The Wink home automation thread

[lsd]

Anybody else see the TV commercial for the Wink Relay? Saw it on hgtv yesterday. Seems like they have a much better marketing department than software..

 

[Kaido]

Over the past week or so, I've noticed a HUGE increase in stability of the Wink hub. I've only seen a brief disconnect last night and one slight delay on lights. I hope this keeps up!

That's good to hear! I'm excited about their new products, but since half of them appear to be Wink-specific, I will not be buying them. For example, the Norm thermostat:

http://www.amazon.com/Quirky-PNORM-W...dp/B00NA9V6Y2/

There's no screen or physical controls. There is an upcoming touch feature (tap once to turn temperature up, twice to turn it down), but does it still work if the Wink cloud or your Internet is down? Scary stuff. Same with the Tapt lightswitch:

http://www.amazon.com/Quirky-PTAPT-W.../dp/B00P7RUR9A

I'd imagine they're using either ZigBee or Zwave for pairing, but historically, the devices pair to the Wink Hub & then relays the control commands to other devices, so again - what happens if access to the cloud is unavailable? I'll stick with my Lutron Caseta gear for now, haha. I'm curious if they're going to use the Relay as an offline middleman to keep basic functionality going...

One user on Smart Things said that Quirky support said that the Tripper window/door sensors are ZigBee-based. For $40 for a 2-pack with an estimated 2-year battery life, I will definitely be picking some of those up (partially because it's a non-critical item like a lightswitch). There's some good pics of the new equipment here:

http://community.smartthings.com/t/...ti-sensor-norm-thermostat-outlink-outlet/6957

 

[IndyColtsFan]

That's good to hear! I'm excited about their new products, but since half of them appear to be Wink-specific, I will not be buying them. For example, the Norm thermostat:

http://www.amazon.com/Quirky-PNORM-W...dp/B00NA9V6Y2/

There's no screen or physical controls. There is an upcoming touch feature (tap once to turn temperature up, twice to turn it down), but does it still work if the Wink cloud or your Internet is down? Scary stuff. Same with the Tapt lightswitch:

http://www.amazon.com/Quirky-PTAPT-W.../dp/B00P7RUR9A

I'd imagine they're using either ZigBee or Zwave for pairing, but historically, the devices pair to the Wink Hub & then relays the control commands to other devices, so again - what happens if access to the cloud is unavailable? I'll stick with my Lutron Caseta gear for now, haha. I'm curious if they're going to use the Relay as an offline middleman to keep basic functionality going...

One user on Smart Things said that Quirky support said that the Tripper window/door sensors are ZigBee-based. For $40 for a 2-pack with an estimated 2-year battery life, I will definitely be picking some of those up (partially because it's a non-critical item like a lightswitch). There's some good pics of the new equipment here:

http://community.smartthings.com/t/...ti-sensor-norm-thermostat-outlink-outlet/6957

On those Tripper sensors, I wonder what the range between the two pieces of the sensor can be at max. I'm thinking that might be a cheap way to monitor my garage doors but I am not sure I can get them super close together.

 

[lsd]

I don't see the battery in the tripper lasting long on a door or window that is opened/closed often. The Lowes Iris window sensor is supposedly Zigbee based also but includes a larger cr2 battery and is priced the same ($20 for 1). I'm going to buy one of those to test it out whenever wink pushes out the update to support window sensors.

 

[Kaido]

I don't see the battery in the tripper lasting long on a door or window that is opened/closed often. The Lowes Iris window sensor is supposedly Zigbee based also but includes a larger cr2 battery and is priced the same ($20 for 1). I'm going to buy one of those to test it out whenever wink pushes out the update to support window sensors.

Thanks to technologies like micro-sleep, a lot of simple electronics are getting crazy battery life now. The Logitech Marathon mouse runs for 3 years on a pair of AA batteries:

http://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/marathon-mouse-m705

All of the wireless keyboards & mice I've bought in the last couple of years (like the Logitech MK320 set) all easily get 6 months of battery life on regular alkalines, so it's definitely doable. Plus, even if the actual battery life is only half of what they advertise (one year instead of two), that is still awesome & means you only have to do annual battery maintenance instead of doing it every month (or having to hardwire in the switches).

 

[Kaido]

On those Tripper sensors, I wonder what the range between the two pieces of the sensor can be at max. I'm thinking that might be a cheap way to monitor my garage doors but I am not sure I can get them super close together.

Most of the open/close sensors I've used have reed switches inside (magnetic). If that's the case, you could probably hack it by putting a stronger magnet further away. Never tried it & don't know what the Tripper uses. I'll see how far apart they can operate once mine come in (no ETA), but it's usually pretty close together. They do make beefy reed switches for garage doors; this one has a 2" operating gap:

http://www.amazon.com/Potter-Amseco-.../dp/B000GUSNQW

Or you could just be creative with the placement, like putting the Tripper sensor on the ceiling by the rail or top lip of the garage door. Depends on how your setup is laid out. Definitely interested to get my hands on them!

 

[lsd]

Thanks to technologies like micro-sleep, a lot of simple electronics are getting crazy battery life now. The Logitech Marathon mouse runs for 3 years on a pair of AA batteries:

http://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/marathon-mouse-m705

All of the wireless keyboards & mice I've bought in the last couple of years (like the Logitech MK320 set) all easily get 6 months of battery life on regular alkalines, so it's definitely doable. Plus, even if the actual battery life is only half of what they advertise (one year instead of two), that is still awesome & means you only have to do annual battery maintenance instead of doing it every month (or having to hardwire in the switches).

I'm probably looking at it differently. I'm going to have about 15 sensors on first floor and I definitely do not want to change 15 batteries every year. If the sensors work and cost the same I'm going to go with the one with the best battery life.

 

[drbrock]

Anyone have an opinion on the garage door openers out there? I am looking specifically at the Chamberlain Myq and the Craftsman Assurelink. The costs are nearly the same.

Assurelink
Pro
Can set timer to automatically close garage door.
Con
Only uses craftsman app and not able to hook up with Wink Hub. (I could be wrong)

Myq
Pro
Works with Wink Hub.
Get Winkhub for free when buying it. Plan on slowing adding other products to house.
Use Wink app to manage garage door
Con
No auto timers

 

[esquimau]

I set up my Wink Hub and a couple GE lights and got enough approval from the other half that I think I can start slowly adding devices without getting "that stare".

One thing that I can't seem to get around... We purchased the QwikSet 910 z-wave deadbolt with the intention of adding it to a smart home set up in the future. Now that we have the Wink, I have it set up through the App and I'm able to lock and unlock and view status changes through the app.

One thing that I can't seem to do is add additional user codes. By default the 910 allows you to program 2 access codes but once you're connected to a z-wave hub you're supposed to be able to have up to 30, allowing you to add and delete access on the fly for things like dog walkers, neighbors that need access, etc. I'm gathering that there's no way to do that currently through Wink. Sure, if I am not busy when someone comes to the house I can unlock the door through the app, but I'd rather not have to leave a meeting to let in the dog walker. This was one of the driving points for getting home automation for me... Is this something I'm likely to see in Wink later (in your best guess) or am I better off going to SmartThings (not even sure they support that). I've been resisting the Veralite since I've read how unfriendly it is to use.

If I keep the Wink I figure I'll get a Chamberlain MyQ next and then decide about the Relay.

 

[Kaido]

Myq

...

Get Winkhub for free when buying it.

Dang, nice deal! Is that only on Wink.com?

 

[MjnMixael]

esquimau, additional lock features are being discussed on the beta boards. We all feel the same way. I'd also love to see battery life reported for the ones that do report it.

drbrock, Go MyQ man. Useable in the Wink App, but it's also it's own system. What I mean is, that like Nest, you'll get a MyQ account that Wink talks to. That means it's separate from Wink's servers (which sadly, is an important distinction right now), but still controllable from the Wink App. Not only that but MyQ seems to be trying to break out of being in a MyQ bubble. Craftsman is useless if they can't branch out and work with other systems, IMO.

I have a MyQ garage door and it works flawlessly.

 

[drbrock]

esquimau, additional lock features are being discussed on the beta boards. We all feel the same way. I'd also love to see battery life reported for the ones that do report it.

drbrock, Go MyQ man. Useable in the Wink App, but it's also it's own system. What I mean is, that like Nest, you'll get a MyQ account that Wink talks to. That means it's separate from Wink's servers (which sadly, is an important distinction right now), but still controllable from the Wink App. Not only that but MyQ seems to be trying to break out of being in a MyQ bubble. Craftsman is useless if they can't branch out and work with other systems, IMO.

I have a MyQ garage door and it works flawlessly.

Thanks will buy today for Christmas. I think that deal is only through wink.com

 

[mcrimm]

I haven't chimed in for a while. I have updated my ceiling cans with 14 LED, dimmable bulbs now that Costco has participation with our local electric coop. We can buy 65 watt equivilent for about 7.00 each - still crazy for a light bulb. I will install aLeviton DZMX1-1LZ Decora Z-Wave Controls Scene Capable Universal Dimmer later this week to control my living room floods.

My chief complaint is the inability of the switches to communicate their position to the app. My iphone will tell me a light is off when it is on - and on when it is off. I know Wink is working on this

Hopefully as this matures, we will see better communication and lower switch prices. $50 for a switch is almost as crazy as $7 for a light bulb.

Mike

 

[CAL7]

Ditto on switch prices. I can't think of any other electronic device that commands such a premium. Waiting for the mass-market realization and concomitant pricing, which is why I have hope and patience for Wink.

 

[Kaido]

Hopefully as this matures, we will see better communication and lower switch prices. $50 for a switch is almost as crazy as $7 for a light bulb.

Seriously. It'd literally cost me like a thousand dollars just to replace all of my switches with the $59 Lutron ones. And I don't even like them - I miss having a flip-switch. Again, my ideal design is a physical stick-out one like the cheap ones they sell at Home Depot, just center-sprung instead of on/off. It'd be so simple:

1. Spring returns to center
2. Flip up for switch on (momentary contact)
3. Flip down for switch off (momentary contact)
4. Flip up & hold up for brightening (spring returns to center)
5. Flip down & hold down for dimming

Ta-da. Traditional human interface, 100% easy relay design with dimming features. Someone Kickstarter that puppy :biggrin:

 

[arod]

Ditto on switch prices. I can't think of any other electronic device that commands such a premium. Waiting for the mass-market realization and concomitant pricing, which is why I have hope and patience for Wink.

I do too... not going to invest in any system until the prices come down and can wait until they do. Somebody has to be working on a $10-20 switch/dimmer.

It is same app, but it works on my 3 android tablets (10", 8", 7") just fine. Not specifically formated for them though.
Matt

That's what I mean.... have no interest in phone apps blown up for the bigger screen. Home Automation is one of those areas that can significantly benefit from showing more on each screen and whatever system I choose has to have good apps across all platforms because part of my plan would be to repurpose old tablets as wall control points but I want something that looks like it belongs on a tablet for that to work imo.

 

[Exigence]

I wouldn't say somebody is "working" on a $10-$20 wireless dimmer switch. Everybody is working to get the cost down, but ultimately you have quite a bit of electronics in there (the wireless and the dimmer) and you have all the problems of LED compatibility for dimming. It's a much more difficult thing to do then people think.

Speaking of compatibility, here's some good info on LED dimming. There are two basic ways LEDs are dimmed. One produces flicker (the electric wavelength is chopped up to save energy) and the other creates a color shift (the overall power is lowered to the LED). How the LED driver that is built into the lamp handles the dimming also effects things. Lutron has a good resource for compatibility (google Lutron LED compatibility). I haven't seen one from the other manufacturers, but I'm sure they have something internally at least.

 

[Exigence]

I've always been surprised that nobody makes a lighting control cabinet for the home user. This would be a box that would go up in your attic that would get power fed to it and then have a bunch of branch sub feeds to the various lights in your house. You then would use wireless remotes for your switches (like a $15 Pico remote). You'd also not need any wiring down walls, which would be a huge plus for retrofits.

 

[Narumi]

I've always been surprised that nobody makes a lighting control cabinet for the home user. This would be a box that would go up in your attic that would get power fed to it and then have a bunch of branch sub feeds to the various lights in your house. You then would use wireless remotes for your switches (like a $15 Pico remote). You'd also not need any wiring down walls, which would be a huge plus for retrofits.

That would be nice, but not all houses are built the same. In a two story house not all the wires for the lights go through the attic, you would have to go to the breaker and find your wires there and then hook it up that way. Also what would you do to the existing light switches? and not all home users know what 120v can do to you, let alone work safely in the attic.

Now if your looking to spend a good chunk of money, control4 or HAI would be something that does what you mention.....

 

[CAL7]

Is there support for dusk timers? Given its tied to a cloud system, one of the features that should be super-easy to implement would be calculation of local sunrise/sunset times. Related question: I see some references to IFTTT support- can that be used for dusk timing? Ideas?

 

[SchillerM]

Is there support for dusk timers? Given its tied to a cloud system, one of the features that should be super-easy to implement would be calculation of local sunrise/sunset times. Related question: I see some references to IFTTT support- can that be used for dusk timing? Ideas?

Maybe with the spotter?

When I went on vacation I just set a schedule to do it. Not that hard to change times every month or so.
Matt

 

[CAL7]

I'm going crazy. I bought some non-wink-certified sensors. One PIR and one tilt garage door. I knew it would be hit-or-miss, but I thought I'd at least have a chance. I'm glad Wink is updating the app frequently, but I can't find in the "add a product" page how I add a generic Z-Wave device. I am only seeing wink certified product options. A pointer, please?

 

[berserko]

Hello,

I have recently purchased a Wink from my local Home Depot. I've read through the entire thread and actually have some more input I can lend to the topic.

As a few others have pointed out there is no native BlackBerry app but starting with Blackberry 10.2.1 BlackBerrys have been able to boot Android apps you can download the Wink app via Snap and it works fine. Except at least on the Z10 you cannot do the initial setup on the BB Z10 doesn't support ad-hoc networks like the Wink set's up so you need to do initial setup on a i-device or droid but after that the app works on my Z10.

I have been using Zwave devices for about 4 years or so. I ended up getting a veralite about 6-8 months ago. I very much love the vast support of devices the vera has and the depth of support they have (example showing the battery level in my Kwikset and my Aeon Window and door sensors.)

I agree the vera Android phone app is clunky at best and Wink certainly walks away with a huge win in that respect.

I certainly agree with some of the other feedback point I've seen here:

Wink really needs to have a local replica of your data incase the cloud goes away. Vera data is all local but you have a cloud for remote access.

From what I read they are doing in beta event's happening based on sun rise/sunset. I have many events firing based on this my vera turns on my outdoor lights at sunset and turns them off @ 1AM. I have a tropical garden in my basement. I have my lights turn on 2 hours before sunrise and 2 hours after sunset to give my tropicals the feeling they're closer to the equator. This is essential functionality for me before I can cut over.

The functionality I really wanted the Wink for was for the Kidde smoke alarms I wanted to unlock my kwikset deadbolt if the fire alarm went off so I could get out of my house. But you cannot unlock based upon an event which is really sad.

Lack of a web page. I think they should keep the mobile app clean and minimal like they have it but for more involved configurations perhaps having a website on device to work with.

Broader Zwave support I know stuff can be added as generics but from what I'm seeing/hearing functionality if lackluster at best I have about a dozen Zwave dimmers 3 Zwave switches, 3 Kwikset deadbolts, 3 Aeon Mag sensors, a couple plug in modules, and a Zwave garage door opener. I have 100% functionality especially on the door locks I'm adding and removing codes all the time or having codes active for a certain period of time. Eg the maid's code works between 9-noon Tuesdays try it outside the window it doesn't work. I even have a distress code if anyone enters the code it opens the door everything behaves as normal but emails everyone saying there is an emergency happening at home.

I really do miss the lack of an ethernet port and that the Wink doesn't support 5GHz wifi.

One thing I haven't tested do virtual 3 ways work yet?

I really like the looks of the relay product. I have built a very custom app and 3d printed a wall bracket for my Playbook but if I could get something like that especially with the promise of a doorbell integration I'm certainly interested.

I did end up rooting my Wink I'm hoping I can perhaps just use it for a bridge between kiddie and have it execute scenes on my vera (via curl) until the product becomes more mature.

Love the price point, love the availability. Love all the networks/protocols it supports. But its awfully immature versus something like vera which is only marginally more expensive. Perhaps this will give vera the kick in the butt to step up the mobile development.

 

[berserko]

Changes to my wink from last night. I now have the root password for the Wink. Thanks John the ripper.

I also have figured out where Wink keeps the various versions of OTA software updates Production, Beta, Development, Flex, Prod Test, Stage Test, Upgrade-test) That's a lot of streams from what I can see many of them are quite stale.

However if you you didn't root your device before taking the initial update then it appears you're SOL. I haven't discovered any new exploits after the initial one disclosed by GTVhacker. I'll probably apply the Beta code stream shortly and see if i can see anything drastically different (I doubt I will as I probably need the beta client SW) unless putting the beta SW wink code puts the client into a different mode.

If anyone with a rooted device wants to discuss some of the findings feel free to PM me.

 

[CAL7]

I'm going crazy. I bought some non-wink-certified sensors. One PIR and one tilt garage door. I knew it would be hit-or-miss, but I thought I'd at least have a chance. I'm glad Wink is updating the app frequently, but I can't find in the "add a product" page how I add a generic Z-Wave device. I am only seeing wink certified product options. A pointer, please?

So, I found the menu item for a new generic Z-Wave device under the hub menu. Once there, I clicked "include" and it responded that it understood and was waiting for the device; on the device, I installed the battery and they seemed to talk. The hub flashed blue then, green, then steady blue. That sequence is dissed to indicate successful pairing. But, then what? I kinda expected to see a new device added... but, no. Is there some place I look, or next step I perform to actually have the device in my Wink app? (P.S. It's a garage door indicator, so I think I'm looking for a Z-Wave binary switch.)