AMD's quad core to be faster than the Intel dual core.

 

[itsmydamnation]

For highly parallel non gaming CPU tasks (encoding, etc) then yes, I would expect AMD's quad core to be faster than the Intel dual core.

i love how dual module is a quadcore when people choose and a dualcore when people choose. They both have 4 threads.

 

[cbn]

Even in games OCed Kaveri is hanging with i3+7750 GDDR5 really well!

Yes, but realize Kaveri is using DDR3 @ 2666. How will Pre-built or lower end DIY systems with lesser RAM spec perform?

Furthermore, the HD7750 can be overclocked as well. So maybe a more complete comparison would be something like the following:

7850K @ stock speed (tested with stock and factory OCed RAM) vs. 7850K OCed (tested with stock and factory OCed RAM) vs. Core i3 + stock speed HD7750 vs. Core i3 + OCed HD7750.

 

[AtenRa]

Yes, but realize Kaveri is using DDR3 @ 2666. How will Pre-built or lower end DIY systems with lesser RAM spec perform?

Furthermore, the HD7750 can be overclocked as well. So maybe a more complete comparison would be something like the following:

7850K @ stock speed (tested with stock and factory OCed RAM) vs. 7850K OCed (tested with stock and factory OCed RAM) vs. Core i3 + stock speed HD7750 vs. Core i3 + OCed HD7750.

Also,

How much it cost to get the Core i3 + HD7750 ???
How much it cost to get the A10-7850K + DDR3-2666MHz ???
How much it cost to get the A10-7700K + HD7750 ???

 

[SPBHM]

Even in games OCed Kaveri is hanging with i3+7750 GDDR5 really well!

stock results have a nice advantage for the 7750 to be honest,
only with high OC using great cooling, that's 950MHz (!?) vs 820MHz, 1150 (4500) vs 1333 (2666) MHz, you are basically comparing a 7750 performance you get out of the box with a "high end" FM2+ system, when you go back to lower speed DDR, not so great cooling, maybe not the $170 version of the APU, things will start looking uglier, and if you want to play games with these settings, you are probably not getting the most out of your money with a 7850+2666 capable ddr+watercooler+good MB


anyway, the IGP offers huge gain in some cases (game loves GCN+don't care much about the memory bandwidth?)

(limited by memory bandwidth, or simply not much gain for GCN?)

i3+7750 smacked for non-gaming workloads.

he compared to an ivy bridge i3, while Kaveri is competing with haswell,

that's MT, the i3 is going to shine in other loads.
and the stock 7850K is not looking any good in this program, slower than the cheaper and older AMD APU.

 

[cbn]

stock results have a nice advantage for the 7750 to be honest,
only with high OC using great cooling, that's 950MHz (!?) vs 820MHz, 1150 (4500) vs 1333 (2666) MHz, you are basically comparing a 7750 performance you get out of the box with a "high end" FM2+ system, when you go back to lower speed DDR, not so great cooling, maybe not the $170 version of the APU, things will start looking uglier, and if you want to play games with these settings, you are probably not getting the most out of your money with a 7850+2666 capable ddr+watercooler+good MB

I think that is a good point.

With that mentioned, I want to find out how A10 performs in a Pre-built Desktop and how much it will cost?

Right now my standard is a Pre-built Core i3 Desktop (commonly on sale for anywhere between $300 and $350) with HD7750 added in. That is $400 to $450 package all together.

 

[Galatian]

Also,

How much it cost to get the Core i3 + HD7750 ???
How much it cost to get the A10-7850K + DDR3-2666MHz ???
How much it cost to get the A10-7700K + HD7750 ???

Prints here out off Germany. I assume AMD will start selling the A10-7000 series at the same price or a slight premium:

A10-6800K: 125€ + 100€ for 8GB DDR3-2666 + 90 € FM2+ mITX Mainboard
A10-6700K: 107€ + 60€ for 8GB DDR3-1600 + 90€ for same Mainboard + 105€ for R7 260X
i3-4130: 100€ + 60€ for 8 GB DDR3-1600 + 80€ for a mITX Mainboard + 105€ for R7 260X

What actually shocked me is the fact that I only have 4 mITX mainboards on FM2+ to choose from on one of Germany's biggest and cheapest reseller. On socket 1550 I can go down as low as 60€, but I wanted the features to be at least a little bit more comparable. The Intel solution comes out cheaper, uses less power, while paired with a discrete chip is even faster on GPU workloads and the CPU is almost always faster in CPU bound tasks anyway.

 

[DaZeeMan]

I like comparing apples to apples as much as possible. With that in mind...

Cyberpower PC website's configurator http://www.cyberpowerpc.com.

Intel i3-4130 3.4 MHz 3 MB smart cache. Cheapest mid tower case (RaidMax Viper), stock Intel cooler, cheapest MSI mATX MOBO (MSI B85M-P33 mATX w/ Military Class 4, GbLAN, 1 Gen3 PCIe x16, 1 PCIe x1), AData 8GB (4GBx2) DDR3/1866MHz Dual Channel Memory, 350w Power Supply, 1TB SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 32MB Cache 7200RPM HDD (500 GB is $10 cheaper, so I'll splurge here). Integrated Graphics only. Cheapest ATX mobo is $27 more expensive, btw...
$501

AMD A10 7850 (7700 is $20 cheaper if anyone cares), Raidmax Viper case, stock AMD cooler, GIGABYTE F2A88X-D3H A88X ATX w/ Ultra Durable 4 Plus, On/Off Charge, GbLAN, 2 PCIe x16, 3 PCIe x1, 2 PCI (cheapest mATX board is only $3 cheaper btw), AData 8GB (4GBx2) DDR3/1866MHz Dual Channel Memory, 350w Power Supply, 1TB SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 32MB Cache 7200RPM HDD (500 GB is $10 cheaper, so I'll splurge here). Integrated Graphics only.
$528.

So the Intel mATX build w/i3-4150 is $501 w/o a discrete GPU,
and the AMD ATX build w/A10-7850 is $528 w/o a discrete GPU.

The AMD build would be $508 if you downgrade to an A10-7700, btw.
The i3-4340 3.6 GHz option is $30 more expensive, FYI.

I'm not debating the merits of either motherboard choice here, just going for the cheapest options. Except on my 1 TB HDD choice - the additional $10 for an extra 500 GB is a screamin' deal.

I'm sure there will be cheaper deals out there, but using Cyberpower's configurator is the 'fairest' way I could think of, where everyone could double check the numbers.

 

[jj109]

I don't think anyone is going to dispute that an A10 is going to be superior to an i3 if he wants to use the iGPU for gaming. Intel GPU solutions are still behind the competition.

An i3 setup is still going to be cheaper for discrete GPU cases, seeing that a Haswell i3 is ~$130.

For i3 + GPU vs A10 cases, the difference isn't as big as certain people here would like to suggest. The A10 will win out in some multithreaded workloads, but the i3+discrete setup is superior for most games.

i3 discrete ($335): http://pcpartpicker.com/p/2Awvu

A10 ($322.98): http://pcpartpicker.com/p/2Awtv

 

[SPBHM]

if dual graphics this time finally works, it could be interesting with another 7750, but then again, how much less expensive (once you buy nicer memory and etc not needed without IGP usage) it is compared to a 7790/260x or something?

from what I can see at the moment, A10 kaveri is only attractive if you need the IGP (for gaming and/or OpenCL), for basic IGP usage or discrete graphics the i3 4130 is simply a better solution, and you would need lower priced parts, like the "athlon X4" line again,

 

[DaZeeMan]

I don't think anyone is going to dispute that an A10 is going to be superior to an i3 if he wants to use the iGPU for gaming. Intel GPU solutions are still behind the competition.

An i3 setup is still going to be cheaper for discrete GPU cases, seeing that a Haswell i3 is ~$130.

For i3 + GPU vs A10 cases, the difference isn't as big as certain people here would like to suggest. The A10 will win out in some multithreaded workloads, but the i3+discrete setup is superior for most games.

i3 discrete ($335): http://pcpartpicker.com/p/2Awvu

A10 ($322.98): http://pcpartpicker.com/p/2Awtv

The AMD setup you linked is using more expensive memory. $20 more to be exact. DDR3 1600 isn't the same as DDR3 2666... also the Intel setup has a $15 Mail in rebate on the Asus Radeon 7750, so you won't see that $15 immediately... Finally, it's an A10 6800, not a Kaveri...

So it's not quite an apples to apples comparison, and isn't a Kaveri in any case.

 

[jj109]

if dual graphics this time finally works, it could be interesting with another 7750, but then again, how much less expensive (once you buy nicer memory and etc not needed without IGP usage) it is compared to a 7790/260x or something?

from what I can see at the moment, A10 kaveri is only attractive if you need the IGP (for gaming and/or OpenCL), for basic IGP usage or discrete graphics the i3 4130 is simply a better solution, and you would need lower priced parts, like the "athlon X4" line again,

A10 + 7750 vs i3 + 260x? Will depend on how well the asymmetric crossfire scales in FCAT FPS.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/dual-graphics-crossfire-benchmark,3583.html

A10-6800K + 7750 just didn't do anything. My guess is that they'll need to come up with something other than AFR if they want it to work properly.

 

[jj109]

The AMD setup you linked is using more expensive memory. $20 more to be exact. DDR3 1600 isn't the same as DDR3 2666... also the Intel setup has a $15 Mail in rebate on the Asus Radeon 7750, so you won't see that $15 immediately... Finally, it's an A10 6800, not a Kaveri...

So it's not quite an apples to apples comparison, and isn't a Kaveri in any case.

My man, you are grasping at straws here. iGPUs are already choked for bandwidth and you want it to use DDR3-1600? What's wrong with rebates? Finally A10-6800K isn't priced at $173... it's a place holder because the site doesn't have unreleased APUs.

 

[USER8000]

Hopefully Crossfire will work better with the 384 shader and 512 shader GCN based cards.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Even with Kaveri's RAM running at DDR3 2666 --> http://foro.noticias3d.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=421821&p=5036333&viewfull=1#post5036333

.....Core i3 + HD7750 is still winning for gaming:

For highly parallel non gaming CPU tasks (encoding, etc) then yes, I would expect AMD's quad core to be faster than the Intel dual core.

Those numbers for the 7750 look awfully low for GDDR5. In any case, kaveri even with fast ram and highly overclocked is not adequate at 1080p.