the linux distro paradox

[NorthenLove]

You people do realized that a trial version of apt-get is now avaiable for rpm distro's like Mandrake and SuSE right ? It's still under development and testing but it is availble.

 

[NorthenLove]

<< BBWF,

Newbies would use neither apt or rpm on the CLI. They want something like Winblows Update or Red Hat up2date or Ximian Red Carpet.

All I personally want is an FTP site where I can download pre-packaged RPMs, but unfortunately companies are leaning away from that avenue (primarily Mickeysoft). >>



Ummm I don't know about Mandrake but I know SuSE has pre-made and regualry updated rpms for Gnome, KDE, Xfree86, Kernels, and other stuff accessable for it's users on it's ftp sites.

 

[Goosemaster]

<< Ummm I don't know about Mandrake but I know SuSE has pre-made and regualry updated rpms for Gnome, KDE, Xfree86, Kernels, and other stuff accessable for it's users on it's ftp sites. >>




IT does. I was just unaware of how to get them to work.


By the way, I was wondering if you knowleedgabble folk could help me out with my post. I can't get into the gui...yes, I am a newbie. But I don't give up so easily...like some people

 

[Rainsford]

I'm not really sure what it is about RPMS that makes them so hard to use. When I first set up a linux box I had apache with all the fixins running in about 5 minutes with Red Hat RPMS. Granted it took me a long time to learn how to use Apache, but getting it running was no problem at all. Of course now I use ./configure, make, make install because it offers a lot more flexability, but figuring that whole mess out was a lot tougher than getting RPMS to work. Anyone that has a problem with RPMS being too hard to use should maybe not be using Linux at all.

 

[Goosemaster]

<< Anyone that has a problem with RPMS being too hard to use should maybe not be using Linux at all. >>



Boy does that make me the doofus...



The problem I find is FINDING the rpms. Then again, I am a newbie, so I guess I have to accept my doofacity until I read some more.


I also agree tha Linux is not really a Windows replacement. I have been using it it a lot lately, I find it very different indeed. What I have found is that most everything Windows can do is possible, it is an EXCELLENT server or administering system.

It is kind of cool too how when you are at the command line you still are accessing the entire system. I guess I am jsut used to dos and how either you are running something or you are not. with linux you can have a webser and a mailerver runnign and the screen will be showing a prompt...



Time to read more books :|

 

[EmperorRob]

You can't learn if you don't have a working systems. Load REdhat/Suse/Mandrake off some CDs then disect what you want to learn.

Goose, which RPMS are you looking for?

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

<< Anyone that has a problem with RPMS being too hard to use should maybe not be using Linux at all. >>


i agree, they are not hard. they're just a pain in the ass.

 

[Chooco]

the thing that pisses me off is that it doesn't even tell you where the RPM is going, you just install it then hunt around for 10 minutes trying to find it.

i think tar.gz WAY better, just set whatever it tells you to set, type make and it's all cool

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

<< the thing that pisses me off is that it doesn't even tell you where the RPM is going, you just install it then hunt around for 10 minutes trying to find it.

i think tar.gz WAY better, just set whatever it tells you to set, type make and it's all cool >>


huh? you have to download the rpm's yourself, and in that case, if you dont know where they are, its definitely not rpm's fault

 

[Nothinman]

the thing that pisses me off is that it doesn't even tell you where the RPM is going, you just install it then hunt around for 10 minutes trying to find it.

9 times out of 10 it will go in /usr/bin, any of the other times it will be in /usr/sbin/, /sbin or /bin. Or you can use rpm to query the package contents and find it that way if that's better for you.

i think tar.gz WAY better, just set whatever it tells you to set, type make and it's all cool

And I remove it how?

 

[manly]

<< Ummm I don't know about Mandrake but I know SuSE has pre-made and regualry updated rpms for Gnome, KDE, Xfree86, Kernels, and other stuff accessable for it's users on it's ftp sites. >>


That wasn't what I was referring to but yeah, that's a nice service provided by SuSE. On the flip side, those updated packages are unsupported and users report mixed results from time to time.

FYI,

rpm -qpl uninstalled.rpm

will list all the files in the package. Read up on the man pages before deciding that rpm is not a sufficient tool for CLI users. Like I said before, it isn't apt, but most times it's good enough.

 

[Chooco]

the RPM doesn't tell you where it put the program stuff, the executable is in the bin but it never puts the program in the same place. you would think that it goes to /usr/the_program but it doesn't.

 

[Nothinman]

he RPM doesn't tell you where it put the program stuff, the executable is in the bin but it never puts the program in the same place.

Like I said, it's almost always in /usr/bin, the other times are special cases. Anyway, also like I said, learn to use rpm and it will tell you where it put everything.

 

[japetto]

i guess. what people seem to miss is that linux is not supposed to be an alternative to windows. <U>linux was made by and for, people who LIKE to fiddle around with the innards of an OS, and all that. Unix hackers i guess.</U> it's not designed for bitter windows users, its designed for geeks who want to mess around with stuff. of course it has changed alot, and distros make things alot easier, especially mandrake/redhat/etc, but when you get right down to it, <U>linux is still maintained by the same people, and is still not supposed to be a replacement for windows</U><U>.
</U>
Could not have been written any better...These are some of the reasons I love linux. I do fear for the future, although. I think more and more distro's are being aimed to draw in windows users. We will see what this means as years pass...And RPM's are ok for those who do not know how to source install, but not when they're all thats available.

 

[Chooco]

actually it is for bitter Windows users, that is the 1 reason my friend switched over, that is why i'm getting a new computer to put Linux on. i'm sick and tired of Winblows XP crashing every single time i exit a game, or say NET_PACKET:bad address type then crash the game server. i'm tired of this computer taking LITERALY 23 minutes to start and about 12 minutes to shut down.
editted for spelling

 

[smp]

actually it is for bitter Windows users, that is the 1 reason my friend switched over, that is why i'm getting a new computer to put Linux on. i'm sick and tired of Winblows XP crashing every single time i exit a game, or say NET_PACKET:bad address type then crash the game server. i'm tired of this computer taking LITERALY 23 minutes to start and about 12 minutes to shut down.
editted for spelling

heh .. I thought that XP was stable.

I only know debian, I have been trying to learn how to compile all of my apps manually, but it's way hard. I guess apt is good then eh? I'm still a newb, even though I've been running the OS for a long time now, I don't have enough time to fiddle.

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

<< actually it is for bitter Windows users, that is the 1 reason my friend switched over, that is why i'm getting a new computer to put Linux on. i'm sick and tired of Winblows XP crashing every single time i exit a game, or say NET_PACKET:bad address type then crash the game server. i'm tired of this computer taking LITERALY 23 minutes to start and about 12 minutes to shut down.
editted for spelling >>


its not for bitter windows users, although there are those...i just dont like the bitter windows users who dont give a crap about linux, they just want to not use windows. then they get all pissed when they have no idea what they're doing, and ask a bunch of really dimwitted questions, and usually end up getting pissed off, cursing linux and going back to windows. then they complain about windows.

 

[Chooco]

actually no, my buddy's puter works great with Linux, everything is fine now

ps. winblows eats it in clusters