The Nail In Obamacare's Coffin

[K1052]

What company has open enrollment that lasts months? From my experience its a matter of weeks. A month max.

I've seen up to two months done. The duration of the period is almost irrelevant...the vast majority of the responses only show up during the last week (or day even) after strenuous prompting by the HR drones.

Point is that to have few signups now is an extremely poor indicator as to what will happen by the time enrollment closes and penalties kick in.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

What company has open enrollment that lasts months? From my experience its a matter of weeks. A month max.

No joke, I received an email this morning informing me that open enrollment starts Nov 1st and ends Nov 15th. As well as the packages have been sent out in the mail. It does sound like nothing has changed for those who have the PPO options as it would roll over come Nov 15th. The email said there were some changes to the HSA plan and those using it would need use the re-enroll (online/mail).

 

[Pens1566]

What company has open enrollment that lasts months? From my experience its a matter of weeks. A month max.

So change his "months" to "weeks". The point remains the same. People procrastinate.

 

[Svnla]

What company has open enrollment that lasts months? From my experience its a matter of weeks. A month max.

Annual enrollment is 1 week here. Two weeks if you are brand new just hired employee.

 

[Apple Of Sodom]

If I want to compromise and pay lower premiums with the knowledge that I will have a lifetime cap, that my 26 year old kid (BTW, if you have lived 1/3 of your life and are still on your parents insurance, you fail) won't be insured and that my back injury from 10 years ago isn't covered then I should get to make that choice.

Car insurance companies do that. Full vs liability. If I wreck my car then get insurance, does the new insurance company have to pay to fix it? No. If I constantly get in wrecks do they have to keep me? No.

I know it isn't exactly the same. I also know that if I don't like car insurance I can shop around, or simply not buy a car.

Let consumers have a choice. Subsidize health care for those meeting ACA requirements. But let the healthy 20 year old keep his $100/month catastrophic plan, because that is what was promised.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

Again.

Again.

You move the goal post. This thread began about people forcibly losing health plans and you continue to scream around that matter by bringing in other ones. You aren't fooling anybody. See halik's wiki link.

You and Halik are incorrect, this is not a moving logical fallacy.

AVinking is attempting to address a straw man argument and you and others are countering with rhetoric, well except for Eskimo, and you chose not to address his point.

 

[Doppel]

You and Halik are incorrect, this is not a moving logical fallacy.

AVinking is attempting to address a straw man argument and you and others are countering with rhetoric, well except for Eskimo, and you chose not to address his point.

No, it is he who is the straw man and throwing a red herring through a now-moved goal post.

 

[Incorruptible]

obama is real POS. This is exactly what he wanted which was to destroy the current system and replace it with single payer.

 

[sportage]

Quote:
"because their existing policies don’t meet the standards mandated by the new health care law."

What does that mean?

Besides I had my insurance "cancelled" multiple times by Blue Cross. Always something that needed to change and my premiums increased.

This means a lot of people, yes probably millions, currently have worthless crappy healthcare plans that have small fine print that IF they become seriously sick they WILL be dropped, NOT covered, and left to twist in the wind.

Yes, a lot of folks have scammy shitty healthcare policies. Some thru work, some obtained on their own.

ACA reform kicks the butt out of those scammy, shitty, worthless policies by requiring the ""provider"" to ""COMPLY"" with basic sound protective regulations and principals.

And people are upset about THAT.... WTF PEOPLE !?!?!?!?

And guess what???
There are A LOT of those worthless policy providers that will be unable to comply.
Yes... probably millions.
Why?
Because those policies are worthless crap sold for profit to get your money $$$$ and provide nothing else but to take your money.
ESPECIALLY if you get really really sick or need real healthcare attention.

Why are people freaking out about this?
What has and is happening are those companies can no longer do business if they are held up to accountability.

A woman should NOT have to get breast cancer to realize she has been sold a shitty policy.
Or a man have a heart attack to see that his shitty policy will drop him faster than an EKG.
Or your child diagnosed with leukemia will DIE because that shitty policy has a cancer clause.
And many companies as well, have been offering their employees those same shitty policies because the company itself has been taken to the cleaners by the providers.

WAKE UP PEOPLE !!!

So you want to keep your worthless shitty insurance policy and "pretending" that if you really get sick or you family member gets sick, that you will be covered by that current shitty healthcare policy????
You have been SCAMMED. Realize that.
And realize ACA reform simply holds accountable those shitty insurance providers pushing their worthless shitty policies onto the victim.

And YES... that shitty policy was probably cheap for you to pay for. Buy.
Cheap because THEY COVERED NOTHING, really....
And thus, now having the ability to obtain REAL health insurance thru an ACA exchange is naturally going to cost the customer more money.
Why?
Because with your old policy, you were buying shit.

And because now thru an ACA exchange you can have access to real insurance.
Insurance that covers everything and for everyone in your family. A thru Z.
Pre existing, high risk, low risk, everyone covered totally and equally.
Breast cancer. Childhood leukemia. Heart attacks. Strokes. Major injury. All covered.

Naturally, a "REAL" insurance policy is going to cost a fair amount more.
And naturally, a crappy limited policy with tons of fine print loop holes will cost less.
But why even waste your money on crap?
Especially when you failed to read the fine print on your current low cost crap policy.
Where it states you WILL NOT be covered for much of anything beyond the sniffles or a ouchie.

WTF PEOPLE !?!?!? WAKE UP!!!

 

[Doppel]

Quote:
"because their existing policies don’t meet the standards mandated by the new health care law."



This means a lot of people, yes probably millions, currently have worthless crappy healthcare plans that have small fine print that IF they become seriously sick they WILL be dropped, NOT covered, and left to twist in the wind.

Yes, a lot of folks have scammy shitty healthcare policies. Some thru work, some obtained on their own.

ACA reform kicks the butt out of those scammy, shitty, worthless policies by requiring the ""provider"" to ""COMPLY"" with basic sound protective regulations and principals.

And people are upset about THAT.... WTF PEOPLE !?!?!?!?

And guess what???
There are A LOT of those worthless policy providers that will be unable to comply.
Yes... probably millions.
Why?
Because those policies are worthless crap sold for profit to get your money $$$$ and provide nothing else but to take your money.
ESPECIALLY if you get really really sick or need real healthcare attention.

Why are people freaking out about this?
What has and is happening are those companies can no longer do business if they are held up to accountability.

A woman should NOT have to get breast cancer to realize she has been sold a shitty policy.
Or a man have a heart attack to see that his shitty policy will drop him faster than an EKG.
Or your child diagnosed with leukemia will DIE because that shitty policy has a cancer clause.
And many companies as well, have been offering their employees those same shitty policies because the company itself has been taken to the cleaners by the providers.

WAKE UP PEOPLE !!!

So you want to keep your worthless shitty insurance policy and "pretending" that if you really get sick or you family member gets sick, that you will be covered by that current shitty healthcare policy????
You have been SCAMMED. Realize that.
And realize ACA reform simply holds accountable those shitty insurance providers pushing their worthless shitty policies onto the victim.

And YES... that shitty policy was probably cheap for you to pay for. Buy.
Cheap because THEY COVERED NOTHING, really....
And thus, now having the ability to obtain REAL health insurance thru an ACA exchange is naturally going to cost the customer more money.
Why?
Because with your old policy, you were buying shit.

And because now thru an ACA exchange you can have access to real insurance.
Insurance that covers everything and for everyone in your family. A thru Z.
Pre existing, high risk, low risk, everyone covered totally and equally.
Breast cancer. Childhood leukemia. Heart attacks. Strokes. Major injury. All covered.

Naturally, a "REAL" insurance policy is going to cost a fair amount more.
And naturally, a crappy limited policy with tons of fine print loop holes will cost less.
But why even waste your money on crap?
Especially when you failed to read the fine print on your current low cost crap policy.
Where it states you WILL NOT be covered for much of anything beyond the sniffles or a ouchie.

WTF PEOPLE !?!?!? WAKE UP!!!

You could have saved a lot of typing by saying instead that yes Obama lied about this but you don't care because he knows best and these millions of people are too stupid to choose their own plan anyway. That is what you feel, right?

 

[WhipperSnapper]

This is exactly what he wanted which was to destroy the current system and replace it with single payer.

The current system is a pre-existing disaster. Our health care system was already in shambles long before the general public had heard of Obama.

 

[Incorruptible]

The current system is a pre-existing disaster. Our health care system was already in shambles long before the general public had heard of Obama.

The current system was better than obamacare. What needs to happen is the the arrival of a free market system.

 

[fskimospy]

The current system was better than obamacare. What needs to happen is the the arrival of a free market system.

Why are all the most effective health care systems in the world not free market if the free market works so well in this situation?

 

[Doppel]

Frankly I think the proper solution to this is to take most of the insurance providers out back and bury in a shallow grave. Their 30% overhead in health care is sport fucking the lot of us.

 

[hardhat]

Does no one have any reading comprehension these days?

We have an article from a ridiculously biased site (canadafreepress) that starts by analyzing an article saying thousands of policies are being cancelled. The article they are interpreting also states

"By all accounts, the new policies will offer consumers better coverage, in some cases, for comparable cost -- especially after the inclusion of federal subsidies for those who qualify. The law requires policies sold in the individual market to cover 10 “essential” benefits, such as prescription drugs, mental health treatment and maternity care. In addition, insurers cannot reject people with medical problems or charge them higher prices. The policies must also cap consumers’ annual expenses at levels lower than many plans sold before the new rules."

Obviously, people should be shocked that they are being offered better, more comprehensive policies at comparable cost. But canadafreepress says that is a bad thing. Also, not all of the policies being cancelled are due to ACA, but instead insurance companies are targeting their most costly policies for cancellation.

Then canadafreepress misinterprets the estimate of Bob Laszewski, when he says

"The U.S. individual health insurance market currently totals about 19 million people. Because the Obama administration's regulations on grandfathering existing plans were so stringent as many as 16 million are not grandfathered and must comply with Obamacare at their next renewal."

As if he means that there will be 16 million policies cancelled. Hint-policies are changed ALL THE TIME. That doesn't mean the policy is cancelled. As has been pointed out, a lot of the policies offered before were worthless.

Then, of course, we have the OP who says "16 million are losing their healthcare."
.........

According to Bob, he estimates that 16 million policies don't meet the requirements to be grandfathered in. That doesn't mean those 16 million policies aren't in compliance with ACA. If they are then they can continue as before (unless the insurance company itself decides to stop offering the policy, or the consumer doesn't want the policy). If the policies are ok then the only thing the ACA changes is putting new legislation into effect that stops insurance companies from having lifetime limits on coverage, or refusing to cover preexisting conditions, or dropping someone to save a buck.

 

[MiniDoom]

website is a joke which anyone can hack personal data from. Fuckers can't properly design a website how the fuck are they going to design a national healthcare system.
http://money.cnn.com/2013/10/29/technology/obamacare-security/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

 

[umbrella39]

EPIC FAIL

My GOD are you stupid and apparently you have a lot of stupid friends posting here.

Pst, idiots, one of the MAIN reasons the ACA was put in place was so that people who:

1. Work good paying jobs
2. Are either not offered health care or have stated they are too young and healthy for that pesky little deduction...

..stop showing up at the hospital with their little boo boo Band-Aid "insurance policies" that don't even cover the cost of the paper their discharge is printed on. They, just like everyone know you can stiff a hospital bill until you are blue in the face. No one is going to come knocking on your door to serve you a process... It just goes away in a few years no matter how much you have stiffed us for.

But those of us who all DO pay for that insurance watch our rates go up and up and up every year to cover the "I have chosen to not be covered" and the "I have a job but my asshole employer doesn't offer insurance so this was all I could afford sorry I can't pay you"

THESE people lost their "health insurance". No one else, these people were going to lose their "health insurance" all along since that is kind of one of the provisions of the ACA yet we have you fucktards coming along claiming it is something else and something new. These people were NEVER told they could keep their insurance because it is not employer offered and it does NOT cover jack or shit.

Do you idiots ever get tired of your own stinky ass lips?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

You could have saved a lot of typing by saying instead that yes Obama lied about this but you don't care because he knows best and these millions of people are too stupid to choose their own plan anyway. That is what you feel, right?

Apparently lying is moral if you deceive the sheep for their own good as you see it.

Let's trust some more!

 

[umbrella39]

You could have saved a lot of typing by saying instead that yes Obama lied about this but you don't care because he knows best and these millions of people are too stupid to choose their own plan anyway. That is what you feel, right?

You could have saved some by typing out Fuck you people that work in health care if my "plan" doesn't pay you oh well. Fuck you, too. No one EVER told people with substandard "health care" policies they could keep them once ACA kicked in. Pay for the health insurance policy if your employer offers it. If they don't get a new job and if that is not feasible now you actually have OPTIONS. GYHOOYSA

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

You could have saved some by typing out Fuck you people that work in health care if my "plan" doesn't pay you oh well. Fuck you, too. No one EVER told people with substandard "health care" policies they could keep them once ACA kicked in. Pay for the health insurance policy if your employer offers it. If they don't get a new job and if that is not feasible now you actually have OPTIONS. GYHOOYSA

Yeah, now people will good choices they can't afford!

 

[halik]

My GOD are you stupid and apparently you have a lot of stupid friends posting here.

Pst, idiots, one of the MAIN reasons the ACA was put in place was so that people who:

1. Work good paying jobs
2. Are either not offered health care or have stated they are too young and healthy for that pesky little deduction...

..stop showing up at the hospital with their little boo boo Band-Aid "insurance policies" that don't even cover the cost of the paper their discharge is printed on. They, just like everyone know you can stiff a hospital bill until you are blue in the face. No one is going to come knocking on your door to serve you a process... It just goes away in a few years no matter how much you have stiffed us for.

But those of us who all DO pay for that insurance watch our rates go up and up and up every year to cover the "I have chosen to not be covered" and the "I have a job but my asshole employer doesn't offer insurance so this was all I could afford sorry I can't pay you"

THESE people lost their "health insurance". No one else, these people were going to lose their "health insurance" all along since that is kind of one of the provisions of the ACA yet we have you fucktards coming along claiming it is something else and something new. These people were NEVER told they could keep their insurance because it is not employer offered and it does NOT cover jack or shit.

Do you idiots ever get tired of your own stinky ass lips?

Deductibles under Obamacare are in the thousands ($6300 for me for the cheapest plan that's 50% more expensive than the $1K deductible plan i had), how exactly is this solving the "little boo boo Band-Aid" insurance policy problem?

You have a point that the "I choose not to insure" argument is void, given the hospitals have to render service. But beyond that Obamacare does nothing to fix the problem, just makes me pay 3.8% along with worse coverage and mental health/ maternity stuff I'll never use.

 

[umbrella39]

So you are claiming your coverage before mirrors your coverage under your new plan, the only thing that has changed is the price...

 

[halik]

So you are claiming your coverage before mirrors your coverage under your new plan, the only thing that has changed is the price...

Old:
http://www.bcbsm.com/index/2013-pla...le-health-insurance/young-adult-blue-max.html $101 a month

Max out of pocket $3500, $1K deductible, 2 free doctor visits a year with $30 copay that don't go into the deductible.

Obamacare:
http://www.bcbsm.com/index/plans/michigan-health-insurance/bronze/select-hmo.html $160 a month

Max out of pocket $6300, $5.9K deductible, $30 copay per primary care visit and $50 copay per specialist office visit *after* deductible.

But you are right, I get more with obamacare: maternity and gyno coverage and pediatric/prenatal/postnatal services for the kids i don't have, yaay!

 

[fskimospy]

Old:
http://www.bcbsm.com/index/2013-pla...le-health-insurance/young-adult-blue-max.html $101 a month

Max out of pocket $3500, $1K deductible, 2 free doctor visits a year with $30 copay that don't go into the deductible.

Obamacare:
http://www.bcbsm.com/index/plans/michigan-health-insurance/bronze/select-hmo.html $160 a month

Max out of pocket $6300, $5.9K deductible, $30 copay per primary care visit and $50 copay per specialist office visit *after* deductible.

But you are right, I get more with obamacare: maternity and gyno coverage and pediatric/prenatal/postnatal services for the kids i don't have, yaay!

In case you were wondering, yes you will almost certainly pay more under the ACA. It sounds like you are young and high income without employer sponsored insurance. That's not a common combination, but you will pay more.

 

[Matt1970]

You could have saved some by typing out Fuck you people that work in health care if my "plan" doesn't pay you oh well. Fuck you, too. No one EVER told people with substandard "health care" policies they could keep them once ACA kicked in. Pay for the health insurance policy if your employer offers it. If they don't get a new job and if that is not feasible now you actually have OPTIONS. GYHOOYSA

Actually they did. Obama. He said it repeatedly. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoV0NeHNklk There was no mention of "if you like it and it isn't substandard" There was nothing taken out of context. You guys are doing exactly what you like to accuse others of doing, you are moving the goalposts only this time it turns it into a blatant lie. People may have liked those plans because they were cheaper or free through their employer.