"Thousands" of min-wage McDonalds workers to walk off jobs to demand better pay

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Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,247
207
106
I don't know why people are so opposed to what companies or ANY business makes. That's kinda what they are supposed to do, how they do it, provided it's all legal, it should fall under who cares for everyone else. Who cares what they pay to whom? If you don't like it, don't work there, find another job.

Fast food jobs aren't something anyone should think of as a long term position, period. If they are for the person(s) in question, accept the pay and deal with it. Otherwise, move up the chain, get trained in another field or go to school while working there and better yourself for a job with actual value. You know, they type that takes some mental fortitude to accomplish.

If they job is easy and anyone can do it, the pay should be crap. Pay isn't based on how hectic or aerobic it is, nor should it ever be.

People care how much (and how) others make money because our economy requires a healthy middle class. Finding another job is only an option if there are better jobs to move up to.

You're parroting the usual American Dream stuff, but, generally speaking, that is not the economy we have today.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
People care how much (and how) others make money because our economy requires a healthy middle class. Finding another job is only an option if there are better jobs to move up to.

You're parroting the usual American Dream stuff, but, generally speaking, that is not the economy we have today.

Since when is flipping burgers supposed to be a middle class job that you raise a family on? It's a job for high school kids.
 

RPD

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
5,056
565
126
Since when is flipping burgers supposed to be a middle class job that you raise a family on? It's a job for high school kids.
Skill and market value play no part in his post. Businesses are supposed to just pay people what they think they deserve.

Again, if you want to flip burgers, mop floors and other tasks one can do with no training, or skill other than breathing; don't expect to be paid well and complaining about the pay after having a family while being paid as such is... what is the word I'm search for here...
 

Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,247
207
106
Since when is flipping burgers supposed to be a middle class job that you raise a family on? It's a job for high school kids.

He asked a general question, I gave a general answer.

You may think fast food is a job for high school kids, but there are a ton of people who do raise families on those jobs because that is all that is available, because there aren't many middle class jobs. The maintenance guy at my local McDondald's has been there for something like 20 years, I think he's making about $12-14 an hour.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,967
19
81
How much seniority do you think workers at McDonalds, etc. have.

I am lucky to see a front line supervisor/shift manager there more than a couple of years.

It's sad some just stay on-board forever. Same as grocery stores (but I think they get paid a little better) and never even moving into management. Just checking and bagging.
 

mikeford

Diamond Member
Jan 27, 2001
5,671
160
106
McD pays too much, average age in fast food is up to about 29 years old, these are jobs for kids to get a start, not a career.

BTW there is really no need for the person taking your order to be in the US, out sourcing will be coming soon to many "you want fries with that" skill level jobs.
 

Pulsar

Diamond Member
Mar 3, 2003
5,225
306
126
He asked a general question, I gave a general answer.

You may think fast food is a job for high school kids, but there are a ton of people who do raise families on those jobs because that is all that is available, because there aren't many middle class jobs. The maintenance guy at my local McDondald's has been there for something like 20 years, I think he's making about $12-14 an hour.

Baloney to 'that's all that's available'. It comes down to people wanting to better themselves. If they don't have the motivation to do it, that's their problem. We've been over this topic a hundred times here, and it seems like there are only two sides to it. The side that says it's possible for people to boot strap themselves up and have a good life, and the side that claims that due to circumstance it's impossible.

99% of the folks in those situations brought it on themselves. Stupid marraiges, kids outside of wedlock, multiple kids outside wedlock, not bothering to finish their education, the list goes on and on.

Then you can complain that they never had a chance, and I'll say bullshit again. Cultural problems in specific communities are cultural problems in those communities. It's not up the government to fix them. Want a perfect example of what happens when you put folks on the long-term dole? Look at the Indian communities (native, not India) around the country and their problems with insolvency, education, etc. Victims stay victims if you let them.
 
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IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,656
687
126

mmntech

Lifer
Sep 20, 2007
17,504
12
0
I've been thinking about this since I was in a similar position only just a couple of years ago.

When I was a kid and you walked into a McD's, most of the people working there were teenagers or college students. The purpose of these jobs was to get a bit of spending money, or help pay for tuition. They were short term jobs. The only adults you saw working there were either folks who were really hard up, or had absolutely no ambition.

Today you don't really see teens working in these places anymore. I don't think it's because they're any lazier than they were 20 years ago. It's mostly adults working in these places. College grads, seniors, new immigrants, former factory workers.

When I worked at the car rental, we had this guy on our team working as the weekday shuttle driver. He had lost his job as a valve fitter in the recession. Went from making $30/hr to $9/hr. Used to call him Surly Steve because he was just perpetually in a bad mood. Can't blame the guy. He had a kids to raise too. Honestly don't know what happened to him. He quit one day and we never heard from him again. Had another guy on the counter who was a talented software engineer. He did get a job eventually, but it took him a year.

These were skilled workers. They eventually get replacement jobs in their fields but it takes a long time to recover them.

The recession quickly pruned out a huge chunk of unskilled labour jobs. Prior to then you could work in a factory for $15-20 an hour and make a decent enough living to survive off. It doesn't help that a lot of desk jobs now require a university degree, when they didn't just a couple decades ago. The government spent billions trying to create new jobs for these people. While most of them have been replaced, they're mostly minimum wage retail or fast food work.

It's very difficult to live off $15,000 per year. That's assuming you can get full time work. Though few places offer that today, even in professional fields.

A big part of the problem is the government can only create government jobs. They cannot create private sector jobs. All it can do is pay to retrain people or hire them on public works programs as was done during the Great Depression. The only thing that pulled us out of the depression was a shortage of labour (due to men going to war) and rich government contracts (for war supplies). Which triggered the post-war boom. America was a leading industrial nation at that time. I think a lot of people thought the good times would keep rolling. The economic downturn in the 1970s should have been a wake up call.

Now a lot of jobs have moved to China where labour is cheaper. For the Chinese, most get a decent enough wage in the factories. More than they would farming, and plenty to live on. But far less than what unionized American workers were making.

The problem is that having too many minimum wage workers are bad for the economy. They don't spend money on surplus goods and many of them collect social assistance, and many more don't pay taxes. This makes them a big drain on government coffers. The real tipping point will be when you have more people taking money out of the government than putting in, to the point where interest cannot be paid on the national debt. This is what happened in a lot of European countries. However, the likes of Walmart and McDonalds don't care as they sell goods that low income people either need or can afford. They'll make money no matter how bad the economy gets.

I think what we will see is an even greater push to unionize these jobs. It's becoming inevitable, and the big unions have been salivating. They've been wanting to dig their claws into the likes of Walmart for years, and the conditions are becoming right for it. Which IMO will be the worst possible outcome as it will significantly raise the prices of literally everything you buy. The only people that really win that battle are the unions, financially speaking.

Honestly, I don't know what the solution is to this problem. I don't think anybody does.
 

Ichinisan

Lifer
Oct 9, 2002
28,298
1,234
136
When did I ever say fast food workers should be paid $15 an hour? That's ridiculous.

It's what they were demanding (but not expecting) according to the article EagleKeeper linked to revive this thread. No matter how much you raise the wages, food prices will increase.
 

Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
8,174
524
126
IThe purpose of these jobs was to get a bit of spending money, or help pay for tuition. They were short term jobs. The only adults you saw working there were either folks who were really hard up, or had absolutely no ambition.

The "purpose" of those jobs is to effect the day to day business of the establishment. They're not there as jobs for kids, or to be short term, or for any other reason.

Where do you people come up with some of this crap?
 

MagnusTheBrewer

IN MEMORIAM
Jun 19, 2004
24,135
1,594
126
An entryway into a dead end is no entryway at all.

"Oh, yes sir, McDonald's was a great experience for me and I am sure the burger flipping skills I learned will really translate into your decent middle class job somehow".....said no employee EVER.

People have to be taught how to work. Usually, people learn at their first job. You have to show up on time. You have to be ready.to work on time. You have to shower and be clean enough to work. You have to be able to follow a schedule. Having a 'bad hair day,' being hungover or, having a term paper due is not a reason for not doing your job. Some folks don't learn these things ever but, THAT is what an entryway job should teach. From that pov, fast food does a pretty good job.
 

RPD

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
5,056
565
126
The "purpose" of those jobs is to effect the day to day business of the establishment. They're not there as jobs for kids, or to be short term, or for any other reason.

Where do you people come up with some of this crap?
I'd be willing to be they want high turn over at most of the positions in fast food to keep the wages low. Who wants to pay a guy taking orders who got raises over time $15, when you can get the same output from someone brand new or a few weeks in for minimum wage?
 

Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
8,174
524
126
I'd be willing to be they want high turn over at most of the positions in fast food to keep the wages low. Who wants to pay a guy taking orders who got raises over time $15, when you can get the same output from someone brand new or a few weeks in for minimum wage?

Doesn't work like that. Raises aren't guaranteed. I recently talked with a guy who was a line cook at Chili's. He started at $9.00/hour and after five years he made $11.25.
 
Apr 20, 2008
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The "purpose" of those jobs is to effect the day to day business of the establishment. They're not there as jobs for kids, or to be short term, or for any other reason.

Where do you people come up with some of this crap?

He asked a general question, I gave a general answer.

You may think fast food is a job for high school kids, but there are a ton of people who do raise families on those jobs because that is all that is available, because there aren't many middle class jobs. The maintenance guy at my local McDondald's has been there for something like 20 years, I think he's making about $12-14 an hour.

Doesn't work like that. Raises aren't guaranteed. I recently talked with a guy who was a line cook at Chili's. He started at $9.00/hour and after five years he made $11.25.

Absolutely this.

People parroting this shit about "those jobs are for kids" clearly are the "haves" and not the "have nots." Even for a guy that serves in our military, has a college background, solid work history and even a security clearance, couldn't get a decent job for over 1+ year in this economy. I'm now an apprentice electrician, but up until I got this job I was working in retail and security both, at $9 an hour.

The reason? Because there is hardly any fucking jobs out there. I put in over 400+ actual applications towards jobs that related to my field in college and my rating in the Navy as an Electronics Technician. Only those unskilled jobs would give me any form of employment. I have far more skills (and technical, at that) than the average person, yet finding decent employment was one of the hardest things I've ever done. I'm not a lazy slob, not trying to milk the government of anything, but I was a phone call away to food stamps the day before I got my call to be an electrician.

You fucks judging those people for working those jobs, making assumptions about how they live their lives, should go die in a fire. Seriously. Just because you got a shoe-in to a nice career/job doesn't mean that the person serving you food or providing a service doesn't work just as hard, if not more to get by. In most places that's the only form of steady employment that was available.
 

RPD

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
5,056
565
126
Doesn't work like that. Raises aren't guaranteed. I recently talked with a guy who was a line cook at Chili's. He started at $9.00/hour and after five years he made $11.25.
That looks like a raise(s) to me. Albeit a small one.

You fucks judging those people for working those jobs, making assumptions about how they live their lives, should go die in a fire. Seriously. Just because you got a shoe-in to a nice career/job doesn't mean that the person serving you food or providing a service doesn't work just as hard, if not more to get by. In most places that's the only form of steady employment that was available.
Pot meet kettle.

There's nothing wrong with people working those jobs. What's wrong is people working those jobs as a career thinking they can support a family and demand they should be paid DOUBLE what they are making.
 

Ichinisan

Lifer
Oct 9, 2002
28,298
1,234
136
... The maintenance guy at my local McDondald's has been there for something like 20 years, I think he's making about $12-14 an hour.

Well that's better than minimum wage. If the maintenance guy wants to earn more, he'll need to get some skills. I was 17/18 years old when the Department of Labor paid for my A+ certification classes, which included a voucher for the test.

Get training for any sort of skilled labor and you shouldn't have to work for minimum wage. It's as easy as that.
 

Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,247
207
106
Baloney to 'that's all that's available'. It comes down to people wanting to better themselves. If they don't have the motivation to do it, that's their problem. We've been over this topic a hundred times here, and it seems like there are only two sides to it. The side that says it's possible for people to boot strap themselves up and have a good life, and the side that claims that due to circumstance it's impossible.

99% of the folks in those situations brought it on themselves. Stupid marraiges, kids outside of wedlock, multiple kids outside wedlock, not bothering to finish their education, the list goes on and on.

Then you can complain that they never had a chance, and I'll say bullshit again. Cultural problems in specific communities are cultural problems in those communities. It's not up the government to fix them. Want a perfect example of what happens when you put folks on the long-term dole? Look at the Indian communities (native, not India) around the country and their problems with insolvency, education, etc. Victims stay victims if you let them.

Victims also stay victims when douchebags don't give them a chance.

You pulled that 99% thing straight out of your ass, along with almost everything else you just said.

I don't want people on the "long-term dole," that is just a straw man you tried to put in my mouth.

I'm writing this line-by-line because "you people" never read more than a sentence at a time, because that's all you need to copy/paste your preferred dogma.

There are not only two sides; there are also those that see missed opportunities for growth, individuals who want to enable more people to earn their own better life, people who are fed up with senseless waste and blind clinging to dogma that was outdated decades ago.

A large number of people currently not trying to better themselves are broken after years of trying to make it, years of being shoved back down by fucking assholes like yourself who insist that nothing could possibly be wrong with the status quo and they would succeed if only they bothered to stop being so wretched.
 
Apr 20, 2008
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Schloz, what you described falls into the temporary category

But it's not. If I didn't get the literally "one out of hundreds" call from the electrician apprenticeship, I'd have moved up a postion or two and kept working retail probably forever.
 
May 13, 2009
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Love how all the tech monkeys here think they are so skilled and look down on everyone else. lol. Get a life trolls. You are no better than the guy behind the counter at mcdonalds. You're just lucky mommy and daddy sent you to tech school so you could sit behind a desk all day and do nothing and pretend you're something special.
 
May 13, 2009
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But it's not. If I didn't get the literally "one out of hundreds" call from the electrician apprenticeship, I'd have moved up a postion or two and kept working retail probably forever.

Just always keep that attitude. I have the same attitude as you. I'm no better than the guy working security or flipping burgers for a living. Circumstances just have worked out for me to where I've ran into some decent jobs. Luck or just being in the right place plays a big part of it.
 

MagnusTheBrewer

IN MEMORIAM
Jun 19, 2004
24,135
1,594
126
Baloney to 'that's all that's available'. It comes down to people wanting to better themselves. If they don't have the motivation to do it, that's their problem. We've been over this topic a hundred times here, and it seems like there are only two sides to it. The side that says it's possible for people to boot strap themselves up and have a good life, and the side that claims that due to circumstance it's impossible.

99% of the folks in those situations brought it on themselves. Stupid marraiges, kids outside of wedlock, multiple kids outside wedlock, not bothering to finish their education, the list goes on and on.

Then you can complain that they never had a chance, and I'll say bullshit again. Cultural problems in specific communities are cultural problems in those communities. It's not up the government to fix them. Want a perfect example of what happens when you put folks on the long-term dole? Look at the Indian communities (native, not India) around the country and their problems with insolvency, education, etc. Victims stay victims if you let them.

You're totally clueless. You compare bootstrapping and lack of motivation to a group of people whom the government systematically destroyed their way of life and culture? Go educate yourself before you try to talk to adults.
 
May 13, 2009
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You're totally clueless. You compare bootstrapping and lack of motivation to a group of people whom the government systematically destroyed their way of life and culture? Go educate yourself before you try to talk to adults.

But but his mommy sent him to techie school. That makes him better than the next man. He's special.
 

TwiceOver

Lifer
Dec 20, 2002
13,544
44
91
My days in fast food taught me a lot about life. I made what I thought was a decent wage for the work I did. Then again I didn't live in a major city where rent is ridiculous and such.

I really wish more people would work fast food some time in their life. It really changes your perspective on those workers and the food they serve.
 
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