The Official Xbox One Thread

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RedRooster

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2000
6,596
0
76
If you read that interview with Phil Fish I believe(the Fez guy) about how MS's current policy requires all indie devs to have an actual publisher before they can put their stuff on the store, and it was costing them so much money it wasn't worth their time to try to get games up onto XBL. Or MS would publish it for a huge fee as well. Either way, the indie devs were getting screwed.
This will save the indie guys a TON of money and make their projects more feasible, but it won't mean the flood gates will open for a bunch of hacky illegal software to go up. There'll still be a very tight certification process by MS to get it published.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
Can't read the link, but I'd imagine it will work like how Apple has it set up.

Does it mention having to sign up as a developer and maybe pay a fee per year or something? I can't imagine MS just allowing everyone to run unsigned code. Piracy would be made quite a bit easier if that was the case. And you could side load apps. That might be decent.

No, no fees...release of updates are free too. It opens up two things in my view.

1) Devs can release their game on PS4 and Xbox One and PC without additional fees.
2) There may be a slew of software that barely passes for quality.
 
Oct 19, 2000
17,860
4
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No, no fees...release of updates are free too. It opens up two things in my view.

1) Devs can release their game on PS4 and Xbox One and PC without additional fees.

I'm not sure where you're getting that. Developers will still need to pay to have their console unlocked for dev purposes. Developers will also have to still pay Microsoft a fee on every copy sold.

Before, as RedRooster pointed out, Microsoft's policy was that any game had to have a publisher, which essentially prices out indie developers. They can't afford that. Now, they are easing restrictions and going against that. Plus, they're giving the ability for anyone to pay to have their retail Xbox One console turned into a dev unit to run code and possibly even issue out betas.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
I'm not sure where you're getting that. Developers will still need to pay to have their console unlocked for dev purposes. Developers will also have to still pay Microsoft a fee on every copy sold.

Before, as RedRooster pointed out, Microsoft's policy was that any game had to have a publisher, which essentially prices out indie developers. They can't afford that. Now, they are easing restrictions and going against that. Plus, they're giving the ability for anyone to pay to have their retail Xbox One console turned into a dev unit to run code and possibly even issue out betas.

How do you know it's fee based? They never mentioned fees and they are not charging devs to release game updates.
 

badb0y

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2010
4,015
30
91
Not really strange. The 360 gives Microsoft a load of steam going into next-gen. It's just the handful of internet junkies who bash Microsoft at every turn. Microsoft isn't in as bad of shape as you'd be led to believe from reading the internet forums all the time.

What is this nonsense? PS3 has outsold the Xbox 360 despite being higher priced and launching a year later.

I don't understand the logic behind these kind of posts.
 
Oct 19, 2000
17,860
4
81
What is this nonsense? PS3 has outsold the Xbox 360 despite being higher priced and launching a year later.

I don't understand the logic behind these kind of posts.

What is your nonsense? Show me where I've mentioned the PS3 anywhere. Also, just because the PS3 outsold the 360 instantly makes the 360 a failure? Where is your logic?
 
Oct 19, 2000
17,860
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How do you know it's fee based? They never mentioned fees and they are not charging devs to release game updates.

How else do you think console makers make their money? Charging for game updates is an entirely separate issue from taking a cut on game sales.
 

badb0y

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2010
4,015
30
91
What is your nonsense? Show me where I've mentioned the PS3 anywhere. Also, just because the PS3 outsold the 360 instantly makes the 360 a failure? Where is your logic?

The logic that there is somehow steam behind Xbox 360... How can Xbox 360 have steam when the only other HD competitor outsold them despite being a year late and having a console at a higher price throughout it's entire lifetime.

Isn't this the exact opposite of having steam? Something like "running out of steam?"

When this gen started it was:
Xbox 360>Wii>PS3

Now at its end it looks like:
Wii>PS3>Xbox 360
 

Sulaco

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2003
3,825
44
91
The logic that there is somehow steam behind Xbox 360... How can Xbox 360 have steam when the only other HD competitor outsold them despite being a year late and having a console at a higher price throughout it's entire lifetime.

Isn't this the exact opposite of having steam? Something like "running out of steam?"

When this gen started it was:
Xbox 360>Wii>PS3

Now at its end it looks like:
Wii>PS3>Xbox 360

No, the Wii pretty much always had the lead, from a pure sales perspective.
Second, the PS3 was sold in regions the 360 never has been, or left soon after. Worldwide the PS3 has a slim lead, but in North America the 360 still has the sales crown.

Third, ask Nintendo just how much that "steam" from this/last generation matters, as they struggle to meet expectations with no current gen competition at all.
 

Dominato3r

Diamond Member
Aug 15, 2008
5,109
1
0
What is this nonsense? PS3 has outsold the Xbox 360 despite being higher priced and launching a year later.

I don't understand the logic behind these kind of posts.

True but the 360 sells a lot more software. There's that steam.
 

badb0y

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2010
4,015
30
91
No, the Wii pretty much always had the lead, from a pure sales perspective.
Technically it didn't but I understand what you are getting at.
Second, the PS3 was sold in regions the 360 never has been, or left soon after. Worldwide the PS3 has a slim lead, but in North America the 360 still has the sales crown.
So? None of this addresses the point I was making.
Third, ask Nintendo just how much that "steam" from this/last generation matters, as they struggle to meet expectations with no current gen competition at all.
This is exactly the point I was making....We can't look at current gen consoles and predict the sales of next-gen consoles. I am sure Sony thought they had the current gen in the bag after the PS2 dominated last gen just as Nintendo thought they were going to own the next gen after the Wii craze this gen.
True but the 360 sells a lot more software. There's that steam.
You are correct but the difference isn't as big as it's made out to be:
http://www.vgchartz.com/platforms/

As for software "steam" I think we've already established that current-gen performance does not indicate next-gen performance but if we are talking about who has the stronger software line up:

PS3:
The Last of Us
God of War: Ascension
Beyond 2 Souls
Gran Turismo 6
Ni No Kuni

vs

Xbox 360:
Gears of War Judgement
State of Decay

I am not even sure if there are any other notable Xbox 360 exclusive games besides those.

But we are getting way off-topic here, I just wanted to point out to blurredvision that his assertion was flawed.
 
Oct 19, 2000
17,860
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But we are getting way off-topic here, I just wanted to point out to blurredvision that his assertion was flawed.

It is not flawed in the slightest. Again, I didn't say anything about the PS3 in my original post, just the Xbox 360, but let's bring the PS3 into it. If you were to go back and look, you'd find that with multi-platform games, the 360 version outsold the PS3 handily every single time. This is true with the CoDs, the Battlefields, the Maddens, the Assassin Creeds, etc. Honestly, who gives a crap that the PS3 outsold the 360 worldwide by a couple hundred thousand units? It's chump change.

To finish, when I say the 360 has steam going into the next generation, I'm not just talking over the last 6 months, I'm talking over the last 6 years. I really don't care about your exclusives list, that means absolutely nothing when the next gen consoles release.
 

badb0y

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2010
4,015
30
91
It is not flawed in the slightest. Again, I didn't say anything about the PS3 in my original post, just the Xbox 360, but let's bring the PS3 into it. If you were to go back and look, you'd find that with multi-platform games, the 360 version outsold the PS3 handily every single time. This is true with the CoDs, the Battlefields, the Maddens, the Assassin Creeds, etc. Honestly, who gives a crap that the PS3 outsold the 360 worldwide by a couple hundred thousand units? It's chump change.
Once again you are missing the context....Xbox 360 started out with a bang, no doubt about that. It was and still is the preferred console by most "core" gamers (the ones that play the CoDs, Maddens, etc.) but the Xbox 360 that launched is not the same that is closing out this generation. Microsoft is focused more on grabbing the casual market and taking control of the living room.

Yea, you are right a couple hundred thousand units is chump change but the fact that PS3 started off as a disaster and still ended up beating Microsoft worldwide is very telling.
To finish, when I say the 360 has steam going into the next generation, I'm not just talking over the last 6 months, I'm talking over the last 6 years. I really don't care about your exclusives list, that means absolutely nothing when the next gen consoles release.
The past 6 years is actually when the Xbox 360 moved away from their "core" gamer base and into the casual market with the Kinect and all.

Regardless any momentum they might have built up in the past generation has already evaporated with the PR blunders of the past 3 months.

But like I said, we will see.

One thing I can guarantee you that the Xbox One won't be shipping 2-3x the PS4 this holiday season lol, what a ridiculous thing to say.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
Here is the thing guys. The margins are much higher on software and accessories than on system hardware. The more games you sell overall the more profit. It also shows an interest in the system and that people are using it. The Wii ended up with the lowest overall software sales. Sure hardware sold but because software wasn't purchased in abundance when compared to the ps3 and 360, it shows that many people ended up letting the Wii collect dust while they used their other console. Or that people only played the free pack in game.

One thing I can guarantee you that the Xbox One won't be shipping 2-3x the PS4 this holiday season lol, what a ridiculous thing to say.

It depends because the ps4 is going to launch worldwide where as the xb1 will only be in select regions. So while Sony has to supply north america, Japan, asia, Europe etc. Microsoft is not yet so they can allocate more units to the regions they are launching in.
 
Last edited:
Oct 19, 2000
17,860
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Once again you are missing the context....Xbox 360 started out with a bang, no doubt about that. It was and still is the preferred console by most "core" gamers (the ones that play the CoDs, Maddens, etc.) but the Xbox 360 that launched is not the same that is closing out this generation. Microsoft is focused more on grabbing the casual market and taking control of the living room.

Just because they're wanting to control the living room doesn't mean they've abandoned the core gamer. Software on the 360 still outsells that on the PS3, I expect the same when GTA5 releases in September. Madden will be the same as always. CoD will be the same. The 360 is the same as it was years ago.

You also seem to forget that the Japan console sales numbers skew the results tremendously. The PS3 outsold the 360 10-to-1 there and the worldwide numbers are still neck-and-neck.

I've not once said the PS3 didn't have good numbers or didn't also have good momentum. I simply stated that the 360 is a VERY healthy platform and that is going to help tremendously going into next gen.
 

zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
Wow what's the story here??? Why have I been paying 30+ dollars for a color cartridge???

It's been ages since I've been around AnandTech. It's good to see that the Hot Deals is still A1.

I'll be ordering from this place.


Yes but as we've seen, the numbers can change from one generation to another. Sony dominated everything in history with the PS2 but look how the next generation turned out? Yes Microsoft went back on most of their negatives so far but it can easily change. Hell, the $100 price difference could easily seal the deal.
 

Midwayman

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2000
5,723
325
126
One thing I can guarantee you that the Xbox One won't be shipping 2-3x the PS4 this holiday season lol, what a ridiculous thing to say.

Not at all. Launch sales are mostly dictated by units available. If Sony if having trouble getting enough units MS could easily out sell them this holiday period. Now that all changes even a couple months down the road.
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
Not at all. Launch sales are mostly dictated by units available. If Sony if having trouble getting enough units MS could easily out sell them this holiday period. Now that all changes even a couple months down the road.

As I said before Sony is launching in more regions. So it is very possible that both have say 20mil units available but the xb1 is sending half of them to north america and sony can't match that simply because they have to accommodate all the regions they launch in.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
So, has my question been answered yet as to what it takes to run unsigned code on the Xbox One? Or at the very least, how to sign your own code for like 30 days or something like Apple does?
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,027
5,912
126
So, has my question been answered yet as to what it takes to run unsigned code on the Xbox One? Or at the very least, how to sign your own code for like 30 days or something like Apple does?

as an ios developer, i'm not sure what you mean by "something like apple does".
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
So, has my question been answered yet as to what it takes to run unsigned code on the Xbox One? Or at the very least, how to sign your own code for like 30 days or something like Apple does?

At gamescom we will know more about how this will all work. As of now they say that at launch you won't be able to use your machine as a dev box.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
as an ios developer, i'm not sure what you mean by "something like apple does".

You cannot, without activating your iOS device on the developer account, install any program correct? Your account allows you to sign it for a limited period of time is my belief. The native iOS platform will not run unsigned code (unless you jailbreak it). I would assume the Xbox would have to be the same, otherwise, piracy is going to be a huge deal. For Android, I can find the app files for literally any app available for purchase and sideload it. Now, the fact that most of those are $0.99 and not $60 makes it not a huge deal. I am sure Sony has the same type of restriction. That is the entire point of having a developer console, it can run unsigned code.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,027
5,912
126
You cannot, without activating your iOS device on the developer account, install any program correct? Your account allows you to sign it for a limited period of time is my belief. The native iOS platform will not run unsigned code (unless you jailbreak it). I would assume the Xbox would have to be the same, otherwise, piracy is going to be a huge deal. For Android, I can find the app files for literally any app available for purchase and sideload it. Now, the fact that most of those are $0.99 and not $60 makes it not a huge deal. I am sure Sony has the same type of restriction. That is the entire point of having a developer console, it can run unsigned code.

with ios stuff, you have a provisioning "key" and a distribution "key" and when you select which way to build/deploy your software, you choose between dev, release, and distro. dev and release use the provisioning one. this allows it to be signed and ran on up to 100 devices, and you set the devices it can work on. when you sign it for distribution, you can't run it on your devices at all. but that is the one you upload to the store. and yeah, it's $100/yr.

with android, you don't even have to pay to develop at all unless you want to put your stuff on the google play store. it is a flat $25 fee for that. that simply allows you to have a developer portal on there and upload your stuff there. no need for provisioning keys or any of the stuff apple does. but yeah like you said, piracy is much easier on android.

i make probably 5-6 more on ios than android software. it's not like im making a living but it's nice little chunk coming in on the side that goes straight to savings heh.

i think the overall developer experience is MUCH cleaner/streamlined on ios than android.

never messed with the xdk or ps stuff though. if it's all free this gen then maybe i will tinker with it a little bit. haven't done any kind of game stuff since my days in college, and even back then it was very limited. and how fitting that it was a 3d fighting game that we worked on in school
 
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