The Usefulness on Firewalls?

[Aolish]

Just wanted to know why people use firewalls? I understand its to protect there PCs and all from hacks and viruses, I can understand using it on a server or something but why use it for people with a home pc (ex. zonealarm) I been using broadband for years and i still have yet to get hacked a single time. Is it because people are just being cautious? Is there another reason other then protecting your pc with a firewall that i don't know about? thx for any replies.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: SSJGouKi
Just wanted to know why people use firewalls? I understand its to protect there PCs and all from hacks and viruses, I can understand using it on a server or something but why use it for people with a home pc (ex. zonealarm) I been using broadband for years and i still have yet to get hacked a single time. Is it because people are just being cautious? Is there another reason other then protecting your pc with a firewall that i don't know about? thx for any replies.

If you have been on broadband without a firewall then I can almost assure you you have been hacked or infected with viruses/worms.

The main reason for a home based firewall is to protect your PC from another person gaining access to it or being infected by all the internet worms that are constantly out there scanning for vulnerable hosts.

Hope this helps.

 

[mboy]

I think it is down to less then 30mn nowadays on broadband isn't it Spidey?

 

[Aolish]

other then the msblast (quick format solved the problem) i have never gotten a virus through hacks without a firewall. maybe i'm just lucky? I do format my drive very frequently so maybe i had something but just got rid of it through all those formats? Is it really recommended to have a firewall up even for a person that has never had any problems without a firewall? ah well, at least xp has its own firewall if i ever need it.

 

[SaintTigurius]

and viruses,

Unforuantly firewalls will not help u against virus's, because u can alwaya accept and email with a virus on it and sh!t. But firewalls are very usefull, i work for Dlink networks and i see the most stupidest things hackers ever do to ppl.

here is one example one hacked into this guy's pc and every 5 mintues the windows manager went up and was Dl porn to his pc... Some ppl might find that usefull and funny... but not to a 56 year old women. LOL that was a funny call.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: SSJGouKi
other then the msblast (quick format solved the problem) i have never gotten a virus through hacks without a firewall. maybe i'm just lucky? I do format my drive very frequently so maybe i had something but just got rid of it through all those formats? Is it really recommended to have a firewall up even for a person that has never had any problems without a firewall? ah well, at least xp has its own firewall if i ever need it.

no, you've been hacked and infected many times. You just didn't know it. Think about it. If I own your machine do i want you to find out? No, I don't.

 

[mboy]

Just think of all the hacks his machine has done without him even knowing it

Dude, their is absolutely ZERO chance that you have not been OWNED at 1 time or more likely, even another.

 

[spidey07]

SSJGouKi,

We're not trying to scare you but lots of us work in network security and really know the Internet pretty well. Bring that firewall up and just see how many times your machine is getting scanned/hit.

 

[mboy]

Originally posted by: spidey07
SSJGouKi,

We're not trying to scare you but lots of us work in network security and really know the Internet pretty well. Bring that firewall up and just see how many times your machine is getting scanned/hit.

And if anyone knows around here, it is SPIDEY!

 

[Boscoh]

Originally posted by: SSJGouKi
other then the msblast (quick format solved the problem) i have never gotten a virus through hacks without a firewall. maybe i'm just lucky? I do format my drive very frequently so maybe i had something but just got rid of it through all those formats? Is it really recommended to have a firewall up even for a person that has never had any problems without a firewall? ah well, at least xp has its own firewall if i ever need it.

Why do you format your drive so frequently? Because you have problems...or because you just want to?

Get you a packet capturing utility like Ethereal (you can google for the link), plug an unpatched XP system into your cable or DSL modem, or dial into your ISP.

I'd be willing to be money that within 5 minutes you're going to see something scanning your computer, probably connecting to it, transferring something, then disconnecting. Most systems that I've demonstrated this very fact with have been infected in 30 seconds or less.

Also, most XP users dont know/dont care about reformatting their systems. They use firewalls and/or antivirus software so that they dont have to. Probably the most frequent cause for reformatting systems on home PC's is a virus infection.

Go to http://www.cert.org/stats/cert_stats.html and look at those numbers. Those are just the amount of incidents that are being reported. The actual amount of incidents occuring that are going unreported are probably AT LEAST one order of magnitude larger than the numbers you are seeing there.

If you research the facts, it's very clear why you need to use a firewall.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: mboy

Originally posted by: spidey07
SSJGouKi,

We're not trying to scare you but lots of us work in network security and really know the Internet pretty well. Bring that firewall up and just see how many times your machine is getting scanned/hit.

And if anyone knows around here, it is SPIDEY!

Thanks man. i could use some cheering up.

 

[martind1]

ya, if you havent had a firewall then odds are your computer has been used in every DOS attack that has been fired off recently. GET A FIREWALL ASAP. Its not just because people liek to have, they need ot have one.


and SaintTigurius, firewalls will help against viruses. It can help keep viruses from spreading if they try to get out through yoru firewall. true, they wont help viruses that spread through email, but that is only 1 type of virus.



Just stop trying to be macho and get one. Other wise have fun with all the reformats you will ahve to do.

 

[cmetz]

SSJGouKi, there's a security principle called defense in depth - briefly, don't make your security depend on just one piece, but layer different and redundant pieces on top of each other to increase the probability that at least one will protect you.

The theory (and the should be) is that your operating system is secure against network attacks. If you're running Windows and not inside MS's PR department, you should know that's not the reality. So rather than trust the OS only, you put a firewall between it and the outside world, an extra layer of defense that supplements the OS's own security mechanisms, in case they fail you.

It is very important that the firewall not REPLACE proper OS security - this leads to an effect known as "crunchy outside, chewy inside" - once you're through the firewall, you're in. The firewall is merely an additional layer.

The other thing a firewall does is adds a convenient administrative point to apply policy to the network. For example, controlling just what's allowed in and out. This is not necessarily a security issue, but rather a policy and control issue. It can also be used to do accounting.

 

[comphollic]

One question....if you have a router, do i still need a software firewall? Doesnt a router have firewalls?

 

[JackMDS]

Normal Home user with Broadband connection needs:

1. Cable/DSL Router. I.e. NAT Firewall.
2. Software Firewall
3. The Cleaning Trio.

On NAT + Firewall Software you can find explanations here:

Link to: Basic Protection for Broadband Internet Installation.

Unfortunately the NAT and software Firewall can not protect you from most of the stuaff that come embedded in Web pages that you view on you own volition, as well as cookies that are mandatory and most commercial Sites.

So on top of the NAT Firewall, and Software Firewall you need periodically to do the following.

Adware program to scan and clean residual ?Junk?.

Link to: Free -Ad-aware 6.181.

A good habit to look from time to time at the StartUp files and see what is loading.

This free program can help: Free - Startup Control Panel.

Another good habit is to look at time on the processing that are running and see if there is some strange unit is Processing Wildly. Free - Process Explorer.

Some people will tell you "I do not need this stuff I know what I am doing".

Well these people are Full of It. They try to pretend that are smarter than others.

Unless you are a Clairvoyant* and have a supernatural senses that tell you what is ebedded in the Millions of Bytes that come every few minutes to your computer from the Internet, there is Not Knowing What I am Doing.

Clairvoyant ? Some one who claims that he is a Psychic, and know and understand the future.

 

[Aolish]

thx for all the replies and links. i guess i'll put up xps firewall just incase.

Boscoh: i format not because of problems but i just like to clean the drive periodically. we all know after awhile the os gets bloated somehow.

 

[RhythmAddict]

On a side note...I find you can avoid a lot of headaches by not using Internet Explorer to cruise the web....active X comes to mind...I'm in love with firefox

 

[n0cmonkey]

I've been crossing the street for 24 years now. I've never gotten hit by a car (well, not while crossing the street). I guess I don't have to look before I cross.

There are a lot of misquitos out here during the summer. None of them have told me I have been bit. Why should I bother spraying "Off" before I go out?

 

[martind1]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
I've been crossing the street for 24 years now. I've never gotten hit by a car (well, not while crossing the street). I guess I don't have to look before I cross.

There are a lot of misquitos out here during the summer. None of them have told me I have been bit. Why should I bother spraying "Off" before I go out?

HAHAHAHA what a great touche

 

[buleyb]

Originally posted by: SSJGouKi
thx for all the replies and links. i guess i'll put up xps firewall just incase.

Boscoh: i format not because of problems but i just like to clean the drive periodically. we all know after awhile the os gets bloated somehow.

Although this is better than nothing, don't think XPs firewall will solve your problems. If you have been breached already, and you turn on a firewall, they can likely still get in, or at least have stuff spreading from your box.


And I might be the first to say, don't put a firewall up for yourself, do it for the rest of us that want this crap to stop spreading. Be part of the solution

 

[Boscoh]

Originally posted by: buleyb


And I might be the first to say, don't put a firewall up for yourself, do it for the rest of us that want this crap to stop spreading. Be part of the solution

Amen.

 

[JonnyBlaze]

i personally have never used a firewall and have never been hacked. i did put ip one for a short time back in the day, blackice i think it was and i sees all the scans but that didnt bother me. those only hit systems that are open to em. a system can be secured without a firewall.

JBlaze

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: JonnyBlaze
i personally have never used a firewall and have never been hacked. i did put ip one for a short time back in the day, blackice i think it was and i sees all the scans but that didnt bother me. those only hit systems that are open to em. a system can be secured without a firewall.

JBlaze

god, not another one. PM me your IP and let me tell you a few things about your computer.
1st scan - I know the OS, open services
2nd scan - check for common vulnerabilities
3rd scan - check for uncommon vulnerabilities
owned and if not keep scanning until you change something, start a service and do much of anything.

-edit- yes a system can be secured without a firewall but it is very difficult to do and take a methodical approach.

 

[AFB]

Originally posted by: JonnyBlaze
i personally have never used a firewall and have never been hacked. i did put ip one for a short time back in the day, blackice i think it was and i sees all the scans but that didnt bother me. those only hit systems that are open to em. a system can be secured without a firewall.

JBlaze

If your running Windows, your not secure no matter what you think. Its a feature. The thing is you just don 't know you've been hacked. A firewall is there to help where the OS can't.

Edit: You lock your doors at night right? Have you ever been robbed? Same thing.

 

[JonnyBlaze]

im sure that you can scan my ip and tell me things about my pc like ports open, user names even. but what can you do from there? i seriously would like to see if you could get in and actually do something besides tell me i have a million ports open because i already know that.
you can get my ip in my sig.
im not saying 100% you cant, but in my experience its never happened to me. if ya can, i sure as hell will get a firewall

JB