The Wink home automation thread

[brinkbart]

2. Is it possible to add more complicated robots? For example, I'd like my lights to dim once it gets past 10 PM, so it's not so bright in my master bedroom as I get ready for bed. The only way I can do this is to setup a schedule for Master Lamp to turn ON (this is key) at 60%. Well here's the thing - what if I am on vacation? I don't want it to go from OFF to ON (60%). I want it to dim, IF, it's already on.

Out of curiosity, have you tried setting up your Robot like this:

If the Master Bedroom bulb is [POWERED ON] after 10pm, then [POWER ON AT 60%].

Presumably the Robot would only run if the state of the bulb is [ON]. I don't know if it works that way, but in theory, I think it should.

However, I still suggest they add "AND" and "OR" statements to robots. That would give you what you want, and give everyone more granular controls over conditions that affect home automation.

EDIT: I just tried, and you were right; you cannot alter the state of a device based on the state of that same device. That's so dumb.

However, if Wink allowed a Shortcut to be run as the result of a Robot, this would solve it. Your Robot would then look like this:

If the Master Bedroom bulb is [POWERED ON] after 10pm, then run the Shortcut named [DIM BEDROOM LIGHT].

See my huge post earlier in this thread for more of my crazy suggestions.

 

[DocHass]

So I installed a Leviton switch (for my ceiling lights) and a leviton plug in lamp dimmer in my bedroom, I want to create a robot that will turn on the lamp whenever it detects that the overhead light is on. When I go to create the robot, under "if this robot detects" I can choose the switch, but I cannot set any variable and the "save" and "clear" buttons are non-functional. I can set it up with my lutron dimmers, but not the leviton. what the hell?

 

[Tech_Greek]

I think this falls under the can't tell if the switch is on or not doc. They probably prevent it so people can't make the robot expecting it to work.

I agree there needs to be a or statement. What if my room mate is home? Will her wink app keep the lights from turning off if she's there and I leave?

 

[Blanky]

I bought the hub for free with some bulbs. Was gonna wait till Xmas but is decided I will try it out because the reviews on amazon are *so bad* I can't wait to see how it works out for me.

Is anybody in this thread who has had their wink hub going for a minimum of a month genuinely happy with it? Home Depot must be getting crushed with returns on this.

 

[Kaido]

I bought the hub for free with some bulbs. Was gonna wait till Xmas but is decided I will try it out because the reviews on amazon are *so bad* I can't wait to see how it works out for me.

Is anybody in this thread who has had their wink hub going for a minimum of a month genuinely happy with it? Home Depot must be getting crushed with returns on this.

You know, I like mine. This thread is for discussion of new Wink technology & related issues, so it probably looks like it has massive problems, but it really doesn't - most of us only post when there's either new equipment available or when we run into an issue, so if you're browsing the thread, it's going to look like it has a crazy amount of problems haha. Mine was somewhat unstable for the initial couple of months at times, but it really only has problems now when their server goes down, which is only occasionally. They did add a server status tracking webpage, which is nice:

http://status.winkapp.com/

You can also browse their history of downtime here:

http://status.winkapp.com/history

October & November were pretty sketchy, but December has only had one publicly logged incident, so I think they're getting the hang of it. I see both sides of the issue: from a consumer standpoint, it's extremely frustrating to have a brand-new system have issues, especially when I have to justify $59 light switches to my wife, and then they don't work from the app because it's raining in the cloud. Not to mention the cost of the equipment!

On the flip side, I've been following smarthome systems for a long time now, and this is an enormous step in the right direction for consumerizing the technology. $60 for an outlet is still crazy expensive, but I can literally go down to Home Depot, pick one up & install it, and then control it from my smartphone. That's freaking AWESOME! So I recognize that it's still the infancy of DIY home automation on a broader consumer level than say X10 or INSTEON, and they're going to have some hiccups along the way.

Right now nothing else compares to Wink. The Staples Connect & Smarthings hubs are OK, and Vera has a possibly awesome new hub coming out soon, but everything is vaporware or vaporquality until things "just work". My biggest preference for a Wink improvement right now would be full offline support for the Hub...no more hiccups when their cloud server goes down! I still have some fiddlyness with different things (like scheduling), but overall it works pretty well. I would still absolutely consider it an early-adopter technology, so I'm willing to accept it for where it's at, especially since I only paid a buck for the hub :awe:

 

[Kaido]

GigaOM has a good article on it:

Wait on Wink: Fixable flaws in this smart home hub, but a solid user interface on which to build

That's really what it boils down to: fixable flaws. In particular:

1. The app is still dumb. It should always open to my shortcuts. Right now, if I kill the app, it opens up to whatever I happened to be looking at last. I want a remote control, not something I have to sift through...right now, it adds an extra step to the workflow, which is a big deal because it's not that much harder to stand up & flick the lightswitch off, you know? Workflow is very important. But, the app has been making improvements, so maybe that's something for the future.

2. The cloud requirement is nutty. I understand why they do it, but it should have a "backup mode" that, at minimum, allows offline wifi control from your smartphone on the LAN. Or even better, have their own DynDNS-style IP service on a separate server that can still jack you into your system remotely if their cloud is offline. There have been 29 service interruptions in the past 3 months alone (count pulled from their public status history).

There are some other misc things as well (needs a web GUI so I can control the house when I'm surfing on my computer, and needs a Windows Phone app as a companion to the iOS & Android apps), but it's all fixable - if they decide to do it. And if they do, they'll have a very, VERY solid system. The problem is, they don't right now - it has an average 3-star review out of 295 reviews on Amazon. Some examples of the more recent reviews:

December 11th:

THIS PRODUCT SUCKS. OUT OF THE BOX

AS A PROFESSIONAL AUTOMATION SYSTEM INTEGRATOR I FELT COMPELLED TO PURCHASE THE WINK HUB AND TEST OUT IN MY OWN HOME SICCE IT OFFERS VALUE AND WIDE COMPATIBILITY. IF TECHNOLOGY EXISTS ON A DIY PLATFORM , WE ARE NOT THREATENED BECAUSE WE OFFER A SERVICE AND FOR SOME IT STILL REQUIRES A PRO TO DEPLOY EVEN THE SIMPLEST OF PRODUCTS.

HOWEVER, THIS PRODUCT SUCKS. OUT OF THE BOX, EXPECT TO SPEND MUCH TIME. FOR ONE, THE APP STORE FOR APPLE COULDN'T EVEN FIND THE APP. MY ANDROID DID BUT FAILED TO ENROLL THE HUB INTO MY HOME NETWORK. FINALLY AFTER MUCH WASTED TIME, IT APPEARS THAT IF YOU UTILIZE WEP PROTECTION (WHO WOULDN'T) OR USE A 5GHZ (WHO AGAIN) ROUTER, IT ISN'T COMPATIBLE. SO IF YOU GO BACK TO 2001 AND BUY A 2.4 GHZ ROUTER AND DON'T ESCALATE YOUR SECURITY TO WEP, YOU CAN ENROLL THE HUB AND THEN TRUST THIS OPEN LEVEL OF SECURITY WITH DOOR LOCKING AND OTHER SECURITY FEATURES IN YOU HOME.

December 10th:

It's okay as concept if works. but it is not stable and it is unreliable.

After connecting 3 GE lights 2 90W and 1 60W and (3) Kidde Smoke & Carbon Monoxid smoke detector (which you cannot add 3 device seperately), things are getting disconnected.

People are still getting goofed up from the lack of documentation; a recent tech support response illustrates one very simple snag that a lot of people have run into:

On the network side of things, it's highly recommended that the hub live at least 10 feet from your wi-fi router.

There's also a good point about app permissions:

I've been watching the protocol wars among ZigBee, Z-wave and Insteon while looking for an opportunity to transition away from several ancient X-10 devices, so I ordered a Wink hub and 2 GE link 60W equivalent light bulbs. Prior to activating the Wink hub, the topology, privacy and hackability issues of this system became apparent. A complete showstopper in my opinion. I didn't realize that the Wink hub has no local config--it uses the cloud to learn and process everything about your home control, your wireless network (and your behavior). Their cloud is an integral sequential link in all of this. It's also unnerving to be prompted by the Wink App to give permissions to: device & app history, identity, location, phone, photo/media/files, camera/microphone, wifi connection information and Bluetooth connection information. Hey, it's OK.. they're good folks ..and nobody ever gets hacked!

Honestly, there is no way I'm integrating any of my webcams into the system, I have no idea what their backend security policy & data collection and distribution system is like. And then there's just the general complaints:

Poor Quality device. I am on my 3rd hub since it was released. I didn't buy it from Amazon, but from my local home depot. The first hub bricked during a firmware update, the second hub would connect to my wifi but say it was unavailable in the app, and now my third hub (wink support sent me directly) will not stay connected. The app is a great all in one interface, and I will continue to purchase products that support the app; however, I won't buy products that require the wink hub.

Works sporadically. Not user friendly. Basically stopped even trying to work after a day of use.

I understand they pushed the product out to the market to beat the competition, but the onboard firmware is half-baked and that's half of what is killing the reviews. For v2, they definitely need to add an Ethernet port, as well as some paper documentation. I had wireless issues on initial setup myself, and I prefer all of my gear to be wired anyway since I change on my wifi password on a regular basis, so that's kind of a no-brainer. I think I made a list of suggested fixes for Wink earlier in this thread, but as a quick recap:

1. Release an updated version of the Wink Hub with an Ethernet port. Include an Ethernet cable that is labeled "you need to be THIS far away" so that it's clear not to put it next to your router.
2. Include paper document in the box.
3. Add full support for wireless.
4. Add a web GUI.
5. Add a Windows Phone app.
6. Have the smartphone apps default to the user's shortcuts for the homepage.
7. Add offline support. At minimum, just local Wifi LAN support if you're home & your ISP or Wink's Cloud borks. Or add some kind of alternative direct-VPN tunneling for the app to control from home. Because you know what would blow? If your smoke alarm went off, but their service was down & you never got an alert. The cheapest smart fire alarm is $49, so it's not like it's an inexpensive investment like a $10 non-connected model is, and it'd be horrible for something bad to happen, but to miss out on it because their service was down.

Plus there's some other stuff, like enhanced IFTTT & integration, but that stuff can come later. Core thing needs to be a reliability improvement, then we can go from there.

 

[JimKiler]

Sorry since someone probably already asked but can I still use the light switch for a wink enabled light bulb? I was excited when I saw the wink commercial but thinking i could no longer use the light switch quickly diminished my enthusiasm.

 

[MjnMixael]

I'm definitely happy with my hub and I've had it for a few months.

That first review, Kaido... that guy was angry because he couldn't connect it to WEP security. Wat? The hub absolutely has it's issues, but lack of WEP is not one of them. WEP is old and bad and no no no no no. Do not use WEP. That's why the hub, rightly works with WPA security standards. But whatrya gonna do.... people will be people.

I can also say that consumer hubs are on firmware 00.33 whereas the beta tester hubs are on 00.47. There's very little actual science to this, but my beta tester hub seems far, far more stable. Whatever they've changed/fixed.. it's been for the better. Hopefully that will role out to the consumer hubs soon.

Ever since that one month (was it October?) where the servers were down for weeks on end... things have been much more stable. I haven't had anything disconnected. I started relying on schedules and robots for automation and it's worked 95% percent of the time.

I'm still on my first hub. Never had to replace it. At this point, I'm using Caseta switches for all but a few of the lights in my home. In two rooms I have a Caseta switch for the main light and Link bulbs for a few other lights that have weirdly placed switches (who built this home, srsly?)I rely on a robot to turn all the lights on/off in that room when the Caseta is turned on/off. Works every time. I have MGO garage door and two Schlage door locks. I also use Nest Thermostat and Nest protect. Oh, and a couple Pivot Power Geniuses. I also have an old Spotter.. but it just sits there, I don't use it for anything (yet). Things have been working great for a couple months. The schedule is obeyed, the robots work... I'm really liking the system once I figured out how to work around it's flaws.

I just installed Relay. Unfortunately, mine shipped with some hardware issue that causes it to reboot/lockup after about 10 minutes. They are replacing it, I'll keep you guys updated on how that goes.

If they fix the flaws (a lot of what you guys are talking about) it will be a BALLER system. Till then, I still think it's the closest to the best DIY Home Automation system out there that we have right now.

Unfortunately, their Customer Support center has clearly been flooded after Black Friday. (They told me that when I called in about Relay.) The beta site has been slow, their response to emails has been slower. I'm betting early next year we'll really start to see some progress again.

 

[Blanky]

Thanks, Kaido. Gonna give it a go this weekend. Only goal in near term is to have 4-6 of the GE link bulbs working on a timer. No other devices, no geofencing or anything else. At least one recviewer couldn't get even that to work reliably but hopefully I can. The lights will be outside, so the hub is going to need to get through a wall and then 30' or so. Something I read from wink said its range was much lower but I can't believe that is true. Surely this thing can reach an entire house if it is centrally located.

I appreciate it is early adopter status and I am not opposed to fiddling with things, but hopefully it is at least possible to bring it to a reliable state. If it has to be rebooted every week I will tire of that mighty fast. My router never does, my security cams never do...so hopefully his can become another one of my systems I don't think about because it works so consistently.

 

[RurikPhoto]

I've been using the Wink hub, GE Link bulbs, Dropcam and Nest for a little less than a month. I like it so far. Once I got the hub in the right location (far enough from the router and placed where the other devices could still reach it), I haven't had any major issues.

The main problems I did encounter were: a very slow/difficult hub software update that eventually went though. I have had to re-pair a bulb once. Lost all my shortcuts and robots (possibly after the software update).

 

[Tech_Greek]

Since the first night I haven't had any issues with delays, down issues or anything. It works for me all the time, I wish it was a bit faster but I feel that's a anti-DDoS deal on their part.

(11/09) was my first day. The only reasons I had issues that day is because I was trying to setup during the time they were doing maintenance cycles for the new app release.

 

[Blanky]

I got this installed. Getting it setup and pairing the lights with their box barcodes went fine. The wink app is intuitive and easy to understand.

And then I encountered something almost heart-breaking because it's so unnecessary. I have two bulbs in a group. Generally when I turn the group off or on both of the bulbs follow suit. However, not always. Just now I turned the group off. One bulb went off. I opened up the lights tab and both bulbs were off on the app, except one was still on in reality. No problem, right? Of course the hub will occasionally poll its devices to see what they are doing. And it did. A few minutes later the bulb that was still on from the failed group-off event came back with the on-icon to represent its proper status.

So obviously this is idiotic behavior. The fact that the hub is not getting back a confirmation from a device or at the very least confirming that a device is in the status of the last user request and, if not, putting it into that status, means that if for some reason the hub fails to turn off the bulb, the bulb just stays on. No additional attempts to turn it off.

I'm going to move the hub closer to the bulbs and see how it works, but that is very stupid behavior regardless.

EDIT: I see there is an update available for the hub, maybe it's old and they have since addressed this silliness, though this seems a server-based issue and I don't know if a change to the hub itself would address. Updating now

UPDATE: nope, as thought this glaring omission in software is a server side issue. Just turned off my group but the lights stayed on. Five min later the icons in the app again properly reflected the state of the lights. This is with the hub through one exterior wall and 10 feet (!!) from the bulbs.

Now, in robots it seems the hub will continually poll an if and execute a then, but that seems no help. I can say if garage light left is on during a certain time, turn off garage right, but I cannot make it work back on itself. This is because the system assumes the schedule alone can competently deal with the lights, but it can't. A workaround would be if a robot could execute on a group within which it resides but it cannot; it can only affect individual devices.

If this thing cannot even turn lights on and off reliably I don't see how I will be able to keep it.

 

[berserko]

I can also say that consumer hubs are on firmware 00.33 whereas the beta tester hubs are on 00.47.

00.47 became available to consumer devices on 12/10.

 

[CAL7]

00.47 became available to consumer devices on 12/10.

Is there a way to initiate an update?

 

[lupi]

Was thinking about getting a wifi thermostat unit, and looks like the honeywell one I was looking at uses a wink portal for doing the settings. Is it easy to use to program online and what chance is there that they go kaput anytime soon rendering the wifi part useless?

 

[Blanky]

Is there a way to initiate an update?

In the wink app itself select the hub and it will say at bottom there is an update.

It's quite telling that a consumer, production device has a firmware version that isn't even .5

 

[Kaido]

Was thinking about getting a wifi thermostat unit, and looks like the honeywell one I was looking at uses a wink portal for doing the settings. Is it easy to use to program online and what chance is there that they go kaput anytime soon rendering the wifi part useless?

I am planning on upgrading to the Honeywell Wifi Thermostat at some point:

http://www.amazon.com/Honeywell-TH93...dp/B00FLZEQH2/

It has its own wifi app for control, and the API ties into Wink, so you can use it separately from Wink if Wink's servers go down. And if wifi goes down, you can just use it like a regular touchscreen thermostat in person. I like that - multiple control & failover options.

 

[CAL7]

In the wink app itself select the hub and it will say at bottom there is an update.

It's at .33 and not indicating an update is available.

It's quite telling that a consumer, production device has a firmware version that isn't even .5

Yeah, introduction of a mass market product at .33 software.

 

[Kaido]

Thanks, Kaido. Gonna give it a go this weekend. Only goal in near term is to have 4-6 of the GE link bulbs working on a timer. No other devices, no geofencing or anything else. At least one recviewer couldn't get even that to work reliably but hopefully I can. The lights will be outside, so the hub is going to need to get through a wall and then 30' or so. Something I read from wink said its range was much lower but I can't believe that is true. Surely this thing can reach an entire house if it is centrally located.

I appreciate it is early adopter status and I am not opposed to fiddling with things, but hopefully it is at least possible to bring it to a reliable state. If it has to be rebooted every week I will tire of that mighty fast. My router never does, my security cams never do...so hopefully his can become another one of my systems I don't think about because it works so consistently.

Yeah, that's the thing: if you recognize that it's still an early adopter product and also realize that hey, you can literally get it for a dollar, it's not a bad ride to jump on. Like I've said in other posts - it's Home Depot-backed and they have a ton of partners, and they're the only one I've really seen available locally anywhere, so they have the strongest game I've seen for DIY'ers.

There's just a few areas they need to iron out the wrinkles with, and I'd bet the Amazon ratings would rocket up to 5 stars. What I'd recommend doing is rebranding it as the Wink Hub 2.0, available in black (instead of white), with an Ethernet port built-in - have a new product page on Amazon, new packaging with paper instruction manuals, that sort of thing. Include offline support, better integration (IFTTT etc.) & reliability, and they won't be able to stock enough of them.

I'm crossing my fingers that they get there.

 

[Kaido]

If they fix the flaws (a lot of what you guys are talking about) it will be a BALLER system. Till then, I still think it's the closest to the best DIY Home Automation system out there that we have right now.

Agreed. I mean, it's a genius idea - I love having to do literally nothing other than install compatible parts & use it. And I feel like we're long overdue for it. I mean, you can start your car & track it via GPS from a 3G signal off your smartphone:

http://www.viper.com/SmartStart/

They just released a Bluetooth electric pressure cooker that lets you control cook time, pressure, and temperature to let you slow-cook, pressure-cook, make rice, yogurt, etc. all in one machine:

http://instantpot.com/

Pictures, movies, music, video & security monitoring, video calls, voice calls, text messaging, and email are all digital these days. It's the tricorder era - control everything from your smartphone instantly, no matter where you are. I like it :thumbsup:

 

[Blanky]

Yeah, that's the thing: if you recognize that it's still an early adopter product and also realize that hey, you can literally get it for a dollar, it's not a bad ride to jump on. Like I've said in other posts - it's Home Depot-backed and they have a ton of partners, and they're the only one I've really seen available locally anywhere, so they have the strongest game I've seen for DIY'ers.

There's just a few areas they need to iron out the wrinkles with, and I'd bet the Amazon ratings would rocket up to 5 stars. What I'd recommend doing is rebranding it as the Wink Hub 2.0, available in black (instead of white), with an Ethernet port built-in - have a new product page on Amazon, new packaging with paper instruction manuals, that sort of thing. Include offline support, better integration (IFTTT etc.) & reliability, and they won't be able to stock enough of them.

I'm crossing my fingers that they get there.

I keep going back and forth in only my few hours playing with it. I really want it to work. I installed two more bulbs. I had originally bought three of the $30 sets, so I paid $90 for 6 bulbs and two hubs. I sold two hubs, grossing $30--although it wouldn't surprise me if the people who bought them ask for returns if they have bad luck with them. Hopefully not! If not, I spent $60 on 6 bulbs and a hub, and considering 60W-equiv LED bulbs are still $8/piece, even without the hub I probably made out okay, as I assume a large brand like GE is going to attract coverage from other products even if Wink just up and dies.

I see there is an API. Am I right to think few people have bothered with it yet? I found no code samples online of anybody having used it other than at the official site.

Issues so far, grouped into shameful (unacceptable; shouldn't have been released to public in that state), and annoying (needs to be fixed, but not down right shameful).

Shameful
1) Isn't smart enough to keep retrying a command if the previous one had failed to exert a change
2) Robots are not able to act upon themselves or a group

Annoying
1) Robots don't have a timer option. E.g. if I have a robot set to turn on the house lights when I arrive home there is no way to set the robot to reverse itself five minutes later. Thus, the lights stay on unless manually turned off or caught up by some other robot event

EDIT: Range seems decent overall. I have this at a wall in a room and 13' from that wall is my "exterior" wall to the garage with its insulation. Then the entire distance of the garage is covered, and finally the lights are in recessing lighting and they seem to go on and off on demand (I'm sure some events will be missed over time, but haven't been yet).

 

[BillinGlendale]

I see there is an API. Am I right to think few people have bothered with it yet? I found no code samples online of anybody having used it other than at the official site.

You'll find an example of calling the API from Tasker on Android using the AutoVoice plugin here: https://plus.google.com/+CraigTrunzo/posts/QiFFiN819Pn

I've been playing with it the past few days and it seems to work quite well. I should note that like you I'm also just getting started with Wink(about a week into the experiment).

ETA: Two things. Being that the Wink API uses REST, there's also Restask(also a tasker plugin, I've not tried this). You can find the API userID and secret in the comments of the UAuth portion of the API documentation.

 

[Woogoat]

Really wanting to like this thing but trouble at every turn. Bought the hub, 8 GE link bulbs and a Smartcode 910.

First hub was unable to connect to my door lock but synced with the lights (after some fighting). When I tried to upgrade the firmware, it failed. Support said they have seen it happen get a new hub.

Hub #2 updates fine and syncs with the door lock in seconds. Now I can't get it to sync all of my GE link bulbs. It starts the pairing process then appears to time out. This time support left it at we will let you know when we figure it out. The other option is try another hub and pair all the things again.

 

[CAL7]

I haven't been able to figure out how to link a non-certified Z-Wave sensor. I go to the hub and follow the process... hub led blinks green and blue which confirms pairing. But I don't know how to access the new device. It didn't show up in the app, at least where I can see it. My support request to Wink is 9 days and counting. I've searched for other support forms, but Kaido's here seems to be the only one (and I know that's not really the purpose). If nobody here can help, can I get a pointer to sites that offer community discussion?

 

[Blanky]

Really wanting to like this thing but trouble at every turn. Bought the hub, 8 GE link bulbs and a Smartcode 910.

First hub was unable to connect to my door lock but synced with the lights (after some fighting). When I tried to upgrade the firmware, it failed. Support said they have seen it happen get a new hub.

Hub #2 updates fine and syncs with the door lock in seconds. Now I can't get it to sync all of my GE link bulbs. It starts the pairing process then appears to time out. This time support left it at we will let you know when we figure it out. The other option is try another hub and pair all the things again.

The iOS app acts stupidly when pairing the ge bulbs. I found that only on one or two of them did I get an onscreen confirmation. On my other bulbs they would flash a few times during pairing, then stop flashing, but the app would "hang". If I cancelled the pairing process, it magically showed the bulb in the main screen, so basically the hub doesn't tell the app when something is paired even if it is, at least in my limited experience.

Billinglendale, thanks for the link above!