The true meaning of christmas...

[jonks]

Originally posted by: piasabird
Christ was born in April???

April 1, specifically.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think the true meaning of Christmas is to celebrate the birth of a human being who took on consciously, the job of dying on the cross so that millions of other souls could realize that their self hate is a lie and that God is there in all our hearts. It is a celebration, I think, of a man whose love was so great he died so you could live and love instead.

Whatever. Jesus did it to guilt trip us all for the next thousand years.

 

[jman19]

I thought it was about racking up CC debt?

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think the true meaning of Christmas is to celebrate the birth of a human being who took on consciously, the job of dying on the cross so that millions of other souls could realize that their self hate is a lie and that God is there in all our hearts. It is a celebration, I think, of a man whose love was so great he died so you could live and love instead.

Whatever. Jesus did it to guilt trip us all for the next thousand years.

The guilt trip is all your own. You feel too worthless to accept that you have been forgiven for all that guilt you carry and for which you never really were guilty in the first place. It is this world that told you you are worthless, not God. But don't feel lonely, not many Christians have that much faith that they actually transcend their feelings of guilt. Faith is not something you profess. Real faith transforms, it makes what Christians call Saints. Thy Will gets done on Earth as it is in Heaven because heaven and earth to the Saint are the same.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think the true meaning of Christmas is to celebrate the birth of a human being who took on consciously, the job of dying on the cross so that millions of other souls could realize that their self hate is a lie and that God is there in all our hearts. It is a celebration, I think, of a man whose love was so great he died so you could live and love instead.

Whatever. Jesus did it to guilt trip us all for the next thousand years.

The guilt trip is all your own. You feel too worthless to accept that you have been forgiven for all that guilt you carry and for which you never really were guilty in the first place. It is this world that told you you are worthless, not God. But don't feel lonely, not many Christians have that much faith that they actually transcend their feelings of guilt. Faith is not something you profess. Real faith transforms, it makes what Christians call Saints. Thy Will gets done on Earth as it is in Heaven because heaven and earth to the Saint are the same.

Howcome you always want to tell other people what they're thinking, rather than actually asserting your own opinion?

I don't feel worthless at all. I feel great! At least 10 times greater than an Arab.

 

[JD50]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think the true meaning of Christmas is to celebrate the birth of a human being who took on consciously, the job of dying on the cross so that millions of other souls could realize that their self hate is a lie and that God is there in all our hearts. It is a celebration, I think, of a man whose love was so great he died so you could live and love instead.

Whatever. Jesus did it to guilt trip us all for the next thousand years.

The guilt trip is all your own. You feel too worthless to accept that you have been forgiven for all that guilt you carry and for which you never really were guilty in the first place. It is this world that told you you are worthless, not God. But don't feel lonely, not many Christians have that much faith that they actually transcend their feelings of guilt. Faith is not something you profess. Real faith transforms, it makes what Christians call Saints. Thy Will gets done on Earth as it is in Heaven because heaven and earth to the Saint are the same.

Howcome you always want to tell other people what they're thinking, rather than actually asserting your own opinion?

I don't feel worthless at all. I feel great! At least 10 times greater than an Arab.

:laugh: You are too funny.

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think the true meaning of Christmas is to celebrate the birth of a human being who took on consciously, the job of dying on the cross so that millions of other souls could realize that their self hate is a lie and that God is there in all our hearts. It is a celebration, I think, of a man whose love was so great he died so you could live and love instead.

Consciously? It was my understanding that dying on the cross to somehow atone for humanity's sins was pretty well Jesus' only purpose for being sent to Earth. How exactly being tortured and then nailed to two pieces of wood is supposed to erase sins, I have no idea. But it's not really a conscious decision if your reason to exist is to die on a cross. God already knows the ending before he's loaded the DVD in the player.

This celebration existed before Christianity even existed. The winter solstice was the time when the days began to get longer. In ancient times, winter was a potentially deadly season. Its exit was certainly cause for celebration - a "resurrection" of the springtime, and of life that had gone dormant in the months before. To modernize the religion, so it seemed less like pagan rituals of times past, it was personified. Now the return of a season is not celebrated, but instead, the return of a person, a person made out to be divine in some way.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think the true meaning of Christmas is to celebrate the birth of a human being who took on consciously, the job of dying on the cross so that millions of other souls could realize that their self hate is a lie and that God is there in all our hearts. It is a celebration, I think, of a man whose love was so great he died so you could live and love instead.

Whatever. Jesus did it to guilt trip us all for the next thousand years.

The guilt trip is all your own. You feel too worthless to accept that you have been forgiven for all that guilt you carry and for which you never really were guilty in the first place. It is this world that told you you are worthless, not God. But don't feel lonely, not many Christians have that much faith that they actually transcend their feelings of guilt. Faith is not something you profess. Real faith transforms, it makes what Christians call Saints. Thy Will gets done on Earth as it is in Heaven because heaven and earth to the Saint are the same.

Howcome you always want to tell other people what they're thinking, rather than actually asserting your own opinion?

I don't feel worthless at all. I feel great! At least 10 times greater than an Arab.

I am not telling you what you are thinking. How do you know when a dog is hungry? I know your hunger because I know what it means to spiritually starve. I am telling you I know what you feel. There is noting magic or unique about you or your existential experience. We are all the same. He who knows himself knows everybody. You don't know yourself like I know me. You have all the signs of ignorance I need. I know you hate yourself because I know how deep and invisible that feeling was in me. I know other imbeciles like me who have also come to see. I have real understanding here and you do not and it's just that simple.

You are a child telling an adult there's no such thing as sex. I have been where you have not. You take that as a threat and a competition, that I as somehow better than you. That IS the result of your self hate. You NEED to shine me on. You are deeply MOTIVATED not to know how you feel. It's your deepest SECRET. I have seen into your DARK. We are the SAME.

What you also should remember is that all those feelings of self hate are all lies. There is nothing wrong with you or any Arab. There is only LOVE. But truth and reason, facts and logic, evidence and opinion, they do not touch how you really feel. You can't change a feeling you do not know you feel.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think the true meaning of Christmas is to celebrate the birth of a human being who took on consciously, the job of dying on the cross so that millions of other souls could realize that their self hate is a lie and that God is there in all our hearts. It is a celebration, I think, of a man whose love was so great he died so you could live and love instead.

Consciously? It was my understanding that dying on the cross to somehow atone for humanity's sins was pretty well Jesus' only purpose for being sent to Earth. How exactly being tortured and then nailed to two pieces of wood is supposed to erase sins, I have no idea. But it's not really a conscious decision if your reason to exist is to die on a cross. God already knows the ending before he's loaded the DVD in the player.

This celebration existed before Christianity even existed. The winter solstice was the time when the days began to get longer. In ancient times, winter was a potentially deadly season. Its exit was certainly cause for celebration - a "resurrection" of the springtime, and of life that had gone dormant in the months before. To modernize the religion, so it seemed less like pagan rituals of times past, it was personified. Now the return of a season is not celebrated, but instead, the return of a person, a person made out to be divine in some way.

What if there is a form of awakening, a god conscious state, that is our true selves, one that is buried by self hate? What if, like in a room of sleeping and awake people, those who are awake know each other and those who are asleep know nothing? Now suppose such awakened people got together with a plan to awaken all humanity, a plan that would require millennia. What if all the sacred texts and predictions of what was to come were pre-arranged and fulfilled by members of such a club of seers? What if Jesus was part of such a plan?

 

[Madwand1]

Originally posted by: Jeff7
This celebration existed before Christianity even existed. The winter solstice was the time when the days began to get longer. In ancient times, winter was a potentially deadly season. Its exit was certainly cause for celebration - a "resurrection" of the springtime, and of life that had gone dormant in the months before. To modernize the religion, so it seemed less like pagan rituals of times past, it was personified. Now the return of a season is not celebrated, but instead, the return of a person, a person made out to be divine in some way.

It's no more than the standard and typical divisiveness of mankind which dates things from the birth of Christ as if there was no history before then, and even focuses a hybrid celebration such as Christmas/Yule into just the celebration of Christ per se. These are artificial and tribal distinctions in my opinion.

What's there to celebrate in a gruesome historical death? What's there to celebrate in the ordinary, cyclic and predictable workings of nature? Not much.. But there is much to celebrate in his message of love, and there was much to celebrate about survival in harsh climates through social efforts.

The spirit of Christmas or Yule, or what have you is very much alive when we think of others and how we might make them happy.

Cheers.

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
What if there is a form of awakening, a god conscious state, that is our true selves, one that is buried by self hate? What if, like in a room of sleeping and awake people, those who are awake know each other and those who are asleep know nothing? Now suppose such awakened people got together with a plan to awaken all humanity, a plan that would require millennia. What if all the sacred texts and predictions of what was to come were pre-arranged and fulfilled by members of such a club of seers? What if Jesus was part of such a plan?

That's an awful lot of what-if's though.

If I understand what you're getting at, I don't see Christianity as the path to that awakening. I see Christianity as another entry in a long list of religions throughout humanity's history, a religion which will one day take its place next to those of Ra, Zeus, and Jupiter.

Originally posted by: Madwand1
It's no more than the standard and typical divisiveness of mankind which dates things from the birth of Christ as if there was no history before then, and even focuses a hybrid celebration such as Christmas/Yule into just the celebration of Christ per se. These are artificial and tribal distinctions in my opinion.

What's there to celebrate in a gruesome historical death? What's there to celebrate in the ordinary, cyclic and predictable workings of nature? Not much.. But there is much to celebrate in his message of love, and there was much to celebrate about survival in harsh climates through social efforts.

The spirit of Christmas or Yule, or what have you is very much alive when we think of others and how we might make them happy.

Cheers.

It relates back to my idea on the purpose of life - the Universe itself is quite indifferent toward you. If you want purpose in life, you must create purpose yourself, and only then may you strive to fulfill it. Causes for celebration are similar to this, in that we give occasions meaning and significance, we are the ones who say whether or not they are worthy of celebration.
I do find it unfortunate that these attitudes of general goodwill, and the celebrations of life and existence itself are seemingly limited to just this one time of year.

 

[MadRat]

Originally posted by: Jeff7
Consciously? It was my understanding that dying on the cross to somehow atone for humanity's sins was pretty well Jesus' only purpose for being sent to Earth. How exactly being tortured and then nailed to two pieces of wood is supposed to erase sins, I have no idea. But it's not really a conscious decision if your reason to exist is to die on a cross. God already knows the ending before he's loaded the DVD in the player.

God gave his only Son over to humanity as a sacrifice. The death of Jesus was a fulfillment of a promise made to Adam and Eve. The whole premise of the sacrifice dates back to God's proclamation after he confronted Adam and Eve on their sin of eating from the tree in the center of the Garden of Eden. They could not re-enter into Paradise as long as they lived because of their sins. If you follow the story in the book of Adam and Eve then you find out that they actually committed suicide as an offering of atonement to God. Afterwards God raised them from the dead and gave them a covenant that he would one day sacrifice his ownself in order to bridge the gap between God and Man once more. Jesus fulfilled this covenant. The book of Adam and Eve is pretty well ignored by christianity nowadays due to its apocryphal nature, but it was very popular all the way up to the middle ages.

Originally posted by: Jeff7
This celebration existed before Christianity even existed. The winter solstice was the time when the days began to get longer. In ancient times, winter was a potentially deadly season. Its exit was certainly cause for celebration - a "resurrection" of the springtime, and of life that had gone dormant in the months before. To modernize the religion, so it seemed less like pagan rituals of times past, it was personified. Now the return of a season is not celebrated, but instead, the return of a person, a person made out to be divine in some way.

I'm not so sure I understand your explanation here. The reason for choosing the last day of the old calendar had nothing to do with the winter solstice. The birth of the Savior is the mark of a new age. The day was chosen to mark the end of a year symbolizing the end of the Old Testament and the beginning of The Word. The church asserts Christ's life during the celebratry period between the Christmas and the Ascension holy days.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Who really gives a flying fuck, chirstams is Juletide, celebrate it by buying more shit you do not need.

It seems to be what most people do.

In my family i give my son what he wants and i give my daughter what she wants and that is it.

They are very happy about it and they love it, i could buy them gifts for £1000 but i don't.

This also leaves them working duing the days of their holiday and that is great too because while they learn responsibility i get to meet women.

And you ask any soldier with kids how easy that is...

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Originally posted by: MadRat

Originally posted by: Jeff7
Consciously? It was my understanding that dying on the cross to somehow atone for humanity's sins was pretty well Jesus' only purpose for being sent to Earth. How exactly being tortured and then nailed to two pieces of wood is supposed to erase sins, I have no idea. But it's not really a conscious decision if your reason to exist is to die on a cross. God already knows the ending before he's loaded the DVD in the player.

God gave his only Son over to humanity as a sacrifice. The death of Jesus was a fulfillment of a promise made to Adam and Eve. The whole premise of the sacrifice dates back to God's proclamation after he confronted Adam and Eve on their sin of eating from the tree in the center of the Garden of Eden. They could not re-enter into Paradise as long as they lived because of their sins. If you follow the story in the book of Adam and Eve then you find out that they actually committed suicide as an offering of atonement to God. Afterwards God raised them from the dead and gave them a covenant that he would one day sacrifice his ownself in order to bridge the gap between God and Man once more. Jesus fulfilled this covenant. The book of Adam and Eve is pretty well ignored by christianity nowadays due to its apocryphal nature, but it was very popular all the way up to the middle ages.

Originally posted by: Jeff7
This celebration existed before Christianity even existed. The winter solstice was the time when the days began to get longer. In ancient times, winter was a potentially deadly season. Its exit was certainly cause for celebration - a "resurrection" of the springtime, and of life that had gone dormant in the months before. To modernize the religion, so it seemed less like pagan rituals of times past, it was personified. Now the return of a season is not celebrated, but instead, the return of a person, a person made out to be divine in some way.

I'm not so sure I understand your explanation here. The reason for choosing the last day of the old calendar had nothing to do with the winter solstice. The birth of the Savior is the mark of a new age. The day was chosen to mark the end of a year symbolizing the end of the Old Testament and the beginning of The Word. The church asserts Christ's life during the celebratry period between the Christmas and the Ascension holy days.

We all know the stupid story made up by the Catholic church sometime in the 800's or so, before that it was not a Christian holiday and do not forget that pain, agony and death was what made it into one, if you want to celebrate that, be my guest.

Personaly i prefer to celebrate Juletid.

And if you even approach me about doing that i will tell you in reality when god ordered a man to cut out the eyes of his own child.

Christmas is about the spirit of Christ and whether we believe in him or not we can all feel the joy of giving.

Even if you don't like the symbolism, it's a good thought-.

 

[Noobtastic]

Originally posted by: PSUstoekl
"Yule is a winter festival associated with the winter solstice celebrated in northern Europe since ancient times. Its Christianized form is called "Christmas", which is essentially the symbolism and traditions of Yule with the Christian story of the birth of Jesus of Nazareth superimposed upon it. Yule traditions include decorating a fir or spruce tree, burning a Yule log, the hanging of mistletoe and holly, giving gifts, and general celebration and merriment."

Hm.

Wikipedia

Yes, all things associated with Christmas are sourced from PAGANISM. You know that tree in your living room? Pagan.

Also, going to church, listening to sermons, and having pastors are all sourced from PAGANISM.


This is general knowledge and I'd be shocked if any of didn't know.

edit: Don't think I lack the ability to appreciate the overall message of Christmas, but it's VERY misleading. Jesus was not born on Dec. 25th, in fact, there is no evidence that Jesus April-March (Easter).

Christmas is far from Christian, and far from anything religious. It has been corrupted by the masses, exploited with materialistic bulls**t and Hollywood movies.

It is simply an excuse to give/receive presents.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Originally posted by: Noobtastic

Originally posted by: PSUstoekl
"Yule is a winter festival associated with the winter solstice celebrated in northern Europe since ancient times. Its Christianized form is called "Christmas", which is essentially the symbolism and traditions of Yule with the Christian story of the birth of Jesus of Nazareth superimposed upon it. Yule traditions include decorating a fir or spruce tree, burning a Yule log, the hanging of mistletoe and holly, giving gifts, and general celebration and merriment."

Hm.

Wikipedia

Yes, all things associated with Christmas are sourced from PAGANISM. You know that tree in your living room? Pagan.

Also, going to church, listening to sermons, and having pastors are all sourced from PAGANISM.


This is general knowledge and I'd be shocked if any of didn't know.

edit: Don't think I lack the ability to appreciate the overall message of Christmas, but it's VERY misleading. Jesus was not born on Dec. 25th, in fact, there is no evidence that Jesus April-March (Easter).

Christmas is far from Christian, and far from anything religious. It has been corrupted by the masses, exploited with materialistic bulls**t and Hollywood movies.

It is simply an excuse to give/receive presents.

Well you got it right from the start then you went berzerk with the whole deal.

It's Juletide, be merry beautiful being.