The Tulsi Disgrace

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

The fact you don’t understand the difference really puts your posts into perspective.

That and the fact he doesn't understand that 'alot' is not a word.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

She isn't being criticized for her speech. She is being criticized for her cowardice in not voting 'Yay' despite the fact she openly said she believes he's guilty.

 

[jmagg]

Not a lemming.

 

[pmv]

Lame ass talking points ftw!!!!!

You don't think the fact that she went and chatted to a brutal butcher like Assad is a major mark against her?

Bugs me that apparently Dennis Kucinich was on the same trip. Not that I'm that familiar with him and his career in any first-hand way, because I'm not American, but what I've heard of him other than this Assad thing would have made me positively disposed towards him because he's clearly a lefty. But the tendency of lefties that I otherwise might think are OK to get disturbingly and weirdly friendly to Arab (and other third-world) despots and torturers is a recurrent source of distress to me. It happens repeatedly, and I find it a huge problem in working out what 'side' I'm on.

Anyway, Tulsi just sounds like an oddball and loose cannon, to be honest. Not even a leftist as I would understand it. I suspect that anyone raised in a cult (which sounds as if is the case for her?) is likely to have confused ideas. I can't see her being an independent candidate, I reckon at best someone will give her a job as a spokesperson or lobbyist or something.

 

[Starbuck1975]

For the record, I didn't ask anyone for an apology. As the entire purpose of the free speech clause in the 1a is to guarantee private citizens the right to criticize public officials, I am quite openly against any "free speech" by any public official that might disagree with that.

I never said you did

 

[Paratus]

Damn Gramps! 70s prog rock isn't that new!

(the song is actually a biting critique of Calvinism and Pascals Wager)

These days I think late 80’s hard rock by an all African-American band sums up the situation better.

“I exploit you”
“Still you love me”
“I tell you 1 and 1 makes 3!”

 

[Amused]

Incredible that a person who has been consistent in their stand and voted accordingly is called a coward and then we have these group of five cheerleaders who gang up with the same lame talking points from the DNC war party..
The russians sure have pegged the gullible on ATPN. They fall for every russian trick and further polarize the country

There is no respect or honor in being consistently wrong.

 

[VRAMdemon]

Lots of gnashing of teeth about her being called out for playing her little games and helping the Republicans make a mockery of the impeachment process. The video posted tells me she is in lockstep with the Republicans that this is a partisan witch hunt and basically while admitting Trump's crimes, he should be censured instead of impeached for these crimes because it's tearing the country apart and the process is, in her mind - partisan. Never mind the the crimes are 100% impeachable. Good job Tulsi.

She's not fooling most people paying attention. She's a political opportunist searching for her next gig. She will be facing a rough primary challenge and she cannot actually be stupid enough to think she has a shot as being President. Her conspiracy theories against the Democratic party that led credence to the idea that there's some party machine that conspires to make sure that candidates who barely pull 1 percentage point in a poll of polls are somehow squeezed out of sight. "If I wasn't treated so unfairly by the DNC, I'd be polling 20 -30%". She barely got above 1 percent - what's the party and the world owe you? The party owes her nothing.

Let's face it...The only reason she's popular with conservatives is that she's playing her games and trashing the Demorcrats..They love her for trashing Hillary for calling her out on her past and present shenanigans with Assad and Putin . If she wasn't playing her games for political opportunity and whatever job she will get wen she's primaried out of the House, - she'd just be another socialist hell bent on destroying the country to conservatives.

So Tulsi - you can't decide whether Trump is guilty of the conduct he was accused of, but that he ought to be censured for it anyway. Gimmie a break. This grandstanding is part of her exit strategy.

 

[Starbuck1975]

These days I think late 80’s hard rock by an all African-American band sums up the situation better.

“I exploit you”
“Still you love me”
“I tell you 1 and 1 makes 3!”

I always found it odd that they called out Kennedy and Gandhi within the context of the song.

 

[Amused]

I always found it odd that they called out Kennedy and Gandhi within the context of the song.

Who says cults of personality can only be/do evil?

Black and white thinking... simplistic...

 

[Starbuck1975]

Who says cults of personality can only be/do evil?

Black and white thinking... simplistic...

The majority of the song talks about the cult of personality within the context of deception and exploitation.

 

[Amused]

The majority of the song talks about the cult of personality within the context of deception and exploitation.

And while both men accomplished great things, they also both deceived and exploited people. Kennedy was a serial womanizer and Ghandi was a raging sexist, pedo and racist.

See how that works? It's never black and white.

 

[HurleyBird]

She isn't being criticized for her speech. She is being criticized for her cowardice in not voting 'Yay' despite the fact she openly said she believes he's guilty.

I think the usual suspects are saying she's a coward for not voting 'nay,' and "standing up for her convictions." Of course:

• Unlike what most in this forum believe, there's such a thing as nuance. Not everything is black and white, 'yay' or 'nay.'
• None would be complaining had she actually voted against her convictions by saying 'yay,' despite the fact that it would obviously have been cowardice. You know it, I know it, everyone knows it.
• The idea that Tulsi is a coward for abstaining is so laughable that it hurts. And it hurts to know that people are so brainwashed to say something so dumb. She knew that abstaining would hurt her politically, and she did it anyway. That takes courage, you silly people.
• If you want to accuse anyone of cowardice, look at Jared Golden, Collin Peterson, and Jeff Van Drew who all seemed motivated by the prospect of reelection. Look at Nader, and all the other Democrats and Republicans who completely reversed their beliefs on impeachment between Clinton and now.

 

[kage69]

I've always been indifferent to her mostly, but after he "present" vote? What a joke.

To hell with her and all the other oathbreakers trying to shield this criminal from justice, she's now in the Susan Collins pile for disposal.

 

[JEDIYoda]

I think the usual suspects are saying she's a coward for not voting 'nay,' and "standing up for her convictions." Of course:

• Unlike what most in this forum believe, there's such a thing as nuance. Not everything is black and white, 'yay' or 'nay.'
• None would be complaining had she actually voted against her convictions by saying 'yay,' despite the fact that it would obviously have been cowardice. You know it, I know it, everyone knows it.
• The idea that Tulsi is a coward for abstaining is so laughable that it hurts. And it hurts to know that people are so brainwashed to say something so dumb. She knew that abstaining would hurt her politically, and she did it anyway. That takes courage, you silly people.
• If you want to accuse anyone of cowardice, look at Jared Golden, Collin Peterson, and Jeff Van Drew who all seemed motivated by the prospect of reelection. Look at Nader, and all the other Democrats and Republicans who completely reversed their beliefs on impeachment between Clinton and now.

She did not abstain! All she had to do is say -- abstain! She did not say - abstain! She tried to be cute and say - present -- she is a coward and did not stand up for anything convictions or not! In this case there is only black and white all else is blowing smoke...

 

[mect]

I think the usual suspects are saying she's a coward for not voting 'nay,' and "standing up for her convictions." Of course:

• Unlike what most in this forum believe, there's such a thing as nuance. Not everything is black and white, 'yay' or 'nay.'
• None would be complaining had she actually voted against her convictions by saying 'yay,' despite the fact that it would obviously have been cowardice. You know it, I know it, everyone knows it.
• The idea that Tulsi is a coward for abstaining is so laughable that it hurts. And it hurts to know that people are so brainwashed to say something so dumb. She knew that abstaining would hurt her politically, and she did it anyway. That takes courage, you silly people.
• If you want to accuse anyone of cowardice, look at Jared Golden, Collin Peterson, and Jeff Van Drew who all seemed motivated by the prospect of reelection. Look at Nader, and all the other Democrats and Republicans who completely reversed their beliefs on impeachment between Clinton and now.

If a person views the impeachment of Trump being similar in merit to the impeachment of Clinton, you might be a partisan.

 

[ecogen]

If a person views the impeachment of Trump being similar in merit to the impeachment of Clinton, you might be a partisan.

I wouldn't limit it to partisanship, there are a lot of genuinely stupid people out there.

 

[himkhan]

Someone one pulls on her strings.

Who is this puppet master.

 

[zinfamous]

Service is not a qualifier to criticize other veterans

neither is it a qualifier to demand that all politicians have served.

 

[Jhhnn]

You really think she's going to jump ship and run as an independent? She's polling a solid 1%, I just don't see where she'd get any major support, and the freight train full of cash needed to campaign.

Remember Jill Stein & Ralph Nader? Like that.

 

[Meghan54]

I think the usual suspects are saying she's a coward for not voting 'nay,' and "standing up for her convictions." Of course:

Unlike what most in this forum believe, there's such a thing as nuance. Not everything is black and white, 'yay' or 'nay.'

Since it was a yay or nay vote.....either for or against articles of impeachment against Trump, what other stand is there to take other than not to take one? It was a yes or no vote...that was the vote....not a dithering, stand on the razor's edge and dance about without committing one's self to vote one's own convictions.

But I'll grant you the nuance angle. But the nuance she espoused was Trump did indeed act incorrectly but should only face censure, not impeachment. That's the nuance she injected....which should exactly lead her to vote NO on whether articles of impeachment should be passed. She's already stated she didn't think Trump's acts rose to the level of being impeached. So why the vote to only be present when her own words would lead one to believe that to vote her nuance/convictions on the question, she'd have voted NO.

What other nuance is there? The vote was yes or no. It's up to her to explain the nuances that influenced her to vote yes or no. Tusli's vote to be non-committal when she's been damned vocal about her views on the impeachment is just spineless. Just wants to be above the fray yet get to stir the pot and criticize others for their views. Guess Tulsi's views on anything from now on should be ignored....if she hasn't got the courage or convictions or will or spine to vote NO as she's yammered about up to the moment of the vote in the House.

None would be complaining had she actually voted against her convictions by saying 'yay,' despite the fact that it would obviously have been cowardice. You know it, I know it, everyone knows it.

No one was asking her to vote against her convictions.....your assertion that anyone was is laughable and a red herring. All anyone wanted is to have her vote her convictions, not try to dance the razor's edge and end up appearing without any conviction or spineless by essentially not voting her convictions.....and you seem to understand her conviction in this was to really vote NO as she'd been quite vocal about being against the impeachment of Trump. You said as much when you stated "vote against her convictions by saying 'yay'."[/QUOTE]

The idea that Tulsi is a coward for abstaining is so laughable that it hurts. And it hurts to know that people are so brainwashed to say something so dumb. She knew that abstaining would hurt her politically, and she did it anyway. That takes courage, you silly people.

She didn't abstain.....she voted present, a completely different thing. Abstaining is one thing....and possibly I'd have more respect for her and her convictions by doing just that, but she voted PRESENT. She did not abstain from voting. Get your facts right and maybe your argument would hold more sway....or be more relevant....or anything other than twittering like a mockingbird.

• If you want to accuse anyone of cowardice, look at Jared Golden, Collin Peterson, and Jeff Van Drew who all seemed motivated by the prospect of reelection. Look at Nader, and all the other Democrats and Republicans who completely reversed their beliefs on impeachment between Clinton and now.

This is a whole 'nuther kettle of fish.....Clinton's impeachment was a sham. Impeached for lying to Congress about a blow job....really? And the original focus of the impeachment investigation by the Repubs was???? Whitewater real estate deal. And not a damned thing illegal was found. So a blow job was the end result....a political sham. And this is very different than Trump's actions by withholding funds appropriated by both houses of Congress to coerce a foreign government to investigate a political rival for bogus reasons. You know it.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Were I the Governor of Hawaii, I'd be calling for her resignation.

 

[Starbuck1975]

And while both men accomplished great things, they also both deceived and exploited people. Kennedy was a serial womanizer and Ghandi was a raging sexist, pedo and racist.

You can revisit the celebration of just about any historical figure. The point is that the song’s lyrics highlight the negative aspects of personality cult, and most reasonable people would not place Gandhi and Kennedy within the same context as Stalin and Mussolini...unless they just needed famous names to rhyme in the song.

See how that works? It's never black and white.

You’re right. Within the context of this thread, Tulsi Gabbard made a decision that was neither black nor white. It seems some are struggling with her exercising nuance and freewill.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Odd vote by Tulsi.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Since it was a yay or nay vote.....either for or against articles of impeachment against Trump, what other stand is there to take other than not to take one? It was a yes or no vote...that was the vote....not a dithering, stand on the razor's edge and dance about without committing one's self to vote one's own convictions.

Glad you brought up Clinton. Is lying under oath a crime? Yes or No. Don’t be a coward and dodge the question with nuance.