The most progressive Christian Denomination?

[thepd7]

Originally posted by: videogames101

Originally posted by: Steve

Originally posted by: RedSquirrel
As a christian we don't HATE homos, we just know what they are doing is wrong. HATE is actually a sin in itself so it would be very hypocrite to actually hate them. Hate is actually the same as murder as far as God sees it.

As a Christian, you don't speak for me.

Well actually, since god can kill people, god's rules don't apply to himself. Which means Jesus could have been homosexual... Bad, huh?

Actually, Jesus lived a human life free from sin. If He had sinned (any sin, including homosexuality) He would not be a perfect sacrifice and therefore Christianity would not exist.

Originally posted by: Dumac

Originally posted by: videogames101

Originally posted by: ITJunkie

Originally posted by: sao123

Originally posted by: swbsam
I was born into a very, very Christian family (my grandfather was a minister), but have always been personally very left leaning. I gave up on Church during high school but now I'm coming back around. Now that I'm married, I think faith and a belief system's important to especially children, but I refuse to go back to a hate spewing, alarmist Church.

I'll stop being blunt, homosexuality is an issue that I hear mentioned at Churches far too often, and I really don't want to be a part of an organization that spews hate of any kind. I'm not looking for a hippy church, per say, but so many churches seem to take an active role on this issue. I'm ok with ambivalence, I just don't like the hate talk.

Are there any options out there?

EDIT

Also, I'll add that I actually enjoy going to Church now. It pumps me up for the week ahead and helps put my life in perspective, with the understanding that something larger exists than just myself. But, after visiting 6 churches in 2 months, I'm noticing either a lot of cult like conformity or hate, but I KNOW there must be something out there for centrists who like to think for themselves.

There is a difference between hate and disapproval. some churches do not understand this. some church patrons do not understand this.

It is possible to have a zero tolerance toward homosexuality without resorting to hate.
I question any church which does not oppose homosexuality, since the bible is quite clear on this subject. I also question any church which also refuses to seperate an individual from their actions. Jesus gave compassion to the prostitue mary, our churches should do likewise. The church is not here to condemn homosexuals, but to offer compassion and salvation. However, the homosexual also has the responsibility to realize his actions are sinful, he must repent and turn from those ways.

Umm...this is precisely what the OP was talking about. You may leave now and thanks for coming :roll:

Yeah

This is why America can't have nice things.

OP has no use for extreme christians gtfo!

Isn't he right, though? There is no reason to follow a Christian denomination if you are not going to adhere to the doctrine. Without the doctrine, Christianity wouldn't exist.

Also, I agree that churches should, and often do, differentiate between the act and the individual. It is the act that many churches focus on, while still loving the individual.

OP: Does the church have to be Christian? Are you specifically looking to teach your child the ways of Jesus or do you just value, as your post implies, some sort of belief structure?

Yes he is absolutely right, with one of the best explanations of how the Church should treat any sinner (which includes all of us btw).

 

[gorcorps]

I like my church, the church of think-for-your-own-god-damned-selfers

 

[IEC]

Originally posted by: NuclearNed
Try the Christian Church - I've been a member most of my life, and can attest to the fact that most of them value intellectualism.

The Christian Church even has 2 flavors - the Disciples of Christ, which is more liberal, or the other option (simply called the "Christian Church") which is more moderate.

the Church of Christ is part of the same Restorationist movement and is the a Capella version

However individual congregations vary widely as there is no central hierarchy or organization to the Churches of Christ.

 

[IEC]

Originally posted by: videogames101
OP, please, consider that raising your child to think objectively will get them way farther in life, then brainwashing them into a fairy-tale story of magic and going to a super-happy place when you die.

They'll think for themselves, won't discriminate, and will have a deeper appreciation for the short time they have on this earth.

Typical response. Religion has very real value even to "objective" people. Perhaps even more so, because an objective analysis of religion will come to this conclusion after observing religious people and how they find meaning/support/guidance/community/etc in their lives... religion can be very beneficial (as long as you avoid the zealotry)

 

[Modelworks]

Churches are like a good suit, you have to try them on.
You really can't say if it will be a good fit just by looking at the outside.
Just show up one sunday and take in a service. Rinse, repeat till you find what you like.

 

[Modelworks]

Originally posted by: videogames101
OP, please, consider that raising your child to think objectively will get them way farther in life, then brainwashing them into a fairy-tale story of magic and going to a super-happy place when you die.

They'll think for themselves, won't discriminate, and will have a deeper appreciation for the short time they have on this earth.

People that hate religion are filled with more discrimination than people that have a religion. You are saying they can't think for themselves, don't appreciate things, are brainwashed and live in a fairy tale, without even knowing the person. Who is discriminating here ?

I know MANY religous people that I would rather be around than some of the people that think its cool to hate religion just because it is a religion.

Contrary to your belief , most religous people do think for themselves and don't live in your magical fairy world.

 

[ColdFusion718]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: swbsam

Originally posted by: sao123

Originally posted by: swbsam
I was born into a very, very Christian family (my grandfather was a minister), but have always been personally very left leaning. I gave up on Church during high school but now I'm coming back around. Now that I'm married, I think faith and a belief system's important to especially children, but I refuse to go back to a hate spewing, alarmist Church.

I'll stop being blunt, homosexuality is an issue that I hear mentioned at Churches far too often, and I really don't want to be a part of an organization that spews hate of any kind. I'm not looking for a hippy church, per say, but so many churches seem to take an active role on this issue. I'm ok with ambivalence, I just don't like the hate talk.

Are there any options out there?

EDIT

Also, I'll add that I actually enjoy going to Church now. It pumps me up for the week ahead and helps put my life in perspective, with the understanding that something larger exists than just myself. But, after visiting 6 churches in 2 months, I'm noticing either a lot of cult like conformity or hate, but I KNOW there must be something out there for centrists who like to think for themselves.

There is a difference between hate and disapproval. some churches do not understand this. some church patrons do not understand this.

It is possible to have a zero tolerance toward homosexuality without resorting to hate.
I question any church which does not oppose homosexuality, since the bible is quite clear on this subject. I also question any church which also refuses to seperate an individual from their actions. Jesus gave compassion to the prostitue mary, our churches should do likewise. The church is not here to condemn homosexuals, but to offer compassion and salvation. However, the homosexual also has the responsibility to realize his actions are sinful, he must repent and turn from those ways.

I appreciate your point and do not want to threadjack my own thread, but my problem is my firm belief that homosexuality is a born trait - genetic...I do not believe it is a choice, and there fore I can't accept that there is any other choice than to accept the individual for who he is, sinner or not. Does that make any sense?

Homosexual acts is a choice, which I think the Bible implies.

Yup I agree 100%. A few years ago, some gay rights activists were claiming that homosexuality was genetic or some phenotype and not a conscious choice. After some medical studies, doctors said that they were able to conclude with high confidence that there is no such thing as a gay gene, which is to imply that this is psychological.

It's a choice and it's also a sin. It's a perversion.

 

[So]

Originally posted by: ColdFusion718

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: swbsam

Originally posted by: sao123

Originally posted by: swbsam
I was born into a very, very Christian family (my grandfather was a minister), but have always been personally very left leaning. I gave up on Church during high school but now I'm coming back around. Now that I'm married, I think faith and a belief system's important to especially children, but I refuse to go back to a hate spewing, alarmist Church.

I'll stop being blunt, homosexuality is an issue that I hear mentioned at Churches far too often, and I really don't want to be a part of an organization that spews hate of any kind. I'm not looking for a hippy church, per say, but so many churches seem to take an active role on this issue. I'm ok with ambivalence, I just don't like the hate talk.

Are there any options out there?

EDIT

Also, I'll add that I actually enjoy going to Church now. It pumps me up for the week ahead and helps put my life in perspective, with the understanding that something larger exists than just myself. But, after visiting 6 churches in 2 months, I'm noticing either a lot of cult like conformity or hate, but I KNOW there must be something out there for centrists who like to think for themselves.

There is a difference between hate and disapproval. some churches do not understand this. some church patrons do not understand this.

It is possible to have a zero tolerance toward homosexuality without resorting to hate.
I question any church which does not oppose homosexuality, since the bible is quite clear on this subject. I also question any church which also refuses to seperate an individual from their actions. Jesus gave compassion to the prostitue mary, our churches should do likewise. The church is not here to condemn homosexuals, but to offer compassion and salvation. However, the homosexual also has the responsibility to realize his actions are sinful, he must repent and turn from those ways.

I appreciate your point and do not want to threadjack my own thread, but my problem is my firm belief that homosexuality is a born trait - genetic...I do not believe it is a choice, and there fore I can't accept that there is any other choice than to accept the individual for who he is, sinner or not. Does that make any sense?

Homosexual acts is a choice, which I think the Bible implies.

Yup I agree 100%. A few years ago, some gay rights activists were claiming that homosexuality was genetic or some phenotype and not a conscious choice. After some medical studies, doctors said that they were able to conclude with high confidence that there is no such thing as a gay gene, which is to imply that this is psychological.

It's a choice and it's also a sin. It's a perversion.

I can't tell if you're being serious or not.

 

[Dumac]

Originally posted by: So
I can't tell if you're being serious or not.

PROTIP: He is.

 

[Born2bwire]

Originally posted by: Spartan Niner

Originally posted by: videogames101
OP, please, consider that raising your child to think objectively will get them way farther in life, then brainwashing them into a fairy-tale story of magic and going to a super-happy place when you die.

They'll think for themselves, won't discriminate, and will have a deeper appreciation for the short time they have on this earth.

Typical response. Religion has very real value even to "objective" people. Perhaps even more so, because an objective analysis of religion will come to this conclusion after observing religious people and how they find meaning/support/guidance/community/etc in their lives... religion can be very beneficial (as long as you avoid the zealotry)

I was raised going to a United Church of Christ and I feel that it was a progressive church. I don't take to churchin' these days, I just don't have an opinion on whether or not God exists (I guess I fall into agnosticism then). However, I do see the benefits of going to church. Religion provides a strong community, lessons in morals and ethics, and can provide answers to philosophical questions that are hard to answer with objectivism. If the OP finds a progressive and open church, then his kids should still retain enough objectivism on their own to finally decide where they stand when they are old enough. Religion doesn't have to brainwash people, it greatly depends on how you present it. What I liked about our church was that we mostly looked to the Bible to see how its stories and parables applied to the modern world. It wasn't about how some verse in a chapter forbade the eating of shellfish and therefore we would all go to hell if we ate shrimp. So I agree with Spartan. I don't know if I'll ever feel compelled to return to practicing Christianity, but I can say that my experiences and what I have seen at my church were largely positive.

But I will definitely echo the feeling that it all depends on the congregation. I always noticed that Rev. Wright preached at a United Church of Christ... so...

 

[SagaLore]

Originally posted by: AstroManLuca
Unitarian Universalism?

That is hardly christian. Spiritual, yes, christ following, no not really.

 

[Illusio]

Non-Denominational has worked really well for me. Less about rules and more about following Jesus.

Try checking for a church in your area that's part of the Willow Creek Association. Should help you to find one in your area:

http://willowcreek.com/

 

[HardcoreRobot]

start your own. just as valid as any of the others.

 

[uli2000]

Originally posted by: Modelworks
Churches are like a good suit, you have to try them on.
You really can't say if it will be a good fit just by looking at the outside.
Just show up one sunday and take in a service. Rinse, repeat till you find what you like.

QFT. Just go, every congrigation will be different. Stick with one you feel comfortable in.

And I must say, for the first time I've ever seen, a thread on religion without (too much) condecending insults from religion haters. Good job ATOT, you may just proved you can have a thread on religion without the constant crap comments from non-believers.

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: swbsam
I'm weird in that I'm both very old school (keep Christ in Christmas, let's sing hymns not "choruses", or worse, Christian Pop) yet am also very left leaning in my personal politics.

The (progressive) Episcopal Church. Diocese of Albany is conservative but everything else in your area should be pretty liberal. There are lots of TEC churches where you area; try a few and you'll probably find what you're looking for. Many TEC still do a organ/hymn service with the robes and candles and other trappings.

<---- conservative "Anglican" instead of progressive Episcopal

 

[LordMorpheus]

Originally posted by: swbsam
I was born into a very, very Christian family (my grandfather was a minister), but have always been personally very left leaning. I gave up on Church during high school but now I'm coming back around. Now that I'm married, I think faith and a belief system's important to especially children, but I refuse to go back to a hate spewing, alarmist Church.

I'll stop being blunt, homosexuality is an issue that I hear mentioned at Churches far too often, and I really don't want to be a part of an organization that spews hate of any kind. I'm not looking for a hippy church, per say, but so many churches seem to take an active role on this issue. I'm ok with ambivalence, I just don't like the hate talk.

Are there any options out there?

EDIT

Also, I'll add that I actually enjoy going to Church now. It pumps me up for the week ahead and helps put my life in perspective, with the understanding that something larger exists than just myself. But, after visiting 6 churches in 2 months, I'm noticing either a lot of cult like conformity or hate, but I KNOW there must be something out there for centrists who like to think for themselves.

"The Church" = Catholics =/= ministers ... ?

Unless the Anglicans refer to "The Church" as well. I've never heard "The Church" not refering to the Catholics.

 

[tealk]

Originally posted by: SagaLore

Originally posted by: AstroManLuca
Unitarian Universalism?

That is hardly christian. Spiritual, yes, christ following, no not really.

Agreed!

 

[Miramonti]

Originally posted by: Dark Jedi
Non-Denominational has worked really well for me. Less about rules and more about following Jesus.

Try checking for a church in your area that's part of the Willow Creek Association. Should help you to find one in your area:

http://willowcreek.com/

He said he didn't want a gay-hating organization, and you link a top evangelical gay-hating brand, lol.

 

[Steve]

The ELCA recently began allowing non-celibate gays (i.e. in a relationship) to be pastors.


Of course, Episcopalians have been doing that for a while, but progress is progress.

 

[polarmystery]

Originally posted by: AstroManLuca
Episcopal is another one that is very accepting.

Also, I just so happened to find a very complete list of Christian sects and their positions on homosexuality. You can even sort the list.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L...tions_on_homosexuality

That chart is what bothers me about the Christian faith. How can a different set of rules align perfectly with said base? It (to me at least) seems like someone buying a do-it-yourself to make said object, and then only following the rules you deem necessary. How can you have one way, and then many ways to salvation?

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: aircooled
Church of Satan (not christian, but quite progressive)

not progressive at all. Orgies around a bon fire and sacrificed goat are so 90's/

Seriously OP... why do you need a denomination. Non-denominational churches are much better... since they do not have to adhere to any national standard or doctrine. You will probably never find a denomination that fits 100% with your beliefs. I find non-denominational churches focus more on a few very core beliefs. My non-denominational church for instance does not even mention homosexuality. That stuff is left up to the individual.

 

[tealk]

The claim that a church can both condemn and bless homosexual relationships with equal faithfulness falls false on its face. Worst of all, it sows a disastrously deadly confusion about the nature of sin ? a confusion that subverts the Gospel and brings eternal consequences. Should homosexuals repent of their sin, or come to the church for the blessing of their homosexual unions? There can be no multiple-choice answer to that question?Woe unto those who cloak such decisions with the disguise of faithfulness.

 

[Crono]

What the thread resurrection?

 

[n yusef]

Here's a list of gay-friendly churches in New York. I just googled it, so it could be dated or incomplete.

You should just go to the individual churches and come to your own conclusion. The denomination only says so much about what goes on inside the churches. My gay male roommate is a pastor at a Baptist church!

EDIT:LOL I just realized this thread is from 2008.

 

[Gothgar]

Originally posted by: tealk

Originally posted by: SagaLore

Originally posted by: AstroManLuca
Unitarian Universalism?

That is hardly christian. Spiritual, yes, christ following, no not really.

Agreed!

so you like bumping year old threads that were just flamebait to begin with?