The Obama Doctrine?

NoStateofMind

Diamond Member
Oct 14, 2005
9,711
6
76
What would it be in your opinion? Has he held office long enough for a consensus? IMO he's been pretty good at saying one thing and doing another. What say you?
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,597
6,145
126
Consensus. Srsly, he's proven over and over again that he will give up as many of his positions as needed to satisfy the demands of the Republicans. So much so, that the Republicans have been forced to oppose Ideas they promoted in the first place.
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,829
3
0
Do what it takes to get reelected?

LOL. Right, that's why he's repeatedly done the right thing even when it's unpopular with his base?


Amazing how the right thinks Obama is an empty suit who does what it takes to get votes the same time he's defying the will of the American people, that he's an eloquent celebrity at the same time he's a witchdoctor who speaks ebonics, that he's a pro-worker socialist at the same time he's an anti-worker corporatist fascist, that he's a weak leader with no balls at the same time he's wasting taxpayer money on Libya, that's he's losing the war in Afghanistan at the same time he's wasting money trying to win the war... Obama must really be the Messiah if he can simultaneously do completely opposite things, both of which Republicans (and the far left) hate.
 
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DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
8,386
32
91
Amazing how the right thinks Obama is an empty suit who does what it takes to get votes the same time he's defying the will of the American people, that he's an eloquent celebrity at the same time he's a witchdoctor who speaks ebonics, that he's a pro-worker socialist at the same time he's an anti-worker corporatist fascist, that he's a weak leader with no balls at the same time he's wasting taxpayer money on Libya, that's he's losing the war in Afghanistan at the same time he's wasting money trying to win the war...

And how he abused his power and just got in the way of BP's efforts to cap the Gulf oil spill, while at the same time he should've done more, shouldn't have relied on their initial estimates, he should've gotten involved earlier.
Oh and how he's spending too much on stimulus packages but he needs to do more to create jobs.

The Right thinks in sound bytes, making them particularly susceptible to having their worldviews skewed by the politicization and constant stream of negativity that conservative talk generates.

"The Sun rises in the East? We'll tell you how this is bad, and how it's the Democrats' fault, right after these messages."
 

matt0611

Golden Member
Oct 22, 2010
1,879
0
0
And how he abused his power and just got in the way of BP's efforts to cap the Gulf oil spill, while at the same time he should've done more, shouldn't have relied on their initial estimates, he should've gotten involved earlier.
Oh and how he's spending too much on stimulus packages but he needs to do more to create jobs.

The Right thinks in sound bytes, making them particularly susceptible to having their worldviews skewed by the politicization and constant stream of negativity that conservative talk generates.

"The Sun rises in the East? We'll tell you how this is bad, and how it's the Democrats' fault, right after these messages."

I want the government to get out of the way and for the market to create the jobs. I want Obama to get out of the way.
The government can start but stop spending so much and taxing us so much. Thats how they can help. So far, they've done jack shit (besides hand out my money to banks, car companies, insurance companies etc)
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
8,386
32
91
So far, they've done jack shit (besides hand out my money to banks, car companies, insurance companies etc)

You just don't grasp what that did. GM's collapse would have killed US automaking as the entire supply chain would've gone belly-up. Losing that much of the US economy would've created shockwaves of uncertainty, leading to spending drying up, and that would've sent us straight into a depression.

Allowing the lenders to go belly-up would've created an even bigger credit crunch than what we went through. Credit is the lubrication of the US economy -- it gives businesses the ability to be adventurous. Without credit to allow them to bank on future profits, they are left with only their cash on hand to work with. You know how you maximize that? Downsizing.
I think we had enough of that the way things went -- more layoffs would've put so many people in the street that there'd be nobody left to buy the products the remaining made, putting everyone out of work.
Again, depression.

Creating 20,000 jobs in Bumfuckington, Nowhere with an artificial economy is meaningless if you lose 80 million jobs with no hope of rescue because the rest of the economy collapsed.

I have no problems with either Bush's or Obama's initial responses in this. They stabilized the patient, which is exactly the point. That all your standard self-absorbed American can see is that "stabilized" is less than "the very picture of good health" and thus wants to whine all day about how things aren't perfect doesn't concern me. They're idiots. You get used to that after a while.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
You just don't grasp what that did. GM's collapse would have killed US automaking as the entire supply chain would've gone belly-up. Losing that much of the US economy would've created shockwaves of uncertainty, leading to spending drying up, and that would've sent us straight into a depression.

Allowing the lenders to go belly-up would've created an even bigger credit crunch than what we went through. Credit is the lubrication of the US economy -- it gives businesses the ability to be adventurous. Without credit to allow them to bank on future profits, they are left with only their cash on hand to work with. You know how you maximize that? Downsizing.
I think we had enough of that the way things went -- more layoffs would've put so many people in the street that there'd be nobody left to buy the products the remaining made, putting everyone out of work.
Again, depression.

Creating 20,000 jobs in Bumfuckington, Nowhere with an artificial economy is meaningless if you lose 80 million jobs with no hope of rescue because the rest of the economy collapsed.

I have no problems with either Bush's or Obama's initial responses in this. They stabilized the patient, which is exactly the point. That all your standard self-absorbed American can see is that "stabilized" is less than "the very picture of good health" and thus wants to whine all day about how things aren't perfect doesn't concern me. They're idiots. You get used to that after a while.



Nothing wrong with Keynesian economics if it's applied, but it's not, only stimulus side of it is, not collection side in good times to pay for bad. Neither is classical economics practiced by conservatives e.g. balanced all the time. We instead have a debt death spiral of deficit spend all the time and cut taxes all the time. And they all know it's unsustainable I must hear it 10 times a day from politicains but it won't change - too much pain. Pain will be cataclysmic though when math catches up.
 

Generator

Senior member
Mar 4, 2005
793
0
0
Do what it takes to get reelected?

You would think, but Obama will have alot to answer for.

If Obama has a doctrine its one of placation. I call him "The Greater Placater" because he makes it very difficult to not make a deal. He will give you what you want but it won't be long before there is some buyers remorse. Obama will get his at the end of day. Obama's irresponsibility is outrageous. I honestly don't see him running for a second term.

Unless...maybe he could somehow placate the entire country. If the Republicans run a rube then we all know that this 2 party system is absolutely fixed.
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
8,386
32
91
Pain will be cataclysmic though when math catches up.

There is a way to cover the gap: Raise the retirement age during the period of transition to a balanced budget.
But they won't do this, of course. They'll raise the retirement age as a band-aid to allow them to continue their current path for just a few years longer. Then we'll be fucked.
 

davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
5,512
24
76
Seems a part of his doctrine is to only do puffball interviews. Would be a lot easier to know where our President stands on issues ahead of time if he won't answer any tough questions. That 10 minute ABC interview with Diane Sawyer was a joke.
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
He is Jimmy Carter part 2.

Unless the Republicans really screw up Obama will lose next year and a few years after that he will be a foot note in history. Other than Obama care he hasn't done anything or accomplished anything worth remembering.

And chances are that Obama doesn't survive either. It will either get killed in the courts or the next President will repeal or at least gut most of the bill.
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
You just don't grasp what that did. GM's collapse would have killed US automaking as the entire supply chain would've gone belly-up. Losing that much of the US economy would've created shockwaves of uncertainty, leading to spending drying up, and that would've sent us straight into a depression.

Allowing the lenders to go belly-up would've created an even bigger credit crunch than what we went through. Credit is the lubrication of the US economy -- it gives businesses the ability to be adventurous. Without credit to allow them to bank on future profits, they are left with only their cash on hand to work with. You know how you maximize that? Downsizing.
I think we had enough of that the way things went -- more layoffs would've put so many people in the street that there'd be nobody left to buy the products the remaining made, putting everyone out of work.
Again, depression.

Creating 20,000 jobs in Bumfuckington, Nowhere with an artificial economy is meaningless if you lose 80 million jobs with no hope of rescue because the rest of the economy collapsed.

I have no problems with either Bush's or Obama's initial responses in this. They stabilized the patient, which is exactly the point. That all your standard self-absorbed American can see is that "stabilized" is less than "the very picture of good health" and thus wants to whine all day about how things aren't perfect doesn't concern me. They're idiots. You get used to that after a while.

I agree with you somewhat except the auto bailout should have been the end of it. Obama's first stimulus after that was a disaster. You don't trickle aid into an economy over 2 years hoping to do anything. That is NOT how you stimulate an economy. It was supposed to keep unemployment under 8% and insted it went over 10%. Like Pelosi said, you gotta take advantage of a good crisis.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
I agree with you somewhat except the auto bailout should have been the end of it.

You do remember Republicans were mostly saying 'let the industry fail'.

That is NOT how you stimulate an economy. It was supposed to keep unemployment under 8% and insted it went over 10%.[/quote]

The stimulus is far too low, most credible economists agree.

Like Pelosi said, you gotta take advantage of a good crisis.

That was Rahm Emanuel, expressing a policy long practiced by Republicans, as documented in Naomi Klein's "The Shock Doctrine". Pelosi Derangement Syndrome...
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
You do remember Republicans were mostly saying 'let the industry fail'.

Yep. They were just getting into the Blame Obama for the the same crap we just did game.

That was Rahm Emanuel, expressing a policy long practiced by Republicans, as documented in Naomi Klein's "The Shock Doctrine". Pelosi Derangement Syndrome...

Wrong Liberal, sorry, but he was not refering to Republicans when he said it on TV.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mzcbXi1Tkk&feature=related

Hillary liked the slogan too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B62igfNu-T0&feature=related
 
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DucatiMonster696

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2009
4,269
1
71
Yep. They were just getting into the Blame Obama for the the same crap we just did game.



Wrong Liberal, sorry, but he was not refering to Republicans when he said it on TV.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mzcbXi1Tkk&feature=related

Hillary liked the slogan too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B62igfNu-T0&feature=related

The context and origin of the quote does not matter to guys like Craig. So don't be to upset when he tries to back pedal or ignores your post.
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,829
3
0
LOL @ Republicans complaining about not letting a crisis go to waste. Did you tomato heads forget 9/11? In your recollection/revisionist history, did Bush let it go to waste? Or did he use it to expand the military industrial complex, drastically alter civil liberties, and get us stuck in a decade long quagmire?

It's mind boggling that you use "don't let a crisis go to waste" as a talking point that supposedly embarrasses Democrats, when it's the very core of Republican strategy. It's like Eliot Spitzer trying to embarrass Charlie Sheen by pointing out that he had sex with a hooker. Do you guys really not realize how fucking stupid it makes you look?

Maybe you really are stupid and can't see that when YOU bashed Obama over the BP oil spill that he had no control over, YOU were not letting the crisis go to waste. Maybe you can't see that just today when you clowns trotted out these bizarre talking points about how Obama is starting a war just like Bush did, you're not letting the Libya crisis go to waste. Maybe it never occurred to you that every time YOU bludgeon Obama with the economy that he didn't ruin and has actually been doing positive things for, YOU are not letting the recession go to waste.

Maybe you don't realize that the very fact that you Republicans gained all those seats in the House last year means that you weren't letting the crisis go to waste.

Yes, maybe you really are a dense bunch of morons.
 
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